How can we make The PokeGym and/or the Compendium better?

Discussion in 'TCG News & Gossip Discussion' started by PokePop, Feb 13, 2004.

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  1. PokePop

    PokePop Administrator

    The last topic cleared the air a bit.
    Now, I'd like to move off in a more constructive direction.
    Please post things that you would like to see done differently, better, or just plain new things that would improve the PokeGym and the Compendium as a resource for the community.
    Thank you
    Pop
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2004
  2. Orange Soda

    Orange Soda New Member

    I'm probably the only person on the board who thinks this, but I think PMs should be done away with.

    Why? At another board I go to, a bitter ex-member somehow or other got ahold of an admin's password, accessed all the board tech stuff, and, among other atrocities, he accessed the board's PM database, read them, and even took screenshots of some of them. As such, I don't trust PMs and never use them.

    Just a suggestion, anyway.
     
  3. Gym Leader Blaine

    Gym Leader Blaine <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/member.php?u=15


    Pop,

    The one thing I would like to see is to be able to use our own pictures for Aviators, I know the Mod do. I have a Star Wars Stormtrooper one on my profile that I would love to have as mine. I know if this is done were people could do it, it might open up a can of worms if the Aviators that people put on are not appropriate and such, but maybe they could be okayed by the Mod and such before hand. Just my two cents.
     
  4. ukpokemonpro

    ukpokemonpro New Member

    Okay first off can I suggest we split any reply into the 2 questions being asked here about the gym and the compendium.

    So Pokegym first

    Okay something needs to be decided about the status of the Gym in TC's own eyes... do you consider it the "official" bulletin boards for PUI and the Pokemon TCG. Note I say do you (TC) consider it as such. If it is not thought so by you then do you see the Gym as another set of fan forums?

    Now this may come out wrong but myself and others do understand how hard it must be to be a bridge between PUI and the general community and to not have PUI acknowledge that link or make it official.

    With that in mind I do think this board needs to find an identity... If it is not the official board for PUI what sets it apart from Pojo, Pokeschool and the pkmn.co.uk forums?

    That identity must then feed through the board and be reflected in the behaviour of all posters and mods and in the nature of the posts themselves.

    So what is the POKEGYM needs answering before anything else can be considered.

    now for the Compendium

    Okay again the current status of the compendium is (excuse my turn of phrase) a "female dog" if it is not recognised by PUI as an official resource then maintaining it's authority as a refernce work is harder than ever before. What stops a TO or Judge from just turning round and saying that the compedium whilst recognised as a repositry of official rulings it does not stand as an official reference in it's entirity therefore we will not recognise it as holding any weight when making a ruling.

    Again it needs clarity of purpose and identity and some of that can only come from PUI :(

    Sorry I cannot give an instant fix here but I am trying to reflect on the hardships facing TC, the Gym and the Compendium.. most of which stem from the Unofficial/Official nature of both!

    Anyhow as it is now after midnight here I am off for tea and a cogitate.. answers in the future .. maybe ..
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2004
  5. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    I would really like to see the option for non-mods/admins to post in the rulings part of the forum. I mean, sure we have our right to post in the tcg strategies part if we think it is wrong, but that only spams up the forum even more. I know that I wouldn't want to post a brand new topic about the ruling when I could easily talk about it in the original post. And sometimes I see some people ask questions that could easily be answered by the rest of the fourm but we cannot help out and post the ruling because we cannot post there. So if everyone was allowed to post in the rulings part of the forum, we could help mods/admins with some of the easy rulings and we could be able to negotiate about the ruling in the same thread other than taking the time to make the poster post another thread on the same subject in a totally different part of the forum.

    Also, I would LOVE to see custom avatars. I know, it might lag the server, but just 80x80 avatars that would have to be hosted on another server couldn't do much harm to the forum. It would then allow much creativity and much diversity that I know I long for. Kinda like the simpson's episode where everyone wore black and white. It was dull, but when it got rainbowed colors, everyone was invigorated and was happy once more to be different. I bet if you took off half the avatars available and allowed us to use our own custom avatars, it would actually make the forum smaller(byte size).

    Maybe we could have a pokemon creativity forum where people can show off their pokemon art, poems, and websites?

    Just a few ideas that sparked in my head...
     
  6. ukpokemonpro

    ukpokemonpro New Member

    Prime

    Definitely a good move the fact that some of the rules gurus can't reply makes it frustrating as heck for them .. note I am definitely not a rules guru .. I am the TO man I leave the judging mainly to those that can :)

    I vote yes on the NON-Poll ;) to open up the Ask the Masters forum.
     
  7. PokePop

    PokePop Administrator

    UK: Re the status of the Compendium. We've been in this limbo for our entire existance. WotC never offically recognized the document as official either. Both WotC and PUI have, however, recognized the rulings within as official.
    I'm afraid that's the best we're going to get. Lord knows we'd love an official recognition.

    Re the identity of the board. I think its clear that we're not going to be the official board. And I'm not sure if we want to be at this point. We'd have to turn over the keys to PUI if we were. My own thoughts on this is that we definately seem to be the home of the TO/Judge/GymLeader community. As such, I see us as giving a voice to the segment of the community that gets the game out there and helps it grow.

    A valuable resource for PUI to pay attention to, IMO.
     
  8. Otaku

    Otaku Active Member

    I think if the compendium can talk TPC into evaluating all the old rulings, it would be good-no snese taking chances of building bad new rulings on bad old ones. I am tired of finding out years later we did it the wrong way from Japan.
     
  9. Sensei

    Sensei Team Compendium Emeritus Staff Member Trader Feedback Mod

    Re:Identity or Unofficial/Official status of the boards.The `Gym has always been in it`s incarnations "the place to go" for the Pokemon community so to speak.If any of us ever have anything that we can let on that`s "officicial",then all it is is something that is for the help to the communtity and we will label it as such.I just don`t see what kind of problem anyone would see in this.It`s pretty clearcut to me.I definately would not want the boards to be "official" if you understand.If that happened,as `Pop said we would have to hand over the reigns to them and I`m NOT going through another WotC situation again in terms of what we can do with "our own board" if you know what I mean.The Pokegym,while the home of many of the games (P)TO`s,judges,Professor/Master Professors and big chunk of the Pokemon Community not to mention where the MT`s(WotC and PUI) have frequented, has always been the place to get any info you needed for the game whether it was "official" or unofficial".

    Re:Opening the ATM forum.My opinion of it is that I like it the way it is.The reason being is that if you open it,it gets cluttered with "incorrect" answers from people even when meaning well,answers that just add to the confusion and sometimes sidetrack into another conversation,and just overall could be more "jumbled" for lack of a better term.The way it is now is simple,easy to read with no confusion and if anyone wants to discuss any ruling or question,they could just talk about it in the Single cards forum.That`s my opinion of it.:)

    `Sensei
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2004
  10. bullados

    bullados <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?

    then, how about answers submitted to mods/admins for review before they are posted? That way, the people with the help feel like they have done something, and the people in power get to stay in power.

    Aside from that, it's just a few boards that I think are missing, and many others will ask for them, so I will not.
     
  11. Sensei

    Sensei Team Compendium Emeritus Staff Member Trader Feedback Mod

    Well,we all have real life stuff(jobs,family,etc.) that takes a lot of time away from here.That would be another load to handle if you know what I mean.By any member discussing it in the Card/Rulings forum,you still accomplish what you started out to do and are contributing no matter which way it would be.Now,thats my take on it.Let`s see what the others have to say.:)

    `Sensei
     
  12. Chrisbo

    Chrisbo Administrator

    Okay, sorry in advance for the long post you are about to read. But since I've been fairly quiet regarding "recent events", I think I'm entitled to ramble on a bit. Here goes.....

    What, you mean like Amelia Earhart and Charles Lindbergh? They were indeed famous aviators. (Sorry, I just couldn't resist :D ). Seriously though, we get asked a lot about using custom avatars and we discuss it from time to time. But in my opinion, it leaves it open for too much potential abuse and non-conformity. All we need is for someone to use a bloody Pikachu or something that will "offend little Johnny's parents", and then it's ruined for everybody. Pokemon is a family-oriented game, and we need to take families into consideration when it comes to site content. Personally, I like to reserve custom avatars as "treats" for honored guests, future contest winners, financial contributors, etc. We have not completely ruled out the idea of custom avatars, but it's not very high on our priority list, to be honest.


    PM's are an optional setting in your profile (i.e. it's disabled in mine, but perhaps not in yours). We haven't had any problems with them yet, and since it's an optional feature I don't foresee much overly abuse of it.


    No, we do not consider ourselves "the official boards for PUI", but we are haunted by that reputation from our previous role as such with WOTC. When ownership of the TCG changed hands, we discussed & debated on whether or not we wanted to approach PUI about becoming their official boards. There are pros & cons to both positions, but as of right now the PokeGym forums are an independent entity run by private, non-corporate individuals.

    The main thing that sets us apart is our members and our attitudes. PokePop expressed it best that we definitely seem to be the home of the TO/Judge/GymLeader community. As such, we tend to be a bit more serious and perhaps less permissive than other sites, but in the end I think that makes us well-respected and mature in the eyes of many people.

    Unfortunately, there never really has been anything to prevent judges from ruling any way they feel like. Sure there have been Tournament Floor Rules, but nothing really "official" on how specific cards & gameplay concepts interact with each other. That's why we started Team Compendium in the first place. We wanted to gather the information given by Organized Play and R&D (first WOTC, now PUI), and present it in a place where judges who wish to be as accurate as possible can use these guidelines to help them through some of the more difficult concepts of the game. All we were doing is sorting the answers the MT's gave into an organized document. Later on, MT_Mike came out with the "Master Rulings Document" (containing many parts culled from TC's Chat transcripts, with our permission & blessings), but unfortunately they did not keep it up to date nor timely, and eventually had to contract out the final update to a small group of individuals (not Team Compendium per se, but I was a member of the update team). Now if PUI ever wanted to come up with their own "Master Rulings Document", I would support their efforts 100%. But from known experience, the effort it takes to maintain such a document and keep it current is very time-consuming. So until something better comes along, we'll be here for the long haul.


