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Thread: Skyla

  1. #1
    Chompy's Avatar
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    Skyla

    What are your thoughts on the Supporter card, called Skyla? Will it be one of those cards where it has to have 4 in a deck, or will be one of those cards that get overhyped and then when the card doesn't work, no one plays it?


    Skyla – Trainer

    Supporter


    Search your deck for a Trainer card, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Shuffle your deck afterward.

    You may play only 1 Supporter card during your turn (before your attack).
    WiiU ID: Chompy621

  2. #2
    Based on how Japan has been playing, I think this will see a 2-4 of in every competitive deck, especially when Plasma Gale Magnezone comes out (but that won't be until February)
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  3. #3
    It'll be our only search supporter worth using. It's going to be a very important card. Trade for as many as you can get.
    Don't ask why. Ask why not.
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  4. #4
    I'm going to have to see it to believe it. Our game has such a high demand for playingmany cards as quickly as possible. Because of this, playing a supporter on nearly every turn has been quite essential to success. We rely on playing juniper/N/cheren/bianca to draw both playable cards and a supporter for the next turn as well. While skyla provides some great search possibilities it can't fuel our turn AND provide a supporter for your next turn, like our current supporters can. This leads me to believe skyla won't be great. However its competetors (bianca/cheren) are awful, so it may see a lot of play afterall.

  5. #5

  6. #6
    I don't see it used that often apart from with the Magnezone. The constant need for draw every turn overshadows it.
    Although I'm probably wrong and the hype will carry it to do well.

  7. #7
    Forum Moderator vaporeon's Avatar
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    Its good for those early setup decks. You can grab those Level Balls, your Ace Specs when you need it and maybe a catcher. It has its uses. I personally think the game needs less draw cards and more utility cards.
    Times like this make you wish you had Energy Switch.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Rambo View Post
    I don't see it used that often apart from with the Magnezone. The constant need for draw every turn overshadows it.
    Although I'm probably wrong and the hype will carry it to do well.
    The only reason we need constant draw every turn is our utter lack of search.
    Don't ask why. Ask why not.
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthPika View Post
    As I've said countless times; you sir are the biggest lucksack I've ever known, both in pokemon and IRL.
    Top 32 Worlds 2013

  9. #9
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    This should be played in addition to the draw supporters. Remember, it basically gives you access to any card in your deck since you can use it to fetch a ball. It gets you the last card for your setup guaranteed, instead of hoping to get it on a Juniper or N. If you don't need it early game, just N it back into your deck and use it to fetch your catchers later.

    I'm definetly looking forward to this card.

  10. #10
    dude so pumped for the fa of this, on another note i think it's a 2 of in most decks but not a 4 of in anything until zone comes out
    2011 Great Lakes Fall Regional Champion
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    T64 2011 and 2013 USA Nationals

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Garch View Post
    The only reason we need constant draw every turn is our utter lack of search.
    No, you're over simplifying.

    First, we have search cards, and they are even Items, thus we can draw for them and use more than one per turn. We had some very powerful search based Supporters in recent years and... yeah, I think we can understand why they aren't here anymore.

    Supporter Search is always second to good draw power, because getting the one card you need is usually not enough, at least early game or when trying to recover from a KO. Now the question is how much "good" draw power do we have? Professor Juniper draws a full seven but discards your hand, making it painful for several decks (even some successful ones). N is so variable and can help your opponent. Now, once we get Colress I really anticipate Skyla taking off; get off one massive draw then anything you missed, Skyla snags directly.

    In closing, let me point out that two Skyla does sound about right.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pokepop View Post
    Subtlety is not Pokemon's strong suit.
    Too bad the real issue is one of clarity.

  12. #12
    With ultra ball and energy search, skyla is pretty much a computer search, aside from not being able to get special energies. Heck, she can even pseudo-search for a supporter by grabbing a random receiver. I'm starting my post release testing with 3-4 skyla and one energy search in everything.

    ---------- Post added 09/25/2012 at 11:59 AM ----------

    Actually she is even a computer search, because she can search it out. Lol

  13. #13
    The problem with Skyla to Random Reciever is that Random Recievering for a Skyla when you are needing a new hand doesn't do anything. Skyla is a decent card, for sure, but i don't think its a staple by any means. Just like every supporter we have, great in some cases, useless in others.
    Top 8 at States, 3rd Regionals with Kicks from Brixton =D 2009
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  14. #14
    The translation I saw specified "Trainer" for Skyla, not "Item". That is why she can grab a Stadium as well. So you would just use Skyla to snag a specific Supporter anyway.

