SUGGESTION BOX: Week 3

[Rogue Archetype]

Thank you SO MUCH to all who contributed to the sticky posts about "Gyrarados" and "Synergy"

It's getting close to time to take them down and start two new stickies.

1. What deck do we want to highlight now?
-- Do we want to start building out decks that include the NEW (call of legends) cards now?
-- Do we want to highlight another proven/successful tournament deck again?

2. What strategy aspect do we want to discuss ?

[idrumprettywell]

techs - what they are, what they do, and how to use them effectively. for decks, we could talk about vilegar..... or trainer locks in general

[LoTad]

I would say vilegar. It seems like a lot of the members on the gym really underestimate it. If we could get a good discussion going, we could come up with a lot of good ideas to do the deck justice. :)

[Barkjon]

Techs for strategy.

For deck either VileGar or DialgaChomp.

[Sages_Training]

Isn't techs part of synergy? Was energy synergy covered in the synergy section? If not, and we're going to sub-class synergy, we should start with energy. How much you need in a deck to win, ect, ect...

I'm a little confused about how these things are being classified. "Techs" is a little too specefic and dependent on the metagame. I don't think young newbies would get the right idea. It'd come off a little too much as dependant on today.

It should be kept to a general overview until things are compiled. If you want to include techs into a discussion, how about "Metagame"? What metagame means, how it can imapct a format, and how techs can be included into a deck to lesson the impact of things running rampant.

As for the deck, I think Machamp SF (and varients) deserves a spotlight before his time runs out. Disscus why he was so succsesful.

[Kayle]

Techs was not discussed as synergy. Teching is... something else.

It feels early for techs, but I won't complain and will do my best to contribute; the Gym members tend to OVER-tech and that's something I think really needs to be addressed.

This week should be Vilegar.

[Rogue Archetype]

Originally Posted by Sages_Training

It should be kept to a general overview until things are compiled. If you want to include techs into a discussion, how about "Metagame"? What metagame means, how it can imapct a format, and how techs can be included into a deck to lesson the impact of things running rampant.

As for the deck, I think Machamp SF (and varients) deserves a spotlight before his time runs out. Disscus why he was so succsesful.

I don't agree with much of what you typed, but I do like the idea of a "What is Metagame" thread. (even if it's not a sticky).

Synergy and Techs don't belong together really. Most techs are really in-the-way and extraneous unless you face a very specific matchup (like a MewTwo teched into Sabelock). A chatot is an anti-lock tech that is useless in the deck if you get a good starting hand.

Ironically, Machamp SF has become a tech in many decks and would be a part of a tech discussion

[Scipio]

I'd like to propose that next week, we talk about a few fan favorites.

Pokémon like Houndoom, Raichu, Scizor, the Eevees...they all have a large fanbase and some interesting cards, but none are top tier. Perhaps pick a few of those cards to make the wouldbeguru's work with.

Also, yes, I did name Pokémon who got primes...but I'd say we'd work with them like we did with Magnezone. Simply specify the Pokémon name and then say "These are the cards they have in format, go nuts"

[raw19]

I would vote for either techs or starters, for the next topic. Both are very important in all the upper level decks of today and it might be a good idea for new-players if we discussed why they were used, why they were necessary, and how to counter-them. Deck-wise, I'd say anything that has to do with Trainer-Locking and more prominently Vilepume. (VileGar, VilePluff, Vile-Gar with LostGar tchs?)

[gallade]

Dialgachomp is probably what to do this time, as it is one of the most complicated decks in the format.

[lucario aura wielder]

maybe its to early but lostgar. and hom many energy should i run in a deck?

[Kayle]

much too early for lostgar. way, way too early.

[Porii Sames]

I like the "how much energy" one. Energy is such an issue in decks now, and energy counts actually make a huge difference in decks, especially SP.

[loudkirbyking]

If I may toss my opinion in here for a moment...

New players really aren't going to want to spend a large bundle of money on things like DialgaChomp, Machamp, and then watch it get rotated(Assuming RR-on/HGSS-on format.) I'd say that, in perfect honesty, considering that we're about 2/5 or so through the season, I'd say we should aim for newer cards with decks. Like, say Donphan, or Kingdra. With newer cards, and many common stores like Wal-mart selling the packs they're in, newer players will want to read about what's just came out and good, not what's only going to be good for a handful of months, then gone. I could see Donphan, Kingdra, Scizor, even an Eeveelution deck. Something that has newer cards so kids don't have to go pushing parents to order packs, but something good.

As for strategy aspect, though this might not be strategy, this goes along with what I just said. Perhaps an article about budget, booster packs, booster boxes, etc. that way a newer player can know just how flat-out expensive, and truly, what they should get and shouldn't get, what to invest in saving up for, etc. Nobody wants to walk into a pokemon league, happy and joyed over a new card, just for someone to say "That card is horrible". Do you like it if I say "Your Luxray X is terrible"? No. So, it might be good to go on and put something about that, so nobody gets embarrassed, y'now? Not being mean to rogue decks, but... yeah. I hope you get my point.

