Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Would you be a PTO without the rewards?

U

ukpokemonpro

New Member
This is a serious question for those Professors who are PTOs as well as running Leagues. meganium45 has more than once spoken of the work PTOs have to put in and it is not small.

What I want to know is would you do the work if you weren't paid?

This is the situation as we find it in the UK at the moment, we are being asked to pick up Leagues, Tourneys, City Challenges and Regionals (States) and possibly judge at Nationals too.. BUT there is no reward for us in doing so. Indeed judging nationals will cost some of us the chance to play for a trip to the US and a place at worlds...

With venues being costly here and with no financial support we are having to try to bear the cost of the venue and cover it with the door money. Not an easy thing to do when the OP provider wants small CCs (cheaper on the promos perhaps?). Add to that producing flyers, posters and more.

So if you're a PTO would you do all the work if there was no reward. And please be honest here, glib answers are not what I am looking for.. thanks.
 
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Oh, definitely! The was our same mentality when we first signed up to run the City Champs. We didn't even know about the incentive until after we were accepted. We just wanted to bring a CC close to our players.

The extra incentive was just a pleasent little bonus that we didn't even know about.
 
It certainly is a lot of work doing the large events, but as long as I could break even I would do, and have done them. As WotC lost the license and before PUI got things rolling, myself and two other Professors held two large regional tournaments in the Portland area. We didn't get paid a cent, and even had a little out of pocket expense. We did it because we love the game and wanted to keep it going.

Would I be willing to do a big event every month, or sometimes even two or three without getting a little something out of it? Maybe not, because as I said, it is a LOT of work. As it stands, I get enough out of doing events to purchase a quantity of each new set as it comes out. That's reward enough, but it is a reward. At some point I guess the reward of watching people enjoy the game and knowing you made that happen just isn't enough. But for me the reward does not have to be cash compensation. I am happy doing it for cards!

BDS
 
I'm not a GL or a PTO, but to see the players coming together and having fun, doing what they like to do and, for many, what they do best, should be a reward in itself.
 
What do you call Large tournaments, we do regular tournaments with 50 people, never get support through the official way. (only from Profs of this board :) )

You want a honest answer,
I run a pokemonclub with 50 members, but don't get a single promocard or anything as support.
I sure want to do CC, prerelease, whatever tournaments without being payed as long as the pricesupport is the same as anywhere else. (so those players at least are treated equal)
I sure want to Judge Nationals (and miss the change to get a change to play Worlds myself) as long as all players get a fair and knowlegded Judge on their table.

It's has been mine (and also the other clubleaders) goal to let this game played according to the given (floor)rules and with equal changes for everyone around the world. That means we are not playing ourselves that much, it costs us a lot of money (traveling to each other) and even more time (trying to discuss everything what is not arranged well overhere).

I asked to let me organize a CC, no respons,
I asked to let me organze a prerelease, no respons.
All I know that if rewards or financial support should be available, that support would not go to the people who are working so hard for this game.

There is already so much difference between UK and Netherlands regarding OP so I won't even speak about the differences with the US.

It's all about even getting a change overhere.
 
I did a lot of events before I was paid, $200 cash prize tourneys and the like. Someone had to run events in St. Louis, so I picked up the torch.

All through the WOTC days I was a volunteer.

Only through PUSA have they started to compensate me for my efforts.

I have had a very selfish reason to keep the game going, I have an 8 year old and 10 year old who love the game. I would still be running all the events that I run in St. Louis, even if it was just to keep them going for my boys.

Would I be going to Memphis, Collinsville, Sedalia, Arlington, or any of the other venues that I am doing events in? Probably not. Renumeration does drive that multiplicity of events.

Anyone who has been to one of my events knows that I throw in something extra, above and beyond the prize support, as most good PTOs do. Everyone, regardless of place, gets a pack of cards as a prize at all of my events. So, a pack and a promo. Who pays for that pack? I do.

I also like to give a special prize for any undefeated players through the swiss rounds of major events. I gave a base 1st edition pack to the winner of the event at St. Louis, and gave a Trainer Deck B to the winner of the swiss rounds in Missouri. We threw a player a birthday party at the Missouri State Event!

I will be giving out an additional Trainer Deck B to the winner of the Swiss rounds in Kentucky, and have a COOL prize pack set for the swiss winner for the gym and stadium challenges that I run, TBA. Those bonuses will make Trainer Deck Bs seem small potatoes!

In short, I run Pokemon Events because SOMEONE needs to run them who knows what they are doing, or it will be a disaster for the players, and the event alike. We have all been to poorly run events, events run in the face of logic and good advice...I just would prefer to run events of the other type, where 5-1 or 1-5, all players walk away with something.

