Rushing magma deck

Discussion in 'Deck Help and Strategy' started by guilleg33, Aug 2, 2016.

  1. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    Hey folks, im here to post another deck i made:

    Pokemon (11)
    x4 blaine's magmar
    x3 cindaquil (smokescreen)
    x3 dark quilava
    x1 dark thyplosion

    Trainer (11)
    x4 time capsule
    x4 good manners
    x3 blaine

    Energy (38)
    x38 fire energy

    i can actually make a pure-less version like:

    Pokemon (12)
    x4 blaine's magmar
    x4 cindaquil (smokescreen)
    x3 dark quilava
    x1 dark thyplosion

    Trainer (15)
    x4 time capsule
    x4 good manners
    x4 blaine
    x3 poke gear

    Energy (33)
    x33 fire energy

    The idea is simple: fast damage, nothing else. Discard energy and make damage, use good manners to look up for blaine´s magmad and put 2energy in the turn with blaine, next turn up to 100 damage. Then use time capsule to recycle the energy. Interesting easy deck.

    any suggestion?
  2. ShadowCard

    ShadowCard Active Member

    This is Team Rocket - Neo Destiny?

    //strictly sticking to this idea
    This deck seems divided. I don't like the 1 Dark Typhlosion. Either Blaine's Magmar is the primary attacker and you don't use Dark Typhlosion--and you won't be able to because you won't be able to place the energy reliably--or Dark Typhlosion is the primary attacker with Blaine's Magmar as the Pokemon supplying the energy to discard.

    I like Mary decks like this. At a certain point, you end up with energy in hand that you need in the deck and, because you have no way to cycle the trainers out of the deck consistenly, you will have trainers trapped in the deck. With Mary, try to draw into those trainers and you shuffle the energy cards back into the deck.

    I simply do not like PokeGear. It is not work like Skyla does. You should be running Neo Genesis Cleffa to cycle your hand. At least, replace it with Mary.

    With the low reliance on trainers, you should be running Chaos Gym. If you don't like that or decide to add more trainers, then Cinnabar City Gym, Rocket's Hideout, Energy Gym, or Ecogym are also options.

    I think Neo Revelation Entei will be better at attaching energy more reliably. Blaine is not fast enough because 60HP is not a hard number to get to. Pokemon will get KOed faster than you can set them up. You'll run out of energy in hand--you're just run out of cards in hand actually!

    I think you need a Double Gust. Without that, you're going to run into Baby problems. Cinnabar City Gym will only slow down Feraligatr for about 2 turns but because 60HP is so low you're going to just outright lose to it even without weakness.

    //deviating from this idea but keeping a similar idea
    There was a deck called EnteiCargo, which used Neo Revelation Entei and Neo Revelation Magcargo. Use Entei to attach energy to Magcargo and then use Magcargo's attack which doesn't require coin flipping. Cleffa to cycle the hand, Tyrogue to KO baby pokemon, your choice. Again, I really like Mary in this deck because it helps you put energy cards from your hand back into your deck, which can then be attached by Entei. 3-3 Magcargo + 3 Entei is less pokemon than the Magmar-Typhlosion method which gives you more room for trainers or more room to do 4-4 Magcargo + 4 Entei for consistency. Weakness and low HP are still issues when compared to Feraligatr but Lava Flow can OHKO Feraligatr where Lava Flow cannot.
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2016
  3. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    actually, i thought about chaos gym, because using x4 time capsule and if chaos gym fails, i can use the recoil effect from time capsule if my opponent uses it. Mary is ok, but i prefer 1 more fire energy in that slot, i need to make the deck with the least number of trainers as possible. Entei holw is ridiculusly awesome but i cant atack, in the turn i used howl, so its more vulnerable against removaling. Blaine`s magmar can attack without any energy discard from the pokemon so, if the opponent uses energy removal i can atack again if i put one more energy... Also, dark quilava has exactly the same ability as blaine`s magmar but it costs one less :fire: so its the perfect teammate, much better than entei howl, even with the great pokemon power.

    i also have macargo and slugma but, honestly i like the cindaquil smokescreen, ad dark quilava has outstanding power with :fire: :fire: . I put dark thyplosion as finisher, i dont create a deck arround dark thyplosion, its just another option to use if you have a good scenario.... with dark quilava and blaine´s magmar its plenty enough to beat almost any pokemon in 1 strike. Honestly i dont care too much about weakness, but cinnabar city gym is a great option

    i have to study this deck

    if i play ecogym i will be in the same problem, because energys will come back into my hand and not into my deck.
  4. ShadowCard

    ShadowCard Active Member

    guilleg33, you sound like league players who have a justification or defense for every card even though their deck does not function adequately :rolleyes: . I see why your deck is the way it is. Your deck will work better in 30-card where the recovery options are more restricted but not in 60-card.

