Guru Point Challenge 2 - Making a Magnezone Deck work!

[Rogue Archetype]

Hi Pokemon Gurus!

I've had many requests to start Guru Points up again. So, to make it managable, I will only give Guru Points to those who participate in these Guru Point Challenge threads (and the stickied thread-of-the-week).

I'll be tossing up these brainteasing challenges to:

1. Keep you from getting bored/ Give us all something to do.
2. Help us share some nifty little tricks-of-the-trade that may lead to some powerful and creative ideas.

Today's Deck is: Magnezone

There are SO MANY different Magnezones in the format. Can we can figure a way to build a beast Magnezone Deck?

SO... today's challenge is to contribute a REAL (viable) examples of how Magnezone could be successful in a deck that has synergy, consistency, and winning potential.

Please read what has already been posted before you provide your own input.

Good answers that lack detail = 1 Guru points
Good answers that are detailed = 2 Guru points
Brilliant Answer that may actually work! = 4 Guru Points!

This excersize gets us in the habit of offering suggestions without destroying a player's effort to TRY his/her idea.

To quote one of our members:
It doesn't have to win. It just has to work. <== Remember this when you help others. Sometimes, the decks that you THINK are no good win in places where you do not live.

RULE = YOU HAVE TO BE SPECIFIC and detailed to get full points (it helps fuel new ideas and keeps the thread alive)

TIP - If you give an abbreviated effort, you won't earn as many points. ( i.e. You can't just say "Play it like Jumpluff with a 1-0-1 Flygon tech" and earn the full 2 Guru Points )

Answers that appear to be off-topic (silly or spam) are subject to deletion.

YOU LOSE POINTS if your respose is merely that the card is 1) not good 2) cannot work
(TIP: Even if this is true, it's not creative and you'd be better off not posting a response at all.)

A list of point leaders will be stickied to the top of the Strategy Forum.

There are some very strong players visiting our forum, here's your opportunity to show off your knowledge of the game.

Secret Tip = LINK cards that you mention in your examples to images in PokeGym's Research Tower. This will earn you 1 additional bonus point for your post!

[Hatter™]

What if Challenge 1 and 2 go in the same deck?
Would you just post the same exact thing in each thread?

[Rogue Archetype]

What if Challenge 1 and 2 go in the same deck?
Would you just post the same exact thing in each thread?

Awesome question... and yes! If you're that brilliant, then you deserve to double up on points :)

[Barkjon]

I will write out a list when I get a chance, but you want to play 2 Magnezone SF, 1 Magnezone Prime, and 1 Magnezone X. Other than that, do usual T/S/S/ for a s2 deck (Collectors, Bebe's, Rare Candies, BTS) to get it working quick. You play Spiritombs as well to get Magnezone out quick.

[Elite_4_Allen]

Okay magnezone analysys.. here goes:

Magnezone, varients: Mega judge.

Today i'll look at straight magnezone, not Mega judge.

List:

4 Magnemite
4 Magneton
2 Magnezone SF (Gyro ball)
1 Magnezone prime
1 Magnezone SF (the other one lol)
3 Spiritomb
1 Uxie
1 Azelf
1 Giratina (Let-loose)
1 Unown Q

4 Judge
2 Cynthia's feelings
3 pokemon collector
3 bebe's search
4 super scoop up
2 rare candy
3 BTS
2 seeker
2 Expert belt
2 Palmer's contribution
2 Warp point
2 PONT (Professor Oak's New Theory)

2 Warp energy
6 lightning energy
2 rescue energy

This is your basic list aiming to get a six prize cards with magnezone.
The gyro ball magnezone is a good attacker and can switch to spiritomb if you want to trainer lock.
The metal one is for setting up other magnezones quickly.
Magnezone prime is great for your consistency and works wonders with judge wich lets you get some disruption snd then you can draw two more cards if you have magnezone out.

TECHS:
Yanmega: A lot of people have been using yanmega in their decks and calling it mega judge.
It has proven itself to be good by winning a number of cities.

Metal energy: You could tech in metal energy to attack with the other SF magnezone but this is totally extra.


Thanks! - (Elite 4 Allen = 2 points)

[jjkkl]

I played and went 4-2 Magnezone against a few Machamps, Gyarados and Luxape decks back in the day, so this is fairly viable in my field of work.

Okay magnezone analysys.. here goes:

Magnezone, varients: Mega judge.

Today i'll look at straight magnezone, not Mega judge.

List:

4 Magnemite
4 Magneton
2 Magnezone SF (Gyro ball)
1 Magnezone prime
1 Magnezone SF (the other one lol)
3 Spiritomb
1 Uxie
1 Azelf
1 Giratina (Let-loose)
1 Unown Q

4 Judge
2 Cynthia's feelings
3 pokemon collector
3 bebe's search
4 super scoop up
2 rare candy
3 BTS
2 seeker
2 Expert belt
2 Palmer's contribution
2 Warp point
2 PONT (Professor Oak's New Theory)

2 Warp energy
6 lightning energy
2 rescue energy

Elite_4_Allen's Magnezone list is fairly solid, but I'm going to posit a different list:

1 Gastly SF
1 Haunter TS
1 Gengar Prime
4 Magnemite
3 Magneton
2 Magnezone SF (Gyro ball)
1 Magnezone prime
1 Magnezone Level. X
4 Spiritomb
2 Uxie
1 Azelf

2 Judge
1 Cynthia's feelings
3 pokemon collector
4 bebe's search
3 rare candy
3 BTS
2 Engineer's Adjustments
2 seeker
2 Expert belt
1 Palmer's contribution
2 Warp point
3 PONT (Professor Oak's New Theory)

2 Warp energy
6 lightning energy
1 Metal Energy
2 rescue energy

This is going to be tl;dr - if you can't be bothered to read it, then don't.

I'm going to be upfront: Magnezone's viability is extremely hampered by the loss of Roseanne's Research: the deck focuses on management of the ability to search for energy, and frankly, Cyrus has such a minimal role in Magnezone that it's not a viable alternative. Now, I'm going to explain why I made the modifications and I'm going to throw out the claim that this is not meant to be BDIF material: just a deck that can run effectively and within a realistic setup frame.

To fulfill the Magnezone issue, we must establish its main problems:
High Energy Costs / Unorthodox Energy Maneuvering
Heavy reliance on Powers, and thereby susceptibility to Power Sprays
Loss of Proper Energy Search

Now, in my experience, Magnezone SF's the main attacker out of the group: the attack, Gyro Ball, is a viable card to use that allows you to both switch with a Spiritomb lock but also circumvent enemy walls and possibly waste enemy attachments. Gyro Ball is your main attacker for a few reasons:
It's ability to switch your Magnezone allows you to supply a different Magnezone to attack, should you get a swarm set up
It allows you to circumvent enemy walls and meatshields
If your opponent is on the offensive, with luck you can force them to bring forward an active that might have a retreat cost
You may Spiritomb lock, allowing you the ability to use Powers without worrying of harassment from Power Spray

Magnezone Level X., I would argue, is crucial to the functioning of the deck: it's 'move as often as you want' is distinctly vital if you feel a Magnezone is at threat, and it's ability to use in constancy allows you to not worry about Power Sprays. This is also extremely vital considering the need to maintain consistent damage with the synergy between Magnezone SF and Magnezone Prime.

This furthermore allows reduction of the Palmer Line to 1 instead of two, as now you only need to focus on retrieving Magnezone, and not its energies. Magnezone SF is important as it provides energy acceleration, but it puts a damage counter on the active.

I've cut Judge lines, primarily since that while Judge disruptions are nice, the focus is to provide consistent, moderate damage with a constant Spiritomb lock: maintaining that constant lock is vital to ensuring your opponent cannot manage as well. Furthermore, by focusing on Magnezone SF, you can circumvent the reliance on Unown Q, since you can attach and discard to retreat it if need be rather than risking the Unown Q start. Rare Candy and BTS are run in fairly redundant lines, as you want to ensure a swarm as soon as possible.

I've eschewed the Metal SF Magnezone, largely since when played it regularly gets sprayed, and other than one or two times, its power doesn't see much use and its attacks aren't as useful as the escape feature of the other Magnezone. The Gengar Prime Line is self-explanatory: Catastrophe + Gyro Ball allows you to force them to either force-promote a Pokemon that could put them behind or force an active knockout.

While Seeker lines and SSU lines within a deck can make a redundant 'lift and drop' strategy with BTS make it seem much more potent, the fact is that it doesn't help that much unless you've got a swarm set up, and by then, a Prime Magnezone is much easier to attain and much easier to manage. Minimal coin flips, in other words, is what you want to aim for in this deck, because of its tendency to self-destruct and weaken over time, you need to pay close attention.

Professor Oak's Theory is the main alternative draw power in this deck. Engineer's is optimal, but you risk, with 7 energy, not get an energy in the draws. I've added 2 Uxies, because you will need them for draw power, and if you wish, you may switch it for Uxie Level. X to Zen Blade a counter against Machamp.


When he speaks English, it's SO good! I love how you support your card choices with explanations. Thanks! - (4 Points = jjkkl )

[ShadowGuard]

Magnezone is probably the most underrated card in the set, if not in the whole format. I've played it very successfully (1 win 1 2nd at CCs) with Steelix and with Flygon, and have people playing it with Machamp Prime seen doing well.

So you can basically play it with almost everything (ok not everything, but many Pokémon - maybe Garchomp SV, Tyranitar Prime? Who knows?). But what do all Magnezone decks have in common?

There are two cards which are excellent partners for its power - Judge and Blissey PL. Judge should be obvious and has already been mentioned by other contributants, Blissey can discard cards, allowing you to draw one card more per turn and healing Magnezone (and its partner). Discarded energy can also be useful for Super Connectivity. Personally, I'd never play Magnezone without its little pink friend. But for all who want to play this combo, take card of your deck count - in long games it easily happens that you run out of cards, so better add something like a Palmer.

Magnezone is not Claydol - so don't just play it for its power, use its attack. Therefor I like to have a high energy count, (14+), cause I sometimes want to burn energy without having trouble for the rest of the game.