    The real problem with claiming Skyla is Computer Search is that... Computer Search is an Item. It will be an Ace Spec, but it was a "normal" Trainer originally. Huge difference having to go

    Skyla => [insert search card/] => [insert non-Trainer target/]

    versus

    Computer Search => Discard 2 Cards => [insert search target/]

    Skyla will have an edge some of the time (that discard cost can really hurt), but especially in a format where Supporters are your major source of draw power, and the fact that you're relying on an intermediary card (which means you're running it and need one copy still in your deck)... it can backfire.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pokepop View Post
    Subtlety is not Pokemon's strong suit.
    Too bad the real issue is one of clarity.

  15. #15
    I agree that it definitely has its drawbacks, and the card by itself is not that amazing, but I still feel that it almost acts like computer search but with different drawbacks. Skyla gives you access to almost anything in your deck and can even access your discard with cards like revive and dark patch. I much prefer search to draw. Heck, with bicycle, skyla can even act like a smaller Bianca (admittedly not that good early game).

    ---------- Post added 09/25/2012 at 08:04 PM ----------

    Also yes skyla to random reliever is bad. But it's still a utility of the card.

  16. #16
    TheRolesWePlay's Avatar
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    Here's the thing about Skyla. There's virtually an Item for everything, and it doesn't get rid of your hand like N and Juniper. In early game I often find myself needing an Emolga and needing to get rid of an otherwise great hand with Juniper or N in the hopes of getting something to get it, but Skyla can get any of the Balls to get it, or any other Pokemon.

    The only thing that Skyla can't really do is get Special energy. Personally I think it's the perfect utility card that takes out a lot of the risk other supporters have in order to get other cards.
    Q. Can I use Rotom's "Mischievous Trick" Poke-POWER when I have no cards in my deck, to put a Prize card into my deck?
    A. No, you can't. That would be far too mischievous. (HS:Undaunted FAQ; Sep 9, 2010 PUI Rules Team)
    Quote Originally Posted by PokePop View Post
    Basic Rule of Thumb: If something creates a situation that is too good to be true (Mime in immune to ALL damage), it is too good to be true.

  17. #17
    Plus now you can reliably run just one of a specific item (tool scrapper is an excellent example) and still be able to access it when you need it, aside from prizing of course. The inability to reliably tech specific cards is one of the few things I dislike about this format (as everyone who's played against my dumb decks from years ago would guess), and skyla solves that for me. I guess that's why I'm so psyched for this card.

  18. #18
    I don't mean to nitpick, but how some are stating things seems... inaccurate. First, formats with "reliable TecH" usually are my least favorite, but Skyla doesn't give us that. For that you need Computer Search/Item Finder or perhaps Twins/Junk Arm... or a card I truly loathed (because it was too powerful) Pidgeot (EX: FireRed/LeafGreen 10/112).

    I believe Skyla can give us a happy medium. Unless they print a method of easily recycling Items from the discard (not costing an attack or being your Ace Spec), then Skyla will be "just right" since you can snag any Trainer (and thus most true TecH cards) from your deck, but at the significant cost of your Supporter. Yes, Pidgeot was a Stage 2 line, but at the time it was often a 2HKO and of course, a re-usable effect.

    So again, I apologize if it seems like I am psychotically obsessing with semantics, I want to express things as clearly as possible, especially for those that haven't experienced the full spectrum of search options the TCG has experienced over the years.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pokepop View Post
    Subtlety is not Pokemon's strong suit.
    Too bad the real issue is one of clarity.

  19. #19
    I think Skyla will be heavily abused in speed decks because it will allow you to search out the ether or pokedex needed to get the T1 acceleration. Those decks also rely on ultra ball, so it's possible to get hand size small enough that bicycle would net you a couple of cards -- not great, but still some draw.

  20. #20
    Forum Moderator vaporeon's Avatar
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    In the defense of Pidgeot, it mad many decks playable, no matter what the deck was. There were also many counters to turn it off. You had Battle Frontier to turn off the power and Giant Stump to force a opponent to discard it. Pidgeot was good but not too good. Everyone played it so they both had the option and Pidgeot made the format skill based and not luck based.

    If you want to talk about powerful, then Cyrus's Conspiracy where only one type of deck could use it. We need more cards that work for everything. It would be nice to have a Dark Patch for all energy types.
    Times like this make you wish you had Energy Switch.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon View Post
    In the defense of Pidgeot, it mad many decks playable, no matter what the deck was. There were also many counters to turn it off. You had Battle Frontier to turn off the power and Giant Stump to force a opponent to discard it. Pidgeot was good but not too good. Everyone played it so they both had the option and Pidgeot made the format skill based and not luck based.

