Directions on how to differentiate Voter Input over other comments:
-Read carefully through each deck.
-Title your post as "Voter Input."
-Tell me which deck right off the bat deserved the win.
-In a few sentences, tell me why that deck deserved the win, and the other deck didn't.. Remember, this is a 1 v. 1 format, meaning that you aren't choosing the best of four, but the best of two...twice.
-Use some grade at the bottom of your post to rationalize your decision - preferably the system I've been using this whole contest.
~~~EspeonChris14 VS Noir~~~
EspeonChris14
"this Challenge was pretty hard.
POkemon(21)
2x Misdreavus LA
1x mismagius SF
1x mismagius DP
3x Uxie LA
1x Uxie Lv X LA
2x Azelf LA
1x azelf MT
1x azelf lv X LA
2x Mesprit LA
1x Mesprit MT
1x Mesprit lv X LA
1x Palkia GE
1x Palkia lv X GE
3x unown R LA
trainers(27)
4x Roseanne's Research
2x Cynthia's Feelings
4x Premier Ball
4x Energy Switch
4x energy Pickup
3x Warp point
3x SnowPoint Stadium
2x Night matainance
1x switch
Energys (12)
12x Psychic
basically this is a AMU deck. With a mismagius tech. The tech is For
big pokemon that have energy that you can ohko or deal big damage
and with the use of
palkia to send something big back to the bench and use mismagius to
send it back to their hand. Unown R, Uxie and Uxie lv x For drawing in to
cards early.
its a basic AMU list. Azelf For getting cards that are prized in to your
hand, Mesprit for disruption and free retreat. Roseannes research to get
pokemon and
energy, Cynthia' for when something is koed to gain a 8 card hand and
normal trainers like premier ball to get lv x's, energy switch for moving
energys
around, energy pickup for that needed energy to use for Mesprit lv x.
Warp points help with mismagius and palkia lv x. Snow point for the
needed energy attachment.
The deck explains it self. every card can be used in their own ways..
Thank you for reading.
Noir
Pokemon: (25)
4x Mismagius (DP)
4x Mismagius (SF)
2x Baltoy
2x Claydol
4x Unown E
4x Unown Q
1x Unown C
2x Croagunk (MD)
2x Toxicroak (MD)
Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums: (25)
4x Roseanne's Research
4x Bebe's Search
3x Professor Oaks Visit
3x Night Maintenance
3x Time-Space Distortion
2x Poke Radar
2x Warp Point
2x Technical Machine TS-1 (Evolve)
1x Team Galactic's Wager
1x Cynthia's Feelings
Energy: (10)
10x Psychic Energy
Note: Had this been DP-SF, Lumineon would be in place of Toxicroak as it works perfect w/ Mismagius' 2nd attack.
Strategy:
The strat to the deck is fairly simple. Mismagius will be your main attacker using search cards to easily bring out Unown Q's & Unown E's to attach, discard and do damage with 1st attack. Q's work great because Mismagius & Toxicroak get free retreat with those, and E's boost HP by 10. Roseanne's, Bebe's, Radar, and other draw cards make it easy to bring those out. Since there are a lot of pokemon in this deck Poke Radar usually goes good. After discarding use the Night Maintenance and TSD's to bring back the Q's & E's. Claydol of course is for draw power. The 1 Unown C is used to get a Q or E once per turn with it's "Call" poke power, with the recycling of those 2 cards, C can prove very very helpful. Toxicroak is here as a backup attacker for between Mismagius attacks. The reason I chose Toxicroak is because it is a stage 1 so it's easier to get out and doesn't require candies, has a very low energy cost to attack, and not only does it do damage, but it has a chance to poison and paralyze the defending pokemon. This is great because this deck doesn't push out tons of damage amazingly fast with 80 being the max per turn, so with paralyze & poison it helps to take down higher HP pokemon without sacrificing Mismagius'. The 2 TS-1's are if you can get them out fast will help to evolve Misdreavus, Croagunk, & Baltoy, after that it is just for discarding w/ Mismagius attack. Always leave 1 spot on the bench open for Q & E.
Ideal Layout:
Mismagius Active
Claydol Benched
Toxicroak Benched
Mismagius Benched
Unown C Benched
Open Bench Spot for placing Q/E then attaching.
