Lucario COL Deck Discussion

Discussion in 'Cards: Strategy and Rulings Discussion' started by Ace-, Mar 1, 2011.

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  1. Ace-

    Ace- New Member

    Hello,

    i wanted to try Lucario COL because i think Lucario is overlooked because of Lost world. Since Lostgar doesnt look strong enough, i think Lucario can become an option for Regionals.
    The followong is based on theory and my thoughts. I dont have much time to test so i hope there will be some players to test my theories. Besides if you dont like my thoughts, tell me what you think and i will quote good others opinions as well.

    1. Lucario COL

    Its your main attacker. It has 90 HP, :colorless: retreat and 2x :psychic: weakness. You should focus on Dimension Sphere. It is a :colorless::colorless: attack which does 30 damage + 20 for every pokemon in your lost zone. The other attack cost :fighting::fighting::colorless: and ignores resistances. In some situations this attack can be decent, but you will use Dimension Sphere a lot. That means you need Pokemon in your Lost Zone as soon as possible to make Lucario dangerous for your opponent.

    2. Choosing Riolu

    We have a Riolu from LA; PT; UL and COL. I suggest to use the LA or PT one because both have 60 hp and no 2x:psychic: weakness.

    3. How to get Pokemon in Lost Zone

    In MD-ON we have

    Palkia G Lv.X
    Mew Prime
    Absol Prime
    Relicanth COL

    to get Pokemon in our Lost Zone. Mew, Absol and Relicanth need to attack, Palkia G has a Poke-Power. So i start with the attackers first.
    Mew Prime has 60 HP, 2x:psychic: weakness and 0 retreat. Its attack need a :psychic: and let you get any pokemon from the deck to lost zone. The body allows you to use any attack from the pokemon in lost zone.
    Statswise this card is just bad. Low HP and 2x:psychic: weakness hurt a lot. However the 0 retreat cost is very nice. The attack is very good for Lucario AND Mew. You send any pokemon which helps against the opponentĀ“s deck to the lost zone and you can use Mew as a second attacker. Against SP you will send a SF Champ and abuse Take Off. Agaisnt a :fighting: deck you send a Houndoom UL/COL and use Fire counterattack to do lot damage for one energy. Against a poke-power/body only deck you send an UD Umbreon into lost zone and use moonlight fang. etc etc. Besides you get 100% a pokemon in the lost zone. However you have to make sure you start with Mew AND Psychic energy. Besides you cant use See off a lot because of Mews Stats.
    Absol Prime has 80 HP, 2x:fighting: weakness and -20 :psychic: resistance and 1 retreat. Its attack needs a:dark: and :colorless: and does 70 damage but you have to send a pokemon in lost zone. The body is like a miasma valley, but it works only if Absol is active. however every basic pokemon gets damage.
    Statswise Absol is the best of the 3 attackers. Decent HP, an okay weakness, good resistance but 1 retreat cost. However you need at least 2 turns to attack which is very slow compared to Mew and Relicanth. Moreover some decks are so fast that you cant even attack with Absol. Besides you cant abuse Techs well like mew does, because you have to search them (bebe, luxury ball, poke comm etc). Furthermore what can you send into your lost Zone? . But this is a good Lostgar Tech. Some might think:" Are you serious? this attack support gengar so well. He/she doesnt need to use hurl into darkness and can use Cursed Droplets to get their aim faster" Well this might be true, but Gengar cant keep up with decks which OHKOS gengar every turn. If you see he/she cant get gengar rdy, retreat it and use lucario instead which should be able to get your last prizes.
    Relicanth is the last of the 3 attackers. It has 80 HP, 2x:grass: and :colorless::colorless: as retreat cost. You need one 1 :colorless: to get a card into your lost zone and you can draw 3 cards.
    Statswise this card look decent on the hand and bad on the other hand. 80HP is good and 2x :grass: weakness as well because there are not many grass decks. But the 2 Retreat cost hurts a lot because i doubt you want to use 2 energies to retreat it. If there is a trainer lock, you cant use Switch/WP as well.
    But Relicanth is faster than Absol. You also can setup a lot better than with absol. Besides a 2nd/3rd/4th Relicanth becomes useless which is a good material for your Lost zone. But this card cant deal damage like Mew and Absol does. So you rely too much on Lucario as attacker.

    My Conclusion:

    Of course it isnt good to play only one of these attackers. You should play at least 2 of them. I suggest to use Mew in every lucario deck. Absol vs Relicanth? Well this decision needs playtesting but if your meta is a lot trainer lock, i think ABsol is the better choice because you can retreat it faster. Relicanth is good against decks which make your setup hard.