    If you want to talk about powerful, then Cyrus's Conspiracy where only one type of deck could use it. We need more cards that work for everything. It would be nice to have a Dark Patch for all energy types.
    I believe the opposite. If you have a ton of cards that are good for everything, where's the creativity and variety in deckbuilding? We already have almost no variety in T/S/S lines as it is.. every deck already has Catcher, most decks use Ultra Ball/Max Potion at this stage in the game, and everyone runs almost the same Supporter line, barring minor adjustments for the specific deck and play style. We don't need more cards that will make everyone's deck the same, we need specialized cards for specialized strategies and types. That's why I'm loving Plasma right now; it gives those types of Pokemon something unique. Frankly, I loved the Gym Heroes/Gym Challenge times where you had benefits for running a Blaine or Erika deck.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Otaku View Post
    I don't mean to nitpick, but how some are stating things seems... inaccurate. First, formats with "reliable TecH" usually are my least favorite, but Skyla doesn't give us that. For that you need Computer Search/Item Finder or perhaps Twins/Junk Arm... or a card I truly loathed (because it was too powerful) Pidgeot (EX: FireRed/LeafGreen 10/112).

    I believe Skyla can give us a happy medium. Unless they print a method of easily recycling Items from the discard (not costing an attack or being your Ace Spec), then Skyla will be "just right" since you can snag any Trainer (and thus most true TecH cards) from your deck, but at the significant cost of your Supporter. Yes, Pidgeot was a Stage 2 line, but at the time it was often a 2HKO and of course, a re-usable effect.

    So again, I apologize if it seems like I am psychotically obsessing with semantics, I want to express things as clearly as possible, especially for those that haven't experienced the full spectrum of search options the TCG has experienced over the years.
    I'd be a fool to suggest that it's one of the best search cards ever, because I have no hard facts to argue that point either way. That's not what I am trying to convey. What i mean is that For this format, and especially for people like me who like playing singletons to gain an advantage in very specific situations, it's the obvious go to card.

    Sounds silly, but for me its kind of comparable to being deprived of food for a few days and then being given ramen: certainly not as good as what you might remember, but at this point, you'll take what you can get.

  23. #23
    Reminds me a lot of this card. Now, obviously, Skyla is better because you can search your entire deck, but my point is that Supporters that do things other than give you more cards often just don't get played. Thinking about some of those supporters, there's Cilan, Seeker, Black Belt, Fisherman, Hooligan's Jim and Cass, Interviewer's Questions, Lucian's Assignment, Marley's Request, and on and on.

    The real question behind the playability of Skyla is simple: Is getting any 1 trainer from your deck more important than maximizing your chances of setting up through simple drawpower? Or, does the format offer the right mix of trainers to allow a player to successfully use Sklya to set up? For the former question, I can see speed decks taking advantage of something like Skyla. I can see Skyla being used to grab Rare Candy as well. And of course, if ever we get something like Uxie or Claydol, I can see Skyla falling in quite nicely (especially with so many trainers that search for Pokemon). For the second question, we are getting trainers like Bike and Computer Search. In case you ever find yourself with no draw supporters and a Skyla, simply Skyla for a Computer Search for a Bike (or a draw supporter).

    So given the trainers in our format once BC gets released, I'm thinking of Skyla more like a toned-down Castaway or Cyrus's Conspiracy than all those other supporters I listed. I think it has a lot of potential, but definitely requires some testing!
    T E A M M I S S I N G N O

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon View Post
    In the defense of Pidgeot, it mad many decks playable, no matter what the deck was.
    Playable or functional? The two are not the same thing. My experience was that Pidgeot made the best decks either dominant (extreme end of "playable") or dominant and functional... where functional just means that the deck accomplishes its goals other than actually securing a win. Basically, that amounts to setting up and accomplishing any key tactics, whether or not those end up winning you the game or not.

    Some top decks wouldn't have worked without Pidgeot, some would. Still, most decks ended up remaining sub-par even if Pidgeot helped them, plus some decks that would have been good were hurt by Pidgeot. Yes, hurt: decks that excel at quickly taking down opponents but at a reasonable cost to itself were really hurt.

    Decks like one of my favorites (translation: this is my personal bias), Liability. Still, many decks suffered as Pidgeot enabled rapid-fire recovers for all decks... meaning the top decks just remained the top decks. Coming up with a clever rogue deck or play meant nothing because the next turn a Quick Search and a Supporter usage and your opponent had their next attacker ready to go!

    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon View Post
    There were also many counters to turn it off. You had Battle Frontier to turn off the power and Giant Stump to force a opponent to discard it.
    There are counters and there are successful counters. Battle Frontier did wonders against the new wave of Dark and Rocket's decks, but it wasn't all that effective a counter for Pidgeot; Pidgeot decks just ran a different Stadium. As long as they could draw (or spare a preparatory Quick Search for) a Stadium, Quick Search was back! That means Battle Frontier could completely fail to counter Pidgeot!

