Rotation time and likelihood. When and How far back?

[drillclaw]

im hoping they atleast filter junk arm....it nulls catcher atleast a little

[vaporeon]

I think they might rotate to Next Destinies. Reason is they reprinted a lot of cards they wish to keep and to keep cards like eviolite and max potion from working on EX's. If they do that, it would at least slow things down a lot.

[Kunx990]

Then we'd only have about 200 playable cards. . .

[vaporeon]

How many other sets do we have coming in before rotation?

[Cyrus]

Originally Posted by desert eagle

LOL.

I like Junk Arm though, reduces variance which is always good for the game, I hope JA stays in next format.

Variance isn't the whole picture, though, the counterpoint being how mindless people can be with JA and still win.

Of course, over a long season, those who play Junk Arms well will outperform those who don't, but I'm not convinced that it's just an automatic gain for the "skill" camp.

[baby mario]

Originally Posted by vaporeon

How many other sets do we have coming in before rotation?

One more (after DEX) in August, Which would leave us with 3 legal sets.

They aren't going to rotate to NEX. There's no justification for a huge cut like that, especially after last year's massive rotation.

I'm just hoping for BW-on. That's what they have in Japan, so that's the rotation that newer sets will be designed to work with.

[desert eagle]

Originally Posted by Cyrus

Variance isn't the whole picture, though, the counterpoint being how mindless people can be with JA and still win.

Of course, over a long season, those who play Junk Arms well will outperform those who don't, but I'm not convinced that it's just an automatic gain for the "skill" camp.

I partially agree with you. There is a point on the power curve where a card is so powerful that bad players can win games simply by playing the card without needing to know how to use it properly.

However, I don't believe Junk Arm is that card in this format. That card is Catcher.

I know I won quite a few games this year because my opponents mindlessly discarded useful cards such as additional Junk Arms and stuff to JA for something like Gear despite having a decent hand, or Revive in Durant without taking into account board position, and running out of resources later on when it matters.

JA is on the cusp of that power vs skill curve level but I don't think it is over, the format was fine pre-EP. Catcher is way over that level though.

[Otaku]

"Properly" is a bit vague of a term in this case. There are some very powerful cards in the game right now, and they work quickly enough that a less skilled player can defeat his or her better if they know the basics of playing the card.

The deck still doesn't play itself, and if a skilled player can last (no matter how skilled you are bad luck is bad luck) they can pretty easily win, because they'll be using their cards optimally.

[Ness]

I hope to see B&W on. No rotation wouldn't be bad, either, since it lets us keep a lot of the playable supporters. Anything in between that, that is, only rotating a few of the HGSS sets makes no sense. With the change in the definition of trainers occurring at B&W, the easiest format for new players to learn will be B&W on. The game should always cater to new players and be inviting.

[King Piplup]

Originally Posted by baby mario

I'm just hoping for BW-on. That's what they have in Japan, so that's the rotation that newer sets will be designed to work with.

No it's not. Japan plays HS-on 60 Card Decks in Seniors and Masters for all official tournaments. (Juniors Play 30 Card)

BW-on is a fun format over there, same as the Palace Cup.


If I had to guess, (Ignore my earlier predictions) I'd say that they'll cut to BW-on this year, then cut NEX-on for the 13-14 season. (NEX being the start of the EX format being the major reason)

[TheDarkTwins]

I really don't think there will be a rotation, and that's what I'm hoping. I think it would be much better for the game at the current moment for that to happen. I feel that's the right choice, but don't know if it will happen. We should have an answer in the next few weeks and May is usually when we get our answer on what is going to happen.

Drew

[Tash]

Originally Posted by Ness

I hope to see B&W on. No rotation wouldn't be bad, either, since it lets us keep a lot of the playable supporters. Anything in between that, that is, only rotating a few of the HGSS sets makes no sense. With the change in the definition of trainers occurring at B&W, the easiest format for new players to learn will be B&W on. The game should always cater to new players and be inviting.

One of the big reasons I think we'll be getting BW-on is due to how hard this block has been trying to move away from supporters.

[Tim17]

Originally Posted by Bilbo Baggins

How fun will stage 2 decks be without Pokemon collector? Even better, How fun will CMT or getting out multiple Eels in 1 turn to counter catcher be without Collector?


If we don't get a good basic search engine (supporter) soon, I don't think a rotation will happen. If something similar to collector is in a set shortly, or it's reprinted, then B&W on. I'm sorry, but no basic search engine supporter card kills the meta.

Originally Posted by ALEXARD

And most of the time Rare Candy appeared in the set that rotated, Great Encounters for example, we should kiss goodbye UL and HS. The card that is turning the format broken is not Junk Arm, is actually Pokemon Collector.

first - I'd like to point out that I haven't been playing much since rotation last year (for a few reasons, including work and not too happy with the meta/card pool).

