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Author
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Topic: The Cure for Cancer
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Magby Guru
Member
Member # 55228
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posted June 22, 2002 10:45 AM
One thing I have noticed in the past few months of playing pokmeon at league and other tournament and sanctioned events is the attitudes of players that I have met. I read this topic about Cancer inside pokemon and it is ABSOLUTELY RIGHT! When I first read this i knew exactly what he was talking about and how right he actually was.
The main problme here is that the players who started out about 3 years ago have now become extremely good and want to KEEP that title for ever. They think that because they have supported this game for so long that they should get a break and be able to do whatever they want. They then begin to develop an attitude that is arrogant and self centered and dont want anyone else but themselves to get the glory. While their foolish little brains are thinking this they are not able to comprehend the damage being done to the game GLOBALY. Every time they say ebonics or a 1337 talk around the new comers who have no idea how good they are [why should they?] become confused with the game and lose interest because why would anone WANT to spend money and TIME to be harassed verbaly and put down every time they try to enjoy this great game? People dont realize that a JOKE to them WONT be a joke to everyone. The youngsters entering this game are looking up to the OLDER more EXPERIENCED players and expect them to be good role models and so do their parents. By acting '1337' the message delivered to little kids is catastrophic. ALways cursing, putting others down because one does not think the other is as good or EVER will be as good as him or her. IN MY MIND the NEW BLOOD IS THE ONLY BLOOD NOT INFECTED WITH THIS CANCER and is the only way to hepl this game become NEW again.
When i first started playing pokemon everyone was nice. I mean sure there were kids who were better than everyone else and would always win. I got frustrated and so did all the other kids. Back in the day when i got the crap beaten out of me in every game I would only have the little ember inside me burn greater and greater because i wanted to be the first person to become better than the person who was currently the best, and the best player tried to be come and did become better to prevent my goal and most other kids goals from being accomplished. BUT IT IS HOW THIS KID PREVENTED IT IS JOW IT MAKES HIM DIFFERENT FROM TODAYS PLAYERS. He would TEACH us new card stratagies, he would help us realize what we were dling wrong, he would NEVER get mad at us for beating him, HE ALWAYS had a smile on his face, he did not CURSE, he was a GENUINE PLAYER. The 1337 crew does NOT do the same thing now. INSTEAD the 1337 crew curses puts people down discourages new players doesnt help anyone but themselves. It is now a more SELF CENTERED ATTITUDE. I know this is true because i was becoming a '1337' person myself until I saw what I was doing and realized "how can i use this language around other people, i sound abnoxouse!". I decided right then and there that anyone who i saw using the cursing or the ebonics/1337 talk i would crack down ojn them and tell them to stop. I SUGGEST EVERYONE ELSE DOES THE SAME!
Just last week i noticed that 5 new kids had walked in the store, bought 5 new themedecks and were playing against some of my friends and other poeple who were EXTREMELY good and beat it out of the other kids every time. So when it was their turn to face me, i went got a theme deck but my haymaker away and battled them. THEY BEAT ME! they were so happy, and that was all that mattered. I gave them something to look forward to every week at league instead of just getting their butts kicked. I also helped them with their theme decks after they bought packs. I taught them new rulings like the metal on zapdos and chancey WHICH THEY PICKED UP RIGHT AWAY MIND YOU. I talked to my friends too who are extremely nice but wanted to get the promos like everyone else and didnt care who they beat to get them, and they do not use 1337 talk either, and i asked them to help out these kids every week when i wasnt there and then they realized, HEY THERE IS NEW BLOOD COMING INTO OUR LEAGUE! So they were mroe than happy to and now because of the way WE as a group acted kids decided to come to our league and we have aorund 5-7 new kids!
Now what would have happened if i cept going down the 1337 road that i was headed? Even though i was the only one at league? lets think and put this into steps...
