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Author
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Topic: Customer Loyalty? WotC vs Pokemon
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cubone
Member # 607
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posted April 27, 2003 04:39 PM
Wow. There are some great posts here. As for myself,my loyalty would stay with the community. I play most of the major TCG's i.e. Pokemon, Harry Potter, Magic and YugiOh. By far, the games WotC is invovled with are far superior. I will continue to play Pokemon as long a I can find an opponent. As for other games or companies, if the product is good, I will be involved. Either way my association with WotC AND Pokemon will continue. ![[Smile]](../tcg/smile.gif)
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Gym Leader and TO for 4th St. Boutique, Moore,Ok. Teach the youth of today. They are our future.
From: MOORE,OK. USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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DaytonGymLeader
Member # 2615
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posted April 27, 2003 09:53 PM
It's an interesting project to say the least.
Does WotC foster customer loyalty? You bet. Their OP program does more than an adequate job of providing for customer loyalty. Compare it to other companies and WotC's OP is a model that has been adapted by several other gaming companies. WotC provides mailing lists and forums for players, judges, and organize to share their ideas and information on the game.
We play a few different WotC games, Pokemon, Harry Potter, and Star Wars. All of them are licensed from other companies. If everyone thinks that the reins were tight for Pokemon, you should have seen Harry Potter. Star Wars, from what I understand, WotC has a pretty loose leash. WotC should make this game the model for when they negotiate with other companies to license card games. Will we continue to play these other games? Sure we will. Will we continue to play Pokemon once WotC's involvement is done with the game? Yes. I've already faxed in my app for TO status along with a resume.
The community in this game is unique. Seeing other gaming communities (clix games, card games, dice games, etc), I'm very glad to call myself a part of it. We've gone thru quite a few trials and tribulations to come together as a cohesive group. Do we still have some growing pains to go thru? Sure we do.
So, the bottom line becomes where do my loyalties lie - the game, the company, or the community? The loyalties lay with all 3. There is really no way to separate them all.
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DaytonGymLeader
Books-A-Million 307
Dayton, Ohio
[email protected]
Founding Member of Team Banda de Foco
Origins 2002 Head Judge
2003 Delaware, OH SBZ Head Judge
2003 Dayton, OH SBZ Head Judge
Origins 2003 Head Judge
GenCon 2003 Head Judge
From: Dayton, Ohio, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Golduck
Member # 523
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posted April 27, 2003 11:58 PM
I'm a Pokemon fan and I'll continue to be a Pokemon fan. It's as simple as that for me. I will continue to buy the cards and continue to organize/judge tourneys, and play in some, no matter which company I'm doing it "for".
I don't have any special feelings towards the company Wizards of the coast. I don't love or hate the company. The people in there, though: those are the ones I care about, not the entire company.
DMTM, MTM and more at Wizards USA and Harlan Levey, Kristin, Karin and more at Wizards Europe - those are great people, and it'd be a pity if Nintendo don't have this kind of great people. But I'm sure they're ok to, and that it's nothing to worry about. People come, people go, things change - that's life.
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Norwegian Championships - register here
Have/Want list
Visit Team Europe's new home page:
TE v. 2.0
Be sure not to miss:
Norwegian Championships 2003
From: Norway, in front of a Mac, designing the new TE homepage | Registered: Feb 2001
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BJJ763
Member # 158
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posted April 28, 2003 06:07 AM
Since i finally have the time to respond...
I'll be going with the game. Looking around my cube i see my Gengar squeezee thingy, my "metallic" Chansey and "metallic" Charmander (from Kellogg's Pokémon Pop Tarts), some Season 1 badges that i never traded, a pile of recycleable papers that contain many envelopes and papers from trades, and my bag that i carry to work with it's Dragonair, Hitmonlee, and Electabuzz Burger King key chains on them. I think of my house and realize that there is not a room in it that doesn't have something Pokémon related in it (the bathroom has some Pikachu toothbrushes, a Pikachu sponge, and probably whatever toys the youngest ones brought with them into the tub last night). I also think of the plans that i would like to accomplish, the sealed boxes and packs down cellar that i'd love to draft with, the extra quarter figures that i'd use either for damage counters or prizes, and the other stuff i've acquired throughout the house that i could use for tourney support. The 2 oldest boys (and my wife) have been playing whatever version of Ruby/Sapphire they got for Easter and they enjoy playing the TGC game. My youngest is becoming a Pokémon nut, spurred on by the TV show (i hear "You missed it" from him if i'm not with him when "Who's that Pokémon?" comes on and of course he tells me who it was) and the paraphenalia he has (cards, magnets, figures, Pokémon Snap, tattoos). He's learing and knows many of the evolutionary lines. And about 1-2 months ago he told me "Jigglypuff is my favorite." So yeah looks like i'm with it.
