Unlimited Combo: Which Of These Two Combos Do You Think Would Be More Dominant?

[Il Trascendente]

Drapion X
Toxicroak (MT)
Murkrow (Neo Genesis)

Objective: Once the defending Pokemon is poisoned, I'd have supporting Pokemon that don't allow the defending Pokemon to retreat (such as Murkrow), while sniping his/her bench.

or...

Dark Gengar (Neo Destiny)
Altaria (PT)
Hypno (Delta Species)

Objective: Once the defending Pokemon is asleep, Gengar makes it easier for Hypno to utilize its Poke-Body more effectively. Altaria's "Perish Song" will also have a better chance of going through because of Gengar.

What do you think?

[Phazon Elite]

Can I choose neither?

If you're building a fun deck, either one's good. If you're wanting to be competitive, you're almost better off using a theme deck. Fossil Muk absolutely trashes both decks.

[C-U elite]

what do the old cards do???

[Il Trascendente]

Originally Posted by Phazon Elite

Can I choose neither?

If you're building a fun deck, either one's good. If you're wanting to be competitive, you're almost better off using a theme deck. Fossil Muk absolutely trashes both decks.

I think you bit off more than you could chew with that statement about Muk. First of all, Muk's Power shuts off if he's Asleep, Confused, or Paralyzed. I also play Ariados (Unseen Forces) so I can pull Muk out and affect it with Sleep and Poison. As soon as it's Asleep, its Power is shut off and Dark Gengar comes into affect. This means the opponent would have to flip 2 heads to wake up; if not, it becomes an easy KO for Altaria or Ariados.

With the other deck, Gust of Wind + Murkrow can lock Muk as the active Pokemon while picking off any benched Muks. On top of that, Toxicroak can still KO Muk in 1 turn (60 + 10 for Poison). Muk isn't as much as a threat as you think.

[Articjedi]

Neither of these work that well because it's too easy to gust and ohko. If you're trying to snipe you're not going to deal enough damage while they're pounding you every turn. Unlimited comes down to setting up a cheap powerful combo that doesn't leave any weaknesses to gust or power lock. It also needs attackers that don't have to worry about energy removal, so you need something that attacks for cheap.

[V_For_Vendetta]

*Sends up Fossil Muk/Magby*
Good game.

[Alazor]

"I think you bit off more than you could chew with that statement about Muk. First of all, Muk's Power shuts off if he's Asleep, Confused, or Paralyzed. I also play Ariados (Unseen Forces) so I can pull Muk out and affect it with Sleep and Poison. As soon as it's Asleep, its Power is shut off and Dark Gengar comes into affect. This means the opponent would have to flip 2 heads to wake up; if not, it becomes an easy KO for Altaria or Ariados.

With the other deck, Gust of Wind + Murkrow can lock Muk as the active Pokemon while picking off any benched Muks. On top of that, Toxicroak can still KO Muk in 1 turn (60 + 10 for Poison). Muk isn't as much as a threat as you think."

Muk players can play warp energy or switch though. But yes Ariados is good, but you could play it with Beedrill (Skyridge).

[V_For_Vendetta]

The player simply would not promote Muk, and would get out another one should you do something to the first one.

[Il Trascendente]

Originally Posted by V_For_Vendetta

The player simply would not promote Muk, and would get out another one should you do something to the first one.

If you guys are going by that argument (Muk > Powers), then Muk can stop any deck (as most decks use Powers), but it's clearly not the case.

[V_For_Vendetta]

...yes it is. If your deck is based around powers, and I shut them down, and you have no ways around it, I win. Period.

[Articjedi]

Most good unlimited decks do not depend on powers, and the ones that do are countered by the non power dependent decks running muk. If you're going to run powers, you need a much more solid lock than this.

[Napoleon]

Can I adjust those two things?

Run Slowking Genesis. Cut off your opponent's trainers.
Run Muk Fossil. Cut off your opponent's powers.
Run Dialga G Lv.X (Can't think of anything else that works). Cut off your opponent's bodies.

You're all set! Your opponent can only use supporters and attack.

This isn't a particularly flashy set of 3, but I would much rather run it than the two lines you mentioned.

You need a solid way of keeping Pokemon up.

The second one is still pretty fail. You say Hypno and Gengar? Well I say Wigglytuff GE and Xatu GE or whatever it is.
T1 Midnight Eyes. T2 Wigglytuff followed by Xatu KO. GG.

[Il Trascendente]

Originally Posted by Articjedi

Most good unlimited decks do not depend on powers, and the ones that do are countered by the non power dependent decks running muk. If you're going to run powers, you need a much more solid lock than this.

But again, you guys are forgetting that Muk only has 70 HP, is weak to , and pretty much never attacks. A Pokemon like Ariados (Unseen Forces) or even Toxicroak (MT) would be great techs against Muk. Then, of course, Altaria doesn't even need a Power to cause destruction, so while the deck does emphasize the Power combo, it doesn't have to rely on it.

[TOMZ]

Originally Posted by Napoleon

Can I adjust those two things?

Run Slowking Genesis. Cut off your opponent's trainers.
Run Muk Fossil. Cut off your opponent's powers.
Run Dialga G Lv.X (Can't think of anything else that works). Cut off your opponent's bodies.

You're all set! Your opponent can only use supporters and attack.

This isn't a particularly flashy set of 3, but I would much rather run it than the two lines you mentioned.

You need a solid way of keeping Pokemon up.

The second one is still pretty fail. You say Hypno and Gengar? Well I say Wigglytuff GE and Xatu GE or whatever it is.
T1 Midnight Eyes. T2 Wigglytuff followed by Xatu KO. GG.

Actuallly, Muk cuts Pokemon Powers, which is the same as Poke-POWERS + Poke-Bodies. No need for Dialga G Lv.X.

[Phazon Elite]

Originally Posted by Il Trascendente

I think you bit off more than you could chew with that statement about Muk. First of all, Muk's Power shuts off if he's Asleep, Confused, or Paralyzed. I also play Ariados (Unseen Forces) so I can pull Muk out and affect it with Sleep and Poison. As soon as it's Asleep, its Power is shut off and Dark Gengar comes into affect. This means the opponent would have to flip 2 heads to wake up; if not, it becomes an easy KO for Altaria or Ariados.

With the other deck, Gust of Wind + Murkrow can lock Muk as the active Pokemon while picking off any benched Muks. On top of that, Toxicroak can still KO Muk in 1 turn (60 + 10 for Poison). Muk isn't as much as a threat as you think.

As Alazor already said, I can just use a Switch, Warp Point, Warp Energy, Scoop Up + BTS/RC, Dawn Stadium, or any other number of cards to get him out of there. Or, I could put TWO Muks out. It's really not as difficult as you think it is.

[spoinkmaster]

Gastly SF and Crobat G, win the game t1 buddy.

[Articjedi]

Originally Posted by Il Trascendente

But again, you guys are forgetting that Muk only has 70 HP, is weak to , and pretty much never attacks. A Pokemon like Ariados (Unseen Forces) or even Toxicroak (MT) would be great techs against Muk. Then, of course, Altaria doesn't even need a Power to cause destruction, so while the deck does emphasize the Power combo, it doesn't have to rely on it.

Sure, but if you ran into say, a ohko deck like kingdra or delcatty ex, they do a better job of not relying on powers than you do. That and they attack on their own, no vulnerable pokemon on the bench to disrupt your combo.