1) Kids come to league first time playing and buy theme decks
2) Kids are happy and get ready to play firt match
3) Kids lose horrible in about 5 minutes to super decks
4) No one offers help after the games are completed
5) Kids have reapeats of their first match about 4 more times
6) Kids are extremely discouraged because they have gotten no help and have been beaten miserably
7) Kids play me and I act 1337 and curse and laugh and act like a complete jerk the entire game to them and dont offer any help
8) Kids decide why spend money to better some one else and to be treated liek dirt every week
9) we never see the kids again or if we do almost never
NOW this is NOT what happened, but this is the classic scenario for what happens to new kids who join the game now a days. ANYONE can preven this form happening! All we have to do is teach and be welcoming to the new blood and accpet them and not try to beat it out of them every time and be more ASSETRIVE as to what effect you are having on the game qand playyers playing it when ever you say somethign bad or innapropriate or do anythign inapropriate. You can be funny without being mean. Not only this but when the other kids learn form you and beocme much better players then you all will have more competitors and be abel to have better playtestoing sessions and be able to have moee discussions in detail and just better enjoy yourslef with a mroe serious crowd of players and PEOPLE.
This is hard for me to explain and my spelling is very bad. Please forgive both and I really hope you can alll understand what i am trying to say here. I really want people to understand me, thank you.
Oppinions needed.
-MG
[edited one word]-`Sensei
[ June 22, 2002, 08:36 PM: Message edited by: Magby Guru ]
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From: falls Curch VA | Registered: Dec 2001
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The Fish King
Member # 60187
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posted June 22, 2002 11:27 AM
Well said, Magby.
I agree very much. I too am one of the best players in my area and one of the biggest (if not the biggest) support of "new blood" at my League location. I have claimed the role of Professor more than any other in Utah... on helping the individual that is.
I've seen the 1337's and have worned them of their ways... I hope many see your post as well.
My $0.02 of free information.
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"In a world filled with turmoil, chaos, and Boston Baked Beans, a man has to find a way to escape the troubles of life." -The Fish King
From: In clothing | Registered: Jan 2002
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Lugia909
Member # 1997
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posted June 22, 2002 01:25 PM
(points to mG) YEAAAAH, BAYBEEEE!!!
You've really managed to nail a lot of the problem here. And thankfully, you've managed to do so from that same zone that so many of the '1337' are working from. The sad thing is that so many of them can't see it...but thankfully, you can.
Thank you for showing that the mark of a real champion is to understand those who aren't.
[ June 22, 2002, 01:26 PM: Message edited by: Lugia909 ]
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"A bowl of bridge mix, six or seven Mai-tais, and I'm in _heaven_!" -- Michael O'Donoghue
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From: Greater Metropolitan Rankin, IL, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Pokesensei
Member # 7
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posted June 22, 2002 01:46 PM
Well said Eric.Very well said.What you said proves why the Brooks` are some of the top ambassidors for the game today.You guys are true champions and I wish some of the other better players shared your viewpoint.This game would be alot farther because of it.
`Sensei
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•STS/World`s Judge
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Right..not blocked that is.At least until I`m overuled by a Gameboy again!-MT Pat smarting after being overuled by a Gameboy.
`Sensei is a madman from another dimension!-DMTM
From: Out of the Box | Registered: Feb 2001
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rebellee1187
Member # 58122
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posted June 22, 2002 01:48 PM
when i royally beat someone, i at least try to help them improve.
Well said.
I like new blood. THe league near me is dying, and we need new players.
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I am stronger than ALL the Jedi! Even you!- Darth Tyrannis
Much to learn, you still have.- Yoda
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From: The basement of the house half a block down the street from Jerry's bait shop. | Registered: Jan 2002
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Big Daddy Snorlax
Member # 11
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posted June 22, 2002 02:29 PM
After reading so many "1337" posts lately, and watching some very good players self destruct, this thread is a breath of fresh air! With players like mG leading the way, there is indeed a very bright future for Pokemon. We all have choices to make in our lives. One factor in our decision process is the role models we see around us. Thank goodness we have players like Magby Guru involved in this game to provide an alternative to the "1337" faction.
