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Author
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Topic: 10 and under got shafted at SBZ
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SD_PokeMom
Member # 97
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posted February 16, 2003 07:12 PM
I agree, Juan...but the question is, what lessons are the older players teaching the younger ones?
This cuts both ways; I just heard from a friend whose 7 y/o son was humiliated (to the point of tears) at the SBZ by an older, much more experienced, FAMOUS player who was making comments in the vein of "I'd be done already if this kid wasn't so damn slow" during their game! ![[Roll Eyes]](../tcg/rolleyes.gif) ![[NoNoNo]](../tcg/graemlins/nonono.gif) ![[Mad]](../tcg/mad.gif)
Of course there are always going to be winners and losers...but there is a gracious way to play another player who is clearly outmatched (see Strike's SBZ report for a great example) and the way above. Good lord: if your "game face" consists of the behavior above, then there is something wrong with your gameplay IMO!
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Master Professor/Tournament Organizer/Pokémon League Gym Leader,
Adventure Games and Comics, Poway, CA
Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Feb 2001
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted February 16, 2003 07:39 PM
They exist in ANY game, any job, and place.
It is NOT endemic to pokemon.
At least LAWYERS don't appear yet at tourneys
IMO A JUDGE and TO can set the tone. He could have been reported for unsportsmanlike conduct... if horrible it could be a GAME loss or DQ.
Uh, but I do understand the feeling of PLAYING slow players. Isn't there a discussion of 30 min not being enough?
Again, this is not league but a tourney...
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Drafts bring out the BEST of the WORST cards in Pokemon
*TC Member/WizpogMOD_Squad/Master_Prof*
+GodFather to an Angel:RIP-Paloma Geronimo
-=-=-=-=-=-
TheCompendium
Team Random
Proud bro of SSJ3DVP11
ipgeek21.com
SHUT UP & DO something about it
From: The here, BUT WHERE shall we go? | Registered: Feb 2001
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SD_PokeMom
Member # 97
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posted February 16, 2003 07:54 PM
I realize it's a tourney...but there is ALWAYS a "first" for anything/anyone. My point is: can't people show a little compassion and cut the obviously rookie or younger players some slack? Or at least show some basic respect?
Obviously, not, in the case I cited; the judges were all standing around watching and making comments with the other players who were done, about how "funny" it would be if this player lost to an obviously new player! ![[Dubious]](../tcg/graemlins/dubious.gif)
[ February 16, 2003, 07:56 PM: Message edited by: SD_PokeMom ]
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Master Professor/Tournament Organizer/Pokémon League Gym Leader,
Adventure Games and Comics, Poway, CA
Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Feb 2001
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Dark and Vile
Member # 74653
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posted February 16, 2003 08:13 PM
Pokemom, I ran into the same thing at Worlds. My daughter was playing a kid with a really bad attitude. He apparently had finished high at an STS or something and kept saying "I'm Internationally known, I'm Internationally known."
He questioned EVERYTHING that happened in the game. As I stood there watching, I wondered why my daughter didn't call him on unsportsman-like conduct.
He got lucky and pulled a tie out of the match. And then wouldn't shake my daughter's hand at the end.
There's no place for jerks like this in the game.
From: Melbourne, FL | Registered: Apr 2002
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DOMCGI
Member # 20344
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posted February 16, 2003 09:03 PM
In my opinion, SBZ is just a bigger BZ. I believe it is also what WotC looking at this.
So we don't have to really serious on this. It is just a bigger fun game.
Everyone just play together and have a day of fun.
If it is a Stadium Challenge which is the step to a bigger tournament, we should be more serious and have 15+ and 14- tournaments.
In Toronto SBZ, the T8 are mostly 15+ and 14-. but a 10 Years old kid make to the semi-Final. He almost go further to the Final but just lost by one prize.
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An Old Pokemon Trading Card Game Player.