    Actually, we specifically created the "Ask the Masters" (ATM) forum to have limited-access in order to keep the amount of traffic to a minimum. You can debate all you want in the "Single Cards" forum, but ATM was designed with the idea of "ask a question, get an answer, period". Sensei also makes some very good points about this too in his post just above this.


    ROFLOL!!! Oh, I wish that were possible! As it is, TPC doesn't like to consider the interactions of older cards with newer cards; they tend to view each block as a separate entity. We've seen this since the days of Gym series ("why would anyone try to use Fossil Ditto against Brock's Ninetales?" [I still have nightmares ;) ]). We have seen some progress in the Rules Team meetings about older cards and rulings, but to go through an entire audit would indeed take a very long time to do, IMO.


    Well, that's about all I've got on my mind for now. I'll post more if anything else comes to mind.

    Thanks everybody,
    - CHRISBO
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2004
  13. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    We all have real life stuff, and having to wait for someone that has real life stuff to get online and post the ruling on something is annoying. I've had posts go unanswered for months at a time. Maybe it was because there was no ruling, and maybe it was because they were asking TPC about it. But I know that if others could have posted, my thread wouldn't have been overlooked for over a month. I mean, if everyone could post, there would atleast had some conversation. That's what a forum is all about. Then a mod/admin could come in and post the ruling and close the thread. Simple as that. Sure you will have people post a wrong ruling but that chances of that are less than the chances that someone will post a right ruling.

    Sure we could always post again in the single card strat part of the forum but would you want to have to post twice everytime you wanted a ruling? I think not.

    But that's just my opinion...
     
  14. yoshi1001

    yoshi1001 New Member

    We need a new theme song for the Pokegym. I guess that's my job, though.

    Overall, though, I think both are run quite well. Maybe a third smaller document could be made to answer just the common questions.
     
  15. Sensei

    Sensei Team Compendium Emeritus Staff Member Trader Feedback Mod

    I've had posts go unanswered for months at a time. Maybe it was because there was no ruling, and maybe it was because they were asking TPC about it

    Yes,if something doesn`t get replied to,that means we are waiting for a response back from Japan on it.Trust me,it annoys the hell out of us as well when we don`t get an answer back and have to wait and wait.I apologize on the offhand chance if a post would accidentally get overlooked but 99% of the time it`s still awaiting a response.Lizard brought up a good point in another thread about posting Q`s that are awaiting responses along with the latest Rules Meeting Rulings.We are discussing it and we`ll see what comes up.

    `Sensei
     
  16. Orange Soda

    Orange Soda New Member

    If anyone could reply in Ask the Masters, then the forum would be little more than Single Card Strategies 2, and that would be redundant.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2004
  17. Chrisbo

    Chrisbo Administrator

    Orange Soda is right. You don't HAVE to post twice if you don't want to. We check both forums when looking for questions to present to the PUI Rules Team. The ATM forum is simply intended as a place for people who want a "black & white answer" without a whole lot of discussion or "opinions". If there are existing rulings or precedents for said question, then it gets answered by one of the TC'ers. If not, then it may take some time before a response is made.

    And the reason it sometimes takes "months" to answer is because it gets discussed and deliberated thoroughly, but in the end an answer from TPC may be required. And they are not very quick to respond in many cases. :(

    Hope this helps,
    - CHRISBO
     
  18. WaRrIoR04

    WaRrIoR04 New Member

    i think an apprentice forum would be good also its the ultimate way to playtest and improve skills besides playing the real game plus theres always someone to play
     
  19. old man

    old man New Member

    For the Compendium -
    I have used the compendium since I first heard about it way back when...

    What I don't like about it is for example, a ruling on a card that the ruling later gets overturned. Example -
    Week 1 - The rule is this way
    Week 2 - The rule is now this way
    And both of these are shown in the document. I'm not saying anything about the rule change itself, just the way it is put into the document.

    To save space I would rather see only the latest current ruling, (and date) in the document.

    When I copy the latest version of compendium I edit out all the previous older ruling and just leave the latest ruling.

    Another thing I do, since I mainly deal only with modified format cards, I edit out any cards that are not in the current format. This saves a lot of space as well. I realize this would be a major undertaking it the TC guys were to do it. I don't know if this would make it any better for others but it sure does for me.


    As for Pokegym -
    Does this really need to be an official source of information? Would ne nice but I don't think it has to be. The unofficial nature of this board & it's predecessors have suited me fine for these last years.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2004
  20. )v(ajin_ipg21

    )v(ajin_ipg21 New Member

    Old Man,

    Really? We have tried our best to do away with overrulings and just keep the latest & greatest answers. We try to update vague answers and to clarify any we think need them and have tried to to avoid redundancy.

    PM me with specific examples if you don't mind.

    The older document huh?
    I know what would REALLY help out with these suggestions...
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2004
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