    About Giant Stump: yes its effect forced players down to just three Pokémon on your Bench but realistically, the only time you'd give up your Pidgeot was when you already had a strong set-up. The majority of the time it would make more sense to keep Pidgeot and rebuild your Bench... and that assumes you needed more than three Pokémon on your Bench.

    Both were released after Pidgeot: Battle Frontier debuted three whole sets later... Giant Stump six full sets!

    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon View Post
    Pidgeot was good but not too good. Everyone played it so they both had the option and Pidgeot made the format skill based and not luck based.
    To give a good impression of the format, players need to be aware that this was a time with draw power like Steven's Advice (EX: Hidden Legends 92/101, EX: Power Keepers 83/108). It was a time of Rare Candy working on a Pokémon you just Benched and could thus accelerate Basic to Stage 1 or Stage 2! It was a time of Boost Energy (most recent printing OP Series 5 8/17), Double Rainbow Energy (most recent printing OP Series 5 4/17), and Scramble Energy (most recent printing EX: Dragon Frontiers 89/101). Being able to snag such cards so easily, even if only once per turn, was plenty.

    So I must completely disagree with vaporeon's assessment. Pidgeot was too good. Everyone always has the option to run every and any card, unless it is literally so scarce there aren't enough copies. Even taking into account pricing issues, this logic fails. Not every deck will have room for every card, so some decisions must be made.

    Pidgeot was what is often referred to as a "loose" staple. A staple is a card every deck runs, however very few cards are "true" staples that virtually every deck either runs or runs maxed out. A "loose" staple can either be a card most decks run but a few don't, or as I am using it in this case, a card that is either run or countered in the vast majority of decks. If you're wondering, since I mean every deck when I say every deck, there will be exceptions: those who can't afford it or stubbornly insist on not running it.

    There was an alternative to Pidgeot, and that was Magcargo (EX: Deoxys 20/107), but I never saw it successfully used without also including Battle Frontier (EX: Emerald 75/106, EX: Power Keepers 71/108). It also was much less prominent than Pidgeot. I likely have missed at least some successful decks that ran only one, the other, maybe even neither, but usually the few decks not running Pidgeot had Magcargo with Battle Frontier.

    I do not mean to dismiss anyone's skill, but it was a different skill set; a significant aspect of general playing skill was rendered largely unimportant because player's could easily access any one card from the deck a turn, and this in turn increased reliance of a specific section of deck building skill. Skill is still skill, but it really was not fun with how it overpowered certain decks while just giving a slight boost to others, and even less fun when you were given the choice of running something you might enjoy or sticking with the archetypes and staples.

    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon View Post
    If you want to talk about powerful, then Cyrus's Conspiracy where only one type of deck could use it. We need more cards that work for everything. It would be nice to have a Dark Patch for all energy types.
    vaporeon, we've been over this before and you haven't refuted the logic; it isn't being exclusive that automatically "breaks" a card. This is not to say I would consider Cyrus's Conspiracyby any means balanced, just that making it work for all decks just means all decks pretty much have to run it, and all get to be "overpowered".

    Think of it like this: back in the day, all decks could choose to run Energy Removal and Super Energy Removal, but some decks could run them better and some decks were less vulnerable to them. The net result was (exact numbers varying based on the time period) a few decks being at the top, a few more being second string, and seemingly everything else a distant third; so distant that truly hopeless or joke decks weren't worth separating out to fourth place.
    Last edited by Otaku; 09/27/2012 at 08:14 AM. Reason: Fixed Wrong Word Typo
    Quote Originally Posted by Pokepop View Post
    Subtlety is not Pokemon's strong suit.
    Too bad the real issue is one of clarity.

  25. #25
    Decks like one of my favorites (translation: this is my personal bias), Liability. Still, many decks suffered as Pidgeot enabled rapid-fire recovers for all decks... meaning the top decks just remained the top decks. Coming up with a clever rogue deck or play meant nothing because the next turn a Quick Search and a Supporter usage and your opponent had their next attacker ready to go!
    Acid Liability wouldn't have worked or been able to win anything at all without Pidgeot.

    Metagross tank decks, a consistent tier 1.5 during that format, also wouldn't have worked at all without Pidgeot.

    Pidgeot doesn't stifle creativity, it enables it.
    From Pojo's forum: "you sacrifice synergy to be playing electrodes and rayquazas in a blaziken deck as it is. it isn't broken enough"

    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon
    However, in a game where you can play 4 of everything, a side deck seems almost worthless

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