Least that's the plan for now. I really have to wait and see what Nintendo does with it. They have big shoes to fill. I can see how they can have an advantage over WotC with Pokemon. But i can also see how they can possibly mess it up. I'll have to wait and see what exactly they have in mind.
As for WotC, if there was a game that we could get into, i would. When the boys first started getting into Pokémon, I resisted buying any Pokémon cards. I really did. We were going many nonsports sets at the time. Couldn't afford Pokémon cards. So didn't buy any. Then one Saturday, we called up the store we bought many of our nonsports boxes from and she told us she had 1 2-player starter set left. I raced down there and got it. 3 sets of everything later (except 1st ed. Base and Shadowless though laters sets we just collected 1st ed. sets only), here we are. Magic isn't really an option, it just doesn't do anything for me. My wife and oldest were Harry Potter fans, but that's over now there's no League for them (though we're still trying to complete Chamber of Secrets). The sports ones...not really. Again, we got into Pokémon because of the boys' interest and they aren't really sports nuts. Neopets? Boys have probably never heard of them so i highly doubt we'll be going that. Risk 2010? That's a possibility. My wife was a huge board game fan years ago and Risk was one of her favorites. Course this assumes Risk 2010 is similar to Risk. Have no clue.... Simpsons? Doubtful. While we enjoy watching The Simpsons, we aren't huge Simpsons nuts. We don't own any figures, we only have a couple of the Burger King toys, don't own a set of any of the trading cards. So i don't think we'll be doing that. And it's a shame. The experience that i've had with the WotC employees (MTM, DMTM, MTP, DMTS, Damian, Kieren, Ron, Elaine, Reed, and the others i've forgotten) has always been a very positive one. I know for a fact that if there was a WotC product that we could enjoy as much as Pokémon, we'd be doing it. For now, i'll just have to wait and see what comes along.
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Our trade list
Pokémon answers at the Compendium
"We are not purposely trying to mess with your minds." - DMTM
Indentifier of the Magby Rule.
Baton-wielding thug cop.
From: Warwick RI USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Dan the Pokeman
Member # 242
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posted April 28, 2003 10:02 AM
For me, the choice (if you can call it that) is crystal clear: Follow the game.
My son and I have played and collected Pokemon for about half of his life (he'll be 10 in September). We've gone to Pokemon League nearly every Friday Night for almost 3 years. Right now, it's hard to imagine how things would be without Pokemon.
While we certainly are grateful to WotC for sponsoring all the tournaments as well as League, we also recognize the WotC did so with it's own best interests at heart - furthering the brand. It just so happens that it was in the players' best interests, too.
Personally, I think WotC was just reaching the top of it's game, so to speak, at promoting Pokemon; it's too bad they weren't able to retain the licence.
So, Thank You WotC, and, as of Jamboree, Good-Bye.
From: Goose Creek, SC | Registered: Feb 2001
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Planteon
Member
Member # 49075
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posted April 28, 2003 01:44 PM
I will probably be as loyal to WotC as they are to the Pokémon community.
If WotC shut down these boards quite soon after the license expires and don't bother to update the card reference data base, then it'll leave a sour taste in my mouth and "WotC" on a product will read "avoid" to me.
However, if these boards are kept alive (at least until there are other new forums available where we can move on to) and the database is completed down to the last tiny error - then "WotC" on a product will read "buy me".
Which ever of these scenarios that makes most sense from a corporate wievpoint (i.e. maximised profits for WotC) will be the one that will happen - WotC is not a charity.
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"There is only one thing money can't buy: Poverty" - John Cooper Clarke
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From: Sweden | Registered: Nov 2001
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WizPoG_Pop
Member # 113762
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posted April 28, 2003 01:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Planteon:
I will probably be as loyal to WotC as they are to the Pokémon community.
If WotC shut down these boards quite soon after the license expires and don't bother to update the card reference data base, then it'll leave a sour taste in my mouth and "WotC" on a product will read "avoid" to me.
However, if these boards are kept alive (at least until there are other new forums available where we can move on to) and the database is completed down to the last tiny error - then "WotC" on a product will read "buy me".