My boys love Pokemon, and as long as they do, I will keep the events they go to the best they can be. I want to give REAL kudos out there to TOs we will go out of the way to play events under - Pokedok and IPGeek (if he is still around) - the events at the Chicago Stadium Challenge run by Dok and the events run by IPGeek at Gencon last year were, in a word, inspiring. Who else would run a draft that lasts until 3:30 a.m., after a huge event??? IPGeek would. Who else would run a draft on the night after a HUGE Stadium challenge event that ran until 1:30 a.m. (which by the way, intoduced us to Mega Murkrow and Psyduck from St. Louis - IN CHICAGO!!) - Dok would.

All of the events that I run are done through the inspiration of events I have gone to in the past, and I only hope that the players in those events leave the event with the same memories and joy that my boys and I left Gencon and the Chicago Stadium Challenge with. We did not win, but we had an unreal time. That is what matters.

OK, you wanted a few sentences, and you got them. There is my rant about why I am a TO, PTO, and still would be if the nickels were taken off of the table (just hope that they aren't)

Meganium45
 
Oh, and to make this even more topical. I feel for the international group.

I am guilty of more than once putting up a "stop whining" type of post, or one that I ripped down after apologizing profusely, but upon reflection, you international TOs are something special.

You are really keeping this going for the love of the game, and it was great to hang out with Freddy K, Team Drunken Snorlax, and the rest of the crew at Gencon last year. I hope to see you all again.

The only thing Europe has EVER gotten, is the rev holo TV reporter, and some unique tourney prize promos (which everyone is expecting will be widely released)

You all truly stay in this for the love of the game and should be commended.

I hope you are commended!!! I hope that Europe gets the playing field leveled soon. I think PUSA is doing a good job at putting some effort forth, with preReleases and the like. Not perfect yet, but at least seeming to progress.

Cheers

Meganium45
 
Beside from the differences, what i want most.

That PTO's, National distributors and more of all PUI/POP will make RULES public and equal.

Example: There are only 3 CC's overhere, Pricesupport for those CC's not even the half of what is stated on the PUI/POP website.
Why publish price breakdowns INTERNATIONAL if none of the overseas Distributors is going to award those?

The biggest award overhere should be: That the distributors listens and follows up advices from the few people really involved in this game instead of banning them from everything and that PUI/POP is more involved in the overseas situation.
Most experienced people overhere are not willing to "work for free" for this game anymore, and I can't blame them.
We are kicked in the back so many times, that in case in the future we are needed, someone has to pay for it.

And by paying I don't mean money, it's not about money and it's never been about money.
It's about saying sorry and for one time listen and try to build up a solid OP base.
If you have a good base there is only in the starting period that experienced people have to travel, thereafter there are new people who can cary our OP in their region.
Only when that is done, than we can talk about Extra's for PTO's /judges or whatever.

I was at Gencon last year,
I showed up at the Detroit prerelease (couldn't finish it because my plane left early)
I will go to Florida and play the last change tournament (at least my kids will, I think I will be aside to translate if needed)
Someday I will show up at one of the UK's tourny's (can I join a CC or Nationals overthere because here also Belgiums can join)

For UKpro, only do those tournaments which you are willing to. Distributors need to understand that Volunteers only have limited time. They have to understand that setting up a good base costs money.
Let them have their 30 CC's but don't feel as you are the one who has to TO those, they should have common sence and face the hard truth of the lack of interest in the past is now coming over them.
 
Giday

I don't know how many other TO's fall into my situation, but this is how it is here in New Zealand for me.

I'm just a joe bloggs off the side of the street who enjoys the game & have a folder of singles gathered over time which i trade / sell cheaply during the saturday afternoons when i run league / weekly tournaments. My events are the ONLY official PUI supported events for pokemon happening in our country on a regular basis, hence my website name "Pokemon NZ".

With a population of 4 million & Auckland (800 km's from my home) being our biggest city (1 million), the lack of support results from the distributor not actively supporting events or leagues in the Wotc era. Now nobody wants to get involved in the retail market, although in Auckland there are a number of very keen players that want to run the league.

If it wasn't for the great landlords of the hall i use, the costs of a venue alone would force me out of the game. As it is, with the reduced rent they charge, i'm able to offer an activity for the 100+ kids that come along after their morning sports have finished. The parents love the idea, no more distracting kids at their sport or baby sitters required, while they try to play. They just pick them up afterwards.

The rewards i get out of all those weekends, printing costs & travel i give up ... 5 boosters for myself from the prize support provided (when it happens) & no more sporting injuries hehehe. I feel this is a fair exchange, as i only charge an entry fee in an attempt to cover the costs. If i was in this to make money or get more from it ... i think a straight jacket would've been ordered for me years ago.

