Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

"Spreadin the Love"(Cress X, Dusky X, Bronzong) A.K.A. A Dusknoir Varient

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Prime some folks are running FOUR Unown Gs in their decks. I was running 3 in two of the four CCs I went to. When facing spread I do my best to have everything out guarded if I can. I obviously can't always get it out as fast as I might need it ... and sometimes stuff gets KOed and it takes a while to NM a G back ... but I've had good stretches both in testing and in real games where everything out was guarded.
 
Well, everyone, here are the decks i have played against and beaten:

Kingdra
AMU
Gengar varients
Empoleon (new age)
Machamp
Dusky varients
Magmortar
Leafeon/Sceptile
Meatloaf
Tyranitar varients
Raichu varients
Magnezone and varients
Blissey varients
Garchomp varients
Scizor/Cherrim

I don't know about you, but i have pretty much prefected this deck for the metagame in my area. I have played many decks like these, and i have a strategy for each... I am counting League Play, League Tournaments, and Premier Events.
 
There is no anything that could know as a good rogue, there is no Obama, There is no Gigas... Only deck that should win Dusknoir is T-tar, but it sees to be not so good if it's losed so much agaisnt Dusknoir. In whaet age class have this deck tested?
 
vanderbilt_grad said:
Prime some folks are running FOUR Unown Gs in their decks. I was running 3 in two of the four CCs I went to. When facing spread I do my best to have everything out guarded if I can. I obviously can't always get it out as fast as I might need it ... and sometimes stuff gets KOed and it takes a while to NM a G back ... but I've had good stretches both in testing and in real games where everything out was guarded.
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Don't you feel 3-4 Unown G is over doing it? What matchups does Unown G actually help out in? It helps against Dusknoir, but does absolutely nothing against Kingdra, Regigigas, Tyranitar, Torterra, Scizor, Abomasnow, etc, etc, etc. Seriously, Unown G really just helps against a few things. Dusknoir, Bronzong spreading (but it doesn't help that much since it can't stop the body), Devolution, Magnezone lv.X auto-paralyization, Machamp (only useful in early game), and Gengar.

If you look at the decks that have won Cities, Unown G only helps out against a few of them when there are over 13 decks that have won more than 10 cities.

I guess if you know your local metagame is going to be 100% dusknoir, Unown G is useful, but in any metagame that has any differences in decks played, Unown G isn't going to be that great of a use.

We are both from NC. There is some Dusknoir played, from you, Brian, and some other people, but there is also Tyranitar played, Regigigas, Machamp, Raichu, and the possibility of many other decks, like Infernape (like your wife played once) or Empoleon (like I played at one city). If you look at just these decks, Unown G helps you against 1 of them, maybe 2 if you count Machamp, but that only helps your basics out. So, why did you play 3 Unown G? To curve your matchups against the few players that you thought were going to play Dusknoir? Were you teching your deck just to do better than the top 1% of the players in our area?

I just don't see 3 Unown G needed, and 4 Unown G to be totally irrational. Your gonna start with Unown G half the time with that many in the deck, and their gonna take up space when your playing against the decks that Unown G does absolutely nothing to help against.

I just don't understand.
 
What won Cities overall

1. Dusknoir - G is a huge help here
2. Kingdra - G is PROBABLY not useful here ... but some builds have TS2 Devoluter & G helps vs that.
3. Regigigas - See Kingdra
4. Machamp - G is helpful here sometimes. I've used it to avoid the T1 donk for instance. With 3 G you start with it a lot.
5. Tyranitar - See Kingdra
6. Gengar - G is a huge help here
7. AMU - G is very nice for avoiding Azelf snipe which can win games
8. Torterra - Believe it or not the conditions that Grotile & co gives has messed me up more than once. G helps.
9. Magnezone - G is helpful to avoid Paralysis.
10. Scizor/Cherrim - G is probably not going to help you much here, though I used is a sacrifice while trying to set up other stuff.
11. Abomasnow - Depending on the build G can be helpful or not.
12. G&G - G is helpful
13. Magmortar - See Kingdra & Torterra
14. Raichu - Most Rai builds have TS2.

Overall it helps a LOT against 4 of the top 14, some against 4 more, and is potentially useful in any match if the opponent runs TS2. That last card is reason enough in my mind to run 3 G in a deck featuring stage 2s and Candy, but overall helping at least some against more than HALF of the top 14 decks is a good reason as well.


As for our specific meta.

Top 2 decks in Cities that I've been to:

1. Dusknoir (6 times ... 2 of these me)
2. Regigigas (3 times)
3. Tyranitar (2 times)
4. Magnezone (1 time)


Matches I've actually had:

Swiss:
3 Dusknoir (G was hugely helpful)
3 Gyarados (G actually helps here if they get that last attack going)
2 Machamp (G was OK but not huge these games)
2 Raichu (G helpful vs 1 that had TS2)
1 Gengar (G won the game for me)
1 Froslas (G was great!)
1 Honchkrow (G was helpful vs Darkrai)
1 Scizor (G not helpful except to sac)
1 Infenape (G not helpful)
1 G&G (G was very helpful in avoiding Bring Down)
1 AMU (G was modestly helpful in avoiding Azelf)
1 Breloom/Weavile (I actually attacked with G to KO his opening Weavile & won the game ... fluke but helpful)

Top Cut
3 Dusknoir (GREAT)
2 Regigigas (Very helpful vs his techs)
1 Raichu (not helpful)

The 3 Gs carried me in Charlotte in both top cut rounds. Brain was running Noir and Michael had TS2 & actually won a game where he used Palkia's Transback attack on a Pokemon that didn't have G. Overall G was helpful in 18 of my macthes and not in 6 of them. That's a pretty good ratio.
 