    Your deck will work like a theme deck. The first few turns will start fine as you started with a basic pokemon + 6 other cards. After a few turns of energy attachments and playing whatever trainers you could find in those few turns, the game devolves to topdecking as you wait for energy without trainers to progress the game. Without big pokemon to wall against the opponent, as assuming your opponent is playing a decent deck, is you'll simply run out of hand and have no options as you attach energy every turn but every so often get a pokemon or trainer instead.

    1) Entei is worth losing your attack. You need the speed to have more than 1 Blaine's Magmar set up.
    2) "removaling" is not legal in Team Rocket - Neo Destiny. It doesn't really matter anyway: if you were truly afraid of it, you would be playing No Removal Gym or Ecogym (or Chaos Gym, that works too). And you have Blaine. If that isn't enough, then Blaine's Magmar is too inefficient in whatever format you are playing and you need to switch to Dark Typhlosion. Because it discards the fire energy, that energy will not be susceptible to removal. Attach it with Blaine and then discard it with Dark Typhlosion's attack. Maybe play Exp.All to save the energy if Dark Typhlosion is KOed.

    None of that matters because you have no way to search for Dark Quilava and Blaine's Magmar, like when playing theme decks, will not get KOs every turn because when one is KOed, you'll have to let another one be KOed in order to power up a benched one--if you can even get it--because you need 3 turns to power one up. Don't trick yourself into thinking you'll have a Blaine in hand whenever you need it. Again, lacking search and you cannot use it the same turn you use PokeGear.

    Dark Typhlosion will never have available energy in play to use its attack. It should be a 4th Dark Quilava or a Cleffa.

    That is what Mary is for. :wink:

    That is just deck functionality. In battle, you have no way to defeat Feraligatr or even slow it down. You don't have an answer for opponent's baby pokemon or Donphan (Neo Genesis). Scyther (Promo #42)--a fire-weak grass pokemon--will beat you too. Weird stuff like Dark Wartortle and Rocket's Hitmonchan are also faster; Erika's Dratini puts pressure on your to find Dark Quilava. Good news is that Pichu doesn't affect you and you don't get trapped by Murkrow.

    I don't know how useful Cinnabar City Gym would be because Blaine's Magmar only has 60 HP. But there are a lot of water pokemon with puny attacks and when you are devoting 3 energy to your main attacker, it may be worth it. Where you are at the moment, even Totodile is scary to run into.
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2016
  5. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    I see... u know, here in my country tcg community is not big enough and most of active people are not "competitive". In my case, we have only a gruop about 12 people and we all play old sets, from base set to neo (all neo) so, we dont play even an EX card or mega (stage 3) or eigther, or 150 to 200+ hp card. I could say i have not gone to a tournament maybe since 2005 or 2006... so this is just for fun hehehe.

    So...coming back into the topic: I think that make 100 damage in turn 2 is just a huge damage in therms of old gameplay and old sets, where most of basic pokemon (and maybe 100% of basic pokemon who has stage 1 or stage 2 evolve) are under 60 hp. Also, even a lesser damage atack (60 to 80) makes the rushing magma still worth. I dont know. I insist; the deck must have the shortest amount of trainers as possible, because thinking in the attacks, you dont need anything else.

    In this case, i find good manners as a brillant idea to drain out from the deck the basic pokemon, preventing to get out of basics in case some pokemon gets KO.

    Lets think another way:

    x4 blaine´s magmar
    x4 cindaquil (smokescreen)
    x4 dark quilava

    x4 time capsule
    x3 good manners
    x3 blaine
    x2 mary
    x1 cinnabar city gym

    x35 fire energy.

    But you know, being honest, i would like to make the energy number nearest as possible to 40. Just 3 good manners, 3 blaine and 4 time capusule in order to have x38 fire energy.... i dont know, I think that decks like this are designed for ALL OR NOTHING, without any medium therms and without studing too much the strategy. If the deck fails, ok, it fails.. but think it as pure damage only without any strategy. Start playing, send blaine´s magmar magmar, chance to hit 20 in first turn or preventing damage with smokescreen. Then, in second turn use blaine and put 2 more energy and... Voilá u reach 100 damage in turn 2 in the bestr scenario. Then you do the same in second and 3rd turn and use time capsuse when you got it. If blaine´s magmar die, it doesen´t matter, u have then another one or a dark quilava. Just focus on damke damage every turn and dont think in nothing else.