You can only be number 1 for a while, because there will always be someone coming along that will take that spot away from you. That's a fact of life. However, true success is not measured by a ranking system, and with an attitude like the one presented here, you can always be one of the best players in the game.
Thanks for giving me hope for the future mG. ![[Wink]](../tcg/wink.gif)
BDS
[ June 22, 2002, 02:32 PM: Message edited by: Big Daddy Snorlax ]
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From: Oregon | Registered: Feb 2001
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nick15
Member # 142
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posted June 22, 2002 03:13 PM
You know, never until this (can you call it?) article did I understand the whole L33t thing. I was sort of on the sidelines the past week or so, but now I really get it. ![[Smile]](../tcg/smile.gif) Good times, good article Magby.
BTW, you ought to add to the L33T steps a 10:
"10) Then we sit around and wonder why so many people stop playing."
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From: Dukhovskoknabilebskohatsk, Russia | Registered: Feb 2001
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Skywolf1
Member # 1448
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posted June 22, 2002 04:12 PM
Magby Guru:
Let me echo my sentiments of what my collegues have already posted. You are correct on ALL points, and I want you to know, that you have just gotten the respect of myself, and I am sure many others with your views on how this game SHOULD be played, and how to have a positive attitude that is most certainly paying off.
You have just "re-kindled" my interest that this game does indeed have a bright future, and for that I thank-you.
Keep up the GREAT work!
Skywolf1
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(aka Skywolf1)
Founder, Card Trainers International
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From: Las Vegas, Nevada USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Dumbledore
Member # 28029
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posted June 22, 2002 05:41 PM
Oh boy magby Guru, I wish I had a few kids(young men) like you in my league....then we would survive.
Great post!
Keep up the good work! ![[Bounce]](../tcg/graemlins/jump.gif)
/Dumbledore
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From: Sweden | Registered: Jun 2001
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Mr. Popo
Member
Member # 85457
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posted June 22, 2002 05:55 PM
Everybody is saying that the "1337" players make fun of newbies, randoms whatever you want to call them and that these new players get made fun of non-stop but that DOESN'T happen EVER at least at my league. I don't know about your guys leagues but it doesn't happen at York.
Everyone also says that us players with experience should teach new players to play better but its not our responsibility, thats what the Gym Leaders are for IMO. If the Gym Leader explains the rules then the new comer should play someone that the Gym Leader knows will explain cards and help him/her through the game. Only play free games with people the Gym Leader suggests them to play against then once there used to the game, and rules they can play in a Tournament but not until there comfortable with game play. Once their playing in a tournament have the Gym Leader tell the "Newbie's" opponents to play slower than usual and explain what each card does.
![[Devilish]](../tcg/graemlins/diablo.gif)
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From: N.E.O. 20 Minutes from York | Registered: May 2002
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SD_PokeMom
Member # 97
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posted June 22, 2002 06:39 PM
Nicely said, Eric...thank you!
'Mom
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Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Feb 2001
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LizardOTC
Member # 124
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posted June 22, 2002 06:58 PM
 
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"No! Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try." -Yoda
"Sewage Portrayed As Meat...It's not just for breakfast anymore!" -LizardOTC
"Like a bad tooth and an unsteady foot is confidence in a faithless man in time of trouble." - Proverbs 25:19
From: The Vast Midwestern Waste | Registered: Feb 2001
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Feraligatr14
Member # 31508
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posted June 22, 2002 07:07 PM
Magby Guru very well said and you captured one of the biggest problems within the game. I have to believe there are more players like you than the arrogant ones that don't realize there is more to the game than winning. Each one of us are an ambassador of the game and how we treat fellow players (especially new ones) is how the game is perceived (rightly or wrongly). I spent an hour today after our season ending tournament helping two players modify their deck in preparation for the Raleigh Gym Challenge. I also gave them some cards for this modification. I only say this because as you mentioned this is what keeps the current players and brings in more (word of mouth).
