Author
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Topic: version 2 for review. (was :8 Year Olds Gettin ready for SBZ )
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annisarich
Member # 105838
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posted February 05, 2003 08:24 PM
Here is version 1 of the deck my son wants to play at SBZ Any input is welcome. TIA
Pokemon 20
2 bulbasaur A01 1 bulbasour A02 1 Ivysaur base 1 ivysaur A03 2 Venusaur base 3 charmander A10 2 Charmeleon A11 3 charizard base 3 cleffa (eeek) 1 tryogue 1 elekid
Trainer 22
2 pokemon breeder 1 fire cube o1 1 seer 2 gold berry 3 switch 1 super scoop up 3 bill 2 copy cat 2 prof elm training method 4 elm 1 town vols
Energy 18
4 recycle 2 full heal 4 fire 1 boost 7 grass
His stratagy is A: He loves charizard. B. Use the Venousar to get energy to the charizard and also as protection/alternative to put up against strong Water decks. C. The cleffas and trainers make a strong fast drawing engine which should get powered up fsat. He would like more boost to make an extra quck attacking Charizard. D. I recomended that he not have the double gust cards as It seems to me he doesnt understand how to play them propperly. So a few switches and berry to aid the high retreat cost zard to get out of trouble if its active and getting whooped
Seems pretty good start for him. I have made a few reccomendations but as usual he wants to hear from the experts.....
So folks fire away (charizard pun not initially intended but kept in this post anyway) [ February 10, 2003, 09:09 PM: Message edited by: annisarich ]
-------------------- Rich
From: A2 MI | Registered: Sep 2002
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dkates
Member
Member # 113463
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posted February 05, 2003 08:45 PM
Looks like a solid deck. I can't think of any suggestions, except maybe to add another boost energy instead of one of the Elms, if possible.
-------------------- Every time I think I can't say anything stupider, I prove myself wrong. Maybe I should just stop thinking.
From: Houston, TX | Registered: Nov 2002
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ScythKing
Member # 26665
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posted February 05, 2003 08:45 PM
quote: Originally posted by annisarich: Here is version 1 of the deck my son wants to play at SBZ
Well I'll tell ya. This was always one of my fave decks to play at League - the younger kids love to see the big beefy guys - especially Zard - come out to play. But it's just a fun deck. Too many evos to make it dependable in a tourney environment. Base Zard is a big fatty that takes too long to get going and keep going. Even if you do use energy trans (which only works with grass mind you) you still have only 1 energy per turn to work with. Waiting for energy the Zard is a sitting duck. Good idea to keep the double gusts out - you have too many fat targets - better a switch or warp energy. Working on the statement that he likes the Zard, my suggestion would be drop the Venasaur - put in some of the new e-Card grass that resists water to cover water weakness, use some of the e-Card water that have colorless attacks (like the AQ horsea) to take care of competing fire. Have fun!
-------------------- -=>* ScythKing *<=- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= There are 10 type of people in the world. Those that understand binary and those that don't. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
From: Chattanooga, TN USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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SlimeyGrimey
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Member # 92882
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posted February 05, 2003 09:10 PM
drop ALL fire energy and replace 2 of them with grass, and 1 with a boost energy(you don't need them for Charizard; just use the colorless attacks with the earlier stages)(I'll use the other space later) so: -4 fire +1 Boost energy +2 grass
the pokemon seem rather fine, so I'll leave them as is.
you'll probably want another breeder for this deck so: -1 Seer(not particularily useful) +1 Breeder
next, you need more healing. Drop the fire cube and the Super Scoop up for 2 Healing fields. -1 Fire Cube 01 (a decent card, but you don't really need it) -1 Super Scoop up(and can't see a use for this card in this deck) +2 Healing fields(won't really help your opponent since Charizard pretty much knocks everything out)
Drop the 2 Professor elm's training method for two pokemon trader. -2 professor elm's traing method +2 Pokemon trader(these aren't supporters plus you can get basics or babies if you need them, it looks like you'll usually have a pokemon in your hand anyway-you can trade that for what you need)
finally use that space left over from the fire eergy to add another copycat(you need LOTS of draw cards) +1 copycat
also try the expedition Venusaur to attach 2 energy cards to Charizard each turn.
-------------------- Grimers will eventually clog the path to my brain and take over my body.
Grimer, how many times do I have to tell you mud pies don't actually have mud in them, so they're not going to help you evolve into Muk!