    I have another deck, more studyed, with Entei howl and i put there lots of trainer to make the deck most versatile as i can. But honestly i dont this deck can be compared with my entei holw or even with a retail damage swap in therms of strategy. This deck is just too rough..., too crude to think about the variables. Isn´t it?
  6. ShadowCard

    ShadowCard Active Member

    Try this:

    x4 blaine´s magmar
    x3 cindaquil (smokescreen)
    x3 dark quilava

    x4 Time Capsule
    x3 Good Manners
    x4 Blaine
    x4 Mary
    x3 PokeGear

    x32 fire energy.

    Removing Cinnabar City Gym is a meta choice. I'm envisioning a metagame among your friends that is evolving and adapting. If no one is playing Water, there is no need for Cinnabar City Gym except as a counter stadium but as discussed there are better stadiums for you to choose from if going that direction. If you use Chaos Gym, you should switch Good Manners for Pokemon March. If your friends use a lot of Colorless pokemon, use Sprout Tower. If using a lot of removal, use No Removal Gym (though I don't think it will stop them).

    I see a turn where you use a Good Manners, Mary, and then PokeGear and find a trainer to use on your next turn, maybe a Mary. I know I said I didn't like it earlier, but it does go 7 cards deep to try to get Time Capsule and Blaine out of the deck so they don't get discarded by Magmar.

    Right. But you are here because you are asking us to look at this deck and offer advice on how to win more games with it. Without knowing what decks your friends are playing (you offered no metagame info besides just now that your friends are playing non-competitive), I am setting my calliber to experienced league player or starting tournament player and then considering what kinds of decks were played back then and what they may look like if a player of a that skill level built one. But build the deck and let us know how it works! :smile:
  7. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    ok, ill try. Looking into my pool, i could only found x3 mary, so ill build the same you suggested but x33 fire and x3 mary instead, just because i dont have x4 mary. Rest the same. But im preety sure the deck will have a better performance with lesser trainers. ill test maybe next weekend.

    TY for your help, it was really helpful.
  8. ShadowCard

    ShadowCard Active Member

    A few years back, there was a then-Standard format deck that ran only 12 trainers (4 Professor Juniper, 4 N, 4 Random Receiver). I think it could do that because of Juniper's massive draw and Random Receiver allowing you to plow through the deck without limit. I think it was a Ho-Oh deck so it wasn't concerned about its pokemon or energy being discarded because Ho-Oh brought them back into play. I don't think you can do something similar here because cards in this era had limits. Cards nowadays have boundless power. You would need Professor Elm, and at that point you may be able to drop Good Manners and your choice of PokeGear or Mary as well as one Time Capsule.

    At a certain point, do you really need 4 Time Capsule? Maybe go to 3 Time Capsule to get your additional energy card. My justification for this is Mary, even with only 3, allowing you to shuffle the energy cards you draw back into the deck.

    *I did not like the style of play relying on Random Receiver. Trainers are options and the playsytyle did not provide enough adaptability for my liking. I also felt relying on 8 supporters with only Random Receiver for a trainer made the deck slower, not faster. You get lulls during game play as if playing theme decks.
  9. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    You know, quilava and magmar discards x5 :fire: from the deck on EACH move... if they are not 5, maybe 4 or at LEAST 3. So, actually when i thought the deck, i put first of all x4 time capsule in order to attack all turns without any worry. Maybe x3 time capsule is good too, but increse the number of trainer just for increase the chance to draw it despite maybe ill not use 4 time capsule during the whole game.
  10. guilleg33

    guilleg33 New Member

    Hey then, i tryed this, as a exception: I couldnt find Mary Usefull at all. Is just i play mary and i draw 2 cards, and i draw 2 fire energy mostof times. I decided to remove mary and put x3 more fire energy instead. The deck does 80 to 100 of damage most of times, i draw a card, a fire energy card and i keep it in my hand unless i got some of my energys removed.
    The only problem is when i discard a Time capsule when atack goes on. But its ridiculusly fast.

    Turn 1, play a blaine`s magmar, attach 1 energy then atack, 20 damage if heads. Turn 2 draw a card, use blaine then u atach x2 fire, then a poke gear or good manner, then attack (because u reach x3 fire energy already) and deal 80 to 100 damage in most of cases. Great enough for turn 2. I beat a Wiggly deck in 2 of 3 matches.

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