I think this "Cancer" has been growing for some
time but I am optimistic that things will change with people like yourself. You make a very good point that if you don't help others to become better how can you get better yourself??? This requires us to stretch and I don't think these 1337 players understand that. Eventually it will "click" or they will be left by the side of the road as this game evolves.
Thanks for the chuckle on your post about "ebonics". I realize it wasn't funny but it was exactly the same thing I said to 2 players at ay our league doing the same thing.
Good post and hopefully some of these players will eventually see "The Big Picture".
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From: Raleigh, NC, US | Registered: Jul 2001
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Otaku
Member # 42359
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posted June 22, 2002 07:43 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Popo:
Everybody is saying that the "1337" players make fun of newbies, randoms whatever you want to call them and that these new players get made fun of non-stop but that DOESN'T happen EVER at least at my league. I don't know about your guys leagues but it doesn't happen at York.
Everyone also says that us players with experience should teach new players to play better but its not our responsibility, thats what the Gym Leaders are for IMO. If the Gym Leader explains the rules then the new comer should play someone that the Gym Leader knows will explain cards and help him/her through the game. Only play free games with people the Gym Leader suggests them to play against then once there used to the game, and rules they can play in a Tournament but not until there comfortable with game play. Once their playing in a tournament have the Gym Leader tell the "Newbie's" opponents to play slower than usual and explain what each card does.
Mr. Popo: Actually, if you go to the Professor Forum, you can read the post that I believe helped kick all this off... and it was started by the GL(s) of York!
Oh, and Kami is looking for you.
Magby Guru: Excellent. You have made me see the light. As a Gl, I should probably go ahead and grab a Starter to play the new people. No only is that giving them a better chance, but if they have the same starter as me, then I can show them how to play it better. You are a good example of how to behave. Oh, and I have tried playing them with my own decks, even MMF vs. their standard and some still lose so I again thank you for helping me see what to do.
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From: Iowa | Registered: Sep 2001
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Baboon
Member # 16933
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posted June 22, 2002 08:01 PM
(Attention...my post DOES go off topic, but keep reading. It comes back to make a good point )
This is a VERY good topic. When I first began attending our crumbling League last August, I wasn't bad by ANY means! I had the usual Clefable deck, or something else, but once I lost, and since I was the new guy, they treated me like scum! I couldn't take it any more! Even though I wasn't exactly new to the game, people's attitudes DEFINITELY affect your decision to stay with the game. Regardless of the hostile atmosphere, I continued attending league (for the free cards ), every Saturday, up until today! Now, those evil morons that tormented me are now my friends!
If only people wouldn't be sarcastic, and not think they're better than everyone else! The world would be so perfect! (Not really, but close enough.) This not only is an issue involving the Pokemon TCG, but also a life lesson. For the past couple years, my life has been not-so-good. Every day when I walked into school, all of the popular people would make fun of me, and some others. All of the cool people would find something to make fun of. Regardless of my intelligence, or any other nice trait I have, I was the lone guy to be made fun of. This is EXACTLY how the new player feels when he gets the snot beaten out of him!
I might be better than MANY other people in different areas, but I NEVER try to make other people feel bad for not being as skilled. I know it hurts ME when I get barraged all day at school by these inconsiderate people. Due to all of this, I now have the personality of "I can't do it, I'm not good enough." What people say to you really DOES have an effect on their actions! So, if you go and tell somebody that they are horrible, sooner or later, after more insults, they'll believe it! I NEVER played a game and told
people that they were bad. Even when I play against little kids, and I beat them, I still shake their hand, and say "Good game". That's a standard action that I do with EVERYBODY! If only other people would adapt this technique...
I try to make everybody feel welcome with my articles at pokeschool. Even the newcoming players that don't know much about the game! I'm doing my part to get new players into the game. I don't try to insult anyone, even the worst of players. I know it really hurts me when others take superficial characteristics, such as nice gameplay, or physical appearance, and treat you like an animal because of them.
[venting done]
Sorry if I got off topic, but I know that this post will mean something to some of you.