Dogbertland will have thrilling rides like "the wedgie" and I'll have a maze in front of the restrooms.-Dogbert
From: Edmonton,AB,Canada | Registered: Jul 2002
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CmonIWanaPLaYa
Member
Member # 101319
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posted February 06, 2003 08:07 AM
I play a similar type of deck and it is fun...the main suggestion I would make is to find a way to get 1 Harvest Bounty Venusaur in there. Getting that 2 nrg attached per turn is critical in this deck. Also..where is the Pokemon Center???? When running Energy Trans Venusaur, you should at least run 2 Pokemon Center, IMO. Good luck at SBZ...Hope you do well
-------------------- Either, you Pokemon Yes, or you Pokemon no. If you Pokemon Guess So, sooner later, "squish" justa like bug Pokemon!!
Registered: Aug 2002
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Raikou1234
Member
Member # 3003
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posted February 06, 2003 04:15 PM
This should be better...
Pokemon 20
3 Bulbasaur 1 Ivysaur 3 Venusaur (Card-E Harvest Bounty) 3 Charmander 1 Charmeleon 3 Charizard 3 Cleffa 1 Tyrogue
Trainers 24
4 Professor Elm 4 Pokemon Breeder 3 Gold Berry 2 Focus Band 3 Copycat 4 Pokemon Trader 3 Double Gust 1 Town Volunteers
Energy 16
4 Recycle Energy 4 Fire Energy 2 Boost Energy 6 Grass Energy
-------------------- Team Format Winner at Origins with SuperSpaceGuy! Go Team Rabid Tyrouge & SSG! IM me at RabidRogueKid for a Game of Apprentice
From: Somewhere | Registered: Mar 2001
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annisarich
Member # 105838
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posted February 10, 2003 08:35 PM
After a weekend event and some playing and suggestions here is version 2.0 Changes in italics
Pokemon 20 2 bulbasaur exp A01 1 bulbasour exp A02 1 Ivysaur base 1 ivysaur exp A03 2 Venusaur exp b-65 3 charmander exp A10 2 Charmeleon exp A11 3 charizard base 3 cleffa (eeek) 1 tryogue 1 elekid
Trainer 24 3 pokemon breeder 2 focus band 2 switch 1 super scoop up 2 bills maintaince 2 poke trader 2 weakness guard 1 energy switch 2 copy cat 2 prof elm training method 4 elm 1 town vols
Energy 16 4 recycle 3 fire 2 boost 7 grass
The drawing trainers are better with out Bills. Bills maintaince seems like a better card. The additional breeder should help also. A few focus band to keep the babies alive a few more turns to build up the big hitters in the safety of the bench. Weakness guard should help against the tidal wave of expected water decks.
Thanks for any input
-------------------- Rich
From: A2 MI | Registered: Sep 2002
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Raikou1234
Member
Member # 3003
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posted February 13, 2003 03:12 PM
3 Bulbasaur 2 Ivysaur 2 Venusaur 3 Charmander 3 Charmeleon 3 Charizard 3 Cleffa 1 Tyrogue 1 Elekid
3 Gold Berry 2 Focus Band 2 Switch 3 Bill 3 Copycat 3 Pokemon Trader 4 Professor Elm 1 Town Volunteers
3 Recycle energy 4 Fire Energy 4 Boost Energy 7 Grass Energy
-------------------- Team Format Winner at Origins with SuperSpaceGuy! Go Team Rabid Tyrouge & SSG! IM me at RabidRogueKid for a Game of Apprentice
From: Somewhere | Registered: Mar 2001
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Sands
Member # 31153
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posted February 14, 2003 03:41 PM
O.K. here is what I would recommend for the Charizard deck you posted. I want to keep it simple so I removed all the Grass Pokemon from the deck.
Pokemon 17 2 Charmander (L.C.) 2 Charmander (A 10) 2 Charmeleon (Exp) 3 Charizard (L.C.) 3 Cleffa 3 Tyrogue 2 Elekid
Energy 14 10 Fire 4 Recycle
Trainer 29 2 Breeder 2 Focus Band 3 Gold Berry 4 Professor Elm 3 Copy Cat 3 Oaks Research 4 Trader 4 Weakness Guard 1 Town Volunteer 1 Time Capusle 2 Healing Fields
Get the two Recycle Energy on your Charmander/Charmeleon/Charizrd line ASAP!