Hope that helps. ^^

Excellent sidenote information there. Very thoughtful. Thanks. (1 point for great input = ShadowGuard)

[Darkmot]

There's a deck I wanted to take to a CC, if there weren't too many Vilegars.... xD
As S_G already mentioned Garchomp SV is a good combination for it, and that was the Deck I wanted to take to the CC....
The list looked like this:

4 Spiritomb
3 Magnemite
2 Magneton
2 Magnezone Prime
1 Magnezone SF#6
1 Magnezone LV.X
2 Gible
2 Gabite
2 Garchomp
1 Garchomp LV.X
1 Chansey
1 Blissey PL
1 Azelf
1 Unown Q
1 Uxie
1 Nincada
1 Shedinja
Pokemon 27

Trainer 20
4 Pokemon Collector
3 Bebe's Search
3 Judge
1 VS Seeker
1 Palmer's Contribution
2 Pokemon Communication
3 Rare Candy
2 Broken Time Space
1 Expert Belt

Energy 13
3 Rescue
4 DCE
2 Metal Basic
4 Lightning

The strategy was to get Chomp asap and keep getting them again with the Rescue Energies and here Magnezone SF helps alot...
No Calls, yes, but I didn't find room for the rescues so I put the calls out, but the Rescues can also be switched with some Calls.
The disruption with Judge and Magnezone Prime's also awesome and magnezone Prime can be used as a good alternative hitter that eventually OHKOs anything for the game....
This Deck does decent against everything except Vilegar, which is near autoloss or very hard.
-Filipp.

You were generous enough to give us a list, but kinda left us on our own to figure it out. Thanks (1 Guru Point = Darkmot)

[Kayle]

Awesome question... and yes! If you're that brilliant, then you deserve to double up on points :)

Magnezone/Feraligatr is established Tier 2. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to think up that blindingly obvious combo.

Just had to point that out. Depending on how studying goes, I may post up a disruption list later today.

[Rogue Archetype]

Magnezone/Feraligatr is established Tier 2. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to think up that blindingly obvious combo.


It doesn't matter man. The goal here is to create a fun environment and let people contribute ideas.

Don't be a thunder thief though :cool:

[Barkjon]

Alright, time for my list...

This is Magnezone disruption, like many others have done.

NOTE TO NEW PLAYERS: You can see all the cards here in the Researching Tower (http://pokegym.net/tower/).

POKEMON (21):

3 Spiritomb AR
2 Sableye SF
4-3-4 Magnezone (2 SF Magnezone [Gyro Ball], 2 Magnezone Prime)
2 Uxie LA
1 Azelf LA
1 Unown Q
1 Regice LA

T/S/S/ (24)

3 Pokemon Collector (HGSS)
4 Bebe's Search (RR)
3 Judge (UL)
1 Cyrus's Iniative (SV)
4 Rare Candy (HGSS)
3 Broken Time Space (PL)
2 Expert Belt (AR)
1 Palmer's Contribution (SV)
2 Pokemon Communication (HGSS)
1 Luxury Ball

ENERGIES (16)

4 Double Colorless Energy (HGSS)
8 Lightning Energy
4 Call Energy

STRATEGY: Get out a Magnezone Prime benched with a Magnezone SF active. You can do pretty good damage with Magnezone if you get him out early (Expert Belts help with the damage output). Spiritomb is a good starter, as you can lock your opponent's trainers and setup your Magnezones, so 'tomb is your preferred starter. However, if you want, you can start Sableye and disrupt with an Iniative to mess up your opponent early. If you start with sableye but have a horrible hand, go for a Collector instead to start setting up your bench. When you play Collector, search for a Magnemite, an Unown Q. and a Spiritomb.

Attach the Q to Sableye and retreat into the Spiritomb. Hopefully you get out some more Magnemites on the bench, and you can constantly DG with Tomb into Magnetons, or you can lay out BTS to evolve straight into Magnezone if you already have Magneton, or you can Rare Candy into Magnezone.

You want to get some energy on Magnezone SF, as he is your main attacker. Generally you will have a DCE and a Lightning Energy on him, and hopefully a belt. Now, you can do some good damage doing. You can constantly Gyro Ball or, if your opponent has a tank up, Gyro Ball w/ the switch and bring up a Pokemon with a Q attached, so you can retreat him next turn and bring up Magnezone.

Once you have a Magnezone up and powered, you can start Judging and mess up your opponent every time they have a big hand. Of course, this leads to the issue of drawing after it, right? Nope. Magnezone Prime let's you draw cards after you use Judge, so you can get going again. Magnezone Prime is also a decent attacker.

Super Connectivity is also a great power to get back energies after either discarding them with Regice (you can get around a wall that way and KO an little-HP Pokemon) or after a Magnezone or other Pokemon with energy on it was discarded.

OTHER NOTES:
I don't play the X, as I didn't think it was extremely useful. Plus, playing Metal energy would take up too much room, and his attack wasn't great.

I don't play the metal Magnezone from SF because his power will often by sprayed if you really want to get set up - assuming you are playing vs. SP, of course.

WHAT THE POKEMON ARE FOR:
Spiritomb (AR): This is your preferred starter. Spiritomb seriously hurts SP decks (and most others), but DG is his primary strength, as it quickly sets up your bench.
Sableye (SF): Sableye is your backup starter. His first attack, Impersonate, can help you disrupt your opponent early on by playing either an Iniative or a Judge.
Magnemite (any set): Just to evolve into Magnezone. Personally, I'd play the metal SF one.
Magneton (any set): Just to evolve into Magnezone, again. Personally, I'd play the TM one.
Magnezone (SF, Lightning type): This is your main attacker. His power, Super Connectivity, is useful to recover discarded energies. His attack, Gyro Ball, can do 60 (80 with belt), often by T2, and the effect is occasionally useful. Good HP too.
Magnezone Prime (TM): This is your backup attacker and primary draw. His power is his main strength, as it can really help your draw early on. His attack is decent if you have energy to spare or need to do a lot of damage at one time.
Uxie (LA): Uxie is you other source of draw. In addition to being able to donk an Unown Q, his power is amazing, and can really help early game.
Azelf (LA): Azelf is extremely useful for his power. You get to look at your prizes, but you can also take a Pokemon from there, replacing it with a card from your hand. This can help you be able to draw more cards with the Prime. Of course, his attack is useless with no Psychic Energy.
Unown Q (MD): Q is really helpful to retreat your starter, as they both have a single retreat. Otherwise, you don't want him up.
Regice (LA): This guy can help you discard energy to use with Super Connectivity later, and he can bring up a Pokemon with lower HP to KO with Magnezone.

ON T/S/S/:
Collector is your friend early game. In the Strategy section I talked about what you should do when you start with it. Bebe's Search is your primary Pokemon searcher, and it can free up cards in your hand to draw more with the Prime. Judge is your primary source of disruption, and can seriously mess up your opponent early game. Iniative can also disrupt and lower your opponent's hand size - it is most effective after using a Judge.

Rare Candy can help you evolve from Magnemite into Magnezone - this is extremely useful to get a Magnezone up quick, either SF or Prime, to start attacking or drawing, respectively. Broken Time Space is similar to Rare Candy, except you can skip Magneton. Expert Belt helps raise the HP and damage output of Magnezone, thus it is very important here.

Palmer's Contribution is your form of recovery, and can get back a whole Magnezone line from the discard, as well as energy. Pokemon Communication is another way to search out Pokemon, and is really helpful to draw more with the Prime. Luxury Ball can also search out Pokemon.

ON THE ENERGIES:

Double Colorless Energy is really helpful to get out a Magnezone SF out and attacking quickly. Play 4 to maximize consistency.
Lightning Energy is your primary source of energy, and again helps get out a Magnezone SF quickly, and is the energy you will use for Uxie and Magnezone Prime if you attack with them.
Call Energy really help your set-up. One of these earlygame is golden, and, combined with a Collector, can get you a full bench in one turn. One turn.

Well... that's the list. Hope you enjoyed it.

This is an unorthodox build. I appreciate how you posted something that you've played. Thank you for the selfless sharing and explanation. (3 Guru Point = Barkjon)

[Kayle]

Don't be a thunder thief though :cool:

What does that even mean? o_O I'm not stealing anyone's thunder by pointing that idea out. It's fine that you want to give double credit to someone whose deck fits BOTH your challenges, but in that case it's a pretty serious flaw that your two challenges happen to consist of making use of two cards that obviously work together.

More than anything I'm interested in the system's integrity.




Anyway, paying homage to Phazon Elite's Drapion/Blissey article and strategy, here's a similar combo using Magnezone: Judge and Electromagnetic Draw. Cards are given with links to their pages (click on the numbers in x-x-x lines to check out my preferred pre-evos).

19 Pokemon:
4 (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41077)-3 (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41053)-[4] Magnezone, using 1 Magnezone Lv. X (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=35696), 2 Magnezone Prime (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=51030), and 1 Magnezone SF-6 (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41006).
1 Rayquaza LA (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=35663)
4 Sableye SF (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41059)
2 Uxie LA (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=35717)
1 Azelf LA (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=35737)

29 Trainers:
4 Pokemon Collector (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=49768)
3 Bebe's Search (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=45479)
4 Judge (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=50179)
4 Rare Candy (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=50139)
1 Luxury Ball (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41097)
3 VS Seeker (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=48295)
2Energy Pickup (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=35702)
3 Junk Arm (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=51033)
1 Palmer's Contribution (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=48289)
2 Seeker (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=51037) [You can also use Engineer's Adjustments (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=50192) or a different consistency supporter of your choice]
2 Conductive Quarry (http://pokegym.net/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=41093)

12 Energy:
6 Lightning Energy
6 Metal Energy

Okay - so here's a deck for the middle-to-advanced players, the guys without the big bucks or the big game but who want to bring a party to the table anyway (or just for people who want to bring a party to the table!). It has some huge weaknesses, but sometimes huge weaknesses makes for the most fun.

This deck is a Magnezone version of Sablelock, essentially. With 4 Judge, 3 VS Seeker and 4 Junk Arm, you've got the potential to slam your opponent with Judges 11 times. Eleven times!! THAT'S A LOT. But what about Judge hurting your own hand? That's where Magnezone Prime and Sableye come in. Sableye can pull supporters straight from your deck, so you can Judge from the hand and then use a Collector or Bebe's Search to grab other stuff you might need. Magnezone Prime can refresh your hand to 6 instead of 4 (and can do it twice in a turn, too).

The basic strategy is to lead with an Impersonated Judge, followed by Impersonates to set up a Magnezone Prime and a Stormfront, preferably, - and leveling up one of them would also be a great idea. Use VS Seeker and Judge to keep your opponent's hand slammed into oblivion, and use Magnezone Lv. X's Cyber Shock to pound whatever they get active into consistent paralysis. You can also use Gyro Ball for a more consistent attacking option, but it forces you to move your field around, which is not always favorable.

You've got dozens of ways to get energy for Cyber Shock - Magnezone SF has Super Connectivity, Rayquaza can grab Lightning energy and Magnezone X can shift it to whoever needs it, you run 3 Energy Pickups and 4 Junk Arms, etc... In fact, because of the amount of energy recovery, it's almost BETTER to use Engineer's Adjustments early to draw cards so you can pull in that energy and attach it before you should've been able to!

