Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 27

Thread: Is "GeChamp" a new metagame counter?

  1. #1

    Is "GeChamp" a new metagame counter?

    Somebody did extremely well with this deck at states. http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?t=95934 I tested it out, its actually pretty good. Although i think that there's another combo with Gengar that would work better, "GeChamp" is a pretty good Metagame counter. Discuss.
    Instagram and Twitter: @lukeriverr
    Vanguard, Pokemon, and Kaijudo

  2. #2
    Content Developer
    Blog Admin
    Contest Host
    Prime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    14,278
    Blog Entries
    22
    Images
    79
    Machamp in general is a great metagame counter. It has a GREAT matchup against Galactic decks of all kinds.

  3. #3
    It was my two sons and I that played GeChamp at Florida states. My son played Gengar through most of the cities and we fooled around with a lot of variants going into States. It was not until after the first weekend that we came up with the idea for the Champ line. They are two powerful stage 2 Pokes that have the ability to attack with just one energy which allows them to keep up with the speed of the G Pokes. Seemed to be the play since there was a lack of Unown G being played. I think Gengar or Machamp can be used in several different combinations with other Pokes but they sure do work well together. There are a couple of other key cards though that make them work against the Metagame though.
    2009 Florida State Masters Champion

    Proud father and sparring partner of Carson and Grafton

  4. #4
    A friend and I are planning on running it for Regionals if it does fine. I played a Master's version and beat it with Gengar/Gliscor. I am in Wisconsin, just to let anyone know. Our metagame is a lot different compared to anywhere else. I don't think that it can meet the standards though. I disagree how some said that Machamp alone is good. It can only beat a few decks and most likely will go even. (ie. 3-3). Gengar alone doesn't have enough "umph" to be played seriously and competitively. I think that the two work a lot more smoother together.

    @jrwaxman
    If you wouldn't mind, could I see your Gengar/Machamp list, via PM. I would like to compare it to the one being used around here.
    Trading Thread

    WANTS: Luxray GL LV.X & MORE!!
    HAVES: LV.X's, SR's & Shinies!! + MORE!!

  5. #5
    ^^ Machamp is a beast. I built it around the concept of going through half the deck T2, and i've gotten two T2 machamp about 80% of the time. I definately think that Machamp with something teched INTO it could have potential, I have been looking at possible techs, especially SP pokemon, stage 1 electrics such as Manectric, and others.

    Todays metagame is definately the toughest, Too many decks to keep up with.

  6. #6
    Front Page Article Editor jjkkl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ontario
    Posts
    1,216
    Blog Entries
    8
    I honestly considered a Gengar/Gliscor, especially since both have no retreat cost and Gliscor's Shoot Poison is really helpful for prolonging the damage done by Shadow Room and Poltergeist.

    I wouldn't consider GenChan (what we call it up here) a metagame counter, though. It loses against decks such as Blastcatty, Torterra, and Dusknoir. It's mainly SP Decks that it has a counter against, and frankly, if playing against a G Deck, if you're skilled enough, you can take it down with any well built deck.
    I am Pokegym's official Grammar Nazi. If you have any questions or comments on writing, feel free to ask me. Likewise, if you have a paper, report, etc., that you want me to proofread, I'd be more than happy. If you do, give me enough time in advance.

  7. #7
    This deck is all about targeting easy quick prize cards. The deck has a hard time taking out decks with big stage 2 Pokes without support basics with powers. But how many decks fit this mold these days? I knew that I would not see these in the top cuts in a G dominated format. There were no Torterra, Dusknoir or Amphy in our Top 16 as I remember and that is what I expected. John Silvestro has always told me two things that I keep in mind when building decks. #1 Speed Kills! #2 Prepare for what you expect to see in top cuts. You cannot prepare for what you might see in the early rounds of swiss.

    This deck has a unique combination of speed and disruptions especially with the release of Lookers. Gastly's Pitch Dark really slows G decks down and the threat of Potergeist requires all decks to ditch trainers and not save them for the oppertune time.

    Usually I stay away from two stage 2 Pokes in a deck unless one of them is for set up like Pidgeot or Nidoqueen but in this case neither one needs the other one and both only require 1 energy to attack.