Which ever of these scenarios that makes most sense from a corporate wievpoint (i.e. maximised profits for WotC) will be the one that will happen - WotC is not a charity.
Planteon: That expectation is a bit unrealistic, isn't it?
Once WotC loses the liscence, they had better shut down the Pokemon forums! If they don't, I would expect TPC to sue them for Trademark and copyright violation.
WotC's PokeGym ain't just a fan site. It's a corporate site. It has to obey rules that a fan site can ignore knowing that it won't be bothered.
Registered: Nov 2002
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Planteon
Member
Member # 49075
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posted April 28, 2003 02:00 PM
OK, point partially taken.
Let's put it this way then - if we're helped by WotC to find a new forum then thumbs up, if the just shut down the boards without assisting the community, then it leaves a bad aftertaste...
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"There is only one thing money can't buy: Poverty" - John Cooper Clarke
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From: Sweden | Registered: Nov 2001
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dkates
Member
Member # 113463
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posted April 28, 2003 04:55 PM
I agree with Planteon that, if WotC is able (and I don't see why they wouldn't be), it would help things if they helped us find a new forum, and maybe repost some or all of the posts from these. Other than that, I just hope that Nintendo can do even half the job Wizards has-- if they can, the game should be able to at least keep its spot, if not rise in the standings of most popular TCGs. Okay, that last statement was a slight exaggeration, but I trust I've made my point. This deal has the potential to ruin the game and WotC, or to be a big help to both-- it just depends on how and how well it's done.
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Every time I think I can't say anything stupider, I prove myself wrong. Maybe I should just stop thinking.
From: Houston, TX | Registered: Nov 2002
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Planteon
Member
Member # 49075
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posted April 29, 2003 01:09 AM
With the sad news that WotC can't release LCII and Jambouree it means that they have less work to fullfil my whishes: "just" update Aquapolis, Skyridge & Promos in the card reference and help us with our exodus to a new Pokemon USA/Nintendo/Independent home and WotC have sored high on my scale.
It is also good to hear that they're still arranging tournaments until the very end, but tournaments must mean increased card sales for WotC, so they're not entierly unselfish (can't see updating the card reference as a big boost for sales, so that scores higher in my eyes...).
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"There is only one thing money can't buy: Poverty" - John Cooper Clarke
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From: Sweden | Registered: Nov 2001
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Pidgeotto Trainer
Member
Member # 133447
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posted April 29, 2003 07:31 PM
As long as Nintendo doesn't 'mess up' the game, all that love the Pokemon game will follow it. Wotc tcg business will be hurt since Pokemon is still top 3 tcgs. (Yugioh, Magic) Wotc still has Magic which I don't play but I know many of you Tcg players do. Many people also play other Wotc games. A lot play Magic others like me play MLB showdown which is I'm guessing 3rd on the Wotc list. (2nd when Pokemon leaves) There is also NFL showdown and Harry Potter which must be doing OK or else they would've killed them after the first set.
For loyalty, I've been going to the same Wotc for 3.5 years, despite the Pokemon league being cut in half over the past year+. For Yugioh MLB and mostly Pokemon. (of course) If they continue to sell Pokemon, and let us play pokemon in their stores I'll still be going there. I'll still buy MLB and the Pokemon e-cards and earlier. The only thing I ask Wotc to do with Pokemon while they still have it is to have the best tournament ever at Gencon and to give us an exact date for the Pokegym closure ahead of time.
Always thankful to Wotc for bringing us Pokemon no matter what happens
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Co-Leader & longest member of Northgate Wizards Pokemon League-Seattle
52nd-Fan Appreciation Tournament 3-1 Blackout theme deck. 2-2-1 Kabutops/Scizor/Furret
10th-Feb Seattle SBZ
10th-May Seattle SBZ
Ash: "Pidgeotto Gust attack."
Pidgeotto: "Pidgeoooo"
Team Rocket: "Looks like Team Rocket's blasting off again." (ding)
Pidgeotto & I challenge YOU
From: Seattle, WA (Home of the 2002 World Championship | Registered: Mar 2003
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Pokidad
Member # 135
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posted May 02, 2003 01:43 PM
You guys have given me a lot more to think about.
I'll leave this one comment to consider and I value all three of these items to continue to support this game.
