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Author
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Topic: Rotation...MTs...Please
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CmonIWanaPLaYa
Member
Member # 101319
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posted November 11, 2002 02:22 PM
Does this mean that the rotation of genesis will be soon??? And then how will that effect the metagame and all those Steelix players??? Also, when will SI roll out or will it go with Gensis?
These questions and more later.....
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Registered: Aug 2002
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Lacy
Member # 43928
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posted November 11, 2002 03:01 PM
We will see the MF format changed eventually, but Neo-On hasn't been around for that long yet. Just be patient, they will rotate Neo Genesis out when they're ready.
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From: Atlanta, GA | Registered: Sep 2001
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DMTM
Member # 10
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posted November 11, 2002 03:11 PM
Not changing "soon".
DMTM
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Frodo_Baggins - "Like the guy said "Get out of the box""
From: Seattle, Wa, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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yoshi1001
Member # 825
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posted November 11, 2002 03:16 PM
Translation:
WotC has said they only plan on rotating on the current yearly schedule. Frequent changes would cause problems.
quote:
[master_trainer_mike presents the speaker with question #252 from sgherika:I know it is very early to ask, but sense it is halloween, perhaps you can look into your crystal ball any tell when the modified will change? i.e. take out some of the neo sets? Summer 2003? End of 2003?
master_trainer_mike says, "No earlier than a year from when it last changed."
10/31/2002 Chat
[ November 11, 2002, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: yoshi1001 ]
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AIM: yoshi1001
From: Janesville, Wisconsin | Registered: Feb 2001
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Soslowpoke
Member # 70
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posted November 11, 2002 03:50 PM
quote:
Does this mean that the rotation of genesis will be soon??? And then how will that effect the metagame and all those Steelix players???
Same thing that happened to Rocket's Zapdos players when Gym Heroes and Challenge were rotated out of modified ^_^
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From: Chicago | AIM: cool runnings93 | Registered: Feb 2001
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SD_PokeMom
Member # 97
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posted November 11, 2002 04:00 PM
![[Dubious]](../tcg/graemlins/dubious.gif) ![[NoNoNo]](../tcg/graemlins/nonono.gif) ![[Roll Eyes]](../tcg/rolleyes.gif)
Yoshi: is it not just a bit presumptous for you to "translate for" DMTM?
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Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Feb 2001
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Psychic_Prof
Member # 96987
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posted November 11, 2002 04:28 PM
I for one can't wait till it happens...
No Slowking
No Gatr
No Cleffa (and other babies)
No Murkrow
I'm so happy!
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Using Archtypes in Pokemon would be like the Iron Chefs making a pepperoni pizza.
Creativity sets the elite from the amateur.
From: Redwood City Gym, Eureka, CA | Registered: Jul 2002
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RULEMASTER
Member # 99791
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posted November 11, 2002 05:06 PM
I don't think it was too presumptous, Pokemom. Yoshi was just trying to help, and he usually knows what he is talking about. ![[Wink]](../tcg/wink.gif)
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From: Wisconsin | Registered: Aug 2002
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted November 11, 2002 05:21 PM
*sigh*
RIP: DVile
Destiny
RIP: Chaos Gym
Sept. 2002
RIP: SLowking????
Next year?
Perhaps... SO what will keep TRAINERmon in check?
CPU will be celebrating THAT day it is announced...
'Tis shall be a sad day...
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SHUT UP & DO something about it
From: The here, BUT WHERE shall we go? | Registered: Feb 2001
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Onix95
Member # 103241
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posted November 12, 2002 12:56 AM
You forget though, that most of the good trainers will also go with Genesis like Focus Band, Professor Elm, Gold Berry, Double Gust, and a few more vanishing from play, leaving us with Potions and Moo Moo Milks, Supporters, Pokemon Reverse, and a few other trainers that had better counterparts. All in all, this balances out the game for some part, getting rid of old favorites, and paving the pathway for new favorites. Anybody up for some Harvested Bounty?
As a side note, we still have Psyduck who'll give you're opponent a Headache...