I think the Unown Q's & E's work awesome with the new Mismagius as opposed to stacking the deck with tons of tools and TM's because, 1) Q's & E's are searchable with supporters where regular tools & TM's are obtainable through draw. 2) Q's & E's are pokemon when not attached so they can be easily brought back from discarding with Night Maintenance & TSD, where regular tools require special attacks to get them back.
Thanks again for grading
~Noir
Now, unlike division one, I think that since preliminary grades are a way for me to bounce opinions back and forth with the membership, I'll comment on the entries in relation to each other much more. Anyways:
-Both lists are good, but suffer from two distinct sets of issues:
*EspeonChris is focusing his build on an AMU/Mismagius hybrid...But he only runs 1-1 Azelf. Also, his draw seems a little low - probably a result of fitting the deck-thinner, Unown R.
*Noir takes the standard Claydol approach to deckbuilding, but doesn't have much backup in case his Claydol doesn't get out fast enough. Aside from taht, it's a pretty solid list.
8/10 for both.
Hmmm...Creativity:
*Espeonchris14, as he states in his entry, has just taken a pre-existing archetype, and threw Mismagius in it.
*Noir has just straight Mismagius, unowns (good), and Toxicroak. The Toxicroak, as I go into detail later, is random.
Creativity: 2/5 for EspeonChris
3/5 for Noir
EspeonChris's entry neglects Mismagius in just about every way, except Palkia Level X gusting up things, and then making Horror Chant a more effective attack. Noir takes many standard steps to making MisMagius works, but he does it quite well. Crash Chant's damage output looks very reliable. But, Noir's addition of Toxicroak is a little random...While I understand why he put it in, it doesn't do much to further Mismagius.
EspeonChris14: 1/5
Noir: 3/5
EspeonChris14 TOTAL: 11/20
Noir TOTAL: 14/20
My verdict goes to
Noir
~~~CardzMaster2004 VS Magnechu~~~
CardzMaster2004
5 Psychic Energy
3 Amulet Coin
3 Technical Machine TS-2
4 Technical Machine TS-1
2 Night Maintenance
3 Time-Space Distortion
2 PlusPower
3 Warp Point
2 Buck's Training
4 Bebe's Search
4 Roseanne's Research
4 Misdreavus L.18 LA
4 Mismagius SF
4 Phione MD1
2 Claydol GE
2 Baltoy GE
3 Unown E L18 MT
2 Unown G GE
4 Unown Q MD
Strategy: T2 80 damage to whatever you want (ideally a key basic or Baltoy, screwing over their set-up). Idealy, you set up T1 with a Misdreavous with a TS-1 attached or with a Phione and energy to Power out an auto T2 MisMagius. Since this deck doesn’t hit hard (only early), your best bet is to guarantee a T2 Mage. Hence, the inclusion of 4-offs in Phione, Bebe, and TS-1 (the latter of which also compliments the damage percentage). Since you’re almost guaranteed a T2 80 damage due to being able to snap the Unowns and (hopefully) the TS-1 for the first turn. With the use of Unown Q to provide free retreat, you shouldn’t need Moonlights in this deck. E is included at 3 because of its HP boosting (which is generally more useful) to G’s 2 simply because status is currently not as prevalent a threat in the format. If status did become an issue, these numbers would be flipped or even go as steep as 4/1 in favor of G. Claydol is self-explanatory. Phione is an interesting addition, as by simply adding this card I am required to run a build for this deck with energy. However, the speed that this thing adds to my deck makes up for it. It guarantees me pretty much an auto T2 Mage and also gives me a second target for PokeTools incase I need to snap another for extra damage.
T2 Magius is crucial to this deck’s success. Hence, it runs the full amount of TS-1 (to also later be used as ammo), Bebe’s, and Phiones. Roseanne’s are also run at full capacity to grab vital Unowns or Baltoy’s or even fetch an energy needed to power Phione or Magius.
One of the HUGEST drawbacks of this deck is its firepower. Post T4, chances are that their active isn’t going to have a low enough HP that you can KO it with just an 80 shot. Hence, the inclusion of certain trainers. To add more firepower or kill a 90 HP Stage 1, I have included Buck’s (at 2) and Plus Powers (at 3). I greatly wish Strength Charms were legal, as I would choose them over the PPs (better deck interaction than the PPs IMHO). Also, if their Active can’t be KOed but the rest of their bench can, you can Warp Point in, snap a Q for free retreat, then hit for the 80 and another KO. Getting to this ammunition can be a challenge, so card drawing in the manner of Buck (which also pumps), Claydol, and Amulet Coin (HIGHLY underrated IMHO, also pumps) are included as well. When Warps dry out, the use of a 60 attack plus TS-2 the turn after is usually the key to your late-game kills. Holding back your TS-2s to make this move a shock to your opponent is the most difficult part of this strategy and should only be ...