    3.1 Palkia G

    So i think Palkia G needs an own part because it is different from Mew, Absol and relicanth. You only have to get bench pokemon and then you can send pokemon into lost zone by using the poke-power.
    First of all the stats. Palkia G is a 100HP basic pokemon with 2x:lightning: weakness and :colorless::colorless: retreat cost. it got a :water::colorless: hit and run attack and a :water::colorless::colorless: spread. The Lv.X got 20hp more than the Non X and its attack is similiar to Dragon Rush.
    Statswise it is decent. 100 HP /120HP are too good, but the weakness and retreat cost hurts a lot. Besides you need to have Palkia G active to play the Lv.X which is slow. But if you get the LV.X out, you can send pokemon into the lost zone without wasting a turn for the attack. Pokemon which should be sent into the lost Zone are pokemon with a "Come-into-play" effect like
    Uxie LA
    Mesprit LA
    Azelf LA
    Shaymin UL
    Giratina PT

    If you use Pokemon tools (unown q e.g.) you can send an extra pokemon into your lost zone.

    4. end part

    So guys that are my thougts on lucario COL. Pls tell me what you think and which option you would suggest if you play Lucario. I know I did some language mistakes but English isnt my main language and i hope you understand me what i want to say. Critism is also welcome but i dont like comments like "Lost World will beat you. take another Deck". Against Lost World Decks you have to play different. If i get time i will add some techs they could help in this deck
     
  2. wulfboy15

    wulfboy15 New Member

    Hm, I'd say at least 2 Absol Prime and 1 or 2 Relicanth. Reason why: Absol is going to be your main tech against Gengar Prime while Relicanth gives you good draw. Depending on the deck you play should make you chose what you use (Absol for Gengar, Relicanth for pretty much anything else to get a good set up)
    If you're feeling spontaneous, then put in a Mew Prime to sweep (especially if you have a Lucario in the Lost Zone)
    Now, non-Pokemon wise I say you might want to think about cards like Judge and/or Cyrus Initiative since both are rather disruptive.
     
  3. ashinto

    ashinto New Member

    Why would you use Absol Prime as your LostGar tech, you're making there job easier?? If I had to make a list for this deck (well, Pokemon wise) I would use this.

    3-3 Lucario
    1-1 Palkia G
    2 Absol Prime
    2 Relicanth
    1 Mew Prime
    1 Azelf
    2 Uxie
    1 Mesprit
    1-1 BDK
    19 Pokemon

    Something along with lines of that probably. BDK is your LostGar counter, you only need 4 basics out to kill it, 5 if they level up.
     
  4. Pikabruce

    Pikabruce New Member

    I think Lucario would make the basis for an acceptable donk deck, which I have done. But I'm not sure it would work as a normal deck.

    Riolu from Platinum is the one to use, because it can attack for 20 or 30 with a DCE. In one game I was able to win with just Riolu against a Spiritomb start, knocking out the Spiritomb with two attacks, and Seeker-ing his only benched Pokemon.

    Palkia G.X is the best way to send your Pokemon to the Lost Zone quickly. If those Pokemon have an Unown Q attached, that will increase Lucario's Dimension Sphere very quickly.

    Lucario can OHKO Gengar, but without an Expert Belt, Lucario would need 6 of your Pokemon in the Lost Zone to OHKO Gengar Lv.X. If you have 5 in the Lost Zone, the opponent can leisurely build a Gengar on the bench, letting you KO some pixies and take a few prizes; when the opponent is ready, he can send up Gengar, Seeker and win the game on the next turn.

    Against a standard opponent, Lucario is still very vulnerable because so many people play Uxie Lv.X, which can OHKO Lucario.

    That's why I feel that Lucario is acceptable as a donk deck (and will be better if/when trainers can be played on the first turn), and it might be OK as a "fun deck", but I don't think it has tournament potential in long games. (Although it might work as a backup attacker in a Mew-Gyarados deck, when Mew faces Umbreon.)
     
  5. wulfboy15

    wulfboy15 New Member



    Because Absol Prime makes your job easier by OHKOing a Gengar.
     
  6. ashinto

    ashinto New Member

    You take a prize, they have one more Pokemon in the lost zone along with the ability to use twins....anyone else seeing this here or is it just me??
     
  7. vegitalian

    vegitalian New Member

    If you want a Lucario speed engine, you'll be looking at something like:

    Pokemon: 24
    4-4 Lucario
    2-2 Palkia G Lv. X (or 1-3, alternatively)
    4 Unown R
    3 Unown Q
    3-1 Uxie Lv. X
    2 Mesprit
    1 Azelf

    T/S/S: 32
    4 Victory Medal
    4 Pokemon Collector
    4 Poke Drawer+
    4 Pokedex Handy910S
    4 Level Max
    4 Junk Arm
    4 BTS
    2 Great Ball
    2 Defender

    Energy: 4
    4 DCE

    Basically, get a Palkia with Q on the bench (and Uxie with Q), level Max (up to 8 times if you have to), send Palkia and Uxie to the lost zone, and hit for 150 (repeatedly while using Defender to keep Lucario alive). The only thing you need to watch for is Lostgar or trainer lock, but if you go half into this idea and start countering other decks, you'll never be able to beat something like Luxchomp or Dialgachomp.
     