Use the Gold Berries and Healing Fields to take damage off of Charizard!
You will see a lot of Kingdra at the SBZ so you need the 4 Weakness Guard!
The Town Volunteer is a 'Supporter' and there are already 6 in the deck. You might use a supporter that keeps you from using your Town Voluteer on the turn you want, so use your T.C.!
Use the Traders to get the Pokemon you need quickly!
See you tomorrow at the SBZ!!
From: Rochester Hills, Mi. U.S. | Registered: Jul 2001
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No Signs of Life
Member
Member # 123483
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posted February 14, 2003 06:22 PM
Usually kids DO love seeing the big, bad Charizard come out in tournaments... I always had a thing for him, too. But the facts must be faced that this deck is too slow, even for an evolution deck. Here's what I would do with the deck:
Pokemon (20) 4 Bulbasaur (Aquapolis) 3 Ivysaur (Base Set) 2 Venusaur (Base Set) 4 Nidoran (m)(Aquapolis) 3 Nidorino (Aquapolis) 2 Nidoking (Aquapolis) 1 Scyther (Neo Discovery) 1 Lickitung (Jungle)
Trainers (22) 4 Bill 2 Professor Oak 3 Computer Search 3 Pokemon Trader 1 Item Finder 3 Gust of Wind 2 Switch 2 Scoop Up 2 Pokemon Center
Energy (18) 18 Grass Energy
This deck isn't exactly energy-efficient, but when there's a Venusaur out you should have no energy chrisis problems. This deck is rid of the Charizard and is focused on hitting... HARD. Get out the Nidoking and Venusaur using Pokemon Trader, Bill, Professor Oak, and Computer Search. Then just start pounding away. When the Pokemon become too damaged, use either Scoop Up (of course, putting all the energy cards on another Pokemon before doing so) or Pokemon Center. The keep on dishing out the damage. Scyther can buy you some time, and Lickitung can hold the fort while you prime your nastiest Pokemon.
Hope your son does well!
-------------------- "Danger is the anvil on which trust is forged."
Registered: Jan 2003
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Mudkip
Member
Member # 122005
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posted February 18, 2003 08:12 AM
quote: Originally posted by No Signs of Life: Usually kids DO love seeing the big, bad Charizard come out in tournaments... I always had a thing for him, too. But the facts must be faced that this deck is too slow, even for an evolution deck. Here's what I would do with the deck:
Pokemon (20) 4 Bulbasaur (Aquapolis) 3 Ivysaur (Base Set) 2 Venusaur (Base Set) 4 Nidoran (m)(Aquapolis) 3 Nidorino (Aquapolis) 2 Nidoking (Aquapolis) 1 Scyther (Neo Discovery) 1 Lickitung (Jungle)
Trainers (22) 4 Bill 2 Professor Oak 3 Computer Search 3 Pokemon Trader 1 Item Finder 3 Gust of Wind 2 Switch 2 Scoop Up 2 Pokemon Center
Energy (18) 18 Grass Energy
This deck isn't exactly energy-efficient, but when there's a Venusaur out you should have no energy chrisis problems. This deck is rid of the Charizard and is focused on hitting... HARD. Get out the Nidoking and Venusaur using Pokemon Trader, Bill, Professor Oak, and Computer Search. Then just start pounding away. When the Pokemon become too damaged, use either Scoop Up (of course, putting all the energy cards on another Pokemon before doing so) or Pokemon Center. The keep on dishing out the damage. Scyther can buy you some time, and Lickitung can hold the fort while you prime your nastiest Pokemon.
Hope your son does well!
hey how could you power up nidoking without fighting energys????
From: Mexico D.F | Registered: Jan 2003
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Spectreon
Member # 60305
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posted February 18, 2003 10:01 AM
A riskier, but more powerful idea woulda been, run Ex Charizard. Sure it can only burn Basic energy, but with Harvest bount to help power it, and it attack doing 120, you can do 20 more damage and have a these possibilties: 25% chance of discarding all (ouch), 50% chance of discarding 2 (was gonna happen anyways, now it does 20 more though), and (my fave) 25% chance of discarding nothing.
with this strategy in mind, I would try and run both Venusaurs, and mostly, if not all grass energy. A few Memory Berries could help attack on turns you cant repower him up. Dont forget, Charizard was built to run effectively without ever having an actual fire energy on him from the start. Base Chrmander has (C) Scratch, Charmeleon has (CCC) Slash, and then Charizards Power makes everything irrelevent.