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From: Pennsylvania | Registered: Apr 2001
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Michel
Member # 286
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posted June 23, 2002 04:02 PM
Sensei is right ... Brooks are not only excellent players, but they have a wonderful mentality. Just like Sensei said, they're what I call 'true champions'.
I was wondering why Sneasel was so quiet in that box. Now I'm sure it's because he loves the people who are there with him. ![[ROFL]](../tcg/graemlins/roflmao.gif)
Really nice post MG. All of us would sit and take the time to think after the reading of your post !
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From: Brussels - Belgium | Registered: Feb 2001
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lurili
Member # 87
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posted June 23, 2002 06:31 PM
You have described the attitude of an effective Gym Leader. The "cure" is one which has been in effect at my League since it's beginning. It is the great puzzle of everyone why I never wiped the floor at my League with InSaNiTy back in the day. It is for the virtue of knowing that the future of the game was held within the people I taught, the people I gave away cards to, the kid who won his first match with that Nidoking he traded for. It is a simple logic of etiquette and a sense of schooling which can drive this game forward. This is the original philosophy The PokeGym ran on. The "leet" would help around and introduce ground breaking ideas which inspire the new peeps to strive to a level which IS attainable. That is the region lost to the cancer and is what must be destroyed and rebuilt.
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lurili:
The original InSaNe player.
Proud leader of tNsn
The Pokemon Ruins
InSaNiTy leads to Chaos.
InSaNiTy X: Record - 48,890-1098
From: SoFla Style (Miami!!!) | Sanity: None | Mind: Fried | Registered: Feb 2001
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Strike
Member # 201
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posted June 23, 2002 07:07 PM
Here's what I wonder... When did the old philosphies of the pokegym became a forgotten past? When the pokegym moved to the wizards site(don't really beleive so).
I tend not to bring my best and most evil decks to my league, I consider my league to be the testing grounds for deck ideas that do seem viable enough for real life playing. Personally I think that's what league should be for, a testing ground for new and old kinds of decks, not a killing field(wish I had a more appropiate term for this). Trust me I have seen this hapen before at some leagues I went to and I saw exactly what MG was talking about, it really does sicken me.
This is truly one of the biggest problems with the game, but it is not a new thing to most games. However one of the biggest reasons for this is fear of having competition arise in an area where they are in control. I really wanted to see new competition arise, but these days there isn't that much and this is really the reaosn why.
However we don't have have all the time in the world to fix this problem, or else there will be practically no new competition and nothing to look forward to for this game in for a uncertain future.
Lurili- I agree with you on almost everything you made a point about. The original pokegym philosiphy is one I would really like to see arise agian.
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From: San Diego, Ca, Usa | Registered: Feb 2001
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GreatFox
Member # 77642
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posted June 24, 2002 01:54 AM
Thank you Magby Guru!!!
You are trully one of the players that leetest should follow as a rolemodel. Our problem has never been with really good players but with those that demonstrate the leetest behavior and give exceptionaly good trainers like yourself a bad name.
If more trainers were like you would would probably never had seen posts like these pop up in WizPoG.
Thank you, you are trully a player that any GL or TO would love to see attend thier League or Tourny.
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From: Los Angeles, California | Registered: Apr 2002
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lance313
Member # 1891
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posted June 24, 2002 11:36 PM
mG- I think you have just earned permanent 'get out of the box free' cards for the Brooks' clan! Exactly the points that people have been trying to make in less than the exacting terms you have stated.
Mr. Popo- quote:
Everybody is saying that the "1337" players make fun of newbies, randoms whatever you want to call them and that these new players get made fun of non-stop but that DOESN'T happen EVER at least at my league. I don't know about your guys leagues but it doesn't happen at York.