  8. Ace-

    Ace- New Member

    hello,

    thank you for your responses

    Absol Prime:

    Well i think this card is a doubleedge blade. In early this card gives you prizes and for the mid/late game use lucario to 2KO gengars. Gengar has a huge problem if gengars are OHKOd every turn (my experience with lostgar). Thats just theory but i need to practice with absol tech

    I tested a Palkia G /Lucario variant. Biggest problem were trainer lock or to retreat palkia g lv.x. Against LC this deck wasnt that bad, but i was lucky that there was no spray for Palkia G X Power. Agaisnt Vilegar i lost because of the big retreat cost of palkia.
     
  9. ashinto

    ashinto New Member

    Play warp energy to get palkia out of there.
     
  10. baby mario

    baby mario Front Page Article Editor<br><a href="http://pokeg

    You REALLY don't want to have to 2HKO Gengars with this deck . . . that's another Pokemon in your LZ.

    I would run it with a bit more SP - Absol G X or Weavile to OHKO Gengars. You could try Krow SV.

    Also 3-4 Mesprit. Probably 4 as you can't have too much Power Lock.
     
  11. ashinto

    ashinto New Member

    Krow SV is the best one (you only need a total of 4 basics out, your's or your opponent's) to get a KO on a Gengar (you'll need 5 out or a belt if the gengar is leveled up). You already play dark and DCE, so why not??

    Vegitalian's list would be the one I would go for, it looks the most solid/consistent. Though I don't like the fact that you will be murdered by VileGar (LostGar doesn't look that easy either).
     
  12. Ace-

    Ace- New Member

    The list i tested were without mew and absol because i dont have both. I only ran Lucario+Palkia G+ Relicanth+ some benchsitters like azelf, mesprit. So i dont play dark energies(for now) and no anti gengar tech.
    VegitalianĀ“s deck looks pretty solid. however its an auto loss against scizor and trainer lock. what do you think of 1-1 dialga g ?
     
  13. Pikabruce

    Pikabruce New Member

    If you include 1-1 Dialga G, then you will need to include cards to retreat it from your active position or (if using Level Max), cards to return DGX to your deck, because Level Max only works on a card in the deck.

    This is my current Lucario Donk deck:

    POKEMON: 21
    4-3 Riolu (Plat)/Lucario (CoL)
    4 Uxie
    4 Unown R
    2-2 Palkia GX
    2 Unown Q

    SUPPORTER/TRAINER/STADIUM: 36
    2 Seeker
    4 Super Scoop Up
    4 Poke Drawer+
    4 Dual Ball
    4 Pokedex
    4 Junk Arm
    3 Pokemon Rescue
    3 Level Max
    2 Research Records
    2 Expert Belt
    2 Broken Time-Space
    1 Pokemon Communication
    1 Luxury Ball

    ENERGY: 3
    3 Double Colorless Energy

    The major differences between my deck and Vegitalian's list:

    He has 4 Pokemon Collector, I have 2 Seeker. If the opponent only has 2 Pokemon in play on my first trainer turn, I want to win the game on that first trainer turn, by knocking out the active and Seeker-ing the benched one. Seeker also helps keep the Uxie draw engine alive.

    He has 2 Mesprit and 1 Azelf. I need the bench space for PGX, a second Riolu/Lucario, and the Uxie draw engine.

    He has 4 Victory Medal, I have 4 Super Scoop Up. Until your Lucario is set up, SSU is needed to remove a starting Palkia G or Unown R, or to re-use Uxie. After Lucario is set up, SSU is useful to remove a damaged Lucario and avoid knock out. I originally had Victory Medal in my deck, but I took them out because other cards seemed more useful.

    He has 2 Defender, I have 2 Expert Belt. Defender is only useful for one turn. Also, Expert Belt reduces the number of Pokemon needed in the Lost Zone in order to OHKO Gengar.

    He has 2 Great Ball, I have 4 Dual Ball and 1 Luxury Ball. I want to be able to play Uxie from my hand so that I can use its power, which I can't do if it is played through Great Ball. Luxury Ball is for Lucario, or any other needed Pokemon.

    I have 3 Pokemon Rescue. Until Lucario is set up, Pokemon Rescue is normally used to re-use Unown R and keep the draw engine alive. After Lucario is set up, Pokemon Rescue can re-use a knocked out Riolu or Lucario.

    I have 2 Research Records. Can be very useful right before a card draw, to get the card(s) you need or to send card(s) to the bottom that you don't want right now.

    I have 1 Pokemon Communication. Sometimes it is impossible to get PGX into play before it is gone from the deck (either drawn or prized). Pokemon Communication lets you send one in your hand back into the deck, so that you can try Level Max again.
     

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