Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Important ruling discussion.

They can call a Judge to check your deck, if they want.

Pokemon USA, taking a cue from their Japanese HQ, expects a certain degree of sportsmanship in Organized Play.
Choosing zero when zero is a valid choice falls within the bounds of what's allowed, although the Japanese managers find even that distasteful(!).

Out and out lying about what you have or don't have in your deck, however, does not.
Since when is lying not cheating?
 
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I agree PokePop that lying is the same as cheating. But there is no need to lie.
I have not seen any rule that says that I cant play a search type card and choose not to find what I am searching for.
 
Well if your searching for something, wouldn't it make sense that when you found it, you would take it? I mean, if that wasn't how it worked then that card would say something like, "Choose up to one pokemon from your deck and put it in your hand."
 
Adv1sor said:
I agree PokePop that lying is the same as cheating. But there is no need to lie.
I have not seen any rule that says that I cant play a search type card and choose not to find what I am searching for.
Click to expand...

They you're not seaching, are you? You're only pretending to search.
 
I find this interesting in regards to how it could appear to be stalling in the "late" game. For example, I've always told players that if they attempt to use "time consuming" actions (such as searching) that it is known will fail, then they're stalling. For example, if a previous Dual Ball produces 0-1 basics, then later Dual Balls CAN'T be played unless Basics are somehow recycled. In this situation, if you DO play a later Dual Ball and "miraculously" produce a basic, you're possibly guilty of cheating; that is, you'd need to prove "long-and-hard" to me if I were judging that you somehow "oversaw" the basic. Even then, I'd probably rule a serious procedural error and might award a game-loss/prize swap penalty.
 
SteveP said:
For example, if a previous Dual Ball produces 0-1 basics, then later Dual Balls CAN'T be played unless Basics are somehow recycled.
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SteveP, this seems to be in conflict with the compendium ruling,
Q. If you use an Energy Search and don't find any Basic Energy, can you then play another Energy Search even though you know it will fail?
A. Yes, you can search for energy cards even if you know you won't find them. They exist as legal cards, therefore they can be searched for. (Jan 15, 2004 PUI Rules Team; Jan 22, 2004 PUI Rules Team)
Click to expand...

If you think that a player is stalling then you, as the judge, have every right and even a responsibility to act accordingly.

But aside from stalling, there are times when it is strategically advantageous to use a trainer card even though you know it will fail.
 
Yes, Adv1sor is right that he'd be able to play the card, knowing it will fail, because the deck is "unknown" and could theoretically contain the card being searched for.

However, knowing something will fail and therefore letting it fail is very different from pretending something failed when it really didn't.
 
Q. Delcatty's "Energy Draw" Poke-Power states: "Once during your turn
(before your attack), you may discard 1 energy card from your hand. Then
draw up to 3 cards from your deck." Can you discard the energy and not
draw because it states "draw UP TO 3 cards"?
A. If a card states that you can search for "up to" a certain number,
you can choose zero. (Mar 18, 2004 PUI Rules Team)
Click to expand...

Finally, a clear and definitive ruling on searching for zero cards!

So, in answer to the question that started this post, Dunsparce can search for Zero cards but Dual Ball can not.
 
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It hasn't been updated with that yet.
IP's been working very hard on moving the site over from hypermart.
 
Wasn't banging the drum.. Oh Look an opprtunity presents itself to thank those involved for the effort in maintaning Compendium EX as a resource for us players.

THANKS

Is the current location of The Compendium to be its final resting place?


[edit and us NON-PLAYERS too ]
 
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Advisor, PokePop, I'm trying to put my Dual Ball example in the context of late-game Stalling. By playing time-consuming actions that you know will fail, even though they might be legal, you COULD be guilty of failing to play in a timely manner as described in the Slow Play section of the Pokemon Floor Rules.

Pokemon Floor Rules said:
Slow Play
Players should attempt to complete their match in the allotted time. It is important for the players to avoid the appearance of cheating or unsportsmanlike conduct, especially when it comes to playing slowly. If the head judge determines that a player is intentionally attempting to stall out a match, it will be considered cheating, and subject to the appropriate penalties.
Click to expand...

Playing a time-consuming action and knowing "that it WILL fail" is definately a violation in my book when it looks like you're going to win the match if you can draw out the time.

Advisor, it appears that you agree in this context (just making sure).

PokePop, do you agree? Or do you think time-consuming actions that are known to fail SHOULD be allowed as a late-game, time-consumption strategy? Personally, I see that as a contradiction to the Floor Rules. JMO.
 
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My opinion is as with SteveP. "Time consuming" actions in late game that you know will fail are,in my opinion,a stalling action.The person knowingly does this to avoid the other player from getting in a few more rounds that would otherwise win the game for them.

`Sensei
 
Yeah, playing it and drawing out the search to keep the other playing from winning is stalling.
Judge's, well, judgement on that.
I was saying that it's legal to play for the sake of getting it out of your hand.
 
I was potentially kept away from a medal at the Rockville CC by someone who just made his turns take 2-4 minutes. I needed one more turn to draw the prize I needed and then Sensei came and said time was up and to finish the trun I was on X(. So be a sport and don't stall.
 
Playing Cards in a timely fashion is not stalling.

Playing cards that do nothing is not stalling.

Playing cards that you know will do nothing is not stalling.

Stalling is a deliberate attempt at slow play to gain an advantage.

Stalling is most likely to take place at the end of a round.

If a player needs a 10 second delay to ensure a win and has a do nothing trainer then that is a legal tactic. Under differring circumstances I would applaud such a play or condemn it as inappropriate. But it remains legal.

A slow or inexperienced player is generally not guilty of stalling. That does not mean that no sanction can be applied if such a player is unfairly disadvantaging their opponents.

Its easy to get a 'stalling' call wrong: The players get it wrong all the time. Yet judges are expected to figure it out after the fact. Its not easy and the above are just some of the guidelines that I personally use.

easy fixes: a short time extension . It is very unlikely that any player would have enough do nothing cards to extend a game by more that a couple of minutes.
 
NoPoke, I don't see us as very far apart on this issue. In fact, I started a topic about ways to "legally" draw out the time without being guilty of Slow Play or Stalling.

Nevertheless, I think there's a BIG difference between playing a Dual Ball to retrieve Pokemon (even though those Pokemon might not provide any possible benefit) and playing a Dual Ball to search your deck and it's a know fact that there are NO basics in your deck, especially when you put those in the context of late-game.

A real life example is driving down a 2-lane highway going half the speed limit and not letting anyone pass so that you can have a clear road ahead of you. Sure, you're totally within your "legal" rights to go slow (unless there's a sign posted saying otherwise). But I'll just bet that if you clog up traffic behind you and a trooper observes this, you'll get pulled over and given a ticket.

Finally, I agree that after-the-fact accusations of Stalling are nearly impossible to rule on. But, just about any decent judge can see Stalling or Slow Play when it happens. If not, that judge should get some training.
 
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And to quote myself :)

me said:
Under differring circumstances I would applaud such a play or condemn it as inappropriate
Click to expand...

between two strong players I'd almost expect one of them to find the does nothing trainer as a way of burning a few seconds to protect their current position.

between a strong player and a novice or between novices I'd suggest that such a tactic is inappropriate.

So I think we agree: context is the key.
 
Not quite steve its a legal play regardless... Its just that I'm likely to have words with said player between rounds either to congratulate on a neat play or to suggest that such tactics are not appropriate ;)

get myself into trouble?...Hot Water? ME? *innocent* :-D
 
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