[Kayle]

Originally Posted by loudkirbyking

I'd say we should aim for newer cards [...] but something good.

In this format? No such thing comes to mind.

The closest would be Steelix Prime, which really only works with Blissey, and is too background right now to really merit a full-on discussion IMO since only a few people actually understand how it works well enough to ask questions without bias. I suppose there's Machamp, too, but that didn't seem to do all that well.

The danger of discussing rogues is that you either have "bad" rogues where someone's feelings are on the line, or you have "good" rogues where indignant or inexperienced players can't admit they're wrong to the one or two players who really do know what they are talking about.

[LegendCallerL]

Maybe "How much energy?" or DialgaChomp.

[hueglin]

Originally Posted by loudkirbyking

If I may toss my opinion in here for a moment...

New players really aren't going to want to spend a large bundle of money on things like DialgaChomp, Machamp, and then watch it get rotated(Assuming RR-on/HGSS-on format.) I'd say that, in perfect honesty, considering that we're about 2/5 or so through the season, I'd say we should aim for newer cards with decks. Like, say Donphan, or Kingdra. With newer cards, and many common stores like Wal-mart selling the packs they're in, newer players will want to read about what's just came out and good, not what's only going to be good for a handful of months, then gone. I could see Donphan, Kingdra, Scizor, even an Eeveelution deck. Something that has newer cards so kids don't have to go pushing parents to order packs, but something good.

As for strategy aspect, though this might not be strategy, this goes along with what I just said. Perhaps an article about budget, booster packs, booster boxes, etc. that way a newer player can know just how flat-out expensive, and truly, what they should get and shouldn't get, what to invest in saving up for, etc. Nobody wants to walk into a pokemon league, happy and joyed over a new card, just for someone to say "That card is horrible". Do you like it if I say "Your Luxray X is terrible"? No. So, it might be good to go on and put something about that, so nobody gets embarrassed, y'now? Not being mean to rogue decks, but... yeah. I hope you get my point.

This post makes a very good economic point. I think it would be worthwhile to discuss a deck that might not be tier one now (due to the speed and power of the older cards), but is solid tier two, with the potential to become tier one next season. That might appeal to many of the players who are newer to the game, or don't have the resources to invest in the current tier one decks.

As long as it is made very clear that your chances of winning a tournament with the deck are limited, I don't see a problem with it. Let's face it, many players go to tournaments with little expectation of getting into the top 4, but still enjoy playing the game.

[Rogue Archetype]

Originally Posted by loudkirbyking

If I may toss my opinion in here for a moment...

New players really aren't going to want to spend a large bundle of money on things like DialgaChomp, Machamp, and then watch it get rotated(Assuming RR-on/HGSS-on format.) I'd say that, in perfect honesty, considering that we're about 2/5 or so through the season, I'd say we should aim for newer cards with decks. Like, say Donphan, or Kingdra. With newer cards, and many common stores like Wal-mart selling the packs they're in, newer players will want to read about what's just came out and good, not what's only going to be good for a handful of months, then gone. I could see Donphan, Kingdra, Scizor, even an Eeveelution deck. Something that has newer cards so kids don't have to go pushing parents to order packs, but something good.

There's just TONS of insight in this post.

I, absolutely, love the idea of shining a spotlight on "the TIN primes" and having some real discussions about making them work. That was excellent and I will use that idea for the "Guru Challenge" deck discussions immediately. Thank you!

As far as the stickied deck discussion, that's reserved for explaining the inner-workings of proven decks that have been winning tournaments througout the world. So, suggestions for the sticky thread should involve the "BDIFs: big decks in format" so 1) old players can swap tricks 2) new players can get an "inside scoop" into how the winning decks win.

[tehmoe]

personally, i would like to see an eeveelutions deck work. or even something like meganium prime work(prime gets no love)

[raw19]

I doubt eeveelutions would really, Tier 1, work until they made an eevee with the same abilities as Arceus.

*Will be one of the first in line to build that, the day it ever happens*

[StormFront]

I'd like to discuss a deck that revolves around Garchomp LvX (not to be confused with Garchomp C LvX)

[Elite_4_Allen]

Originally Posted by raw19

I doubt eeveelutions would really, Tier 1, work until they made an eevee with the same abilities as Arceus.

*Will be one of the first in line to build that, the day it ever happens*

An eevelutions deck won a cities this year, so it's not bad.
On topic: The deck we review this week should be dialgachomp.

[LegendaryLugia]

Just because a deck wins a random CC doesn't mean it's a good deck.

[raw19]

Indeed? What all decks were represented at the cities. *Is honestly curious now*