[ November 12, 2002, 12:57 AM: Message edited by: Onix95 ]
From: Honolulu, Hawaii | Registered: Aug 2002
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Super Psyduck
Member # 921
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posted November 12, 2002 01:35 AM
What shuld we do when elm,cleffa and so on goes out of mmf.. They have to reprint some cards from Genesis. Other wise you can only use 1 valuble trainer ech turn and that is the nice supporters..
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From: Norway, Nesodden :) | Registered: Feb 2001
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Golduck
Member # 523
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posted November 12, 2002 07:17 AM
I think all of you are forgetting an important thing: reprinting of Genesis cards. Battlezone will have a reprint of an old card every season, called "Best of Pokémon" cards. The first one is Electabuzz from Base, and I bet all my shinings that some of the next 7 will be Genesis cards.
My bet? Cleffa will be a "Best of Pokémon" promo. Cleffa is here to stay, I'm sure! Remember how many times the MTs have said that Cleffa isn't broken because it helps the game more than it hurts it?
I think "Best of Pokémon" will have one Pokémon from each Energy type:
Lighting: Electabuzz (Base)
Fighting: Hitmonchan (Base)
Water: Blastoise? (Base)
Psychic: Slowking (Genesis)
Grass: Meganium (Genesis)
Fire: Magby (Genesis) or Magmar (Fossil)
Colorless: Cleffa (Genesis)
I'm just guessing, though. This would help keeping some of the good Pokémon in the format, and also adding some "new". The Trainers on the other hand... I don't expect Elm and Focus Band as promos.
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From: Norway, in front of a Mac, designing the new TE homepage | Registered: Feb 2001
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Psychic_Prof
Member # 96987
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posted November 12, 2002 08:11 AM
I sincerely doubt they would promo base blastoise. It's a good thing that it's gone. As for your other predictions...doubtful. Historically...Promos are usually basic pokemon.
Also, there is already a promo Cleffa...and though multiple promos are done often, I also doubt Cleffa will be remade.
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Using Archtypes in Pokemon would be like the Iron Chefs making a pepperoni pizza.
Creativity sets the elite from the amateur.
From: Redwood City Gym, Eureka, CA | Registered: Jul 2002
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SauroN
Member # 373
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posted November 12, 2002 08:44 AM
uhh...just cuz most of the promos have been basics doesnt mean they HAVE to be =/. some have been trainers too. actually I dont even WANT cleffa back. jungle scyther would be a good promo. magmar fossil (o_O) ... love that card...
Blastoise. I WANT THIS BACK. *sob*
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From: Sweden | Registered: Feb 2001
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CPUSrchDiscarding2forOak
Member # 37400
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posted November 12, 2002 08:45 AM
Let's take a look at this, shall we?
Major issues with getting rid of Genesis:
Slowking. When Slowking is gone, people will be able to take out all of the Igglybuffs and Pichus (which will have to come out anyway, they are Genesis as well), giving a few more slots to work with.
Steelix: Resistance to Grass is dead. This means slightly more people will play Grass -- and this also means more people can play fire to counter that grass.
CLEFFA: This card, IMO, needs reprinted before Genesis rotates. With the loss of a good way to get a hand that isn't a Trainer, decks will slow down considerably.
Murkrow: Without Slowking support to keep the player in the lock, this card isn't all that powerful.
Focus Band: Ahh, the almighty Focus. I can't tell you how many games I've played in (and even more I've watched) that have been determined by the flip of a Focus band. IMO, this card needs reprinted as well. It was the great equalizer for a deck that had a big hitter, but weakness to a major archetype. (Old MF Entei-Cargo players sure realize this, heck, current MF Entei-Cargo players see this.)
Time Capsule: Not to worry, as the Aquapolis spoiler lists tell us that there is a Supporter that not only replaces this card but may allow the player to retrieve NON-BASIC energy as well...
Gold Berry: The other half-decent Poketool for healing damage. If people didn't play Focus, they were playing this, and for good reason. I sure hope we get better healing.
PROFESSOR ELM: The other big issue with Genesis rotation. Without this card, every draw card ends up being like an Elm anyway, as you won't be able to do much that is useful after you play it. There needs to be some other drawpower.