The deck's big weaknesses are speed and a lack of a seriously reliable attack option. When all you have to work with is Lost Burn for huge KOs and Cyber Shock for general stuff... yeah, it's not much fun. You could include some Fire Energy to blow up with Rayquaza, but I don't think it's worth it when you can do 200 for the same amount of energy using Magnezone Prime.


Feedback:
Have you had a chance to test this build? Anyway, you gave an idea and a suggested list AND some pretty good explanation of card usage. (2 Guru Points = Kayle)

[flash2351]

Ok, i also play a magnezone deck, but it works extremely differently from most of the other decks here. Instead of playing spiritomb starts, locking your opponent's trainers while slowly evolving your own, i run a aggressive smeargle start and try to get my zones out t1 or 2

Pokemon:
4-3-2/2 Magnezone SF(conductivity)/Prime
2 smeargle
2 uxie
1 unown q
1 azelf
1 regice

T/S/S
4 judge
3 collector
3 bebe
3 comms
2 engineers' adjustments
2 seekers
2 rare candies
2 expert belts
2 sunnyshore city gym
2 broken time space
1 palmers
1 vs seeker
1 luxury ball

Energy
11 electric
2 rescue
2 dce

Now to explain the cards:

4 magnemite sf (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41077): This magnemite is definitely the best magnemite to use sincve it has free retreat provided you have another magnemite benched.

3 magneton sf (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41053): I chose this magneton simply because it isnt weak to ground, forcing donphans to e-belt before they can ko it =D.

2 magnezone sf (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41006): This card is great as a early game attacker using gyroball and helps power up the prime with its pokepower

2 magnezone prime (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=51030): This should be the first zone you set up since combining magnetic draw and regice, you have a pseudo-claydol. It also has a really painful attack =D

2 smeargle (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=50598): Potraiting a collector or a bebe t1 is brilliant, esp if you use their collector, set up finish, and judge it away =D. Its high risk high reward lol.

1 regice (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=35729): This card firstly, gets rid of opposing tomb starts, and helps you discard uneeded cards to clear your hand for magnetic draw. Also, you can use him to discard energy so that you can attach at least 2 energy per turn

2 uxie (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=35717): Well, this is a staple in almost every deck, giving you draw power before your magnezone is up

1 azelf (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=35737): this card is great for his nifty ability to pick a pokemon out of your prizes.

1 unown q (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=34956): free retreat for your smeargle, who wouldnt want that?

For T/S/S

Judges are great for disruption and combined with magnezone, it becomes a PONT for yourself.
Collector, bebe, comms and luxury ball are great for searching out the correct pokemon that you need.
Engineers' adjustments is a great source of drawpower and puts energy into your discard pile too.
Seeker allows you to pick up a damaged zone easily to heal it.
Rare candies allow you to get your zones out fast.
BTS is great early game for speed evolution while sunnyshore helps eliminate weakness against ground.
Palmers is for recovery while vs seeker allows you to re-use any one supporter in your discard pile.


Strategy:
Get your magnezone prime out asap for consistent draw power. Once your prime is out, you shouldnt have problems setting up the sf to start softening/killing your opponent via gyroball. After they knock out your first magnezone, you should have powered your bench up enough that your magnezone prime can easily sweep the opponent using lost burn.

A few things to note:
Don't start lost burning too early. When i first started with this deck, i always tend to run out of energy before i finish drawing all 6 prizes simply cause i didnt take the ko's i could have taken with gyro ball.

Keep track of your deck size. You can very easily deck out because you will be drawing like 3-4 cards a turn and end up deck-burning before you draw your last prize. Keeping a judge in your hand late game also helps. I.e. when you are going to deck burn, stop using magnetic draw and regi-move and let your hand size build up. After which, judge to put the cards back into the deck before your deck runs out of cards

Dun bench regice if you dun need to against luxchomp because they can easily bright look your regice up and snipe around it.

A nifty combo you can pull off is if your gyroball killed their hardest hitter and they cant return the ko, you can send your smeargle with unown q attached up. This helps you accomplish two things, it gives you a free potrait next turn AND you can super-conductivity twice to smeargle instead, hence keeping your magnezones undamaged.

I've played against you with this and I've seen that THIS list does work. It's awesome that you've selflessly given up one of your builds AND told us how to run the deck. That's Good Spirit of the Game right there! Thanks! (3 Guru Points = flash2351)

[MrSmileyPants]

Here's my take on Magneruption (Magnezone + Disruption)

Pokemon: 19
3-2-2/1-1 Magnezone (2 Prime, 1 Super Conductivity, 1 LV.X)
2-2 Blissey PL
3 Sableye SF
1 Unown Q
1 Uxie LA
1 Azelf LA

T/S/S: 27
3 Pokemon Communication
3 Bebe's Search
3 Pokemon Collector
3 Rare Candy
3 Cyrus's Initiative
4 Judge
3 Broken Time-Space
1 Palmer's Contribution
1 VS Seeker
3 Junk Arm

Energy: 14
6 :lightning:
6 :metal:
2 Sp. :dark:

Strategy is to either T1 Initiative or Collector with Sableye, then start setting up a Magnezone X. Judge away their hand, refresh yours with magnetic draw, help out Sableye with Super Conductivity, keep Maggy alive with Blissey, and attack with Magnezones. VS Seeker + Junk Arms allow you to judge up to 8 times.


Another idea I just came up with would be to pair the Prime with Landmin X, Interviewer's Questions to get energies and a higher grass energy count. Use Landmin X's Seed Flare to stack energies onto benched poke's, (in smaller increments, not all at once) then switch to Magnezone Prime and Lost burn (Just enough for KO.) Use rainbow & lightning energies, and different Magnezones in order not to (lost) burn through all of your energies too quickly.

Have you tested this build? It looks like it can be taken down easily. You're also at high risk of decking out (Blissey + JunkArm + only 1 Palmers = Deckout if game runs long). Thanks for taking the time to share your list. (2 Guru Points = MrSmiley Pants)

[Box of Fail]

This Gyro Ball switch list brought me success in the GA marathon. Although I have a few revisions to perfect the list, I believe I should post the list that I actually played, without any edits.


Redshark 3.80 Deck List
Date: Tue Jan 25 23:47:09 2011

Name: zoneswitch
Comments:

TOTAL CARDS: 60

POKEMON: 26
Level-Up: 1
1 : Glaceon Lv.X, MD-98
Stage 2: 4
2 : Magnezone (Prime), TM-96
2 : Magnezone, SF-6
Stage 1: 7
1 : Glaceon, MD-5
1 : Magneton, TM-43
2 : Manectric, PL-11
3 : Magneton, SF-42
Basic: 14
4 : Magnemite, SF-66
1 : Regice, LA-36
2 : Electrike, PL-74
1 : Uxie, LA-43
1 : Lucario GL, RR-8
4 : Spiritomb, AR-32
1 : Eevee, MD-63

TRAINERS: 19
Pokemon Tools: 2
2 : Expert Belt, AR-87
Supporters: 16
4 : Bebe's Search, RR-89
3 : Looker's Investigation, PL-109
4 : Judge, UL-78
4 : Pokemon Collector, GS-97
1 : Palmer's Contribution, SV-139
Stadiums: 1
1 : Broken Time-Space, PL-104

ENERGY: 15
Special Energy: 9
4 : Call Energy, MD-92
1 : Warp Energy, SF-95
4 : Double Colorless Energy, GS-103
Basic Energy: 6
5 : Lightning Energy, GS-118
1 : Water Energy, GS-117

Strategy: Use Spiritomb to set up both consistent draw support and a Gyro Ball attacker, then switch into Spiritomb with Gyro Ball. The deck sports incredible consistency, running 4 Bebe's, Collector, Call Energy and Spiritomb to ensure a quick setup. With Magnezone Prime, the deck can draw several cards a turn, allowing for the abuse of Judge to cripple SP decks. Regice discards energy to be attached by Super Connectivity, and lowers hand size to compliment Magnetic Draw. Super Connectivity allows Spiritombs to switch every turn without even taking the risk of being donked, and Magnemite's magnet allows the player to retreat it easily whilecharging it up; thus, the deck omits Unown Q altogether.


Using Lucario GL, the deck exploits a favorable Gyarados matchup, both knocking out the French fish in a single hit, and also bringing up Spiritomb to limit their options. Spiritomb slows their setup considerably, especially considering the trainer-heavy Gyarados decks seen in recent weeks.

Glaceon LV.X turns heads, but it also turns the Vilegar matchup around. Switching into Glaceon LV.X allows Magnezone to bypass the cruel Fainting Spell, and Glaceon protects herself from Level-Down with her Poké-Body. Glaceon MD's Snow Cloak and Speed Slide further improve the Vilegar matchup, and Speed Slide also allows a leveled-up Glaceon to counter Umbreon UD's Moonlight Fang. Regice discards trainers to help control the damage output of Poltergeist, and also discards potential targets for Gengar Prime's Hurl into Darkness. Using Glaceon, Magnezone can handle Vilegar; Manectric's Power Wave can also be devestating to the ghost deck.

With 3 Looker's and 4 Judge, Magnezone has the capability to beat SP. Manectric limits Garchomp's options; Magnezone must essentially shuffle in Luxchomp's hand and then switch into Spiritomb to win the game. Regice also can be used as an instrument to achieve knockouts. Though most SP decks give Magnezone trouble, the deck has a very decent chance of using disruption to take six prize cards, simply by limiting SP's options.

Feedback:
Thanks for dropping by and offering this up. It's amazing. I read your tourney report about this awhile ago. It's GREAT to see a proven build. Thanks. ( Box of Fail = 4 GuruPoints)

[Phazon Elite]

Anyway, paying homage to Phazon Elite's Drapion/Blissey article and strategy, here's a similar combo using Magnezone: Judge and Electromagnetic Draw. Cards are given with links to their pages (click on the numbers in x-x-x lines to check out my preferred pre-evos).


Haha, I'm totally ripping off my deck's strategy, too.

Pokemon: 22
4 Magnemite (Magnet)
3 Magneton (of YOUR choice!!!!!!!!!)
2 Magnezone (Electromagnetic Draw)
1 Magnezone (Super Connectivity)
1 Magnezone X
2 Electrike (I DONT CARE WHICH ONE!!! HOORAH!)
2 Manectric PL
1-1 Entei-Raikou Legend
3 Sableye SF
1 Unown Q
1 Azelf LA

Stuff: 24
4 Judge
4 Bebe's Search
4 Junk Arm
2 Engineer's Adjustments
1 Pokemon Collector
1 Cyrus' Initiative
1 Palmer's Contribution
1 Luxury Ball
4 VS Seeker
2 Rare candy

NRG: 14
7 Lightning Energy
4 Special Metal Energy
2 Basic Metal Energy

A very off-the-wall version with disruption, straight-up damage, plus spread. I have 1 Collector because I will likely only need one, and I can always Vs Seeker or Junk Arm->VS Seeker if I need more. Same explanation for the lone Initiative.