    I like the deck because it has so many options and can be "teched" to fit your individual playstyle but you need to know your Metagame.
    2009 Florida State Masters Champion

    Proud father and sparring partner of Carson and Grafton

  8. #8
    I really think it's an extremely powerful deck. It has:

    - Disruption
    - Sniping
    - Auto Destiny Bond
    - HUGE Direct Damage
    - Easily teched

    The fact that it has a good Dialga G matchup is enough to make it a smart play for regionals, as I'm sure we'll see a TON.
    ~Team Hatter~

  9. #9
    Gowk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Houston, Tx (United States)
    Posts
    343
    Quote Originally Posted by Prime View Post
    Machamp in general is a great metagame counter. It has a GREAT matchup against Galactic decks of all kinds.
    Keep in mind there is also the great, but now seemingly hidden, Gigas. (Its a counter, not a good one, but a counter)

    What i fail to understand is how Gengar is the key pokemon now. Its snipe is great, and geist is nice. But what does that counter? 6 snipe?

    It does its job. It counters Dialga, G decks in general and a wide arrange of decks, but what about other rogues? Or 'hidden' decks? Torterra? Dusknoir? AmphyTric? Rampardos? Any of the numerous, now unseen decks.

    All in all, it works. Congrats to the winners, and users, of this deck.

    Gowk

    Ps: That is the last time i hurry through a thread and post
    Quote Originally Posted by Absoltrainer View Post
    I'd have a gun for when some rabid Pikachu decided to try and hit me with 20,000 volts.

    but on topic, I'd have an absol
    Wow. Not cool.

  10. #10
    Using Miasma, you can Snipe claydol for knockout, and soften things up quickly.

  11. #11
    I like Gengar just because of how psychological it can be. If your opponent sees that you have a Gengar out they are usually less likely to use Uxie/Cosmic Power because they have a chance to draw a bunch of Trainers and Supporters that they won't be able to get rid of in time. Machamp is pretty powerful, obviously, so overall I think that it is a very interesting idea to say the least.

  12. #12
    yoyofsho16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,378
    Images
    1
    I don't understand how you can fit ANYTHING into this deck. I tried building it last night and came up with this:
    3 Gengar
    2 Haunter
    3 Gastly
    1 Machamp X
    2 Machamp
    1 Machoke
    2 Machop
    1 Claydol
    1 Baltoy
    1 Uxie
    1 Azelf
    1 Cresselia
    1 Cress X

    4 Bebe's
    4 Roseanne's
    4 Rare Candy
    1 Warp Point
    1 Luxury Ball
    3 Cynthia's
    4 Looker's Investigation
    2 BTS
    1 Night Maintenance
    1 TSD
    4 Poke Blower +

    4 Multi Energy
    4 Fighting
    4 Psychic

    And that is 61 cards... but how do you tech in anything? Plus, I think it's a little short on Fighting energy...
    www.sixprizes.com
    Quote Originally Posted by ryanvergel View Post
    No one cares about what bad deck you are testing. You are a very new senior and are a blip on no one's radar. You could reveal your exact deck and list and nothing would change.
    TEAM HATTER! ...like a boss

  13. #13
    I run 6 Psychic, 4 call, 1 fighting.
    You just had 3 spaces open up.
    You can go 1-0-1-1 machamp, or 2-1-2. Not 2-1-2-1. +1 Space
    You really don't need all four lookers. 3 is fine. +1 space
    2 Cynthia's is fine in the long run. +1 Space
    TSD...No. +1 Space

    Hurray, you just found 6 spaces.
    ~Team Hatter~

  14. #14
    Why Cresselia? Don't see the point in that...
    From Pojo's forum: "you sacrifice synergy to be playing electrodes and rayquazas in a blaziken deck as it is. it isn't broken enough"

    Quote Originally Posted by vaporeon
    However, in a game where you can play 4 of everything, a side deck seems almost worthless

  15. #15
    Yoyo- your list is close to what I won with....just a few key cards off. I did not run the Champ level up or an Azelf. Speed stadium, 4 Lookers and 3 Cynthias were key to keeping hand size up. I only ran 11 energy and no calls. I agree with Cresselia comments. It was fantastic when I got it up and it won me 2-3 games but only got it into play a few times. But is that what you should expect out of a "tech" anyway?? My son did not play it...went 11-0....and did not seem to miss it.
    2009 Florida State Masters Champion

    Proud father and sparring partner of Carson and Grafton

  16. #16
    The hardest matchup i see is Kingdra. Whats the strategy VS it?
    James "Wames" Arnold
    Worlds Participant 2005/2006/2011, T32 Nats 2009, T8 Nats 2011