Pokemon Professor: Score of 40/50
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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mysterioustrainer
Member # 1049
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posted February 16, 2003 09:16 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SteveP:
Due to lack of 15+ players and the fact that 3 of our top 4 players couldn't attend due to other commitments, the 10-under in Colorado was well represented in our top 8 finals. We had three 10-under players in the top 8. Only one player made it to the top 4, but that player went on to win it all and beat the current #1 player in Colorado, Bobby Derian, a 15+ player. Congrats to Breton Brander who won with a semi-rogue Golem/baby deck (see the decklist in the Tournaments section).
I agree that a 10-under division would have been nice. But we were lucky enough in Colorado to have them well-represented in the top 8.
Might I also note that I got creamed by one of those 10 and under division players.
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~Myst
www.freewebs.com/mysterioustrainer
Check out my personal website. Includes my ideas for decks my own fake cards, GB Teams, links to Ebay auctions, main trading page and much, much more.
1748 DCI Rating
Top player in state of Wyoming (Hmm. Could have something to do with the fact that the other four players in the state haven't played in over two years?)
From: Wherever the adventure takes me! | Registered: Feb 2001
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SuperSpymewtwo
Member
Member # 115730
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posted February 16, 2003 09:32 PM
In response to sportsmanship, I thought that we had decient atmosphere of game faces, except for the few who were disapointed. I eliminated a kid who was about 11 and whom was in near tears. I said that he did a good job and held his own in play. We shook hands, but he was rather upset. In situations like this, I do not know what to do. But I always tell my opponent when they say that "I am going to lose", that they will lose if they do not believe that they could do it, but believing in themselves just gives them that much more to feed off of to getting closer to winning. I believe in this concept 100%, because doubt is a bitter curse in any game play.
I think that this SBZ tournament is a good way to introduce the lower age group to competitive play and mold their skills and see many strategies at work. Heh, I learned a couple things from the lower divison, especially how a Poliwrath from Exp. works when played. The SBZ was a blast and I met many great players there and hope to play them in a future tournament.
[ February 16, 2003, 09:37 PM: Message edited by: SuperSpymewtwo ]
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"The circumstances of one's birth are irrelevant. It is what you do with the gift of life that makes you who you are." -Myuutsuu-san(American Version)-
"Face your destiny not with fear, but with courage."-Yosho from Tenchi Myuo-
o
o o
`Kaze to Issho Ni`
From: The States! Wahoo! (Although, Japan would be nice...) | Registered: Nov 2002
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Gym Leader Blaine
Member # 5977
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posted February 16, 2003 10:09 PM
You know it is funny how we on the board complain about not havin a 15+ group, now that we have some we are complaining about the 10 and under group, we just can win them all. In Salt Lake City, we only had 2 the was in the 10 and under group. Half of the players were in the 11-14, and the other half was in the 15+. IT is true that we had two that were 14 or younger enter in the top 8. I thought something like this would happen, that is way at the SBZ in Salt Lake, when everyone signed up they got a pack ontop of the promo 41 that was being given out. That just seemed a little more fair to me for someone paying $5 to enter in the tournament. IF there was enought players in this tournament then they should of split up the groups, but there was not enought like what you would see at a Challenge tournament. All and All all the players were very supportive of one another. When the promo Jumbo cards and prized was given out, everyone was clapping and such, which just made it a wonderful experiance for all.
Sorry that not all of yours went that way from what you are posting, but I am thinkful we were able to have this tourament, and hope the MT's will let us have it in the future.
Thanks MTM, DMTM, MTP,
Tymon Martindale
AKA Gym Leader BLaine
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"One day I will be the most powerful Jedi ever!" - Anakin Skywalker
darkmt_mike presents the speaker with question 83 from gym_leader_blaine:DMTM who would win in the battle in Gengar VS Jango Fett?
darkmt_mike says, "Hmm. think Gengar uses the Force so I would bet on him."
Salt Lake City Professors Web Site
From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Mar 2001
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted February 16, 2003 10:36 PM
Report it to the Store Owner... an ANGRY parent and potential customer *hopefully* would be BAD news.
BUT,
no ccg or tcg, tourney or competition will be perfect. NOR will the environment will.
Again, what will be learned from the experience?
TO give up or persevere??
AND perhaps to be a BETTER competitor?
THERE were so many friends & new faces... OUR SBZ was FUN!!