But, sadly for you guys, I have to work in the morning, so good night! lol

Also, this list is entirely conjecture. It's never even been used, but it might be a good starting point for someone wacky like myself.

feedback:
I love the idea of Manectric and ERL (entei-raikou legend) in there. It just seems pretty hot to combo ERL with SuperConductivity Magnezone and spin away with ERLs PokePower hitting attack (which can be followed up by a Manactric PowerWave if necess.). The trainer/supporter line look clumpy and untested. The idea of the three pokes together in the same deck is cool. Thanks for the offering. (2 Guru Points = Phazon Elite)

[Kayle]

I like your list, Marvin. That looks fun!

[AyameHikaru]

I played Magnezone at Cities... O.o;;

4 Magnemite (SF, Magnet)
3 Magneton (SF, Magnetic Resonance)
2 Magnezone (SF, Super Connectivity)
1 Magnezone (SF, Magnetic Search)
1 Magnezone Lv. X
2-2 Palkia-Dialga Legend
3 Spiritomb
1 Uxie
1 Azelf
1 Unown Q
1-1 Infernape 4
23 Pokemon

3 Collector
2 Bebe's
1 Luxury Ball
2 Judge
2 Expert Belt
3 Conductive Quarry
3 Seeker
2 Twins
2 Palmer's
1 Rare Candy
22

4 Rainbow Energy
4 Lightning Energy
4 Special Metal
1 Metal
3 DCE
16 Energy

This deck doesn't set up fast, I admit. However, the ability to Time Control EVERY turn even without energy in the hand is invaluable. A breakdown is as follows:

SF Magnet Magnemite: The ability to have free retreat is great. For a while I ran the other SF Magnemite in order to be able to attack for free, but I found that I generally only Rammed once, if that, per game. Having a free retreater is much more valuable.

SF Magnetic Resonance Magneton: There's not a whole lot to choose from as far as Magnetons go. However, with three Conductive Quarries in the deck, the chances of getting one out are pretty good. That 20 spread goes a long way, especially after a few Gyro Balls have spread damage around.

SF Super Connectivity Magnezone: Having two of these means a) Cyber Shock/Time Control every turn even with a bad hand and b) it's what you're attacking with.

SF Magnetic Search Magnezone: I know what people are saying. "ZOMG NO PRIME???!" The truth is, I ran the Prime for about two weeks before switching to the setup above. Yes, you get more cards in your hand. However, the ability to search out one of your Pokemon is more valuable. You have two of the other Magnezone to get you energy once it's on the field/in the discard. Having the searcher lets you set up that much faster.

Magnezone Lv. X: Super connectivity + Electric Trans = win. You bring something up that doesn't mind taking a few damage counters. (Azelf, Uxie, Unown Q, etc.) Double Super Connectivity. Electric Trans to move one, use the other to retreat. Bingo, you've got an energy on a Pokemon that may not have survived the 1 damage counter. Then, you can Seeker/Quick to save your energy retriever, or you can leave it as a sacrifice so you can use Twins.

Palkia Dialga Legend: The beauty of the deck. With the above build, I personally have gotten off Time Control ten times in one game. Plus, with 4 (movable thanks to Energy Trans) Rainbow Energy, you can use Sudden Delete if something appears that can threaten you. The wall of 160 HP is somewhat diminished by the repeated Super Connectivities, but if you can get off three per Legend (very doable) it's worth it.

Spiritomb: Typical Magnetomb strategy. Hopefully start with it, evolve, and Gyro Ball back to it repeatedly in order to lock your opponent out of Trainer cards.

Uxie: Having only one Uxie seems like a risk. Judging without having more than one Uxie in your deck can backfire. However, once you get 3-4 energies on the field and the Magnetic Search Magnezone out, frankly, you don't need that many cards in your hand. With Seeker, you can reuse Uxie if the situation demands it.

Azelf: Running so many single cards means you'll be using this guy fairly often. Even after Time Walking, he still serves a purpose as an energy retriever (See Magnezone Lv X), which is more than most decks can say. Also, in a pinch the Rainbow Energies can be used to lock something active, which is invaluable in mirror matches.

Unown Q: Free retreat on Spiritomb, Uxie, Azelf, and Infernape? Yes please!

Infernape 4: Surprise tech! This thing is the bane of Gyarados decks and Kingdra decks! In the Gyarados matchup, Gyro Ball with an Expert Belt pretty much oneshots everything not named Gyarados, so using Intimidating Roar pretty much equals taking a prize. He also cripples Kingdra Prime down to 20 damage. In a pinch, the Rainbow Energy can be used on him as well.

Collector-Bebe's: Why more Collector than Bebe's? Because basically everything that's not Magnetic Searchable is a basic. Literally the ONLY thing you can't pull out with Magnetic Search + Collector is Infernape 4 Lv. X. Bebe's helps you out getting your Magnezones set up, but Collector saves you out of bad starts more often.

Luxury Ball: Staple, what can I say? Gives you a way to search out Uxie after a Judge.

Judge: Hand refresh is refreshing. Reading your opponent and killing their strategy is even more refreshing. Plus, it's satisfying to see Gyarados waste Collectors with Impersonate.

Expert Belt: This really turns around some matchups. It turns 120 in two turns to 160 in two turns, which is enough to knock out anything not named Rhyperior Lv X or without a L-type resistance. Since you'll almost always be going back to the Bench after Gyro Balling, it's not too risky. It also makes Cyber Shock hit 100, which is a useful number.

Conductive Quarry: Counterstadium to Gyarados (Though they'll win that fight in the end) as well as good recovery. Reviving those Special Metal Energies is great, and watching your opponent groan as you attack three in one turn (1 for turn, 2 Super Connectivity) is amazing.

Seeker: Magnezones get damaged. It's unavoidable. Your Legend will eventually be on its last legs. If ONLY there were a way to get it back in my hand! Oh wait.... there is! With Magnezone Lv X in play, you can move energy around and Seeker back into your hand only what you want. "But wait, PDL has a three retreat cost!" Conductive Quarry + 2 Super Connectivity has you your three energy back maybe even the turn they go to the discard. A word of caution, though. Time those carefully. It's terrible to see a Pokemon on your opponent's side of the field go from 10-20 away from knockout to fully healed. So use them, but use them well.

Twins: Since you hope for a Spiritomb start and you continually shove Spiritomb and maybe your pixies into the line of fire, they're going to take some hits. They're going to the discard. Your opponent will take prizes. But hey, that's where this comes in! Searching out your DCE, your Rare Candy, etc., makes losing a Spiritomb or two not seem so bad. Use 'em while you can, though, because if you get PDL going it's likely they'll be dead draws.

Palmer's: I know most decks only run 1. However, you may be caught unaware and lose a Magnezone early. If you've only got one Palmer's you face the hard choice of recovering your one immediately, or waiting until you lose your second (leaving only one available) to recover. With two Palmer's that decision is easy. This deck runs best with all three Magnezone in play, so the faster you can recover, the better.

Rare Candy: Allows for a fast bounceback using Twins and Magnetic Search. All you need is either Magnemite or Magnezone in your hand. Magnetic Search for whichever you don't have, and Twins for Rare Candy and DCE. A single Super Connectivity gets you up and running. This also allows for better use of Palmer's, since you know you don't have to pull back Magneton every time.

Rainbow Energy: This deck has some amazingly strange directions it can attack from. Infernape needs Fire Energy, PDL needs Water Energy, and Azelf needs Psychic Energy. Rainbow Energy solves all of that. Best of all, it's moveable with Electric Trans, meaning you needn't be choosy about where you drop it. You can stick it on a Spiritomb if you want so it takes the damage, then move it to something else, leaving your attacker untouched.

Lightning Energy: 4 doesn't seem like very many, and honestly it's not. but with Rainbow Energy you've got 8 Lightnings, essentially. Also, since PDL is your best option mid to late game, metal energy are more important.

Special Metal/Metal: With so many metal Pokemon, it's common sense to run four specials. They also let you win out against Umbreon UD with Magneton - Yes, Magnetic Resonance does 20. But, when it's powered by special metals, Moonlight Fang only does 10. Special Metals also make Garchomp C cry as its Dragon Rush is reduced down maybe all the way to 40 damage.

DCE: Used primarily for Gyro Ball, it also comes in handy on PDL for Sudden Delete and on Infernape. With a single Rainbow and a DCE, Infernape can oneshot a Jumpluff. Lets you bounce back fast, since you only need two energy attaches instead of three. (Or one if you Super Connectivity.)

Warnings: You will run into problems against Scizor Prime. 5 basic energy = not a happy Magnezone. It's workable if you happen to draw the right energy, but it'll be brutal if you draw nothing but specials.

Things that were tried and abandoned: Black Belt, Staraptor FB, moar Uxies, Magnezone Prime, ERL.

Feedback:

This list looks like it can use some tune-up, but you've done the hard work of building and playtesting. That's a great offering! Thanks for giving explanations that appear to really be looking out for the reader. Good spirit of the game shines through this post. Thanks. (3 Guru Points = AyameHikaru)

[Scipio]

Allow me to present: Magnechomp C

24 Pokémon:
4 SF Magnemite (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=41077&c=194)
3 SF Magneton (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=41053&c=194)
2 SF Magnezone (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=41006&c=194)
1 TR Magnezone (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=51030&c=253)
1 LA Magnezone LV.X (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=35696&c=190)
2 SV Garchomp C (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=48224&c=223)
2 SV Garchomp C LV.X (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=48290&c=223)
4 AR Spiritomb (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=49185&c=227)
1 MD Unown Q (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=34956&c=175)
2 LA Uxie (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=35717&c=190)
1 LA Uxie LV.X (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=35735&c=190)
1 LA Azelf (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=35737&c=190)

24 Trainer/Supporter/Stadium:
4 Pokémon Collector (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=49768&c=233)
3 Bebe's Search (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=45479&c=205)
3 Conductive Quarry (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=41093&c=194)
3 Engineer's Adjustments (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=50192&c=239)
2 Rare Candy (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=50139&c=239)
2 Palmer's Contribution (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=48289&c=223)
1 Luxury Ball (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=41097&c=194)
1 VS Seeker (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=48295&c=223)
3 Warp Point (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=34941&c=175)
2 Pokémon Communication (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=49839&c=233)

12 Energy:
4 Call Energy (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=34876&c=175)
4 Special Metal Energy (http://pokegym.net/gallery/showimage.php?i=34887&c=175)
4 Lightning Energy

This deck isn't among the fastest, but boy does it have a lot of attacking options. The viable damaging attacks are:
Gyro Ball - Your main attack. 60 damage and switching if you so require. Very handy in sending out fodder/Spiritombs.
Cyber Shock - Hit them hard and keep them stuck for a turn. Secondary attack, often used.
Lost Burn - A guarantee that you'll get that last prize/those last 2 prize cards.
Dragon Rush - 80 snipe for nearly free in this deck? Yes please.
Zen Blade - Last resort attack. But hey, its still 60 damage.