I do agree that Collector at this point has the potential of being an issue with the large sum of basic-based decks out there. However, I do feel that if they reprint it (or make something similar) it needs to exclude searching/adding EX's. My reasons are due to the huge damage output, the large HP and the fact it only takes a maximum of three turns to get one powered up (the whole luck thing gets applied to set up).....where as stage ones are lucky to dish out a mere 90 or so for about the same energy cost and perhaps get one or two swings before getting KO'd due to such low HP.

my issue sits that the design on the cards went from "nearly anything is playable in the meta" to "here's the good cards, they're rare or uncommon/shortprint - spend more money. Oh, we designed the game to go faster than ever, too!" or something to that description (note* this is my view - I'm not saying that's the intent of the game creators/etc).

if they do rotate - it'll be only 2 sets gone or BLW-on. My reason is based off a previous post - assuming CoL is a reprint set that only the TCG got (meaning the OCG did not get it)...it would be odd to have cards in the TCG that the OCG doesn't not have - so if OCG were to cycle only two sets, the TCG would have a few cards (like Ninetales w/ power) that the OCG would not. This is unlikely to happen.....meaning it's rather likely to see BLW-on.....assuming CoL is TCG exclusive.

does that make sense?

[Poke Trainer J]

For the health and sake of the game, we need to rotate to Black/White-On because If we have no Rotation this year or If they scale back a set or two then that would put more uneeded power creep in the TCG that the game doesn't need. Part of the reason why the current format is unbalanced right now is due to the power creep of the HGSS Sets and they need to go.

[Swordfish1989]

Originally Posted by Poke Trainer J

For the health and sake of the game, we need to rotate to Black/White-On because If we have no Rotation this year or If they scale back a set or two then that would put more uneeded power creep in the TCG that the game doesn't need. Part of the reason why the current format is unbalanced right now is due to the power creep of the HGSS Sets and they need to go.

Power creep of HGSS? Are you kidding?

I didn't know that Zekrom/Reshiram came out in HGSS. Or Mewtwo EX. If HGSS was the power creep block, then we would be seeing a lot more Pokémon from those sets getting played right now, don't you think?

[Tim17]

the power creep started in HGSS (hello Donphan Prime), and got much worse when BLW came out (hi outrage dragons with 130 HP)......

[baby mario]

At the time, some people saw HGSS as a bit of a re-set in terms of power creep. Yeah, Donphan did 60 for 1 with a drawback, but Kingdra LA was doing better before anyway and Donphan has never been a stellar card. Good, but not brilliant.

Apart from Donphan and Jumpluff (with its 90 HP) there were no real big hitters in the set. That and the return to x2 Weakness for everything made it look quite retro after all the SP.

[MiniWade]

I just don't get why they would rotate out special dark and metals. The dark set just came out, if they reprint these special energies then I can understand BW-ON. If not then may be no rotation.

[baby mario]

Special Dark and Metal are a privilege, not a right.

Maybe Pokemon doesn't see why those Types should get an advantage anymore, now that they have Basic Energy?

[Otaku]

Yeah, the "Special Energy" versions of Darkness and Metal Energy could simple be phased out. Originally this was done because Darkness and Metal Pokemon were the two "add-on" Types and this was either to make them special. Now we have basic versions of the Energy and you'll note that nothing else gets that privilege.

There is also the chance that we'll just get them re-released in a later set with a name change, so that we no longer have to be all Special Darkness and basic Darkness. ;)

[bullados]

Originally Posted by Otaku

There is also the chance that we'll just get them re-released in a later set with a name change, so that we no longer have to be all Special Darkness and basic Darkness. ;)

I kinda hope that doesn't happen. If it does, they instantly become amongst the most expensive non-Rare cards in the game. Kids have a hard enough time finding Special Darks and Special Metals, and they've been reprinted almost as many times as Potion et al. Finding the new things would be far more difficult for them.

[Otaku]

Depends on how they are re-released exactly. For all we know they'd be a League Promo that your average kid can earn two of in a season... on top of being in a starter deck. ;)

Seriously, no sense worrying about the hypothetical. There is also the fact that this is even for a possible rotation, and who knows how easy the replacements could be to get. Even if they were a bit hard to get... compared to an in demand Pokemon EX they can't be that bad.

Lastly I really hope if they don't just let them rotate out they consider creating analogous Special Energy cards for the other Types. ;)

[NoPoke]

Originally Posted by baby mario

Special Dark and Metal are a privilege, not a right.

Maybe Pokemon doesn't see why those Types should get an advantage anymore, now that they have Basic Energy?

With Dark Claw in the format Dark special energy seems like overkill.

[EliGagerNorris]

Originally Posted by NoPoke

With Dark Claw in the format Dark special energy seems like overkill.

Exactly, plus the only semi-relevant Metal type, Registeel EX, already does the damage reduce effect.

[Rozureido]

I'm praying they rotate to BLW-on. Mostly cause I have sold all my HGSS-COL cards. I will be unable to play competitively till September anyways, so I can always get back what I really need but still. I can't see them not rotating. Too much has changed in the game between blocks. Also with a 150 plus card set coming this august there will be a more than ample card pool to build with at the start of the season.