*still tired from the judging*
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Drafts bring out the BEST of the WORST cards in Pokemon
*TC Member/WizpogMOD_Squad/Master_Prof*
+GodFather to an Angel:RIP-Paloma Geronimo
-=-=-=-=-=-
TheCompendium
Team Random
Proud bro of SSJ3DVP11
ipgeek21.com
SHUT UP & DO something about it
From: The here, BUT WHERE shall we go? | Registered: Feb 2001
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GymLeaderPhil
Member # 455
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posted February 16, 2003 11:04 PM
Sorry to hear about that Pokemom. From my experience as a judge and player, I've seen many older AND younger players trash talk their opponents. Additionally you always have some parent on the sideline harrassing their kid or kid's opponent. Even if I'm not judging or playing, I think the right thing to do is to call a judge over to deal with the problem if I see a player not "joking around" (they always use that excuse).
With the younger players, it is expected to happen I guess. Kids can be very cruel. However this does not mean they should go unpunished for their actions. I've made it clear to express to the younger players that I do not "look-over" negative comments. We're playing a game, though much at stake, it is simply to have fun.
Suprisingly most of the older players are only concerned about the DCI Ranking versus prizes. Which seems crazy because the only people who should be concerned about their DCI Ranking is if they are in the Top Ten for their Country or for the World. Those are usually the only canidates who recieve invites to events, if any.
What really ticks me off is the arrogant older players. I've heard stories from respected sources over the actions of several talented players in the span of the game. Should we take them into consideration if we are judging one of those individuals? I dont think so. When you go into a tournament to judge you must take no sides, try your best to not make biased decisions.
My bottom line is that if you have not dealt with a player, then you do not know the player, even if you heard stories about him or her. However, if you have judged or played with the person who has caused problems in the past when you were there, I think you have the right to deal with their actions a bit more severly.
-Phil
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THIS is truly thinking outside of the box!
Check out Florida's Pokemon Website
From: Where ever the ladies take me | Registered: Feb 2001
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NoPoke
Member # 42315
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posted February 17, 2003 02:00 AM
I'm not sure that I'd try to eliminate trash-talking..but anything that even hints of psychological warfare gets STAMPED on.
I expect ALL players to know how to loose gratiously and I expect ALL players to know how to win graciously. I don't enforce the handshake at the end of a game...but I do expect to see smiles as I wander around. regardless of the competative aspect its about FUN and COMMUNITY.
Legal stalling is a part of the game. Maybe a slightly unsavoury aspect but there are much worse things to worry about. However if a more experienced player stalls against a younger/less experienced player than I will take a dim view of that behavoiour.
If either player is upset then as a judge I want to know why. I have paused games while addressing this situation and will continue so to do. You then have to walk the tightrope between not interfering with the flow of the whole competition and the need to ensure that all players have the best possible experience of competative play.
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'Good News' or 'Bad News' but NOT NO NEWS
some people brag about their tournament results, me I'm gonna brag??? about what players have managed to get past me LOL
-------Hoodwinked---(things I won't get wrong again...)------
'legal stalling' : game loss at least
'only joking' on misreported match results: DQ Yep its that serious!
The prize swap penalty as it applies to shuffling.
From: Crawley England | Registered: Sep 2001
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NoPoke
Member # 42315
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posted February 17, 2003 02:10 AM
As to the main issue of 10- being outclassed...
A pure age modified swiss competition does favour the best players. The intention is to award the top prize to the best player!
However if the intention is to run three competitions, one for each age group, a single age modified swiss competition can still work. You just look at the final standings within each age group rather than the overall placement.
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'Good News' or 'Bad News' but NOT NO NEWS
some people brag about their tournament results, me I'm gonna brag??? about what players have managed to get past me LOL
-------Hoodwinked---(things I won't get wrong again...)------
'legal stalling' : game loss at least
'only joking' on misreported match results: DQ Yep its that serious!
The prize swap penalty as it applies to shuffling.
From: Crawley England | Registered: Sep 2001
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old man
Member # 28
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posted February 17, 2003 03:28 AM
Frankly I'm surprised at how some people are responding to this issue of everyone in 1 tournament. It seems they either didn't understand or couldn't grasp it.