The strategy is simple enough. You get your Magnezones set up and go by the usual Zone strategy: Cyber Shock -> Gyro Ball for the KO, but there's a twist. In certain situations, you can send up your Garchomp C. Then, use the several Super Connectivities and give him the energy. Proceed to Level Up and voila, you just got free energy. Then, you can go two routes. Either you use Garchomp's free retreat and move the energy about with the power of Magnezone LV.X, or you pull a Dragon Rush with him. Both strategies work well, and the way it works gives this deck more options against various strategies.
Engineer + Conductive Quarry, Magnezone Prime and Uxie X give this deck pretty intense drawpower. Survive the first few turns and getting your cards shouldn't be an issue.

There are a few alterations you can consider. First off, the starter. If you're gutsy, you can forfeit the Spiritomb. This will require alterations in the trainer line since you'll NEED Broken Time Space. Alternately, you can put in a different starter - Smeargle and Sableye come to mind.
If you run Broken Time-Space, consider running Seeker and/or Super Scoop Up. Thanks to the energy movement that Magnezone LVX provides, you can bounce your energy to a poke of your choice, Seeker up the damaged Pokémon and proceed the smackdown.
As for energy, again for the gutsy players, Call Energy can be cut. Double Colourless works well with both Magnezone SF and Garchomp C, but will be useless for Cyber Shock. Alternately, you can add additional Metal or Lightning energy that will help mid-to-late game more then the Call Energies will.
You shouldn't add more Pokémon. The thing is, you want 3 Magnezones in play. Then you'll probably have an Uxie and Garchomp too...and then space gets scarce quickly. So don't add stuff like Crobat G or whatever, you do have some cards leeway but you don't have much in the way of bench space. Especially if you needed to use Azelf.

Yeah, the deck isn't fast. But it hits hard, can pull those 80 damage snipes repeatedly if you play your cards right, and its generally speaking hard to constantly KO Magnezones. So what are some major issues?

Machamp.
Fighting Tag bypasses the paralysis you inflict. Furthermore, it tends to hit a large bit of your deck for extra damage. It is beatable but not exactly an easy task to pull.
Donphan.
In the same vein, but this one is easier to deal with. If common in your area, use more Expert Belts so Cyber Shock followed by Gyro Ball is a surefire OHKO.
Vilegar.
Gengar in itself isn't THAT much of a nuisance - Fainting Spell is. Cyber Shock is 10 shy of putting Gengar in Uxie range. You best hope for a bit of luck on this one.

Aside from those three though, you can have a solid gameplan against each big deck in the format. Let's see...
LuxChomp.
Try to preserve your Garchomps early game. Once you get them out, make them count, KO a few pokes of them and try to not let them get revenged too easily. Alternately, tank up a Magnezone X if they don't run Blaziken FB. They'll be hard pressed to one or two-shot it. Bouncing yourself to Spiritomb also helps.
Gyarados.
While you hit him for weakness, unless you get Lost Burn going, you won't OHKO. So, try to take a few prizes from the other pokes in Gyarados, all the while making sure he has to Belt lest he misses the 2HKO on Zone (Do so by stacking Special Metal). Once you have 3 prizes left, Lost Burn should clean house.
DialgaChomp.
In this matchup, let Chomp do a lot. Snipe his Chomps quickly. Try to avoid Remove Lost vs. Special Metal. Once they have a lack of Chomps, pull out the big guns and start smacking Dialga - he'll fall down. Eventually.
Tyranitar.
Tyranitar is two shotted by Cyber Shock, but be wary of the fact that you cannot really tank against him, so don't waste your Special Metals. Another case of "If its big in your area, bring Expert Belt", because you don't want to miss the 2-hit-KO with Gyro Ball really.

So yeah, there you have it. Its a fun deck.


feedback:
Your list + Explanation = A very informative offering. Someone, not only, has an interesting list to try here, but they also go into battle with a "gameplan" for their entire meta! This took some time and I certainly appreciate what you've posted here (and how you put care into making it useful). (3 Guru Points = Scipio)

[Rogue Archetype]

but in that case it's a pretty serious flaw that your two challenges happen to consist of making use of two cards that obviously work together.

More than anything I'm interested in the system's integrity.


The "system" encourages dialogue and participation. If someone wants to post MORE often, then the system is working :smile:

A combo is only "OBVIOUS" to someone who knows it already; there are people that DON'T already know it. (think about that)

You need to be careful condemning those who post the "obvious" because it tends to be unwelcoming to those who don't know; they read something and get excited and then read how stupid they are for not already knowing what they just read. :frown: (that's whack)

So, if the system makes you "pros" come in and post "the obvious" then the others benefit.

Because... as one of my philosophy professors once said "it's only 'common sense' if you know it."

[Kayle]

The system I am referring to is point rewards...

Whether or not the combination is obvious to any random player who comes on here, I'm betting 90% of established users either thought of it already, or would have thought of it after a few seconds of looking at the two Pokemons' names close to each other and thinking about deck ideas. It's not a creative thing to come up with.

Do you want to doubly reward the first person to provide an in-depth list for something that is already well-established and well-known, even if only to the rest of us, just because you picked two Pokemon that go together well? Seems like a slap in the face to other people who shirk the known and try to come up with something creative, fun and practical for the everyday player.

[DoomScizor]

POKEMON: 25

2 : Trapinch, RR-84, Only one in format
4 : Magnemite, SF-66, Best in format, search-able through magnezone, Free retreat
4 : Spiritomb, AR-32, Ultimate starter, Slowing your opponent, consistency
1 : Unown Q, MD-49, Free retreat on spiritomb

2 : Vibrava, RR-53, Only one in format
3 : Magneton, SF-42, Best in format

2 : Flygon, RR-5, Gives free retreat, hits hard, could be invinceable for a turn, Just an all around good card
2 : Magnezone (Prime), TM-96, Draw power, Heavy Hitter, bench sitter
1 : Magnezone, SF-5, Awesome Search power and Alternative Attacker
1 : Magnezone, SF-6, Energy Recovery, Alternative attack.

1 : Flygon Lv.X, RR-105, Awesome Mil power and Lvl X sniping

1-1 : Entei Riakou Legend, UL-90-91, Searchable, Easy set up, Late Game prizes off uxie, Azelf, Crobat G, Smeargle, Et Cetra...


TRAINERS: 19
Trainers: 5
1 : Luxury Ball, SF-86, No explanation needed
2 : Rare Candy, UL-82, Quick Evolutions
2 : Expert Belt, AR-87, For the Extra damage
Supporters: 12
4 : Bebe's Search, RR-89, No explanation
4 : Judge, UL-78, Disruption, Hand Refresh, Staple in magnezone
3 : Pokemon Collector, GS-97, Basic searching
1 : Palmer's Contributions, SV-139, Recovery
Stadiums: 2
2 : Broken Time-Space, PL-104, Quick evolutions

ENERGY: 16
Special Energy: 9
4 : Call Energy, MD-92, Consistency, Energy fodder
4 : Double Colorless Energy, GS-103, Speed up attacking
1 : Warp Energy, SF-92, Get out of a bad situation
Basic Energy: 7
7 : Lightning Energy, GS-118, Needed to attack with Zone prime and give free retreat to Zones


Strategy: It's a pretty straight forward deck, You disrupt your opponent with Judge and dropping your hand size to Consistently draw with Magnezone. Set up either a Flygon or Gyro ball magnezone and take off. Or you can hit heavy with Zone Prime, ERL is to take the last 2-3 prizes for the game. I have only played it at 1 CC but I made top 8 without the ERL tech. I posted this deck a while ago as NoFlyZone.

Feedback;
I've played against this. Was it you? Anyway, I remember the deck having issues with speed and making a late game stand. What is great is that this is not a theorymon deck, but it's something that you've put effort into testing. Thanks for sharing your hard work with us. (2 Guru Points = DoomScizor)

Unless you played at Brandon City Championships it wasn't me. My build didn't really have that much trouble with speed, maybe I just got lucky that day. The trouble I ran into was a Scizor/Umbreon build, but that Spawned the ERL tech

[Porii Sames]

I was going to post here, but...

dang...that's a lot of lists...and I have -1 experience with Zone...lol

good luck all!

[Rogue Archetype]

The system I am referring to is point rewards...

Whether or not the combination is obvious to any random player who comes on here, I'm betting 90% of established users either thought of it already, or would have thought of it after a few seconds of looking at the two Pokemons' names close to each other and thinking about deck ideas. It's not a creative thing to come up with.

Do you want to doubly reward the first person to provide an in-depth list for something that is already well-established and well-known, even if only to the rest of us, just because you picked two Pokemon that go together well? Seems like a slap in the face to other people who shirk the known and try to come up with something creative, fun and practical for the everyday player.

If 90% of established players came in here and contributed ANYTHING, that'd be awsome because they'd learn and borrow from each other and everyone else would benefit.

I'm simply trying to do something positive and fun.

Remember , you have the same opportunity to post and earn as everyone else. So, post your "obvious" ideas too!

Let's have fun with it.
Thanks.

[Phazon Elite]

The system I am referring to is point rewards...

Whether or not the combination is obvious to any random player who comes on here, I'm betting 90% of established users either thought of it already, or would have thought of it after a few seconds of looking at the two Pokemons' names close to each other and thinking about deck ideas. It's not a creative thing to come up with.

Do you want to doubly reward the first person to provide an in-depth list for something that is already well-established and well-known, even if only to the rest of us, just because you picked two Pokemon that go together well? Seems like a slap in the face to other people who shirk the known and try to come up with something creative, fun and practical for the everyday player.

Sorry, but I have to be honest: If you're complaining about the "rewards" (as intangible as they are) being easy to abuse, you're missing the point of the thread.

[Rogue Archetype]

Sorry, but I have to be honest: If you're complaining about the "rewards" (as intangible as they are) being easy to abuse, you're missing the point of the thread.

