Judging and playing at the same time.

Discussion in 'State/Province/Territory Championships' started by FriedBlaziken, Mar 15, 2008.

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  1. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    Are you allowed to do that?
    There has been an incident at Brisbane States, where a guy, judged and played at the same time.
    He gave Jason a game loss in the process.
    Is this legal?
  2. ryanvergel

    ryanvergel New Member

    Be very careful when you do this. The charges you're accusing could be verrrrry looked down upon. Make sure you have your facts straight.
  3. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    Thats what Jason told me.
    Jason can you please post to confirm?
  4. Jason

    Jason New Member

    This player/judge in question was playing against my friend and I was playing against my opponent on the same table...so yeah its true....
  5. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    Your facts are wrong.

    Rob played, but he did not 'judge'. All decisions were made by Paul. Rob assisted Paul where neccesary.

    The game loss Jason was given was for cheating. He was lucky he did not get DQ'd.
  6. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    Jason... care to explain?

    quote by the judge involved:
    "well i had to make some tough calls and jason windham got disqualified for cheating amd another guy he was playing a warning for swearing. 2 games came down to same prizes first game after 35 minutes and i went straight to frank for rulings in those cases so if anyone has a problem with the way i judge, don't whinge to someone else SPEAK TO ME DIRECTLY THIS IS THE LAST TIME I AM GOING TO REPEAT MYSELF. and if it was jason who was whinging ignore him and all you melbourne guys watch him like a hawk cause he will claim ignorance on grounds he is disabled."
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2008
  7. Jason

    Jason New Member

    first of all i did not cheat.

    misunderstandings always happens from me, you know.

    Turn one. I started with Sentred and Sean started with Ekans
    Iused Grope and Sean benched a few pokemon and used trainers. Used ekan's Poison fang and got tails on poison,

    My Sentret got 10 damage.

    My turn, I evolved my Sentret into Furret.
    Do my business etc, and used Keen Eye.

    Sean evolved his Arbok and Weezing.
    Used Arbok's Deadly Poison and my Furret is now 20damage and Poison
    Because of Weezing in play, I now have 40 damage.

    My turn, I do my business and ended my turn with Keen eye
    and I get 20 damage from poison so it should be 60 damage.

    the game stops there....

    So ya know, I did not cheat, period - as I said earlier, misunderstandings usually happens and i must be my fault for forgetting poison but still, these who run heavy poison decks still can remind players and can place counters fror poison in between turn to stop confusions etc.

  8. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    In fact, Rob and Paul *DID* call Frank, several times, (Frank is the OP Manager for Australia.) for a ruling on this and other incidents/queries. And heck, by all means you were supposed to be DQ'd.

    That wasn't the only incident you were the center of today. There were several incidents were you were yelling, screaming and abusing other players.

    I was watching your game. I was playing next to you. And you were "Ignoring" your opponent and not playing your part of the game. You refused to acknowledge that he attacked, (Thus, he would have won the game from KO'ing you.) and then you said he *DIDN'T* attack you. Which was total baloney.

    Last edited: Mar 15, 2008
  9. Jason

    Jason New Member

    I was watching your game. I was playing next to you. And you were "Ignoring" your opponent and not playing your part of the game. You refused to acknowledge that he attacked, (Thus, he would have won the game from KO'ing you.) and then you said he *DIDN'T* attack you. Which was total baloney.

    Explainations???? Was that first round or third round?

    as for me swearing and yelling...well i was in an uncontrollable mood and nearly had a panic attack so yeah, sorry to these that i caused it as that loss really hit me so hard.... Ah well....
  10. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    Let's say I had the 'pleasure' of having to sit next to, or near you, for every game today...:thumb:
  11. LOL poor Jared,,,

    but i heard there was like 10 misplays or whatever...
    lets just hope it doesn't happen here in Melb
  12. evil psyduck

    evil psyduck Moderator Trader Feedback Mod

    If Rob was playing in the tournament he should not even have been consulted. To much of a chance of a conflict of interest. I am not saying Rob would do anything like that. It could just give an appearance of it.
  13. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    Yes. It might look like "conflict of interest". But I guarantee you it is not the case. If it was "conflict of interest" then Jason would have been dragged kicking and screaming out the door and never welcome back at the card store, rather than the slap-on-the-wrist of a "Disqualification but can continue playing the tournament".