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I understand that Unown G is going to help a lot in many swiss games, and it has helped in many top cut games. I'm not saying not to play it. But in how many of those games did you need to get 3 Unown G on the field at the same time? How many games did you only need 1 or 2 Unown G to protect key benched Pokemon? How many games did you just need to Unown G the active Pokemon?
 
Prime obviously I’ve gone back and forth on this. That why I said I ran 3 twice and ran 2 twice.

I’m too lazy atm to go back and do further analysis, but I see at least 14 real games in my list where having G on more than one thing was helpful. Keep in mind that with 2 you might have one prized. You might have one go into the discard early. There are all sorts of easy scenarios where you will end up with 1 G in play which isn’t always enough. Consistency is better with 3.
 
I think a lot of the decision to run 3 Unown G comes down to reducing the need to spend valuable search on it, and giving you a little more leeway in your mid-to-late game Night Maintenances... if you're running three, have one in discard pile, and you really need to shuffle back in a Dusknoir line or something, it lets you be a little bit more flexible.

I think a lot of the decision comes down to tailoring for, as you said, the top sliver of players - Dusknoir's reliably placed one or two players in each top three that I've attended, and so bumping up your Unown G count is less useful in Swiss, but really beneficial in Top Cut.

I think.
 
PokemanMaster said:
I don't know about you, but i have pretty much prefected this deck for the metagame in my area. I have played many decks like these, and i have a strategy for each... I am counting League Play, League Tournaments, and Premier Events.
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You shouldn't count ANYTHING but premier events. There are just so many players that are awful at league... Not only that, but you could consistently play weaker players at league, while at a tournament you are only playing stronger players with each win.

That count is super misleading. I have never won any premier events ever, yet I always go X-0 at my league. So... would it be right to say my Gigas deck is 46-1?

Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

Prime said:
I understand that Unown G is going to help a lot in many swiss games, and it has helped in many top cut games. I'm not saying not to play it. But in how many of those games did you need to get 3 Unown G on the field at the same time? How many games did you only need 1 or 2 Unown G to protect key benched Pokemon? How many games did you just need to Unown G the active Pokemon?
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You never have 3 at once... it just makes it easier to G something right after your active is KO'd.
 
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That's more or less the thought, Yoyo.

Now, here's what I wonder - Mr. Sterrett's article on VanderHatter has different variations, centered around a 51-card deck skeleton. What would this deck's skeleton look like?

Pokeman and I have the following cards in common between our two lists.

4-2-2-1 Dusknoir (Note, we differ over what third 'Noir to put in, hence, it's part of the variance)
1-1 Cresselia
1-1 Azelf
2-1 Uxie
2 Unown G
1 Spiritomb
19 Pokemon

2 Roseanne's
4 Rare Candy
3 Bebe's Search
2 Night Maintenance
2 Warp Point
2 Moonlight Stadium
2 Premier Ball
1 Luxury Ball
18 Trainers

9 Psychic
4 Call
13 Energy

50 cards, which leaves a lot of room for playstyle variations.

Core list strength is like having core body strength - if your core is fit, you'll be fit overall, as well.

By all means and purposes, keep the debate between DP33 and SF17 alive, but also attack and analyze the center of this deck.
 
Eh, I'd just advise Pokeman to take the "115-2" out of his topic title - it distracts from substantive discussion of deck theory.

Even if that 115-2 was against the absolute best possible competition, it still looks silly. Why not just put your cc win/loss record down instead?

As for this deck, I've been trying the 1-1-1-1 I originally suggested to Milan, and so far it's been amazing. In the few games that I've played, I've only ever felt the need to use one SF1 Dusknoir the whole game - two tops. More than two Shadow Command Dusknoir seems to be overkill.

SF2 VS Promo is an extremely interesting discussion. At first I thought that the SF2's Poke-Body would be 110% game-breaking, but now I'm getting the vibe that Promo might be better.
 
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Running the Dusknoir SF17 for the extra damage alone seems just silly - if the boost doesn't trigger, you're sitting on an inferior DP33. However, its PokeBody is a return to a focus on the spread nature of this deck. However, I'm not sure if that's precisely that's the optimal direction to head.
 
yoyofosho16- i told you what decks i played against in a previous post. Those decks all had the necessary trainers and list, but i overcame it.
 
prodigal_fanboy said:
Running the Dusknoir SF17 for the extra damage alone seems just silly - if the boost doesn't trigger, you're sitting on an inferior DP33. However, its PokeBody is a return to a focus on the spread nature of this deck. However, I'm not sure if that's precisely that's the optimal direction to head.
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Oh, the boost is guaranteed to trigger.
 
But even if it does trigger, is the +10 damage and spread better than the 70 damage, heal 20, and snipe 20 coupled with a chance at effectively wasting one of their tutors?
 
For the record, Cressy X is hoss late-game.

I'm still not sold on the Azelf X, personally. I'll test the Tyranitar MU more as soon as I have the chance to play someone who's really good with it, however, of all the Lv. Xs I run, I always don't want that one.
 
yeah, prodigal fanboy, Cress X is really good. This week, i took it out and ran a 1-1 Weavile SW line. It helped against Dusky and Gengar matchups, and i went 4-2 missing Top Cut at 10th place. I played 2 Dusknoir and a Gengar decks.
 
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