In a properly ran DCI tournament there is only 1 tournament that is broken down by the 3 different age groups. I feel a lot of this is because in most allthe previous WotC sponsored events the age groups have been broken up, & now they were suppose to all be in one group.
Running DCI sanctioned tournaments for about 2 years now I have seen some -10 year old players get creamed by older players. I have also seen older players get taken out by the younger players as well. side note - this also happens in sanctioned YGO tournaments as well!
Was everyone really gunning for that top spot & that very nice trophy, or were there people just playing for fun?
In the SBZ I ran about 1/2 of the players "play the tournament circuit" & knew what to expect. The other half had never been in a DCI sanctioned event before, although some had DCI #'s but never had a use for them.
I'm not going to address the trash talking here. That can & should be handled by a judge on-site if it is a problem. At thournaments I run that is rarely a problem & what I do hear is not during a game but in between rounds.
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Certified Master Professor (some say I am certifiable) &
Dci tournament coordinator for the OKC area!
From: Del City, OK, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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ukpokemonpro
Member # 518
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posted February 17, 2003 04:54 AM
I have to agree with NoPoke here we ran our 1st South East Callenge as Age Modified Swiss and use reporter to show the overall standings and the standings within age group... there was very little if any problems and we all had a good time.
Seems to me that we are facing the age old problem of Tourneys not always bringing out the best in people.. tras talking, unsporting conduct, etc.. well the TO and Judges set the tone and control the pace.. if we can run it with 3 of us for 44 players and ave fun ... you can to.
Stamp out the trash talking, use the time limit and give all players at all ages recognition by using reporter properly.
I have read elsewhere that a coin flip was used at one SBZ to decided the winner .. a coin flip! Shame on the TO and Head Judge that allowed that and shame on WotC for getting them to organise a tourney they clearly couldn't handle..
WotC and the DCI need to realise that Premier Pokemon events are not always best run by MtG premier event organisers.
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ukpokemonpro
"a meaningless title is just that ... meaningless"
"London Super Battlezone 2003"
quote the judge...
'only joking' on misreported match results: DQ Yep its that serious!
14,000 deck boxes yeah we'll take all of them .... what have I done!
Find the Pokemon League and Tournaments in Kent at:The Gamers Guild
From: Gillingham, Kent, UK | Registered: Feb 2001
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Pokidad
Member # 135
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posted February 17, 2003 05:33 AM
Johnny and others:
I truly understand the issue here....however, the tournament was advertized as "Age-Modified." Perhaps a lot of parents and younger players do not understand what this means or did not prepare themselves for this type of tournament. In some respects, it is analogy to a person buying a house next to an airport and then complaining about the air traffic noise. We all have to be prepared for torunaments and know how they will be handle. I truly have mixed feelings on this one since most of the 10 and under kids that play in tournament play at the local level (there are exceptions) can not compete with older players.
I have always prepared by kids (including players who are at out local stores) what to expect and how to conduct themselves in any torunament play. We do make mistakes by under estimating the tournament environment or our abilities. This should be a good experience for all players. From the comments, it was for the most part with the exception of some 10 and unders having a hard time dealing with emotions (maturity) and unfortunately poor sportsmanship of a few older players. Personally I have met these poor sportsmanship players and it is no fun playing a game with them.
Back on point. We need to learn from this "Age Modified" experience in competitive play and decide where to move from here. Magic has the JSS series (15 and under). Would this type of tournament be any different? I would expect not. I now one kid who attended the JSS and was 9. He had the best deck there but lost every game. Mostly experience. I was told he handle the tournament very well and he had a lot of support from about eight 11- 15 players. This experience has made him a better player and he isn't attend to drop out of the game due to this one experience. He likes the game. It will make him stronger.
Again, it really depends on the child how they will handle this situtation as well as the parent. We all need to inform ourselves of the rules and what to expect. I'm not sure if there was only a 15+ and under (like the Magic JSS series) we would have seen a different result.