  17. #17
    ^^^^ Kill the claydol fast, snipe the Uxie and flip a couple of heads on the Feinting Spell. I played Kingdra all through cities and Grafton played Gengar all the way through. I have no idea how many games we playtested and I would say it is a 50/50 match depending on how many Unown G the Kingdra plays. A 50/50 matchup is all I ask for anyway. Having an autoloss in this format is to be expected to maybe and then it all comes down to matchups at the tournament level. As long as your autoloss is not to one of the four decks you expect to see in tops then you are okay.
    2009 Florida State Masters Champion

    Proud father and sparring partner of Carson and Grafton

  18. #18
    This deck really gets hurt by any deck running 2+ Unown G. No one in FL prepared for gechamp, and instead focused on mirror type situations and only ran 1 unown G, hence the deck doing so well.

    I don't see the deck performing as well vs any deck with 2-3 Unown G, however, as Gengar and Machamp are very bad attackers vs a pokemon with an Unown. The autoloss to toolbox is probably hurtful too (weavile/skuntank/honch/toxi all PUNISH gengar and machamp- assuming they run an unown or two), as well as an autoloss to Obama and a few other older decks that are still played.
    Last edited by ryanvergel; 03/31/2009 at 10:01 AM.
    r

  19. #19
    ^^^^ Totally agree Ryan. Part of why we decided to run the concept was because we noticed the lack of G's being played.....including ourselves. We used to run at least 2 in every deck and were down to none at the first States in GA. If decks can find 2 spots for G that will make it harder but will slow them down some against other matchups. Will they tech them in for GeChamp? With more Gengar and Machamp being played throughout the format I would expect to see more played. There is a nice balance though with the two Pokes attacks though and the right trainers that they can still be dealt with........but it will be harder. Warps and Blowers really help.
    2009 Florida State Masters Champion

    Proud father and sparring partner of Carson and Grafton

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by jrwaxman View Post
    ^^^^ Totally agree Ryan. Part of why we decided to run the concept was because we noticed the lack of G's being played.....including ourselves. We used to run at least 2 in every deck and were down to none at the first States in GA. If decks can find 2 spots for G that will make it harder but will slow them down some against other matchups. Will they tech them in for GeChamp? With more Gengar and Machamp being played throughout the format I would expect to see more played. There is a nice balance though with the two Pokes attacks though and the right trainers that they can still be dealt with........but it will be harder. Warps and Blowers really help.
    Yeah, after Machamp has done SO well, people will/should start playing 2 unown G in their decks.

    GeChamp was a great week 2 states deck, as no one was really prepared.
    r

  21. #21
    @Ryan Abomasnow is actually slightly in my favor when i tested against it with gengar, machamp, or Gechamp. With gengar, snipe the uxies and spiritombs, Poltergiest bronzongs, its all good. with machamp, Pokeblowing a basic helps. if you drop x and get 2 heads with hurricane punch, bye bye full hp aboma. JMO, but its based off of my own experiences.
    Instagram and Twitter: @lukeriverr
    Vanguard, Pokemon, and Kaijudo

  22. #22
    Most good Obama decks don't play Bronzong anymore.
    Austin Cook

  23. #23
    the one that i mostly play does...
    Instagram and Twitter: @lukeriverr
    Vanguard, Pokemon, and Kaijudo

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by i like burdn of a day View Post
    @Ryan Abomasnow is actually slightly in my favor when i tested against it with gengar, machamp, or Gechamp. With gengar, snipe the uxies and spiritombs, Poltergiest bronzongs, its all good. with machamp, Pokeblowing a basic helps. if you drop x and get 2 heads with hurricane punch, bye bye full hp aboma. JMO, but its based off of my own experiences.
    You're playing a bad list or a bad deck.
    r

  25. #25
    Dark Ninja's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Somewhere basking in my ninjaness
    Posts
    469
    Quote Originally Posted by i like burdn of a day View Post
    @Ryan Abomasnow is actually slightly in my favor when i tested against it with gengar, machamp, or Gechamp. With gengar, snipe the uxies and spiritombs, Poltergiest bronzongs, its all good. with machamp, Pokeblowing a basic helps. if you drop x and get 2 heads with hurricane punch, bye bye full hp aboma. JMO, but its based off of my own experiences.
    I really want to know how terrible of a Abomasnow list you're testing against, or how terrible whoever you're testing against is. Because unless they never see an Abomasnow, you're going to lose that match.
    Quote Originally Posted by Young_Conover View Post
    LOL yo i never donked any1 with my kingdra!


    *looks up into the sky* WHHHHHHHHYYYYY!

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •