Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Thoughts on 2 day Regional.. As seen by Jimmy Ballard...

(Dumb analogy follows.)

I just got back from a long Saturday at the ski slopes. Although it's a very different sport, I equate (somewhat) my ski outings to my attendance at premier Pokemon tournaments. It's hard to cram the travel-time and fun-time into one day. My most enjoyable ski outings are when I split up the travel-time from the fun-time, and when I don't cram my appetitie for skiing into one day (I usually attend the bigger ski resorts that have numerous trails). Regardless of how crowded the resort is, I don't ever seem to get enough runs down the slopes in just one day. Nevertheless, there are those who are quite content with cramming their ski outings into mega-hour events.

(end of analogy).

And, therein lies the dilemma with organized play. It's not flexible, not based on individual needs or desires.

In discussions like this, I often hear words like "unacceptable" and "undesireable" used to justify longer events. To me, it's all a matter of perspective. What's good for the goose is not always good for the gander. :wink:

I would love to see multi-day Regionals, BTW.
 
I think that the key to making Regionals a 2 day event is to have more than just top cut on the 2nd day.

TCG side events (30 card decks, booster drafts, theme deck events, alternate formats, etc.) is one possiblity. Another would be tie ins to the Video Game. If you had Video game events going on during day 2 then you might have some spillover growth where folks play both.
 
I think your on to something V_G. Implementing the videogames for day 2 might keep the crowd over for another day. And might even bring in more ppl who will come in just for the vg portion of the event. A nice way to tie in both parts for a 2 day tourny.
 
ARMondak said:
Another possible solution is to consolidate the Regionals, and have 6 "super" Regionals that are all two days. These could have bigger prizes, potentially giving invites to Worlds for the winners or top 2.

As it stands right now, the divisions are disproportional attendance wise. There's no reason to do a two day regional for the younger divisions, as they most likely will finish before 10 PM anyways. Also, it depends a lot on the region. The Mountain West region doesn't need two days, while the California or Texas regional almost certainly does. Thus, it's tricky to have an across the board two day regional system. If the Regionals system was to stay the same as it is now (with the same regions), I think that the individual regionals should be predetermined for one day or two, based on previous years' attendance.
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I agree here, as a players point of view the 2 day Regional Event would benefit most. I believe it should be split into a 2 day event, simply for the fact people need to rest. I would rather have my opponent playing the best to their capabilty rather then many mistakes being made. That doesn't benefit anyone. But thats from a Masters point of view. I play from Mountain West region and there was a 12 hour Regional event. Very long and tiring, To be honest after that event I didn't play pokemon for about a week. I felt pokemon drained.:lol:
So I would suggest Regionals being both one day and 2 day event. Allowing the Juniors to finish in one day. And depending on the numbers for the Seniors at the event determine if they should finish in one day or split it into 2 days. Masters usually always have a large amount of players therefor should be a 2 day event for the Masters. Thus allowing the players and Staff to play or Judge at their full potential. Player errors would be reduced, and the Judges I believe would like that better because it will give them a chance to rest from a long day of standing and over watching matches.
Also this will allow people to choose which Regional Event they would like to attend and make it a weekend event/vacation. So players that are chasing points can attend a larger event. Normally when people go to play in Regionals they get there friday night, attend Saturday they play till late hours between midnight- 4AM so they are going to go back to the place they stayed the night before. Then the next morning take off after resting, but if it does go into a 2 day event Saturday/ Sunday it should be later in the afternoon. Like between 2-3PM that way if people have to attend somewhere earlier it will give them time to do so then attend the event.
 
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I'm SERIOUSLY considering a 2 day Regionals for Houston. My thoughts are Swiss Rounds then maybe a DS event for the first day. Top Cut ONLY on the second day, starting at 9:00 or 10:00 am.

The more and more I think about it, I like the idea. It sure would make it easier and more relaxing.
 
I may only have one semester left, but I'm still a college student, and as a college student, I'm not thrilled with the prospect of staying an extra night in lieu of just toughing it out for a while. However, if the overwhelming majority of players really do want to take this step forward, then I'll happily go along with it.

But Mike, one question: if you were to do a two day event, would you do "all" top cuts on Sunday, or just Masters?
 
I am a parent that plays with kids that have played as juniors and now seniors and my wife work the events. I would not like a two day event and I believe it would reduce attendance. I will outline my logic and the elaborate later.

Pros:
Shorter day of playing

Cons:
Two days
Inability to plan your time and cost.
You do not know what you are committing to.
What happens if someone does not make it to the second day? How does the last spot get filled?
The players would not be rested as stated in one of the post.
Rogue decks would lose an element of surprise and would be at a disadvantage.
Sprite of the Games is lost.

Alternatives:
I do not know why registration starts so late at an event that the room is rented for the entire day. Registration should be from 8AM to 9AM. Starting play by 10AM. This is a start time of 2 to 3 hours before the current system. These are held on a weekend so traffic should not be an excuse as to why we cannot start at 8AM. Surely this is the easiest and most cost effective solution to late running events.

More regional events. There are obviously too many people attending the events to allow them to function within your expectations. With too many people in attendance that means more pokemon cards and accessories are being sold. So the extra prizes should not be an issue.

As a player if there is the potential that I have to stay an extra day if I make top cuts I may forgo the event. There are cost to a player just with the potential of going to a second day. Where will I stay if I win? So, I have to pay for a room somewhere? Now if I do not make top cuts the event ends after any potential for a refund of the room and I just wasted money to attend a free event. If I do make top cuts then I have to feed my family three additional meals out. Considering that we usually do not dine out that is a substantial cost. The additional cost to me to make top cuts would total about $150 to $200. And if I do not make top cuts, I am still paying for a room at a minimum of $80 that I most likely would not even use. Chances are good that I do make top cuts since I have done so the that 3 years. Knowing that this free event would cost me $200 I may elect not to go or if I do go and make top cuts I just would not show up the second day.

What if someone makes top cuts and does not show the next day? Do they get a loss? Do they get dropped and their spot passed down to whom ever was next in line and showed up to the second day?

As someone who works the events my wife would not work the event if it required attending the second day unless the room was paid for or was given at an extreme discount. Yes, the product given out is nice but it in no way covers the cost of attending and working the event. My wife says she works harder at a pokemon event than she does at her real job.

The players would not be rested. You know they would be up all night discussing who is in the top cuts and what decks they are playing. They would test play all night to determine the best way to play against those decks. A rogue deck's strategy could be broken if a bunch of top players had time to break it down, share the cards they saw in the deck and come up with the way to work around that deck with the cards they have.

With that last statement it breaks the sprite of the game.
 
@UFTroll: IF a player does not show for day 2 (SEFs) (this ALMOST happened at Nats in the SR division), they would get a loss rd1 and be done. There would NOT be a fill in. That is why the option to DROP is/should be announced before the final results go up. IF you drop before the final results, then the person on the cut line would move up and play in SEFs.

Otherwise, I think you bring up valid points, esp. as a parent of kids that play. I Judge all these events and I know the feeling.

Keith
 
One really obvious thing that just hit me. Everyone keeps talking about how a second day is unnecessary for the Juniors & Seniors. How about Day 1 is just for Masters? The second day, when Juniors & Seniors play can be when Masters finish their tournament. There's no reason the younger divisions have to play on Saturday instead of Sunday. Just an idea. (For parents who both play & travel with kids, perhaps side events can be offered Day 1 for the kids.)

I'll be sure to attend whatever Regional offers a two-day event. If that means flying to Texas, I'll do it.
 
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Ness said:
I'll be sure to attend whatever Regional offers a two-day event. If that means flying to Texas, I'll do it.
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I was just thinking the same thing.

@UFtroll: Starting an event at 8am when you have a four+ hour drive to a regional is the same thing as a two day regional. Still virtually mandated that you spend the night, still feeding my family. As a parent who has no intention of playing in a regional I would much prefer a two day regional IF a one day means a very early start or a late night. If Jrs and Srs can finish at a decent time, then let them finish in one day, if masters are running 10+ rounds they probably should be split to two days.

I bet virtually every person who attended Nationals for the last few years would say their mental game was improved when it was split to three days this year.
 
Wait, why would "consistency" have to matter at all? That doesn't make any sense. Two day events based on attendance is consistent. The fact is juniors and seniors don't need two day events for regionals yet. Juniors and seniors playing on sunday would be perfect. To address your other post, it's simple to plan if you're going to make top cut or not. Are you a good player? Plan for the second day. I just don't see how it's more expensive for two days. If you drive up the morning of saturday, stay that night and leave sunday it's only one night of a hotel. Bring your food if you don't want to buy it. Rogue decks lose their surprise the second they're played. One night of testing against it (no way is someone going to have the cards if it's actually obscure) is not going to change anything. Not to mention if you win this free event you very much get your ~80 dollars for the hotel back. Even if you plan on getting NO sleep for a one day event with a two day you can get sleep, have an extra day of fun, and an overall better experience for a minimal extra cost.
 
If Regionals were to turn into a sort of mini Super Trainer Showdown, with lots of things happening at them, I'd love to run a two-day event.
If they remain just an extended tournament due to large attendance, I couldn't see it as much.
Lot's of extra cost, little extra return.
And I'm not just talking about money.
 
I assume a two-day regionals would have to have side events...

more so than they already do...
 
I now figure, with my venue, except for staff costs, my additional costs would be minimal, and I am STILL torn about going to a 2-day event, because it seems like a LOT of effort for a mimimal number of people benefited.

How late is too late on day 1 for Masters? For Juniors?

What are the thoughts there?

That would really help in this decision.

I am still leaning to a 1-day event, Masters Finals DONE by 11:30 pm, Juniors Finals DONE by 9:00 pm.

Thoughts?

V
 
meganium45 said:
I now figure, with my venue, except for staff costs, my additional costs would be minimal, and I am STILL torn about going to a 2-day event, because it seems like a LOT of effort for a mimimal number of people benefited.

How late is too late on day 1 for Masters? For Juniors?

What are the thoughts there?

That would really help in this decision.

I am still leaning to a 1-day event, Masters Finals DONE by 11:30 pm, Juniors Finals DONE by 9:00 pm.

Thoughts?

V
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I kinda like your idea, in some cases seniors can finish before juniors, so the senior finish time could be 8:30-9:30.
 
I think the best alternative is to have registration at 8am SHARP and the tournament begin at 9:45 am at the latest!! These tournaments are posted MONTHS in advance, so you can plan an early morning drive, or a Friday nite stay at a mom and pop hotel for one night. Inform your players to pack/bring a lunch and play through the day. Junior's and Senior's could be complete by 7pm, along with Swiss rounds for Master's, meaning the entire tournament could be done by 10pm.
Again, this event is planned for and posted MONTHS in advance, so players need to step up and take accountability to keep the tournaments from running all night and into the mornings. START EARLY......
 
imo, these issues are overlooking 2 things. The first is the venue. Is it large enough to hold that many people for 2 days? Another thing is that there are people besides Masters. I know, crazy right?
 
PokePop said:
If Regionals were to turn into a sort of mini Super Trainer Showdown, with lots of things happening at them, I'd love to run a two-day event.
If they remain just an extended tournament due to large attendance, I couldn't see it as much.
Lot's of extra cost, little extra return.
And I'm not just talking about money.
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Would it be plausable to run some sort of Pokemon Video game tournament on 2 day of Regs? Something where POP could justify the cost a bit more and draw in more players. Also give players a reason to travel and not have to choose between TCG and VCG since they will either have done well at the tcg or bad and than can play in the VCG.

---------- Post added 12/27/2010 at 01:07 AM ----------
Porii Sames said:
imo, these issues are overlooking 2 things. The first is the venue. Is it large enough to hold that many people for 2 days? Another thing is that there are people besides Masters. I know, crazy right?
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Masters make up the largest percentage of tournament percentages, we are usually the ones who travel the farthest or at the very least the ones who plan the trips (parents taking there kids), its not the junior or senior you need to convince its a good idea to have a two day tournament but rather the Parents/Masters, I know crazy right.
 
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