PokeGym Roundtable 29 - Rulings and PokéGym Teasers

Discussion in 'Roundtable Podcast' started by bulbasnore, Aug 10, 2008.

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  1. bulbasnore

    bulbasnore Administrator Staff Member Trader Feedback Mod

    Pokegym Roundtable Podcast

    Roundtable 29: LA rulings preview and new Gym features


    Show Notes:

    This show PokePop & bulbasnore preview some Rules Team discussion on Legends Awakened (LA) and give you a preview of some coming content featuers on the Gym.

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    Last edited: Aug 10, 2008
  2. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    thanx for the ditto card ruling I was getting really confused with that
     
  3. Brawler

    Brawler <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=

    Listening to it right now!

    Thanks! Some of my questions will be finally answered!
     
  4. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    If the Ditto ruling is correct, then 2 Active Dittos have infinite HP. They both gain 20 more than the other one, so the second the other one comes active, the first one has 60+20, the second one then gets the 80 and adds 20, the first one then gets that 100 and adds 20, so on, and so on.
     
  5. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    I know I brought it up in league, but my league leader lissanne said that they just both get 80 hp and they don't go beyond that.
     
  6. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    That is probably how it will eventually be ruled, but the idea that was thrown around during the Podcast was that Ditto would receive the maximum HP of the defending, which would be 80HP in this case (defending being 60HP + 20 from Snowpoint) and then Snowpoint would affect it, adding another 20, making it 100HP.

    If that is true, and Ditto does copy the maximum HP of the defending, when 2 dittos are active, their HP is always updating to be 20HP over the other. Of course, neither can damage each other, but it would be funny to see 2 infinite HP Pokemon.
     
  7. PokePockets

    PokePockets New Member

    Just listened to the Podcast, and what i got from what they said about Ditto, i would rule that it would have 100 HP since it specifically states on the card that it copies the defending pokemon's MAXIMUM HP, in which case that Ralts would have 80 Maximum HP
     
  8. Brawler

    Brawler <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=

    What about Deoxys-D having that weird card text?

    I don't believe that was mentioned.
     
  9. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    no but if 2 dittos were in play with snow point temple this is what would happen

    ditto #1 would have have 80 hp from copying the opposing ditto who got an hp boost from snow point temple and then get his own hp boost to put himself up to 100 hp

    ditto #2 would copy the 100 hp of ditto #1 and then get his boost from snow point temple to put himself up to 120 hp.

    ditto #1 would copy that 120 hp and get a snow point boost putting it self up to 140 hp.

    this takes action forever
     
  10. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    Both poké-bodies take place at once, there is no taking turns #1 #2 and updating the values. The dittos are given a boost to their HP by snowpoint before and after Ditto DNA is applied. Once its applied, it doesn't update itself, as it already has a value to use, even if the other Ditto gets something on top of that.

    If Ditto looked at the other Ditto for a second time, it would be looking at a result of its own poké-body, which doesn't make any sense at all. However HP is calculated, the poké-body doesn't stack on itself, you can't use values which are a result of the poké-body itself to update the HP.

    E.g. Both dittos have 80 HP from Snowpoint temple, and copy this value as their max HP. 20 is then added to this value, to give 100. If Ditto DNA were to be rechecked, you'd have to remove the effect Ditto DNA already had, and the value would be reset to 80, and then 20 added again to give 100.

    You can't take turns with the Dittos and keep using their poké-bodies. A poké-body is always in effect, and only affects a pokémon once.

    Besides, it's not as if there is a contradiction caused. Both Ditto's have the same HP and everything has been taken into account, so everything is OK. Nothing gets re-applied, and rechecking everything gives the same values.
     
  11. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    I'm just confused by the way it was theorized in the Podcast. They mentioned that the other basic would gain the +20HP, and end up at 80HP, then Ditto would copy that 80HP and gain the +20HP. It definitely seemed like a "take turns" thing. Ralts gained 20HP, now Ditto's HP matches the maximum amount and then it gains 20HP. Let's say it was a grass basic. If I put Shaymin lv.X in play, Ditto would now copy the new maximum HP and then gain +20.

    But I guess the way you explain it, the Ditto thing wouldn't work, because the second one ditto discarded the +20HP to now apply the new maximum HP on the other ditto, the other ditto would then readjust it's HP to copy the first ditto. Because of that, they'd both go back to 60HP, then both go to 80HP, then both go to 100HP. It wouldn't happen one at a time, it would readjust at the same time, thus the inability for one to pump the other to pump the first one, over and over, etc.
     
  12. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    It's not a take turns thing. Ralts NEVER has 60HP. It doesn't have 60HP and THEN 80HP, it just has 80 because of snowpoint. There is only one value Ditto can use, and that is the maximum HP! There is no point where Ralts' HP is anything but 80, and that is the value that is used by Ditto.

    Ditto never re-adjusts itself back and forth, it just does what it does at the same time as any other effects by looking at the max HP. No oscillation, just a value set. The value in Ditto v Ditto is 80, each copying the other's HP that snowpoint has added to and setting that as the max HP to which 20 is added. Actually, I'm not sure whether snowpoint should be counted twice or not, but everything else I am certain.

    Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

    By the way Prime, have you thought about what would happen in a Ditto mirror if one (and only one) had an Unown E attached? :grin:

    As unown E has the same text phrasing as Snowpoint temple, it must work the same, being applied before and after copying.

    Ditto A with the unown E attached would initially have 70, and Ditto B must copy it to give B 70 HP too. Ditto A must copy that too, and E must be reapplied to the maximum. So they diverge to infinite!

    So Prime, although I do not think your specific example results in infinite HP, I have no idea how this situation with Unown E should work out.

    Better ask the masters... :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2008
  13. Regis_Neo

    Regis_Neo Moderator

    *Downloads and listens to*

    Btw, will there be like a worlds one in the future?
     
  14. Brawler

    Brawler <a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=

    Saw a situation the other day with Azelf.

    Person thought the only prize you have to flip back over is the one you put back down.

    But, it does not mention flipping over prizes.

    Errata please?
     
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