-------------------- To evolve, treat Eevee poorly, when it hates your guts, let it get ko'ed in th night while holding Spell Tag. PS, if it gets ko'ed outin the day, then it will die, go visit its grave in Soul House of Lavender, next to Fuji
Spectreon: The Scary Ghost Pokemon
Spectreon often haunt graveyards, sneaking up and scaring unsuspecting visitors
From: Lavender Town, Kanto | Registered: Jan 2002
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bulbasnore
Member # 703
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posted February 18, 2003 08:30 PM
I agree about Exp. Charizard/Exp.HB & LC Venusaur/PKMNCenter for the combo. Transburn with the originals was awfully fun, but I only got to see the combo a couple times.
That said, here's just a variation of the other nice 'Zard deck posted by Sands, Either should run faster and farther than the two color deck:
Pokemon 17 4 Charmander 2 Charmeleon (LC) 3 Charizard (Exp) 3 Cleffa 3 Tyrogue 2 Pichu
Energy 14 14 Fire
Trainer 29 3 Breeder 3 Gold Berry 4 Professor Elm 4 Copy Cat 3 Trader 3 Weakness Guard 3 Memory Berry 2 Town Volunteer 2 Healing Fields 2 Double Gust
Pichu is for pounding that Power-ed or Body-ed PKMN that just eliminated your 'Zard while you build up a new one. Remember to stop using him when you get Zard built up. No need for Elekid here since the next card, Memory Berry, let's you attack while repowering.
Memory Berry is for using Charmeleon & Charmander's attacks while you get more NRG on Charizard OR when you don't need a to use Zards big attack to get the KO.
The second TV is to make up for the recycles you can't use with Exp. Charizard.
You can use Double Gust to get at building threats with this setup.
If you go with the other LC Zard, put the recycles back in. Its just that there are some 110/120 HP PKMN running around and you don't want to firespin 2x to get them.
Just a thought!
-------------------- Pokemon TCG is a game for all ages. 6th Place June 2002 WCSC Professor Draft 6th Place July 2003 Comic Con Fan Appreciation Tourney
From: Where you play a kid's game and never T8 in it! | Registered: Feb 2001
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MetalDarkDitto
Member
Member # 840
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posted February 19, 2003 03:26 PM
Here would be my version of your deck(dunno if it is too late or not, but I might as well try)(note: This version is intended for a mod environment)
Pokemon:20 3x Charmander(Whatever one suits you) 1x Charmeleon(Same as Charmander) 3x Charizard(2 Base set, 1 Expedition) 3x Bulbasaur(Your choice) 1x Ivysaur(Your choice again) 3x Venusaur(All Harvest Bounty) 2x Cleffa(Neo one) 2x Sentret(Your choice) 2x Furrett(Aquapolis)
Energy:12 4x Recycle 8x Grass
Trainers:28 3x Copycat 3x Prof. Elm 3x Town Volunteers 3x Bill 4x PKMN Trader 4x PKMN Breeder 3x Prof. Elm's Training Method 3x Healing Fields 2x Switch
This deck should go a lot faster, especially if you can breed up to a Venusaur, a Charizard, and get a Furrett out on turn 2. I know, a lot to ask for so quickly, but with the searching powers of both your trainers and the Furrett coupled with the sheer card drawing of Cleffa, Prof. Elm, and Copycat, it can be done.
You just try to get one of the Charizards out with a Harvest Bounty Venusaur and a Furrett on turn 2. Furrett may not make much sense, but it can get you your Recycle energies for your Charizard, so it can Fire Spin/inferno as quick as possible every turn. If you are able to get out all 3 Harvest Bounty Venusaurs in a few turns, you can decimate your opponent with your Expedition Charizard and it's 120 every turn. Have fun!
-------------------- In the Shadow of the night,the Legendary MetalDarkDitto will come out and destroy you all. Why not me? I'm it's Trainer. So bow before me and hope I'll spare you. Current Decks:Rainbow Beat-Down, Dancin' Riptide,Dragon Fury Rainbow Rocks
From: Taylors,SC,United States | Registered: Feb 2001
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Spectreon
Member # 60305
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posted February 19, 2003 03:58 PM
You can only Harvest Bounty once per turn, since it uses your 1 energy attachment per, but you could use another Pokemon, Bellosum. Its power will allow you to attach an energy on a flip, and as many chances as Beloosums in play. Also its resistance to water comes in handy too.
