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Prime
09/13/2004, 03:50 PM
To evolve or not evolve, that is the question. I have a few pokemon that I have been asking myself this question about.

1) Poliwhirl: Poliwag evolves into Poliwhirl at LV25. At that moment, you can use a water stone and evolve it into Poliwrath. But Poliwrath only learns two moves after that, Submission and Mind Reader. Poliwhirl on the other hand, if not evolved, learns Body Slam, Belly Drum, and Hydro Pump. But let's look at the stats. Poliwrath has better base stats in every catagory other than SP. So if you would compare two poliwraths, one evolved right away, and one evolved after a while, the quickly evolved poliwrath would have better stats in every catagory other than speed. So both sides have their advantages. So what would you do? Evolve, or wait and evolve after a while?

Add this into the loop. You can either evolve into Poliwrath, or Politoed. Both Poliwrath and Politoed have equal HP and SP, but 'toed has higher Special Stats(SP.DEF, SP.ATK), and 'wrath has higher Regular Stats(ATK, DEF). I like Poliwrath, but I feel with surf, higher SP. ATK would help, and against Electric, higher SP. DEF would help.

Also, I would like to abuse the hypnosis with either Poli' and team it with Dream Eater if I can, to form a new type of Poli. But this is just an idea. THis should not affect what Poli-form I choose to evolve into.

So, what should I do. Evolve right now? And if so, into what?

Hot Mustid
09/13/2004, 04:03 PM
get ur moves, then evolve, the stats change accordingly (At least they should, u never know :p )

Prime
09/13/2004, 04:12 PM
Well, if I wait to evolve until I get all the moves, the poliwrath after evolution will be drasticly weaker than a poliwrath that had been evolved ASAP. I don't know if I am willing to sacrifice better stats so that I can get a few extra moves, that who knows if I will use them.

Hot Mustid
09/13/2004, 04:15 PM
I always evolve my pokes right away, ALL the time :p

so my opinion would be to evo :p

Pablo
09/13/2004, 04:21 PM
Prime you do not sacrifice ANYTHING by evolving right away other than the ability to learn moves, I'm too tired to explain the EV and IV system, but even if you evolve Wrath right away or after learning some moves, the Base stats come into effect whenever Poliwhirl evolves, and ALL Poliwraths have the same Base Stats so the only thing that changes their stats are EV points and IV points. If you took 2 Poliwrath's same level, but one evolved at Lv. 25 and one evolved at level 50 say, just as an example, and they both fought vs the exact same Pokemon AND were born/created with exact IV's, level evolution will not matter, so just go ahead and get more moves, you will NOT get penalized at all for evolving later with lower stats, for more information go to Gamefaqs.com, and check in the Ruby section, the 'Advanced Trainer Guide' I believe is its name, and that will help you understand better the EV/IV system used in RS/FRLG and why evolution at later levels doesn't affect stats, heck even if Poliwhirl evolves at Lv. 100, it wont get lower stats than any other Poliwrath other than the variations on EV and IV points.

Simply stated IV points are determined when you catch/hatch the Pokemon and will never change, and range from 0-31. EV points are determined by the different Pokemon you fight vs with, so fighting vs many spindas will produce a better special attack, and fighting with only crobat's will give a better speed etc.

Prime
09/13/2004, 05:11 PM
Mudkip: So your saying that no matter the stage, they will have the same stats when compared poliwrath to poliwrath? Well sure, never the exact same stats, but ideally, the same stats if the same exact pokemon with same everything. But when do the stats equal themselves? Don't the stats even out to be the exact same at LV100? Meaning, that two Poliwraths at LV60, one has been a Poliwrath since LV25 and the other just evolved, there stats would not be the same, correct?

Pablo
09/13/2004, 05:38 PM
they should in theory be the same, the variations are the different pokemon you fought and the IV's the game generated when u first caught/hatched the poliwag/whirl/wrath. doesnt matter what level, ima try and explain this to you:

Stat = (((( BaseStat * 2 + IV + EV/4 ) * Level ) / 100 ) + 5 ) * P

that is the formula the game uses to calculate ANY stat, so let's break it up:

Stat the value for Attack/Defense/etc.

BaseStat the MINIMUM value for every stat at level 50, and multiplied by 2, minimum of every stat at level 100.

IV (individual value) the value generated at the time you get a Pokemon. Ranges from 0-31, 0 being lowest and 31 being highest.

EV (effort values/points) you have a maximum of 510 points to be distributed amongst the 6 different stats, you cant add more than 255 to a single stat. For every 4 points your Pokemon will raise the stat it got the 4 points in by 1, therefore the maximum points added to a stat is 63 (255/4).

+5 those are 5 points that EVERY pokemon has regardless of IV values and EV distribution.

Ok so now after this, we take Poliwrath's base stats at Lv: 50 (i.e minimum stats every poliwrath have at level 50):

Pokemon HP Att. Def. Spd. Sp A Sp D Total

Poliwrath 90 85 95 70 70 90 = 500

Poliwrath 180 170 190 140 140 180 = 1000

so the second Poliwrath is a Poliwrath at level 100 with its minimum stats, not even adding the 5 points. so after that, it is obvious that every poliwrath will have those stats, + 5 + w/e their IV is and +w/e EV's, depending on pokes u battled with that specific pokemon

Prime
09/13/2004, 05:47 PM
Mudkip: So, just to make sure, the same exact pokemon, poliwhirl, evolved into poliwrath at LV25 and gains 25 levels, and a exact copy, ideally, evolved into poliwrath at LV50, will have the same exact stats?

Pablo
09/13/2004, 06:00 PM
ideally and in theory yes, what will differ is IV's and EV's

NoTime4LoveDrJ
09/13/2004, 06:07 PM
Mudkip: So, just to make sure, the same exact pokemon, poliwhirl, evolved into poliwrath at LV25 and gains 25 levels, and a exact copy, ideally, evolved into poliwrath at LV50, will have the same exact stats?

In a word, yes. As Mudkip said, you lose NOTHING but the ability to learn moves. Your stats will even out when you evolve. Your EV training is much more important than leveling at any specific time. You could probably learn Hydro Pump and such from the RS Move Tutor.

Prime
09/13/2004, 06:14 PM
Thanks alot everyone, next time it comes up, I will know what to do.