You're still awake?

Finish your post so I can do the points thingy on it!

[Phazon Elite]

You're still awake?

Finish your post so I can do the points thingy on it!

I didn't even know about the points when I posted that list.

Besides, I literally made it up on the spot, so I can't really do a good job of explaining every card.

[Kayle]

Sorry, but I have to be honest: If you're complaining about the "rewards" (as intangible as they are) being easy to abuse, you're missing the point of the thread.

....:rolleyes: yeah, sorry.

I mean, I GUESS I was worried about giving someone uncreative double Guru points, but I mean, who asked the question again? Oh right. Hatter.

[chase4787]

Alright so I'm almost out of fuel (AKA Dr. Pepper) from the first Guru challenge, so this one will be shorter.

Magnezone is a crazy UFO pokemon introduced in generation IV. Since the first tcg expansion featuring Magnezone, Diamond & Pearl :setsDP:, 7 Magnezone cards have been printed (including 1 Lv X) with 6 modified legal now. As you'll see, Magnezone have a weird frequency of having attacks that require both :lightning: and :metal:.

From oldest to newest, here they are:


Magnezone - DP 32 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41215):setsNDP:

This Magnezone is metal type, which doesnt give it a type advantage over many pokemon. It's first attack, Mirror Shot deals 40 for :metal::colorless: with a smokescreen effect. The second attack is over priced for :lightning::metal::colorless::colorless: and a discard of all :lightning: energy for 100 damage. If you were using this Magnezone, I wouldn't recommend using the second attack. :fire:+30 is a good weakness for our format, so is :psychic:-20. :colorless::colorless: is understandable for a large metal pokemon, but pricey. 130HP is solid and makes for good tanking.

Magnezone Lv X - Legends Awakened 142/146 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=35696):setsLA:

Another solid metal type Magnezone with 140HP, The Lv X again has the awkward :lightning::metal: energy cost on it's attack Cyber Shock which discards both, does 80 damage and paralyzes, which is always nice to get a paralysis with no coin flip. It's :ppowr: Electric Trans is nice for moving :lightning: or :metal: energy around. :fire:x2 weakness sucks but it comes with the level up. :psychic:-20 is again nice with Gengar running amok but :colorless::colorless::colorless::colorless: is crazy when compared to the other Magnezones.

Magnezone - Stormfront 5/100 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41005):setsSF:

One of the 2 Magnezones released in this set and the 3rd and last :metal: type one. This one has a few perks to it. It's :ppowr:, Magnetic Search, is a built in energy search but only for :lightning: or :metal: energy. It also has 2 attacks, Speed Shot for :lightning::colorless: that it isn't affected by anything and Crush Volt for :lightning::colorless::colorless: for 80 damage and a discard of any energy attached to Magnezone. If your making a deck where magnezone sticks around to fight I'd recommend either this one, the Prime or DP 44 :setsNDP: (both mentioned later). :fire:+30 is great in our format so is :psychic:-20 resistance, :colorless::colorless: retreat for a magnezone and how this car looks when its reverse holo but 120HP is kinda sucky.

Magnezone - Stormfront 6/100 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41006):setsSF:

The second Magnezone from Stormfront :setsSF:, this time :lightning: type. It's :ppowr: Super Connectivity, is a lot handier than its :metal: counterparts Magnetic Search. Super Connectivity grabs an :lightning: or :metal: energy, attaches it to a pokemon of your choice, and places 1 damage counter on that pokemon. Handy. Magnezone's one attack, Gyro Ball does 60 and allows you to switch with a benched pokemon and if you do, your opponent does the same (I'll talk more about this attack later). 120HP and :fighting:+30 is unfortunate in our format, giving this magnezone a pretty big drawback. :metal:-20 resistance is nice when dealing with Dialga G (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=42370) or it's Lv X (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=42354) and :colorless::colorless::colorless: retreat is costly.

Magnezone - DP 44 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=42973):setsNDP:

The second DP :setsNDP: promo Magnezone. This one has 130HP making it able to take a hit or two. It's attacks work well together with charge beam costing :lighhttp://pokegym.net/forums/images/smilies/colorless.pngtning:, doing 30 and attaching a discarded energy to Magnezone and the second dealing an initial 60 for, another awkward :lightning::metal::colorless::colorless: but with the optional bonus of discarding an :lightning: and :metal: energy to change the attacks base damage to a powerful 120 enabling a OHKO of Gengar (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41029), Gyarados (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41030), and Luxray GL Lv X (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=45505) and a few (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41036) other (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=48290) Meta (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=48300) attackers (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=42354). :fighting:+30, as mentioned before, sucks. :metal:-20 is nice and :colorless::colorless: is again, pricey but tolerable.

Magnezone (Prime) - Triumphant 96/102 (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=51030)(hmm, apparantly there isnt a triumphant set logo yet. either that or im blind)

Magnezone Prime has 140HP, a great :ppowr:, solid attack and sparkles. Magnetic Draw is similar to Claydol GE (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=33234):setsGE:'s :ppowr: Cosmic Power but without the discard built in to take advantage of it. Magnezone also has a vicious attack that can OHKO any pokemon. :fighting:x2 sucks but apparantly we are going back to that, :metal:-20 can be nice and :colorless::colorless::colorless: retreat is costly.


Ok, great you listed out everything about all of them and it took you hours to write it out and get all the links but me only 5 minutes to read. I suppose I'll humour you and ask what decks can be made with them?

Quite a few decks have been made involving Magnezone but few have really succeeded. Listed below are a few that have seen moderate success.

MagneGatr

MagneGatr uses Feraligatr to attach energy to Feraligatr then burn it off with Magnezone Prime doing 50 damage for each. This deck is a fast one that can potentially OHKO any pokemon. Magnezone's Magnetic Draw also helps accelerate things, making faster and more vicious.

CurseGar with Magnezone

A few people I know had success with this combination. It involved constantly switching pokemon with Magnezone SF (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41006):setsSF:'s Gyro Ball and Gengar AR (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=49254):setsAR:'s Shadow Skip to do consistant 60, move damage around and keep the attackers alive with Super Scoop Up (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=34897).

Thunderstorm

Thunderstorm was a deck that I made, played for a while and had moderate success with. I used Raichu HS (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=49819):setsHGSS: and Magnezone SF (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=41006):setsSF:. Raichu would set up quick and thunderbolt consistantly with Magnezone's help and a belt or plus powers if needed. Using Magnezone's power Raichu, once it got going, could do at least 100 a turn. It worked well, especially when using Sunyshore City Gym (http://pokegym.net/forums/view.php?pg=towercard&imageid=45568).

In conclusion, just like the last Guru Challenge, the card can be used in many ways, but typically work better as supporters (with the exception of Magnezone Prime, it can be devastating).

*Anyone notice that Gengar has, through the last few rotations, been a threat. He always seems to get great cards and combinations.
**This one was definatly not shorter

feedback:
Amazing formatting done here. Thanks for doing all of that; it makes everything so easy to follow. You've done a great job of detailing how the combos are executed andave synergy and you've given great detail about deck strategies/card usage. (3 Guru Points = chase4787)

[Darkwalker]

I've been using and tweaking my Magnezone deck throughout CC's this year. I'll start with the list I have currently settled on and give a short explanation after. I will also try and give a general rundown on the decks I've played against and my general strategy going into the matches.

First the list: (A bit of a warning here, I tend to try and fit as much as I can into my lists to give me as many options as possible)

3 Magnemite (SF 66) (Magnet)
3 Magneton (SF 42)
2 Mangezone (SF 6) (Super Connectivity)
1 Magnezone Prime (TR 96)
1 Magnezone Lvl X (LA 142)
1 Chansey (HGSS 58)
1 Blissey (PL 22) (Nurse Call)
1 Electrike (PL 74)
1 Manectric (PL 11)
2 Spiritomb (AR 32)
1-1 Entei & Raikou Legend (UL 90, 91)
1 Azelf (LA 19)
1 Uxie (LA 43)
1 Ditto (LA 27)

4 Judge
2 Bebe's Search
2 Engineer's Adjustments
2 Pokemon Collector
1 Palmer's Contribution
1 Seeker
2 Pokemon Communication
1 Bench Shield
1 Expert Belt
1 Junk Arm
1 Luxury Ball
1 VS Seeker
1 Warp Point
1 Sunnyshore City Gym
1 Broken Time-Space

1 Basic Metal
3 Lightining
3 Call Energy
4 Special Metal
4 Rainbow Energy
2 Warp Energy

The Magnezone line I use is pretty straightforward, 3-3-2/1-1. While I originally had 4 Magnemite in the deck one eventually was cut to make room. Aside from a pair of games with terrible prizes (Azelf plus 2 Magnemite prized) not having 4 in the deck didn't seem to hinder me all that much. Typically you will only have 1 Super Connect and 1 Prime Zone out during the game at the same time, so the 3rd line is backup. I chose the Metal Magneton for resistance, ability to use Sp. Metal, and it's attacks are situationally good. The Zone line of 2 Super Connectivity, 1 Prime, 1 Lvl X seemed to be the best line up for my uses. Super Connectivity fuels the deck (and the Prime's attack) plus it has a decent hit and run attack to combo with Spiritomb. The Prime is not only a decent card drawing machine, but it has a ton of HP and an end-game sweeping attack. The Lvl X has the amazing Electric Trans Power that I try to abuse as much as possible, and a very underestimated auto paralyze attack. On top of all of that it can tank with Special Metals and swap out your weakness to Fighting if needed.

Now for all of the techs...

Blissey's Nurse Call serves many different functions in the deck I had a 2-2 line in the deck for a while but paired it down to a 1-1 when it was brought to my attention it could only be used once per turn period (not per Blisssey as I had originally thought) and because a Chansey start is generally not good. The ability to heal with Nurse Call is so good in this deck, since Super Connectivity will spread some damage around your side of the board. Being able to rid your hand of Trainers against Vilegar, toss Energy to be Super Connected back into play, and reducing your hand size for Magnetic Draw made Blissey a perfect partner for 'Zone.

Manectric combo's with Entei & Raikou Legend, has free retreat, can spread damage to set up KO's, can get Lighting energy out of the deck and attach it to my bench, and can serve as a speed bump for Garchomp's Dragon Rush while I set up a Magnezone. As a bonus, Electrike even has free retreat! If I manage to get the Bench Shield on it as well, then it can pose even more issues for some decks.

Spiritomb is used to slow down SP and Gyrados while also setting up my lines. I only ended up with 2 as any more tended to clog up my hand and my bench, plus I simply don't have much room available to add in more. 2 is also the minimum I would suggest to get around the Regi Move strategy of sending one to the bench in order to play trainers. I expect to lose both of these during the game while setting up.