We are not meaning to say that all 1337 players do that, but enough of the vocal ones do to taint the views on the rest.
quote:
Everyone also says that us players with experience should teach new players to play better but its not our responsibility, thats what the Gym Leaders are for IMO. If the Gym Leader explains the rules then the new comer should play someone that the Gym Leader knows will explain cards and help him/her through the game. Only play free games with people the Gym Leader suggests them to play against then once there used to the game, and rules they can play in a Tournament but not until there comfortable with game play. Once their playing in a tournament have the Gym Leader tell the "Newbie's" opponents to play slower than usual and explain what each card does.
Hmmm... So when the good players you play with move on, and all you are left with are 'n00bs' what kind of challenge will you have then? Or will you take pride of beating people who present no challenge, just so you can proclaim you are 'the best'? How hollow that would be, and how sad. Is it not better to teach players to be better, thereby keeping you challenged and making you better in the process?
[ June 24, 2002, 11:39 PM: Message edited by: lance313 ]
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Proud member/founder of Team PokéParents - we play Pokémon with our kids!
From: Vista, near San Diego, Home of 2001 WCSTS, 2002 West Stadium and 2003 SuperBowl | Registered: Feb 2001
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Lacy
Member # 43928
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posted June 25, 2002 09:06 AM
Even though my actual experience with rude players has been limited, I have to say I totally agree.
It's very important to help the newer players, not only for the game to grow, but for them to eventually become more skilled at the game. This seems to be something some players fail to realize.
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From: Atlanta, GA | Registered: Sep 2001
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Espeon407
Member
Member # 26233
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posted June 25, 2002 09:31 AM
Reminds me of me when I was a n00b....
(The following is a tale of a n00b becoming a pro, who never developed the 'Cancer.' It may be a little off subject, but it's sortof a tale related to the subject.)
When PKMN debuted, I was the only kid at school who didn't have some Pokemon cards. One gave me his Charmander, and I treasured it like a million dollars. Then, I got a theme deck. Then, booster packs. Then, a binder fulla cards.
Before ya know it, I'm the best PKMN player in the entire school (even w/out a Base Charizard).
Then, I moved, and the older players crushed me with their Haymakers/ Venomoth decks/ etc., etc.
So, I wanted to beat them in a game. After all, I was the best before, right?
Eventually made it to the semi-finals of my state's first tourney (lost to a Chansey/Alakazam deck), and was once again the best at my League.
Did I take pride in it, and seek out to crush everyone who came before me? Of course not. I was a "Prof. Oak" there (second only to the Gym Leader), and helped all n00bs who asked for help.
Then the League was shut down there, and I landed here.
(FYI: I only got 12 questions correct on Wizards' Prof. test, so I'm not really that much of a pro., really.)
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Second to post in "You Make The Card." w00t.
From: Somewhere in the USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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kakkaroto7
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Member # 2439
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posted June 25, 2002 09:58 AM
Lance313 said: Hmmm... So when the good players you play with move on, and all you are left with are 'n00bs' what kind of challenge will you have then? Or will you take pride of beating people who present no challenge, just so you can proclaim you are 'the best'? How hollow that would be, and how sad. Is it not better to teach players to be better, thereby keeping you challenged and making you better in the process?
Isn't this what is happening at our current GC events and has been a case since atleast LAST YEAR's QT events? I remember beating bad decks/players (a term that also means "randoms") one after another easily. The only competition is one or two people from that state (for each GC/QT type event I went to), but usually only competition from out-of-state players. This has been a problem for a very long time, one which we need to correct, or the one or two good players in an event will always beat everyone for the trip (although the best players do all play good players at worlds, because it is invite only). I'm really getting tired of playing against 12 year olds playing with a "Turbo Shining Deck" or such EVERY tournament, then losing to one of the good players. Not having good players play against you makes your skill drop, because you don't usually care what happens as long as your opponent isn't your own age, and you forget. I think I'll be helping many a player in utah, hopefully. I have to find SOME use for my "worthless" more than 4 of Computer Search, Oak, Gatr, wrath, etc. Maybe next year there will be competition (before I turn 15 and die etc.)
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"Nothing good can ever come from staying with normal people."
TurboLand 4L
From: Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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