Well, it was advertized as "Age-Modified." You can have a good feel when attending the type of competition that will be there. Just need to come prepared or don't attend this type of event. We do have choices. Again, please don't take this the wrong way. ![[Frown]](../tcg/frown.gif)
From: Falls Church, VA USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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ScythKing
Member # 26665
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posted February 17, 2003 05:34 AM
quote:
Originally posted by IPGeek21:
BUT couldn't they also learn strategties from OLDER more experienced players?
Geek, I loved your whole post. Perfect.
I played in A SBZ Sunday in Nashville and was pretty impressed by the talent there. Seemed like half of the players were serious competitors and the rest were there for fun, or were inexperienced. I saw quite a few of the older players being very patient and teaching/coaching as they went along with the younger/inexperienced players. They all deserved a good sportsman award IMHO.
There was also a friendly rivalry going on between the Toy'sRUs League (can you BELIEVE it!) and the GameKeep League. Lots were new players from when I was Gym Leader in that area. Gave me a real boost on the future of the game. ![[Big Grin]](../tcg/biggrin.gif)
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-=>* ScythKing *<=-
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There are 10 type of people in the world.
Those that understand binary and those that don't.
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From: Chattanooga, TN USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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ScythKing
Member # 26665
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posted February 17, 2003 05:43 AM
quote:
Originally posted by SuperSpymewtwo:
In response to sportsmanship, I thought that we had decient atmosphere of game faces, except for the few who were disapointed. I eliminated a kid who was about 11 and whom was in near tears. I said that he did a good job and held his own in play. We shook hands, but he was rather upset.
You handled it very well. I'm pretty sure THAT particular player was undefeated up to that point(the finals). He was feeling pretty cocky and you let the air out of his tires pretty quick. He was swallowing that famous bitter pill and I think he did a great job of choking it down - a sign of a true champion. You all did great!
[ February 17, 2003, 05:53 AM: Message edited by: ScythKing ]
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-=>* ScythKing *<=-
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There are 10 type of people in the world.
Those that understand binary and those that don't.
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From: Chattanooga, TN USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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GymLeaderPhil
Member # 455
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posted February 17, 2003 06:22 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ukpokemonpro:
WotC and the DCI need to realise that Premier Pokemon events are not always best run by MtG premier event organisers.
Sometimes that is the only option they have with a lack of Pokemon Players and TOs signing up to become a Primere TO. Not only do they have to organize Pokemon events, but they may be asked by WotC to sanction other games. With Magic The Gathering there is a big list of certified judges that an organizer could contact to run their Magic event.
What we really need to do is to pass the word along or make some note about there being a whole 300+ professors that a Magic Primere TO could ask to Head Judge the event. Because so far it does not seem like they are aware of what is going on.
-Phil
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THIS is truly thinking outside of the box!
Check out Florida's Pokemon Website
From: Where ever the ladies take me | Registered: Feb 2001
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Gym Leader Blaine
Member # 5977
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posted February 17, 2003 08:21 AM
I agree with you one some of this. I have been running tournaments for the past couple of years, and have yet to be really given a main Pokemon tournament of mine own. The Premium MTG TO in the area is really good to work with me, and everytime he has a pokemon tournament to run, I am the first he calls. I work out judges and such. For SZB he gave it all to me. He was running a Magic tournament on that same day so left everything in my hands. I brought my laptop and such and ran the whole thing. All he has to do is email in the results which he will get a copy from my DCI reporter. The thing that sucks most about this is that I will not get credit for TO this tournaments, ture I am listed as the head jugde, but I also did all the work, and the TO credit will go to him. Which makes me sad cause then WOTC will not know that I can run these kinds of tournaments, becaues there reports wont show it. I think there are some other professors that are in the same kinda standing.
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"One day I will be the most powerful Jedi ever!" - Anakin Skywalker
darkmt_mike presents the speaker with question 83 from gym_leader_blaine:DMTM who would win in the battle in Gengar VS Jango Fett?
darkmt_mike says, "Hmm. think Gengar uses the Force so I would bet on him."
Salt Lake City Professors Web Site
From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Mar 2001
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted February 17, 2003 08:30 AM
GLB,
WE know better next time GLB. IF ANOTHER one of these is announced I WILL LOBBY to have a GAMER"s location to hold this next time...