Holding back your TS-2s to make this move a shock to your opponent is the most difficult part of this strategy and should only be employed when other options are not available (TSDs gone, no Warp available). TS-2 is not run at full capacity as its sole role is to power Magius’ attack. Its other use is rather narrow in a deck that hopes to OHKO everything, so its late game use is more viable than its early. Never snap more that 2, as the third can be used as a surprise tactic.
Because of the limited amount of times Magius’ attack can be used, a lot of discard pile recursion is needed. 3 TSDs will give the player ample access to a possible 3 Pokémon per turn and the 2 NM are included in case vital energy is sent to the discard pile or your only access to more pokémon is through using Roseanne’s.
I toyed with an energy-less deck idea for the longest time and decided against it. Why? Well, this is IC and to completely ignore one of the Pokemon’s attacks is deck suicide. While it is a slightly underpowered attack, returning a key Candied evolution to your opponent’s hand is more than a happy thing. While the applications are slim, they do exist. Also, the inclusion of energy is KEY to this deck running at full speed, as Phione is one of the keys to a T2 Ghost Mage. While energy-less is certainly viable, a part of the deck’s speed and versatility is sacrificed in the name of creativity IMHO.
Ideal Set-Up:
T1: Phione or Misdreavous active. Use Roseanne for energy or Baltoy and an Unown. Use either TS-1 or Evolutionary Wish to net a MisMagius.
T2: Use Claydol (should be able to locate through drawing or Bebe’s) or Roseanne’s to get out the rest of the needed Unowns, TMs, or Tools. Use Warp or retreat if needed. Attack for 80 and KO.
T3: Grab more Unowns, TMs, and Tools through Claydol, Bebe, and Roseanne. Bench/search for a second Misdreavous if one ahs not been located yet. Use Buck or PPs if desired. Attack for 80+ and another KO.
T4: Snap a TSD or NM for Unowns and/or energy. Bench and snap Unowns from TSD. Evolve to second MisMagius if this has not been done yet. Warp to set up for new Mage and save other from KO. Attack for 80+ (+ if PPs and Bucks were employed) for KO.
T5: See “T4” and choose which actions are needed to get 80 damage plus a KO. Always ensure that there is a second Magius on your bench (never a third). Never have more than 3 pokemon on your bench at the end of your turn.
T6-8: PROFIT! (win!)
TecHs I Wish I could have included:
--Energyless build: This is the reason why Pokemon should start including multiple matches and a sideboard. An energyless version of this deck is MORE than viable and would include an other Unown G and E, another TSD, another TS-2 and another Claydol (to improve odds of drawing into him rather than spending time searching for him).
--Banette SW: Another energy-less build that ran 3-2 Banette for counter placement (avoids P resistant pokémon).
--Yanmega: Because of this decks low firepower, damage spread was another option I considered. Another energy-less build employing a 2-2 line plus another TS-2.
--Cress X: Low HP makes Cardz sad, and MisMagius has it in spades. Cress X alleviates some of this problem, but not much of it.
--Ampharos SW: Jamming doesn’t seem like a big deal until your opponent experiences essentially an entire bench PP for each Supporter they need to play. Energy-less build running 1/0/1, 3 RC.
--Luxray DP: Suggested by a friend when I asked for combo ideas. The strategy is to find all the pieces needed, then bench the Luxray, bench something useless to them, and return their biggest trheat to their hand. Run energy-less @ 1/0/1, 3 RC.
--Azelf X: No weakness is HUGE and it only takes 1 energy to attack. And its basic form is a huge utility card. Run @ 1-1, 4 psychic energy, -1 Amulet Coin.
Magnechu
Pokemon 24
4 Misdreavus LA
4 Mismagius SF
2 Baltoy GE
2 Claydol GE
4 Unown Q
4 Unown E
4 Unown G
Energy 7
3 Psychic Energy
4 Call Energy
Trainers 29
4 Technical Machine TS-1
4 Technical Machine TS-2
4 Night Maintenance
2 Time Space Distortion
4 Bebe's Search
4 Roseanne's Research
3 Cynthia's Feeling
4 PokeRadar
Okay, so Mismagius from SF...
