Professor Juniper in Gyarados

Discussion in 'Cards: Strategy and Rulings Discussion' started by bosoxfan818, Mar 20, 2011.

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  1. bosoxfan818

    bosoxfan818 New Member

    So for those of you who haven't seen this card from the B/W promo cards.

    Professor Juniper (Supporter)

    Discard your hand, Draw 7 cards.

    Umm.... Gyarados decks just got got bumped up to BDIF?
     
  2. Happiny13

    Happiny13 New Member

    It's a supporter. . . You will usually be using collector, but gust of wind makes it very nice in my opinion.
     
  3. bosoxfan818

    bosoxfan818 New Member

    Assuming the new rules go into place.

    T1: Start Sableye and either Collector in hand. Collector for 3 Karp, Impersonate for Juniper.
    T2: Hopefully with the cards you drew from Juniper, setup G-Dos. Hit for 90+.

    Ouch...
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2011
  4. Happiny13

    Happiny13 New Member

    ^That gives you a turn 3 Gyarados. Not good.
     
  5. z-man

    z-man New Member

    Just another reason I don't want the rulechange to be pre-rotation D: Because of the rulechange, you'll be allowed to open Sableye and play the collector in your hand just to Juniper the karp away. That would just be annoying. Gyarados is approaching the levels of scary good for post-rulechange pre-rotation. This isn't like LostGar... this is actually going to be nearly format breaking.
     
  6. yoyofsho16

    yoyofsho16 New Member

    Haven't you been playing for a while?
    FELICITY'S DRAWING.
    Explain to me how discarding ALL 3 KARP and drawing 7 is slower than what we currently have. Right now we have Regice and Junk Arm, which don't do much for setup other than discard cards (Junk Arm does get back trainers, though). This is a GOOD, can't-be-locked card for discarding that Volkner's has been so useless in replacing, which is what Gyarados has needed.

    The example given doesn't make sense, as if you started with Sableye you'd have a BRAND NEW HAND OF 7 CARDS t2, and t1 with BW rules as z-man said. Saying this is bad is just not within the boundaries of common sense.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2011
  7. Porii Sames

    Porii Sames Active Member

    If the rule change comes mid season without a rotation, people will all play Sableye donk/Gyarados. And then Vilegar. And the Dchomp to beat Vilegar.

    It will be counter deck attack.
     
  8. bosoxfan818

    bosoxfan818 New Member

    This is WORST case scenario
     
  9. Happiny13

    Happiny13 New Member

    Felicities made Gyarados slower, but they had amu to make up for it at the time. I think it'll be faster just with junk arm and regice.
     
  10. yoyofsho16

    yoyofsho16 New Member

    This happens all the time... it's called meta.
    Vilegar wouldn't beat this, it only requires Supprters and BTS to setup. With 4 BTS, 4 Gyarados, 4 Collector, and 4 Juniper, you've got an average 1 of each per 15 cards... with Starting hand + 1st/2nd turn draw + 7 new Juniper cards, you're already going through 16 cards of your deck, and that's WITHOUT trainers.

    ---------- Post added 03/21/2011 at 12:02 AM ----------

    Explain how? There WASN'T a Junk Arm or Smeargle 1 year ago, so people weren't playing Drawer.
    T2 Gyarados with a Sableye start was VERY common last year, all you had to do was t1 play collector and t2 play felicity's to have access to a total 11 cards, more than 50% chance of getting the crucial BTS. Now you're talking 5 or 6 more cards WITH the benefit of Poke Drawer and Junk Arm. This is so obviously good. Just try it.
     
  11. Happiny13

    Happiny13 New Member

    ^T2 90 wasn't common at all. It was considered god start iirc. I got laughed at when I tried making a speed build that could get T2 90.
     
  12. yoyofsho16

    yoyofsho16 New Member

    Perhaps? T2 60 definitely wasn't uncommon with a sableye start.

    I just played 20ish test hands, and you're further from correct than I can possibly conceive someone being on any topic.

    I didn't fail to get a t2 60 once, and 3/4 of the time I got 90. Half the time it was t1 (BW rules). ONLY ONCE did I even touch Poke Drawer, and that was because it was in my starting hand. This was with 4-4 Gyara, 4 sableye, 4 Juniper, 4 collector, 4 BTS, 4 Drawer, 4 Junk Arm, 2 Uxie. I didn't always get BTS, but every time I didn't I laid Karp down t1 anyways. With Unown R, that could be even more nuts.
     
  13. Box of Fail

    Box of Fail New Member

    Sableye will be BCIF if they implement the new rule changes. Gah.
     
  14. Phazon Elite

    Phazon Elite New Member

    ^ Yeah, for like three months. lol.
     
  15. ogremarauder

    ogremarauder New Member

    Easy fix -- Ban Sableye. Is banning a card somehow taboo? EVERY other popular tcg has had to do it at some point. Why not get rid of the offending card and clean up the format a little. I'm not advocating a banned list of every card that is good, just a few certain "broken" misfits.
     
  16. The Knee

    The Knee New Member

    If we don't get a mid-format shift I think we'll see a drop in interest, and in the increasing trend of Regionals attendence over the stellar improvements of the last few years. We've had the same top tier decks for way too long. Look at this years field for regionals. Luxchomp, Gengar, Gyarados, Dialga, Machamp. Sound famaliar? Japan pretty clearly has larger problems at the moment, so their difference in format is inconsequential.

    I think a lot of the player base would respond positively to a Pre-national format shift of RR-on, or at least something. A fresh format would motivate players and give the game the "Fresh start" a lot of people feel it needs.

    ---------- Post added 03/21/2011 at 11:39 AM ----------

    It's not Just sableye. If you leave platinum rotated in when B/W comes out and the rules are implemented I'm willing to wager over 70% of games don't last past t1. I'd bet my account on it.
     
  17. Scipio

    Scipio New Member

    While true, Sableye is a big culprint here. With the Candy nerf, Stage 2 donks are a fair bit harder to pull off.

    Uxie and co though...-shudders-.
     
  18. Box of Fail

    Box of Fail New Member

    Personally, I'd like to see them print B/W without midseason rotation, BUT they should not implement the new rules until the rotation after worlds.
     
  19. jeffrey123

    jeffrey123 New Member

    how will sableye be broken if you can play trainers t1? idgi...

    ooh is it belts and bats and stuff?
     
  20. BlisseyRocks

    BlisseyRocks New Member

    Two supporters first turn? the ability to ALWAYS go first and play two supporters sounds pretty darn good to me.
     

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