Wotc @ Beverly Hills was NOT, NOT equipped to hold a 50 person event *mall security was well unduly strict with us even the kids =/*
BUT They did a great job accomodating ALMOST all who showed. THAT I commend them for.
WHEN MTM even gives a hint at another SBZ we HAVE to NOTIFY HIM of our interest *I did not even know I could lobby for a place to run it...
I learned MY LESSON.
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Drafts bring out the BEST of the WORST cards in Pokemon
*TC Member/WizpogMOD_Squad/Master_Prof*
+GodFather to an Angel:RIP-Paloma Geronimo
-=-=-=-=-=-
TheCompendium
Team Random
Proud bro of SSJ3DVP11
ipgeek21.com
SHUT UP & DO something about it
From: The here, BUT WHERE shall we go? | Registered: Feb 2001
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Gym Leader Blaine
Member # 5977
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posted February 17, 2003 08:39 AM
Im sorry to hear that the WOTC store were you ran it was not a good place to run it. The SLC SBZ was ran at a Game Keeper and they have a store area in the mall that is not being used by anyone to run there league, it was great. Could of used a couple more tables, but we will get it next time.
As for lobbying were the next one is being held, you should talk to the TO that is give the events. WOTC contact them that they want the TO to run a tournament in the area, it is then the TO's decition to decide were HE (the TO) wants it to be run 9 out of 10 times.
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"One day I will be the most powerful Jedi ever!" - Anakin Skywalker
darkmt_mike presents the speaker with question 83 from gym_leader_blaine:DMTM who would win in the battle in Gengar VS Jango Fett?
darkmt_mike says, "Hmm. think Gengar uses the Force so I would bet on him."
Salt Lake City Professors Web Site
From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Mar 2001
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Pokenaut
Member # 189
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posted February 17, 2003 09:57 AM
My son Spencer (8 yrs old) was the highest placing 10- at the Delaware Ohio SBZ and although he wasn't thrilled just missing top8, he ended up having a great time overall (finishing 4th in a side tourney helped). Remember though that he plays in a sanctioned event EVERY Saturday against some of the best players in Ohio in Age-Modified, and he's KNOWS he has to make it past the older kids to have a shot. I can see how a 10-kid without that type of background could be pretty put-off by having to play kids nearly twice their age and experience after the first few rounds.
As far as IPGeek's observations about location choices, I agree wholeheartedly. Nearly half of the players that showed up at this SBZ were from Northern Ohio, and of that half most all were from my home location York Comics. Had myself or LeagueMom KNOWN that we were supposed to "solicit" WotC for the honor of being a SBZ candidate, we would have. The initial "official" word from WotC was that ALL SBZ locations were to be decided BY THEM based upon League/Battlezone attendance. Had they done that, York Comics would have been the natural go-to for an event. Had this event been in the Cleveland area (which BTW, was NOT hit hardly at all by the same storm that possibly hurt the Delaware attendance) I guarantee that attendance would have been much higher. We have over 20 players EVERY Sat at York, and the total for the SBZ was 40 (which was good mind you, but less than expected on my part...again...weather). Later on, as WotC was filling the remaining locations for SBZ it was stated that they were counting on TO's to vie for the remaining spots. By that time I was already slated to be a judge at the Delaware SBZ. A simple search by WotC of sanctioned events/attendance may have cleared a lot of this up. This is NOT sour grapes on my part mind you. I had a great time, as did most of the players I saw. I do thank DaytonGymleader for asking me to judge, but had the shoe been on the other foot, and the event held up my way, I KNOW he would have gladly made the trip north to help us with an event. Maybe this will happen in May, we'll have to wait and see.
'Naut
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Ç...What if the Hokey-Pokey is what it's REALLY all about....Ç
Proud member of Team Poképarents- we play Pokémon with our kids!
Founding member of Team Dead Sneasel-Our team's home is York Comics and Cards in Parma, Ohio
~Being an insomniac dyslexic agnostic, I often stay up all night wondering if there really is a doG~
From: Shaker Heights, Ohio USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Meganium45
Member # 99835
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posted February 17, 2003 11:54 AM
Hey, my 6 year old won the 14- age division in Colinsville - and all of the 10- players played well against their older counterparts.