Prizes for most of my big tournaments rely on the prize support provided or the local sponsors i gather on each occasion. After our distributors not even bringing Sandstorm to New Zealand & having to buy the boosters for a Pre Release first, it creates a major financial strain. With 50+ players at our first ever PR, I had to take a loan for the TMTA event & yes, i lost money on the event, but it was the only way to do it.

Would i still do this for no rewards of any type ... seriously ... probably not. I'd probably take my US$2000 racing bike out of the shed & hit the pedals again or go back to refereeing soccer.
 
Mainly most of us never got a penny before, as a matter of fact, we strived for years effortfully for just a league from wizards, one would think that since we are so close we would get a lot of suppert, but thanks to a man I dont want to mention (cough*reidshmaedaka*cogh) we never got anything, we made the tournaments by ourselves, and I am proud to say (?) that many a time we lost money to it, just because we love the game, heck, argentina, chile and brazil all got at least a league, while we dont, and frankly If I was told no money would come from nintendo, I would just revert to our normal style, that is the main reason I really apreciate the PUI era, they have finally realized Mexico existed and gievn us a shot, so far we have been able to achieve some level, but it is thanks to the suport given to us, that is why I try to look on the better part of things, I have sometimes argued on the old pokegym forums (wotc era) with some of the europe guys, I been there, having to buy every single promo from ebay just to give at a tournament, but why focus on what cant be done rather than on what can be, that is my selfish optimistic point of view. I really wish that europe gets the kind of support mexico is gettiong right now.
 
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I thought PTOs DID get rewarded when running major events.

Anyway, I was a TO under DCI. However, I urged my local store owner to sign up to be a TO. Since then, he's become a PTO, something I'm sure probably would've never been offered to me. He makes TONs more money as a store owner, so I'd think that being a PTO is more of a status symbol for him, something he can use to influence POP to choose him to run major events.

I don't want to be a PTO, reward or not. I'm very happy being just a Professor, Gym Leader, and Head Judge.

BTW, if you run leagues and DON'T get the promos/badges, that's YOUR fault. Every PTO who runs Gyms SHOULD get at least one promo and one badge. If not, that's YOUR decision, not something imposed upon you.
 
UKpro, I think there's a bit of difference between "selfish" and "greedy". I'm not sure I know any league leaders, or tournament organizers that are greedy. To me, that person fully expects to be paid, and is not willing to help out without renumeration of some sort. For the most part "selfish" people would like to be paid, but when asked will do the task, will do so without knowing for certain if they will be paid. Then there are people that do so, who wouldn't care if they ever got paid, due to their love of the game.

I'd honestly like to say I'm in the last group, but I wouldn't be totally honest. I have to admit, economic realities would force me to say I hope I'd be paid in some manner. I honestly can't afford to do all the work necessary that a premier tournament organizer does, on my work salary alone. My wife doesn't work, and indeed is not able to work, due to extreme health problems. I have many current responsibilities, some requiring time, some requiring money. I'm glad that Nintendo feels that certain things are worth some benefits, because it shows they value our experience, and hard work. To me, (and I'm not a premier tournament organizer - at least yet) I'm not concerned how much I'd get, but that they offer. So I guess you could say I'm in the "selfish" category. I'd still do it if I wasn't paid in some manner, but looking at myself honestly, I like to know that they value my experience enough to offer. If I had to pay for the venue, and prize support like you do, I'd find it very hard to continue. Tough decision.
 
BTW, if you run leagues and DON'T get the promos/badges, that's YOUR fault. Every PTO who runs Gyms SHOULD get at least one promo and one badge. If not, that's YOUR decision, not something imposed upon you
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Steve do you ever READ all outside US posts, because if you did you would know we are not treated the same overhere.
We can't decide a single thing.
 
You know what, I'm going to rephrase my last post a bit. There's a difference between an opportunist and greedy. I'm more of an opportunist, than selfish or greedy. It's great that the opportunity is there to receive some support for work done, and I'd be willing to have some, but that's not the reason I became a professor in the first place.
 
RainbowGym, are you a PTO? I thought we were talking about PTOs here. That's the subject of this post. If you're not a PTO and you're not getting rewards, that's some PTO's decision not to reward his/her staff, if you are indeed staff.

Anyway, here in the US, PTOs and TOs alike (and maybe non-TO store owners too) can hold leagues. PUI doesn't restrict these PTOs from taking a promo for themselves, only from selling those promos. If a store owner doesn't run the gym, and doesn't offer a promo to his/her gym leader (or club leader in your case), that's NOT PUI's fault.