Entei & Raikou Legend serves as my mid-game equalizer, bench sniper, and occasionally game finisher. I don't mind using it and losing it to take 2-3 prizes off of benched Uxie's, Azelf's, Smeargle's, and Crobat G's among other typical bench sitters. It's also a fire type so I can hit annoying stuff like Dialga G X or Steelix for a OHKO if need be. Free retreat is another added bonus.

Azelf and Uxie are for emergency uses, and I generally try not to play them unless I absolutely need to. With Rainbow in the deck, though Azelf can Lock Up an opposing Spiritomb or Smergle if I need a turn or two to build up. Uxie's ability to avoid a Fainting Spell flip by returning to the deck also led me to keep one in the deck.

Ditto is my wild card. Not only is Ditto a hard counter for Gengar, especially with Blissey healing it, but with 4 Rainbow in the deck and the ability to move them around with Magnezone X, you can use virtually any attack out there against your opponent. For example, I managed to Champ Buster a Machamp Prime for KO to seal one game and revenge kill Garchomp C X with its own Dragon Rush in another.

I knew I wanted my trainers to revolve around Judge, so using 4 was an automatic decision. The disruption they provide allows the deck to get into the mid to late game a little easier than it normally would against speedier decks. Judge also tends to get opposing players to drop that second (or 3rd) Uxie on the bench in an attempt to get set up themselves. Those extra Uxies end up being prizes thanks to Entei & Raikou Legend.

Where as Judge works very well with Magnezone Prime, Engineeer's Adjustment worked just as well with Super Connectivity. Drawing 4 cards, while also speeding up my energy attaching is just too good not to use.

Seeker, VS Seeker, Junk Arm, Warp Point, and Expert Belt all add to the flexibility of the deck. More would be nice in some cases, but not having them at all would be much worse. Bench Shield was added later to make Manectric a little more annoying for Chomp players.

During deck building I tended to weigh Energy with an effect as more useful than a trainer with a similar use. Warp Energy is better here than Warp Point, Call Energy is better than Collector. The simple reason for that is that those energies are also 50 more damage each that Magnezone Prime can dish out later on in the game. Going light on trainers also had a secondary benefit of making the Gengar match a bit easier and opposing Smeargle's Portrait power tended to find a Judge way more often than they would the Pokemon Collector they were hoping for.

I'll go over the main 3 match-ups during CC's.

Luxchomp is by far the hardest match. The ability to snipe, drag up, and generally out speed and over power you before you get going is tough to deal with. On top of that you can't really afford to trade prizes with them, because you will run out of resources before they do and Luxchomp is designed to do that while Magnezone is not. If you are able to slow them down with Sipritomb and set up a Leveled Up, Belted, Magnezone Prime you can Lost Burn and Cyber Shock your way to victory. Also, keep an eye on their bench during the match and use ERL to quickly end the game if they are sloppy. Judging away their Cyrus chains can also put them in a bind occasionally, but don't expect Judge to win this for you on it's own. Most of my losses during CC's came from LuxChomp. I'm still looking for the right build to tip that match-up in Magnezone's favor, but so far it has eluded me.

Gyrados, on the other hand is typically much easier to deal with. Judge and Trainer lock them with Tomb early to stunt their setup, and watch them scramble to draw cards via Uxie drops. Once you are set up you can do everything from tanking with Magnezone X and Blissey healing, to OHKOing them with Lost Burn. ERL usually abruptly ends the match.

Vilegar is a very even match, typically. Depending on the build most games with literally come down to a coin flip for Fainting Spell. Ditto makes things hard on them if you can get it set up early and use Shadow Room on them. Don't be afraid to risk a Fainting Spell flip, though, as they will eventually pick apart your bench full of Power having pokemon. In addition to Ditto, I had some success with using a tanked Magenton and BTS in play to spread a lot of damage around their board, while also ditching my trainers with Blissey. ERL and Manectric also happen to add up to 110 damage, which can cost them several attackers at once if they set up quickly to avoid getting Judged. Use Thunder Fall first, then retreat to Manectic's Power Wave to avoid losing 2 prizes to a heads on Fainting Spell for ERL instead of 1 for Manectric. I tended to ignore Vileplume entirely and focused on threats during these matches.

feedback:
THIS is what you call a "plug and play" post! Someone can print this out, build out the list, study what you've written and compete RIGHT NOW! This one is a the gold nugget that people read and sift for. Thank you so much for sharing and taking the time to type all of that! (4 GuruPoints = DarkWalker)

[Tagrineth]

Nature + Technology =

Pokemon (18):

4x Eevee (Evo finder)
2x Leafeon (RR)
2x Leafeon Lv. X
1x Espeon (MD)
3x Magnemite (Magnet)
2x Magneton (I use the metal SF one for electric energy costs)
3x Magnezone Prime
1x Uxie

Trainers:
3x Pokemon Collector
3x Bebe's Search
2x Judge
2x Copycat
2x Seeker
1x Twins
1x Flower Shop Lady
3x Expert Belt
2x Rare Candy
1x Junk Arm
1x VS Seeker
1x Premier Ball
1x Luxury Ball

Energy (18):
4x DCE
9x Grass
5x Electric


So, the idea is simple enough: It's a deck that combines two powerhouse beaters with high OHKO potential, both of which also support each other with their Powers.

Leafeon Lv. X: [G][C]: 30 +10 more for each Energy attached to Leafeon.
Energy Forcing: Once per turn, attach an Energy from your hand to one of your Pokemon.

I try to lead with Leafeon to start dumping Energy into play quickly. Once the hand is depleted by Energy Forcing you can shuffle-draw or Magnetic Draw new hands, and when Leafeon falls if you cannot replace Leafeon you put up 'Zone and destroy something.

Anything Leafeon cannot punch down, 'Zone can for sure.

Leafeon with a Belt hits 130hp. Espeon is in the deck almost solely for the Gyarados matchup as having Espeon + Belt makes Leafeon a 3HKO from natural 3-karp Tail Revenge. Granted Gdos runs its own Belts and Crobats, but any little thing you can do helps.

Hasn't received much playtesting yet as I only recently put the first draft of the deck together, but it seems to flow well. The ability to OHKO anything as needed tends to be a huge boon.

Feedback:
It would be interesting to see how this build performs in testing. I've used 2 LeafX in builds before, but never successfully with a Stage2 (just requires SO much draw and luck to set up before you get beat down). The number of starting pokes and NO call is scary (no tomb, no smeargle, and like 8 basics?). This looks like it's really in it's infant stages, but it's an idea that someone can pick up and try to make work. (leafeon/leaf guard, is a pretty good attacker vs. Gyrarados) - (2 Guru Points = Tagrineth)

[CFOURCOLTSFAN]

This magnezone is for MD-TR , since we don't what cards are in CoL for certain

Pokemon(22)
3-3-2-1-1 Magnezone LV.X(SF-SF-Gyro Ball-Magnetic Draw-LV.X)
1-1 ERL
1-1 Manectric(PL-PL)
1 Uxie
1 Azelf
2 Spiritomb
1-1 Blissey(PL-PL)
1 Ditto(LA)
1 Unown Q
1 Regice
1 Mesprit

T/S/S(21)
1 Seeker
1 Sunyshore
1 Conductive Quarry
1 BTS
1 Bench Shield
1 Junk Arm
2 Bebe's Search
3 Judge
2 Pokemon Collector
2 Engineer's
1 VS. Seeker
1 Palmer's Contribution
2 Rare Candy
1 Expert Belt
1 Luxury Ball

Energy(14)
2 Call
3 Lightning
4 Rainbow
4 Sp. Metal
1 Warp Energy

This is a list that has seen a lot of success in my area(variations of it of course). The list is designed to just have good matchups v. most of the decks despite it's techiness.I also like the mesprit for powerlocking and seeker is just good in general.

V. Vilegar- tough matchup usually but your goal is to just get magnezones and use ERL to really mess them up due to their powers. Ditto is such a game saver w/ the rainbow energy.

V. Luxchomp-Toughest matchup b/c of their speed. You need to get a tomb ASAP to slow them down. Also the bench shield is for this matchup so they have to brightlook up the manectric to KO it. ERL again wins games. Magnezone's HP is also just gross for them to deal w/ BTW.

V. Gyarados-You win period. Magnezone is just as fast and hits for weakness. It's tough for them.

V. Machamp-Easy b/c what happens is most of their energy gets stuck on one pokemon and then you one shot it w/ Lost burn.

Most of the techs are in their for one matchup but it tends to flow really well.

feedback:
this deck has been mentioned in the thread before. However, you've done something good here. What you've done is show us what a list looks like when it's TECH'd Out. Then you go into some discussion about HOW to use the techs (i.e. cards that are in the deck to handle bad matchups with popular decks in your area). Many people toss a tech card or two into a deck but they don't help the reader understand what they are and how/when to use them. Thanks. (2 Guru Points = cfourcoltsfan)
yeah my bad i didn't darkwalker's post before mine...

[Baroness Meena]

This is actually my current league deck.
Tis fun to play and the healing of blissey has been found to be frustrating for opponents if timed correctly :tongue:

Pokemon 25
2 x Heatran (1AR:fire:/1LA:metal:)
2 x Heatran LV.X
3 x Magnemite (2 sF :metal:/1TU:lightning:)
2 x Magneton (SF :metal:/1 :lightning:)
2 x Magnezone (SF:lightning: )
1 x Magnezone LV.X
1 x Chansey (HGSS)
1 x Blissey Prime (HGSS)
1 x Uxie (LA)
1 x Azelf (LA)
1 x Unown Q
3 x Spiritomb (AR)
1 x Electrike (PL)
1 x Manectric (PL)
1 Relicanth SV
1 x Scyther UD36
1 x scizor prime


Trainer/Supporter/Stadium 23
2 x Pokemon Collector
4 x Bebe's Search
4 x Seeker
1 x VS Seeker
1 x Palmer's Contribution
1 x Luxury Ball
3 x Level Max
2 x Professor Oak's New Theory
2 x Switch
1 x Warp Point
1 x Premier Ball
1 x Bench Shield


Energy 12
4 x Lightning Energy - Basic
4 x Metal Energy - Special
2 x Metal Energy - Basic
1 x Rainbow Energy - Special
1 x warp energy

Strategy:
Start with spiritomb to stall and get a magnezone and manectric set up. retreat with unown or knock out spiritomb and use level max to get heatran lv x and maybe magnezone lv x. bench shield for manectric to prevent snipes (other than damage counters). Use cyber shock for paralysis and heatran lv x power attaches energy back (if basic) also have power on magnezone if heatran not set up to get discarded electric and metal energy. Use energy trans to move to undamaged pokemon to allow blissey to heal all pokemon without losing energy. seeker back up for another go. gyro ball can be used to get out of active and put up scizor. The body helps block players using rescue and call energy and also can provide a OHKO for tanks with easy energy movementI can build second magnezone also to gyro ball to and spread damge for when blissey can't heal. The general pixies for draw power and help if vital card is prized.