-------------------- To evolve, treat Eevee poorly, when it hates your guts, let it get ko'ed in th night while holding Spell Tag. PS, if it gets ko'ed outin the day, then it will die, go visit its grave in Soul House of Lavender, next to Fuji
Spectreon: The Scary Ghost Pokemon
Spectreon often haunt graveyards, sneaking up and scaring unsuspecting visitors
From: Lavender Town, Kanto | Registered: Jan 2002
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MetalDarkDitto
Member
Member # 840
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posted February 19, 2003 04:05 PM
By the way the card reads, Harvest Bounty stacks upon itself. The strateegy would work if it does truly stack. I'll go ahead and provide a scenario, as well as copy the power down per text.
Venusaur:Pokemon Power: Harvest Bounty. Text: Once during your turn (before you attack), if you attach an Energy card from your hand to your Active Pokemon as part of your turn, you may attach an additional Energy card to that Pokemon at the same time. This power can't be used if Venusaur is affected by a Special Condition.
Now for the example:
Expedition Charizard is out as your Active Pokemon and currently has no energy attached to it because it used its attack and got 2 tails, losing all of it's energy. As luck would have it, they were all Recycle energy and were returned to your hand. Your bench consists of 3 Harvest Bounty Venusaur and 2 Aquapolis Furrett. On your turn, you attach 1 of the Recycle energy from your hand to your Active Charizard. This activates one of your Venusaurs and allows you to attach another Recycle energy from your hand. The second Venusaur uses the power on the second Recycle energy and allows you to attach your third Recycle in addition with the second one. The third Venusaus activates on the third Recycle energy and allows you to attach your last Recycle with the third Recycle. That is one way to put it
The other way is to consider them activated all at the same time. Venusaur 1 adds 1 energy to the first attach, the next Venusaur does the same thing, and so on. In short, the Harvest Bounty Power has just one limit:How many Venusaurs you have in play. [ February 19, 2003, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: MetalDarkDitto ]
-------------------- In the Shadow of the night,the Legendary MetalDarkDitto will come out and destroy you all. Why not me? I'm it's Trainer. So bow before me and hope I'll spare you. Current Decks:Rainbow Beat-Down, Dancin' Riptide,Dragon Fury Rainbow Rocks
From: Taylors,SC,United States | Registered: Feb 2001
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Big Daddy Snorlax
Member # 11
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posted February 19, 2003 04:52 PM
quote: Originally posted by MetalDarkDitto: By the way the card reads, Harvest Bounty stacks upon itself.
Unfortunately, Harvest Bounty is not cumulative. No matter how many are in play, you only get to attach 2 cards during your normal energy attachment.
BDS
-------------------- Member of Team Compendium The source of official WotC rulings for Pokémon TCG
Mod on Pokeschool Rules/Strategy Q & A
From: Oregon | Registered: Feb 2001
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MetalDarkDitto
Member
Member # 840
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posted February 19, 2003 04:58 PM
<points back up> Is there a way to disprove the set-up I just showed Snorlax? If not, then that scenario should be brought in front of your groups to see if the ruling can be changed.
-------------------- In the Shadow of the night,the Legendary MetalDarkDitto will come out and destroy you all. Why not me? I'm it's Trainer. So bow before me and hope I'll spare you. Current Decks:Rainbow Beat-Down, Dancin' Riptide,Dragon Fury Rainbow Rocks
From: Taylors,SC,United States | Registered: Feb 2001
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Rickdraco
Member
Member # 22369
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posted February 20, 2003 03:41 AM
I'm shocked you haven't tried keeping a couple of the LC Venusaur, and putting in a couple of Rainbow Energy, and only having Grass as the basic energy cards. so i'd suggest from your V.02
-3 fire -4 recycle +1 Venusaur (LC) +4 Rainbow Energy +2 Grass Energy
That should help, although if you can find space for 2 pokemon center it would work better. Bear in mind that when you use Rainbow energy with energy trans, yoiu don't place damage on the pokemon you move it to, as it is not being played from your hand.
-------------------- I can last an eternity, or be over in the blink of an eyelid. But so long as two or more stay together, forever I will be.
From: Blackpool, England | Registered: May 2001
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