First looking at the card, the 2nd attack seemed awesome. Dusknoir's power in an attack. With cards such as Lumineon this could be grea--oh wait can't use other SF cards
http://s4.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif
So, I figured I could use Luxray DP orrrr I could try to abuse the first attack. It could be doing 80 for 0 a lot of the time, I thought, so that's not bad at all. Swarming Mismagius from early turns and doing 80 for nothing couldn't be bad. And of course, if they get greedy and 4 bench, Mismagius can be there to punish them swiftly.
Now, the list:
Obviously 4-4 Mismagius if we're going to be swarming with him. Our main attacker, obviously.
2-2 Claydol for the consistency and draw power..
Now the interesting part. All 12 Unowns that can be attached as tools. Not only are they easier to find than regular tools (Roseanne, Bebe, PokeRadar) but they can be got back after discarding (Night Maintenance, Time Space Distortion). These Unowns are the source of Mismagius's power, how he does his constant 80 per turn. As an added bonus, all of the Unowns have abilities that if attached to Mismagius, will benefit him (her?). +10 HP, free retreat, or no effects from attacks all have their uses in certain situations. Not much else to say about these, but I guess you could attack with them if need be, as well.
Energy is simple: 4 Call as in most other decks, this is especially important because 1st-2nd turns you wanna load the bench with Unowns. Only 3 Psychic because you won't be using Mismagius' 2nd attack a lot, so not many are needed. They are here though when you do need to use that Dusknoir attack.
These Trainers are different from any deck I've ever made. To start off, 4 Evoluter and 4 Devoluter. Again, they serve a dual purpose. Foremost, they are ammunition for Mismagius. On the other side, Evoluter adds a lot of consistency into getting Claydol and Mismagius up, and Devoluter adds tricks to the deck. Being able to do 80 on something and then Devolve it if it goes to the bench is nice, or just Devolving a Candied guy. Either way, both of these are extremely useful in both ways.
4 Night Maintenance and 2 Time Space allow an extra 15 Pokemon (on average) back into your deck. I would say 2-4 of these would be Misdreavus/Mismagius, as your opponent should be forced to KO 6 Mismagius to win, so that leaves 11-13 Unowns to come back. That's 3 more turns of 80, which is huge.
4 Bebe/4 Roseanne for the consistency and the necessity in this deck to get Pokemon out above all else. 3 Cynthia's because Mismagius is frail and will die easily at times, and 8 cards the next turn is nothing to snubb at. 4 PokeRadar follows the same theme as Bebe and Roseanne, except it has the benefit of not being a supporter. You should be nabbing at least a Pokemon or two from PokeRadar, which is really good considering every Unown you get is +20 damage that turn.
Overall, I feel that this would be a solid deck. With all the tools/TMs/Pokemon retrieval cards, this deck can do 80 for 0 approximately 8 times or more during the course of the game, which should be enough, in combination with Devoluter and Mismagius' 2nd attack to win the game.
Good luck to my opponent and thank you Kettler!
Mikey
The lists of both
Cardz and
Magnechu are good. Cardz has an engine that is very indicative of getting out a T2 Mismagius, and so is Chu's: they both have four TS-1, which is excellent. However, I feel that since their focuses are getting out fast Mismags, Magnechu is wise to run 4 Call and 4 Roseanne.
Cardz has Phione, which could be considered a consistency crutch; however, based on the engine, four phione almost seems redundant. Magnechu has no crutching like Chatot or uxie, but that's bearable.
Ultimately, Magnechu's list is somewhat better, and is more likely to whip out a fast Mismagius. 8/10 to Cardz, and 9/10 to Magnechu.
Creativity is pretty brutally stale on both fronts. While Cardz does something interesting with Amulet Coin, it isn't enough to move him into the 3 range. 2/5 for both.
On the card use front, neither of you really abuse Horror Chant all that much, so I have to ask "who abuses Crash Chant the most? I view almost no real difference on this front. If my count is correct, then Cardz has
19 cards discardable for Crash Chant, while Magnechu has
20.
I see some good, nearly equal work on both fronts. 3/5 to both.
SO, with two nearly identical entries, with Cardz only differing from 'Chu on Phione and Amulet Coin, I simply have to decide whose deck functions better. I believe that Magnechu's does, and therefore give him the win:
CardzMaster2004: 8/10, 2/5, 3/5= 13/20
Magnechu: 9/10, 2/5, 3/5 = 14/20