DOUBLE GUST: I can't name a player that doesn't use Slowking that doesn't have 4 of these in their MMF deck. In the days of pure Unlimited, GoW was something to be expected -- a way to get rid of that big threat that was building up on their bench. In new MF, people either play low retreat cost cards, Switch, or one of the non-holo Legendary Dogs to counteract the negative effect of this card, still leaving it gamebreaking. Either reprint Gust, or reprint this -- please, don't leave us with just Pokemon Reversal!
Discovery rotation effects:
There are really only two issues:
We finally get rid of Espeon, and we have the unfortunate loss of Tyrogue.
With the lack of decent babies, Tyrogue loses power anyway, as that's what he was there to KO in the first place.
My prediction, based on dropping Genesis and Discovery, and with the current new promo info:
A lot of decks gain power. Entei-Cargo didn't need all that draw anyway, but loses the free retreater it once had in Cleffa -- and must now run the fourth Switch. But since other decks won't be able to get set up as fast, and Entei can still quickly Howl the night away, this deck is really only vulnerable to...
The new water decks: Dark Gatr isn't a viable choice now (Slowkings are gone, as are the babies it was meant to stop). Kingdra is left, reveling in all of its brokenness. Its focus band is gone, but Pokecenter remains -- leaving nothing but OHKO decks immune to its power. Water may also have allies in:
The holo Feraligatr or Poliwrath: The Gatr has a built in Switch and a decent attack, the Poliwrath can move energy around and do a decent amount of damage. However, both need 4 energy and Poliwrath's combo relies on flips. Except for Kingdra, all of this water is weak to:
The new promo, Base set Electabuzz: A lot of players will be splashing this card. With only 1 Electric needed for it to do any of its attacks, some players (maybe even Entei-Cargo?) may splash it and a couple of Rainbow energy in their decks, "just in case".
It's really too early to tell what this would do to the metagame -- we haven't seen Aquapolis yet, and we haven't seen Skyridge either. There are a lot of cards in these sets (and hopefully lots of BROKEN TRAINERS!!! ![[Devilish]](../tcg/graemlins/diablo.gif) ) We also don't know what the other Promos that Battlezone is going to give us are.
So yes, I will be loving the day Genesis/Discovery get rotated -- This leaves me with my Entei-Cargo deck, donning a Beavis mask, and chanting "FIRE FIRE FIRE FIRE FIRE FIRE!!!!"
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What, like the pro-archetype attitude is supposed to be restricted to THIS company, and THIS TCG?
All card games run on archetypes. Magic is 90% archetypes. YGO is 90% archetypes. Pokemon was, for the most part, all archetypes before and during MF2. Pokemon will be archetype-based during MF3. Pokemon will be archetype based when it is under Nintendo.
Viva la unoriginality!
From: West Mifflin, PA | Registered: Aug 2001
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jdb728
Member # 60530
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posted November 12, 2002 10:49 AM
"Perhaps... SO what will keep TRAINERmon in check?
CPU will be celebrating THAT day it is announced..." ![[Confused]](../tcg/confused.gif) , LOL, Slowking doesn't keep Trainermon in check, it just keeps the opponent from playing trainers, while the Slowking player gets to play trainermon all day(unchallenged) ![[Crowd]](../tcg/graemlins/invasion.gif) .
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From: Salem, Or. | Registered: Jan 2002
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CPUSrchDiscarding2forOak
Member # 37400
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posted November 12, 2002 11:10 AM
As it should be ![[Razz]](../tcg/tongue.gif)
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What, like the pro-archetype attitude is supposed to be restricted to THIS company, and THIS TCG?
All card games run on archetypes. Magic is 90% archetypes. YGO is 90% archetypes. Pokemon was, for the most part, all archetypes before and during MF2. Pokemon will be archetype-based during MF3. Pokemon will be archetype based when it is under Nintendo.
Viva la unoriginality!
From: West Mifflin, PA | Registered: Aug 2001
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TheCrossFormatKid
Member # 87741
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posted November 12, 2002 12:17 PM
"Kingdra is left, reveling in all of its brokenness. Its focus band is gone, but Pokecenter remains -- leaving nothing but OHKO decks immune to its power."