1. The game
2. The Community (boards and people we have met and love this game as much as us).
3. The Company, mostly the dedicated employees such as MTM, DMTM, and many others.
If any one of the items above is lost, loyalty to any game will need to begin again (Ah, that wait and see mode with Nintendo). Loosing MTM, DMTM and other key WotC employees is loosing part of the "game" and the "gaming experience." So, yes, I feel my loyalty to this game will have to be won over again by a new company. However, my loyalty to some key WotC employees will continue.
From: Falls Church, VA USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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TheGameHHH6662
Member # 108723
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posted May 02, 2003 02:36 PM
Myself and my son Shaun have been involved with Pokemon since the heady days of Fossil.Through my son(who is currently ranked fifth in UK )I set up a league for the local kids which grew and grew and subsequently became a professor and then a master professor and judge/TO and to be honest I just cant imagine NOT being involved with Pokemon.I cant say my loyalties truly lie with Wizards due to the appalling standard of service we have received from the UK office although I do understand that the USA end has been far better(MTM,DMTM,Pat etc)I honestly cant see myself getting involved with Neopets and feel that when Nintendo take over I will be there to play and help and hopefully be involved in the UK tourney scene and I know that my fellow master profs(ukpokemonpro,Freddy K,NoPoke etc)will carry on doing a great job of keeping Pokemon alive in the UK !!
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Play the game or the game will play you.
Hark,can you hear them? How beautiful they sound,the children of the night!
So,you think you're tough with that Gatr? Well bring it on!!
From: Norwich,England | Registered: Oct 2002
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SteveP
Member # 14743
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posted May 02, 2003 05:01 PM
Hi Dave. I assume that your 123 loyalty list is in order of importance. For me, loosing WOTC and those great MTs will not keep from from playing and buying Pokemon, unless of course Nintendo absolutely blows Pokemon organized play. Yah, those guys are great, and I understand that some in the Pokemon playing community have grown to be good friends with them. Hopefully, Nintendo with provide some decent laiasons to fill the WOTC MT's shoes for those who need and want it.
Regarding loyalty to the community, I'm most loyal to my local players. I find myself scheduling family events and trips around my weekly BZs. As for the "more distant" community, the boards and once/twice a year events MUST be continued at Nintendo in order to keep me involved with those outside my local arena. Although I'm going to Origins and possibly GenCon, I've got to admit that my primary reason for going in a bit selfish (to get all those cool prizes MTM says he'll be giving out). My secondary reason of course is to play Pokemon and meet everyone.
That's all.
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Proud member of Team PokéParents - we play Pokémon with our kids!
From: Colorado Springs, CO, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Pokesensei
Member # 7
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posted May 04, 2003 09:47 AM
You are correct Dave in that Nintendo will need to earn our loyalty.It remains to be seen how they will handle OP.If they change things too drastically or don`t give it enough support(i.e.Chats,Leagues,etc..),then they can kiss the game goodbye.People will leave them in a heartbeat so they are walking on thin ice right now.
As for WotC,yes,it won`t be the same without the MT`s.We owe those guys alot and we will miss them dearly.I will still play D&D(my all time fave game) and anything else I choose to play by WotC,so the game going to Nintendo does`nt have any impact on what games and what company produces said games that I play.
One thing I will admit,however,is I am extremely dissatisfied with Hasbro and how they have handled Pokemon since the buyout of WotC.They can flat out kiss my arse.
`Sensei
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•Founding Member of TEAM COMPENDIUM
•STS/World`s Judge
•Admin of WizPog
Right..not blocked that is.At least until I`m overuled by a Gameboy again!-MT Pat smarting after being overuled by a Gameboy.
`Sensei is a madman from another dimension!-DMTM
From: Out of the Box | Registered: Feb 2001
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XAct
Member
Member # 121043
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posted May 04, 2003 10:06 AM
This is a very simple question for me. I'll go for the game. I've never seen organised Pokemon play in my country, so my decision is obvious. Only a handful of persons ever played the Pokemon TCG with its proper rules in my country, and they don't do so anymore. This is not a rant to WotC. Realise that the island where I live is so small that it's almost insignificant (imagine an 18 miles by 11 miles island: that's the place where I live, in a nutshell ![[Razz]](../tcg/tongue.gif) ). The reason I play is simply because I love the game. I found the game's machanics so superb that I simply wanted to play, so I turned to the Internet and played online. And, of course, unless I don't find persons online who want to play, I'll continue to do so.
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I'm the second worst Pokemon Player in Malta. There are only 2 Pokemon players here.
From: Malta | Registered: Jan 2003
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