Lucario Need help

Discussion in 'Deck Help and Strategy' started by Spanky123, Aug 21, 2008.

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  1. Spanky123

    Spanky123 New Member

    I made this deck in about 10 minutes with some cards I've had laying around. I wanted to get some advice on if it will run or should i just trash it and save the cards for something worth while.

    Pokemon:16

    Chatot x2 MD
    Riolu x4 DP
    Lucariox3 DP
    Lucario LV.X MT
    Cranidos x3 MT
    Rampardos x3 Pop 6

    Trainers: 27

    Rival x2
    Professor Rowan x1
    Night Maintenance x2
    Professor Oaks Visit x1
    Bebe's Search x3
    Dusk Ball x3
    Switch x2
    Warp point x2
    Potion x2
    Quick ball x1
    TGM x1
    Plus Power x1
    Fossil Excavator x2
    skull fossil x4

    Energy: 17

    Basic Fighting 16
    Call energy 1


    I don't know if this deck would run but is has a good concept!
     
  2. Red Haired Shanks

    Red Haired Shanks New Member

    Heres my opinion:

    -2 potion
    -1 Skull Fossil
    -1 Riolu

    +3 Plus-Power
    +1 Dusk Ball
    Somehow, When I just play a 3-3-1 Lucario Line, The deck is way faster.

    ~Norman
     
  3. sandy4123

    sandy4123 New Member

    use new lucario its a better sniper
     
  4. Rai

    Rai <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=

    Uh, that's not relevant, since Lucario's a damage spreading deck, not a sniping deck. And I don't know what mathematics you're using, but Lucario DP spreads damage faster than Lucario LA.

    Let us say that both Lucarios have just been evolved and... shockingly didn't have energy on them until this turn! (This should give Lucario LA the edge because it starts selecting bench targets sooner then Lucario DP) But we're in luck; two fighting energies happen to be in our hand, and our opponent will be nice and not play Galactic's Wager or any other hand disruption. Shall I tally up how much damage Lucario is doing turn after turn?

    DP:
    Turn 1: 30 to active (via Feint)
    Turn 2: 70 total to active, 20 to bench (90 total damage)
    Turn 3: 110 total to active, 20*2 to bench (40 total, making 150 total damage)
    Turn 4: 150 total to active, 20*3 to bench (60 total, making 210 total damage)
    Turn 5: 190 total to active, 20*4 to bench (80 total, making 270 damage spread)

    As opposed to LA...
    Turn 1: 30 *1
    Turn 2: 30*2 (60 total)
    Turn 3: 30*3 (90 total)
    Turn 4: 30*4 (120 total)
    Turn 5: 30*5 (150 total)

    You realize that in 5 turns, Lucario DP has put 120 more damage into play? Sure, most of it will have been on whatever the active is. Combined with Metagross LA, that's not a bad thing at all. Turn 1, they're equal. Sure, Lucario LA might be considered better then because that 30's done to whatever you want. Turn 2, they're pretty much equal, as 70 or 60 won't mean any KOs unless it's on a basic. But Turn 3? Later? The extra 30 damage a turn's pretty hard to pass up, even if it means you're sniping 10 less, and it takes you an extra turn to set up. Granted, Lucario probably won't get to smack 5 turns in a row. Regardless, it only takes a few turns for that extra damage to make a difference.

    Unless of course, the goal of a damage spread deck has been misinterpreted (it IS to put the most damage in play as fast as possible, is it not)?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~

    NOW. With the deck help...

    I'd find Riolu LA to be more reliable then Riolu DP. Mostly 'cause you aren't flipping a coin to attack with LA. Given how many starters are weak to fighting (Pachirisu, Eevee, Stantler, Sentret, etc.), being able to hit with a fighting type early on is probably a good thing, and Riolu DP won't OHKO any of those, so the possiblity of dealing extra damage doesn't seem to make up for the possibility of dealing no damage.

    I think... You might find a more worthwhile partner then Rampardos, especially since Cranidos is essentially a weaker Lucario DP, and Rampardos's self damage doesn't make it too reliable for clean up. I suggested Metagross earlier, though it's a different energy type. You might want to give it a look, since being able to maximize Lucario DP's spread is a very nice trick.

    Your trainers certainly need help though. Lemme see here...
    -2 Rival (Inferior draw to most everything else, despite giving the greatest hand advantage of any supporter in the game)
    -2 Switch (Redundant when Warp Point's a lot better in this deck. ESPECIALLY redundant if you play Metagross LA)
    -2 Potion (Healing... AFTER the fact doesn't seem to help when plenty of cards can OHKO a Lucario)
    -1 TGM (Lonesome joe, and less draw power then Oak's Visit while holding less potent a bonus then Buck's)
    -1 Pluspower (Not useful when lonely)
    -1 Quick Ball (Same as Pluspower)
    (IF you switch out Rampardos) -2 Fossil Excavator
    (Again, if you switch out Rampardos) -4 Skull Fossil (If you keep Rampardos, reduce the Skull Fossil count to 3)

    You typically want to play 3 or 4 copies of your key supporters, hence why I'm trimming down on the multitudes of Lonesome Joes. If you happen to play Gardevoir for instance, they'll delight in being able to take a vast variety of options with supporters, while you might get frustrated with how you're finding Team Galactic's Mars when you need Oak's Visits, and so forth. A minor trick like Warp Point is fine at 2 copies though, as you probably won't need it every single turn.

    +3 Buck's Training (Helps with reaching the odd numbers to KO Gallades and the like. Pluspower is a fine alternative, but I like being able to draw at the same time, and you shouldn't need to stack these frequently)
    +2 Professor Oak's Visit (Highest hand advantage that's useful, IMO)
    +2 Cynthia's Feelings (Useful shuffle draw, similar to Rowan's but for different times)
    +3 Roseanne's Research (NEEDED to get out basics and energy quickly. Especially if your replacement line uses an energy other then fighting)
    (If you cleared out the Fossil Excavator) +2 Quick Ball (ensured pokemon, and the 2 copies is... Lower then I'd like, but as space allows...)
    (If you cleared out Rampardos) +2 Rare Candy, +2 Pokeradar (gets the replacement line out faster with rare candies. Lucario doesn't really care about having Candy though...)

    You might notice the Clearing out Rampardos option has you inserting 16 cards, while you'd only be removing 15 cards. That's 'cause your replacement line should be a 2 basic, 1 stage 1, and 2 stage 2 line, especially with Rare Candies. If you decide the replacement line should be stage 1 for the final evolution, then instead of playing 2 rare candy and a 2-1-2 line, you should play a 3-3 line and 3 Pokeradar.
    Certainly you could play a smaller Rampardos line to fit tricks like Rare Candy. However, I think Rampardos is one of the few stage 2s with limited benefits from Rare Candy, because Cranidos is actually a decent pre-evolution, and Rampardos has limited options unless it has three energies. Thus, a 3-3-3 line actually sounds reasonable.

    Finally, I'd do what I could to have 16 or 17 energies, with three of them being Call Energies. If you slip in another line, finding out how many energies could be Multi and how many could be basics of another color would be useful. It really depends on what you decide on a partner, though.
     
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