Not really, it loses the GOOD seadra, so, if you can't mudsplash, why use it in the first place?
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From: Hoodbridge, VA | Registered: Jun 2002
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DMTM
Member # 10
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posted November 12, 2002 03:06 PM
Just because something goes away, does not mean that it goes away for good.
Of course some will never be back...as usual for me just take the list that CPU wants and I will have made sure 90% of those never return! ![[Evil Smirk]](../tcg/graemlins/Up_to.gif)
We never seem to agree on what should be brought back do we CPU? ![[Big Grin]](../tcg/biggrin.gif)
Thats okay without stife there is no fun. If I didn't have you to argue about what should and should not be back then I don't know what I waould do! ![[Smile]](../tcg/smile.gif)
Maybe you should take the tact of saying the opposite of what you beleive and then you'll get what you want that way!
In any case don't assume that when Genesis rotates out that some of those cards won't show up. But then again don't assume they will....especially if their on CPU's list! ![[Cool]](../tcg/cool.gif)
DMTM
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Frodo_Baggins - "Like the guy said "Get out of the box""
From: Seattle, Wa, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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nick15
Member # 142
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posted November 12, 2002 03:41 PM
So Genesis leaves. Expedition will [ugh] replace it. And a new "big" set will fill the gap. Soon the "oh no!" thing of 2003/2004 will be when Expedition is rotated out. Big deal.
Or better yet, bear in mind that these "Base Set" revisions will become a standard in Pokémon from here on out. Legendary Collections was essentially a "Base Set Three". Come 2003/2004 when "Base Set 4" is released, expect to see some key Genesis cards in it. I doubt very much that Wizards R&D would keep players deprived of Cleffa and/or Elm for too long.... they did bring back Bill.
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From: Dukhovskoknabilebskohatsk, Russia | Registered: Feb 2001
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Soslowpoke
Member # 70
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posted November 12, 2002 03:51 PM
Hmmm you've all seemed to have forgotten that Wizards is working on their own set...I'm pretty sure we'll see *some* reprints in there.
I'd also put my money on a "Neo: Legends" (LC2) set.
Oh yea, I also think Revelation, SI, and Promos 21-39 will be rotated out along with Genesis and Discovery...if that ever happens
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From: Chicago | AIM: cool runnings93 | Registered: Feb 2001
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DMTM
Member # 10
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posted November 12, 2002 04:03 PM
If we went to all of the trouble to make our own set, why in the world would we put cards we have already printed in it?
DMTM
[ November 12, 2002, 04:07 PM: Message edited by: DMTM ]
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Frodo_Baggins - "Like the guy said "Get out of the box""
From: Seattle, Wa, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Golduck
Member # 523
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posted November 13, 2002 04:05 AM
Dragonite, Arcanine, Rapidash, Scizor, Machamp, Dark Persian, Venusaur... Promo evolutions are quite normal. There are of course more Basics, as in every other set.
quote:
Originally posted by Psychic_Prof:
Historically...Promos are usually basic pokemon.
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From: Norway, in front of a Mac, designing the new TE homepage | Registered: Feb 2001
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Super Psyduck
Member # 921
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posted November 13, 2002 05:20 AM
Im concerned how they are supposed to reprint them. Who knows maybee we will see a newer Lc set. When Genesis and Discovery goes out.. Well it will not be a bad traft set will it.. Lol..
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From: Norway, Nesodden :) | Registered: Feb 2001
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Magby Guru
Member
Member # 55228
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posted November 13, 2002 03:28 PM
One thing is true, Genesis and Discovery will go out. The thing is then that if we look at the new expidition set, the game will become a flipping one. Genesis is the most stable set IMO, and then when that and discovery go out we are stuck with Gatr, but mroe importantly MAGCARGO. Since Genisis will be gone kingdra decks lose their recycle energy, making that dekc lose a TON of power. So i guess we will jsut have to wait and see what happens. I also hope wizards shoot out some NON-flipping sets. ![[ROFL]](../tcg/graemlins/roflmao.gif)
-MG
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From: falls Curch VA | Registered: Dec 2001
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