This works surprisingly well altho I am currently thinking of removing scizor line and relicanth for maybe Blaziken FB or Infernape 4.

feedback:
How about removing your scizor and relicanth stuff for switches and more warp energy? That would allow you to get out your heatran AND be fearless vs. Bright Look. I've built zone/heatran (with a tech Jirachi doom desire) a long time ago. It was, actually, a great deck but Unown G was killing me. Now, there's no unown G which makes your build make me rub my chin and eyeball my deck graveyard.... hmm... LOL! Thanks for sharing. (2 Guru Points = Baroness Meena)

[Vegeta ss4]

4 Magnemite SF-66
2 Magneton SF-42
2 Magnezon SF-5
2 Magnezone Prime
2 Voltorb SF-81
2 Electrode Prime
1 Uxie
1 Azelf
1 Dialga PL-5
...17

2 Bebe's
2 Seeker
2 Twins
1 Palmer
4 Poke Drawer
4 Junk Arm
3 Quick Ball
3 PokeDex
3 Pokemon Rescue
3 Rare Candy
2 BTS
...29

Energy
2 Call
2 Rescue
10 Lightning
...14

This is another rogue deck I've been working on, and in some testing it has done quite well. This deck is one of the fast decks for a deck that thrives and kos every turn. Magnezone SF allows you to search for any lightning or Metal Pokemon, which makes this deck always consistant. Magnezone Prime allows you to draw cards until your hand reaches 6. This is crucial, considering this deck is a basic trainer setup deck. It thrives on many trainers being played a turn. Magnezone Prime is the main attacker, it does 50X the amount of energy send to the lost zone by discarding it there. 3 energy and it is almost koing everything in the format. Here is the engine of the deck;
Electrode Prime. This was my favorite card of the latest set, mainly because it is such a strategic card and allows for quick outs. This has been an engine that I have devised, its a quick accel engine that abuses being behind at the start, then allowing yourself to nearly grab anything you want out of the deck. Here is why that is;

The trode engine is as follows, Trode Prime/Poke Drawer/Junk Arm/Twins/Speed Trainer/Pokemon Rescue. Now, onto how exactly this allows you to search for whatever you want. Trode allows you to ko yourself, and look at the top 7 cards of your deck, then choose as many energy cards as you like and attach them anywhere you like. Then you discard the rest, in which the backdoor search engine is in full swing. By discarding these extra cards, you will find yourself with a few trainers in the discard pile, or pokemon in the discard pile. With cards like Pokemon Rescue which basically makes that move you just did, a "search" of some sort. With trainers in the discard now, you could have some you'd love to see in there. Such as a Poke Drawer, which when combed with Junk Arm, you can have to Poke Drawer. Using Junk Arm can also allow you to go into other strats, but more of that later. After Trode is Koed, this will make your opponent to draw a prize, and make you behind on prizes which activates TWINS(a broken sexy
card).

Call is a great card, and with a magnemite start, it will come in handy. Rescue is a SAVOR of Magnezone.

Dialga is in here in combo with Junk Arm, seeker, Trode Prime. In a nutshell, you will be discarding energies with Junk arm, then dropping that Dialga allows you to search your discard pile for a combo of 3 energy/pokemon. After setting up a trode, you play Dialga, get 3 energy from discard pile, and put them ontop of your deck. Trode self Destructs and bam, 3 energy attached to whatever you want, automatically.

I am a huge fan of this system, but sadly this trode engine wont be big until the next format, just thought id show you a rogue/decent deck looks like.

This a prime example of what SYNERGY looks like. Which is one of 3 things I preach about. ASK R_A.

Hop you enjoyed:) .

feedback:
The thing that can be learned here is how to toy with the idea of trainer draw speed, thin out the deck, drop a TrodePrime and TWINS. You've inspired me to do some more with that (there's GOT to be a way to get this combo going, but the discard is just SO BAD). I love how you advize people to ATTACH THE RESCUE so you can live to see late game with this build. This is a list worth toying around with and testing. Trainer lock makes you cry though. So, have you considered 2 cyclone + 1 more seeker to get that starter spiritomb out of the way? (2 Guru Points = Vegeta_ss4)

[Vegeta ss4]

I built both guru decks with the thought process of "Iron Chef" style. To not worry about the metagame. The goal as I interpreted it as, was to create a deck that's good enough to do what it needs to do, in terms of setup. If it was a different case, then I would have made some adjustments. I would of actually used Luxray LVX to get the switcheroo going. If this style of challenges weren't with that mindset, then I agree with both scores I have received. If I am right in terms of how the challenge process is, then I received no where near enough points, for either.

I will explain a bit about my Zone list. Discarding card is the GOAL of the deck. I have actually played this deck against people and shocked them at how fast I was setup. I had fully powered Zone with 2 more zone, 9 energy+ attached by T-3. Anything that goes in the discard helps me out, tremendously. I have nearly 10 Bebe searches in the deck, in theory, 8 of those aren't even being used as a supporter for the turn. I have a. Way to make sure I get the energy on top of deck. I am a bit shocked at the score, but im glad you are inspired by the engine.

[Rogue Archetype]

2 points means you have a good idea with lots of detail.

More than 2 points means that the deck has gone into tournament and won (or I've personally seen it work well).

So, 2 points is the highest that I give an unproven idea (you got the 'high score' so there's nothing to be shocked about). :smile:

[gallade]

Heres my quick idea: magnezone lawck. BEFORE YOU SAY SOMEONE HAS POSTED THIS, THIS ONE IS A LOCKING DECK XD

24 pokes
4-3-2-2 magnezone (sf, sf, prime, electric one) -your main attacker and draw power.
3-1 uxie lvx -set up even faster, and consistent draw FTW
2 unown q -retreating is nice
2-1 spiritomb (ar, tr) -trainer lock and hand lock
2 sableye -another starter, get the judges started
2 mesprit -keep the lock going

25 trainers
3 bebes -get stuff set up
3 communication -get stuff set up
4 judge -the main way you lock
3 SSU -heal and lock
1 palmers -recovery
2 vs seeker -a lot of supporters = a lot of vs seekers
2 twins -your going to be behind
3 seeker -keep mespriting/magnezoning
2 BTS -after seekering a magnezone, play it back down, also, fast set ups FTW
2 expert belt -more damage = more fun

5 electric -attack, it's the right thing to do
3 call -set up FAST
3 DCE -attack a little faster, don't need to max it out

Your strategy is to lock them as much as possible, while dishing out 60 (80=belt) a turn, while trainer locking, power locking, and shutting down their hand.

feedback:
Thanks for sharing one of the decks that you've been working on. That was selfless and really shows great spirit of the game :) More strategy detail would've given this more deserved points. ( gallade = 1 point )

[Vegeta ss4]

2 points means you have a good idea with lots of detail.

More than 2 points means that the deck has gone into tournament and won (or I've personally seen it work well).

So, 2 points is the highest that I give an unproven idea (you got the 'high score' so there's nothing to be shocked about). :smile:

I understand the grading system now, I was interpreting iron chef style.

[Rogue Archetype]

This thread has been accounted for in the Guru Points total list.

[Tagrineth]

Just to throw this out here, this was my older Magnezone concept which works great in formats not like the current one lol.

Pokemon:
4x Magnemite (Magnet)
2x Magneton (SF Metal)
2x Magnezone (SF Super Conn)
1x Magnezone Prime
1x Magnezone Lv. X

2x Electrike (PL)
2x Manectric (PL)

2x Chinchou (meh)
2x Lanturn Prime

1x ERL Top Half
1x ERL Bottom Half

2x Jirachi (RR)

1x Uxie

Trainers:
3x Pokemon Collector
3x Bebe's Search
3x Engineer's Adjustments
2x Twins
1x Judge
1x Seeker
1x Palmer's Contribution
2x Switch
2x Rare Candy
1x VS Seeker
1x Pokemon Communication
1x Luxury Ball
1x Premier Ball

Energy:
4x Special Metal
11x Electric


This was the final build before I scrapped the deck.

The basic idea is start with Jirachi. Abuse Detour to double-up on setup Supporters - fishing out every basic, or drawing 8 cards, or even searching 4 with Twins (tee hee). Generally the deck allows the opponent to take the first prize card, sometimes the first two, in order to set up at least one Magnezone and one of each stage 1.

The general goal of the deck is to spam Gyro Ball into Jirachi early on. If Jirachi doesn't die, free retreat back into Magnezone and repeat as necessary. Jirachi dying allows the deck to fish out several of the low-count Tech supporters (e.g. Jirachi dead -> Cynthia's for a fresh hand, or -> Seeker for healing/reusing Uxie). Once Jirachis are spent, generally either one Manectric or one Magnezone will bite the bullet and be sacrificed for the greater good (Manectric's free retreat is so good!). Palmer's can retrieve any pokemon or line that needs to be re-used (e.g. recycling Jirachis, especially against Gyarados).

Midgame is where you start preparing for the deck's win conditions. Against power heavy decks (aka anything that runs pixies), this means zapping once or twice with Manectric PL's first attack to soften up targets for ERL. Against tank decks, this means setting up Lanturn Prime or Magnezone Prime. The midgame often involves one or two quick prize trades; against the usual Expert Belt builds this tends to mean evening out the prize count, sometimes coming slightly ahead depending on what the opponent has up. At the very least though, generally this phase also involves destroying the opponent's biggest remaining threats leaving techs and support, or crippling their support line leaving their threats sitting ducks.

Endgame is the cleanup phase. Any remaining big hitters come in strong with either a second shot from ERL or a recovered and replayed Lanturn Prime. Gyro Ball to wear out the opponent's remaining defenses is always a good option as well.

Against SPs, most of this procedure goes right out the window in favour of setting up Magnezone SF ASAP -> Manectric PL -> ERL for prize card spam. If they don't see the ERL coming it can often turn a 5-2 or worse lead into an outright win.

Since the deck outright strives to play from behind, Twins is one of the best Supporters you can possibly draw. Detouring a Twins tends to get really sour looks from opponents, lol.

And when all else fails, Magnezone Lv. X provides a trump card with automatic paralysis to threaten a forced 2HKO your opponent must deal with immediately.