    Why is this topic on the Pokegym? This is an issue for the Aussie boards (Croftminster).
  14. Jason

    Jason New Member

    Why is it on the Gym but not on Crofty? You know that you and I cant post there xD
  15. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    That didn't stop you from getting people to make threads about this same issue on Croftminster.

    The point is. This is not an international affair. It's a Brisbane affair. Let's try and keep it that way. Making threads like this that bashes someone doesn't resolve anything.
  16. P_A

    P_A Active Member

    "Disqualification but can continue playing the tournament".

    Well, that's interesting. I don't think I've ever heard of that in the penalty guidelines. Either a person is DQ'd and sent packing or they aren't. Not that I want to get involved with any internal squables or anything, but that sounds fishy.

    In any case, it certainly looks like the original post has been answered. It is frowned upon to judge and play at the same time. Those who consulted a player on a ruling probably shouldn't have, and those who are players should refuse to give advice to those who are judges, because it creates the spectre of impropriatry. There are many different aids to the judges today, including the compendium ex, compendium lvx, tournament guidelines and penalty guidelines - all of which I bring to each premier event. I also bring the penalty forms. If I have internet access I also use the Ask the Masters forum here on the gym. If I'm really stuck, I even have access to one of the rules team. I can't think of anything else I'd need to make an informed decision for a ruling, or penalty on an infraction. However, given the case that a player was consulted, hopefully the penalty was correct and fair.

    I have given game loss penalties to players who exhibit poor sportsmanship. I never want to go that far, but I've even had to DQ players as well. A judge should be fair, but firm in supporting the fair play for all. If a person admits that they were "in an uncontrollable mood", perhaps they should re-evaluate their reasons for playing, and modify their behaviour to acceptable levels. Of course I wasn't there, and cannot comment on who did what or why, but I am commenting on statements issued here.
  17. NoPoke

    NoPoke New Member

    I brought up the issue of players and judges on the op forums some time ago. http://forums.pokemon-tcg.com/showthread.php?t=2918

    The issue of judges consulting players and if a player should answer was covered. (It is not as black and white an issue as some posters suggest)

    As to the subtext that seems to be beneath this thread I'd suggest getting your cases together and presenting them to POP / Croftminster directly and not on an open forum.
  18. PokePop

    PokePop Administrator

    Are you saying that no Australian member is allowed to discuss anything here unless it pertains to the World Championships?

    The quote you gave from this player/judge is very interesting. I'm guessing it's quoted from the Aussie board?
    "Originally Posted by Rob - Judge
    well i had to make some tough calls... "

    If he posted that, it sounds very much like something someone that was judging would say.
    Now, maybe he had someone else make the official call so that officially he wasn't judging.
    If that's the case, that seems like a technicality and I don't know if that would hold up.
    An event needs a judge who is there to judge, not to play.
    And not a judge who is looking to some few select players to do their work for them.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2008
  19. Krucifier

    Krucifier New Member

    Are you serious? I can't believe YOU of all people would think THAT.

    God. NEVER did I say that anything to do with Australia can't be said here. I said that INTERNAL ISSUES LIKE THIS. THAT HAVE *NOTHING* TO DO WITH THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY. SHOULDN'T. BE. MADE. INTERNATIONAL.

    How many times has threads like this been made, and every time, the only result is "lol u suk" and "ahaha" or just all out flaming.

    Let's give a few examples. Let's say, a peadophile came to your league. Would YOU want it to be made INTERNATIONAL?!? Then. Let's say, one of your Judges decided to beat the living crud out of one of the players. I am sure you wouldn't want that made INTERNATIONAL.

    You obviously seem to treat Australians different. You delete all the threads like this that come from America. But you let the Australian ones devolve into a flame fest.
  20. PokePop

    PokePop Administrator

    I think if you look, you will see that we do indeed have threads like this and allow them to go for awhile.
    I don't appreciate the blanket statement,
    We don't care where anyone is from. I don't know why you keep bringing that up. It's a real complex that you have, playing the "Aussie card".

    No one hates Austrailia. Get over yourself.

    Regarding your examples:
    What I'd want as the TO has nothing to do with what is a valid topic of discussion on this board.
    As the admin of a Pokemon fan site: No to the first. Yes to the second.
    One is not an act of an official.
    The second is.
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