Finally RainbowGym, it was YOUR post that prompted me to make the statement I did. So, if indeed you're a PTO and for some reason you're not getting a promo (and your players are), please explain. Please tell us the "rest of the story," as Paul Harvey would say over here in North America.
 
procrastination_alley,

UKpro, I think there's a bit of difference between "selfish" and "greedy". I'm not sure I know any league leaders, or tournament organizers that are greedy.
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? I never used either "selfish" or "greedy" anywhere in my posts.. please don't put those words into my mouth :( And BTW you show neither with the help you have given us past, present and I hope future :)

SteveP,

I thought we were talking about PTOs here. That's the subject of this post. If you're not a PTO and you're not getting rewards
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Please read my first post again the question is ...

Would you be a PTO without the rewards?
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That is effectively what is being asked of us in the UK at the moment, take on the responsibiltes and risk of running major events with no reward.

So would you for example run an end of the month sealed, followed by 3 weekends of CCs, a weekend of States and then a Pre-release all in 6 weeks and all at your own risk?

That is the question given that at the moment there are no International PTOs!
 
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Perhaps I went a bit overboard with my words, but in no way was I trying to put any in your mouth. You see, perhaps I've been a bit defensive about this subject as well. Not everyone likes the idea that people get renumeration of sorts, (either boosters or payment) possibly because of jealousy, or who knows what else. If I seemed to include you in my explanation, or perhaps seemed like I was putting any words in your mouth, I sincerely apologize, because in truth, I was only speaking about what is my experience. I have a problem sometimes when some ask me to explain about why we have such a large quantity of cards (I try to be as open as I can with people). I have to say that although I spend quite a bit on cards, some were given to me (though in truth, nowhere near as many as I've bought). Some people don't seem to like that for some reason. In my post I guess I overstated things, or perhaps didn't find the exact words I should have to express how I feel. In any case, the answer I hope came across is that given the same circumstances that you have, I would tend to get easily frustrated, and would probably decline certain responsibilities that they expected of me. I may try to help out a bit when I can, but I'm no saint.
 
I may try to help out a bit when I can, but I'm no saint.
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Now that I can relate to ;) I think most of us can relate to that. There are rewards to running events and that is true even here in the UK, there is a chance to make some money on the door fees, sales of cards and accesseries, at venues that allow that! And of course in respect of pre-releases the judges/organisers boxes.

BUT, I for one am feeling increasingly tired, I have seen no new league kits since February, the tourney programme is ill thought out and without our involvement doomed to fail. Add to that no advertising for the CCs in the UK anywhere except where we organise it ourselves, no advertising for States except where we organise it ourselves and NO repeat NO CONFIRMATION of NATIONALS and it all adds to the stress.

So when PUI/Distributors glibly say 30-40 CCs in the UK plus 5 Regionals and Nationals I just wish they would spare a thought for those of us doing the actual work on the ground :(

So come on you PTOs would you do all that is asked of us if you didn't get paid, if PUI didn't advertise your events and if all risk is on your back?
 
Here in Canada we aren't getting "States". POP apparently feels we are too small potatoes for that. Also, we won't be getting a National either. Perhaps the same reason. I feel fortunate that we are getting a gym challenge, because that's the only way for some to be able to afford to go to Worlds. But apparently again, no Stadium challenge. If PUI and your distributors are asking for Regionals and Nationals, perhaps for the players, that's great, it's more than they got here. But again, you would think they'd be willing to help you out. I would ask for some compensation. Believe me, if they want it bad enough, they'll do so.
 
It's not so much the compensation as such that bothers me; although I would not say no to the PTO's package :) , it does take some of the risk away from running an event that may fall flat despite my/our best efforts.

It is getting increasingly hard to stay motivated when the players want new league promos and I have seen nothing new from the distributors since February, when PUI and the distributors seem to be taking us for granted and often show us outright hostility.

BTW a very big thank you to all of you who have traded materials with us so that we have managed to keep players interested. Without your help we would have given up long ago :)

It is not an easy problem to answer, we know some of what is needed to keep TOs and PTOs, League Leaders and Players Motivated but outside the US that is not always being delivered. I know that PUI are promising much as they have in the past but I am very dis-heartened.

I am trying to encourage and develop 2 new TOs to take some of the work from me but it all takes time! The current rush to fit in CCs, Nationals and Regionals/States has left me little chance to do that but does give me an opportunity to give them a baptism of fire. I just hope they are both flameproof, especially when it comes to TMS!

Anyhow I am off to push for Banners, Posters and anything else I can try to squeeze out of the distributors...
 
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