You talk about a RUSH - have a 6 year old win against the bigger guys in swiss, then win his division! Talk about cloud 9! He's done something his big brother has never done, win a major Pokemon event! This after finishing in the top 8 at the Central Stadium Challenge!
Hey! This is why I strive to have my guys play the best competition out there. They enjoy it more, and it preps them for the big events. thank you Dragon King!
Meganium 45 - Also SBZ winner 15+ a family sweep!
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"To Make a Difference, you have to be Different"
Winner and parent of 6 year old winner (Little Duck) of Colinsville SBZ!
Other son was the 9 year old winner May SBZ at Dragon King, the best place to play Pokemon in the Midwest!
NOW 3 TROPHIES!!!
THE MASTER PROFESSOR IN ST. LOUIS and TO too! Yipee!
Gotta love St. Louis 8th, 9th and 10th and the Origins Professor Championship! (I was 9th :( )
Too bad we never have room for our bench - - lol.
From: St. Louis, Missouri | Registered: Aug 2002
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Crobat1
Member # 85086
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posted February 17, 2003 12:11 PM
Having followed this post--I have come to the following conclusions.
1. Many of us have gotten used to having tournaments with age limits which allow the younger players to compete within their age group.
2. There are benefits to playing in open tournaments. My son (then 10) loved playing at Origins in the Open events--and he even won one. It was quite a thrill.
3. The problem is one of misunderstanding. An age modified event is actually much more of an Open event than an age limited event.
4. I personally think they should have run SBZ with age limits or as an Open event. This age modified format was confusing and to some misleading.
By the way, having played in a number of age modified, I will mention yet another problem. There is a bias against the younger players when it comes to tie breaks for the playoffs. Daniel and I found that my tie break in an age modified event was consistently higher than his, which I attributed to the fact that he often played someone in the first round who went on to have a very losing record.
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Bilbo Baggins: "Every worm has its weakness."
Crobat2:
Winner, Syracuse SBZ, Feb, 2003
22nd Place, 10 and Under, World's, August, 2002
Winner, Friday's Open Modified Event, Origins, July, 2002
Winner, 10 and Under Gym Challenge, Milford, May, 2002
Crobat1:
Winner, Albany SBZ, May, 2003
9th Place: Professor's Tournament at World's, August 2002
Top 4, Theme Deck Tournament at World's, August, 2002
Top 8, Unlimited Side Event at World's (Undefeated in Main Draw), August, 2002
From: Binghamton, NY | Registered: May 2002
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NoPoke
Member # 42315
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posted February 17, 2003 01:15 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Crobat1:
By the way, having played in a number of age modified, I will mention yet another problem. There is a bias against the younger players when it comes to tie breaks for the playoffs. Daniel and I found that my tie break in an age modified event was consistently higher than his, which I attributed to the fact that he often played someone in the first round who went on to have a very losing record.
Its an interesting point though I wouldn't call it 'Biased'. It should not be a surprise that loosing to a stronger player does less damage to your tie break value than loosing to a weaker player. However reporter is actually generous in how it treats loosing players when calculating their tie break value: reporter credits them with a 1/3 win ratio.
reporter only resorts to the tie break values to resolve ties... So a first round win against a weak player still gets you the full three points.
I probably haven't convinced you that reporter is unbiased, and I do agree that if you are a very strong player then it is better to start off in the middle of the pack rather than at the bottom. As to how to fix this well just ask to be 'grandfathered' into the next age group up! If a strong 10- player asked me to be entered into the melee with the older players I'd not raise any objections as TO.
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'Good News' or 'Bad News' but NOT NO NEWS
some people brag about their tournament results, me I'm gonna brag??? about what players have managed to get past me LOL
-------Hoodwinked---(things I won't get wrong again...)------
'legal stalling' : game loss at least
'only joking' on misreported match results: DQ Yep its that serious!
The prize swap penalty as it applies to shuffling.
From: Crawley England | Registered: Sep 2001
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