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Author
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Topic: Comments on Professor Draft
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Charwolf
Member # 40
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posted March 17, 2002 05:58 PM
First and foremost, it was a blast. Do it again in a heartbeat. However, I think there is a couple things WOTC can do next time to put even more skill into the mix. Comments welcome, I'm just posting my thoughts.
I think this is what was originally intended, but it bears saying- we should have played swiss rounds within our own pods. Two reasons- the one luck factor I can think of that happened when everyone paired up swiss is that deck weaknesses were thrown wide open. I'll put my matches up as an example.
I was playing Fire/Fighting, and had a decent deck. (Not too good, but still...)
Round 1- Water/Grass (Loss)
Round 2- Water/Fighting (Loss)
Round 3- Water/Grass (Again! Loss)
Round 4- Grass/Psychic (Loss, but closer)
Round 5- Grass/? (Close win. Thanks to Group Therapy!)
Now, those were really poor matchups. One, maybe 2 I can understand, but going against some form of weakness during the entire tournament tends to not require skill to win....
The second thing is that playing this way means -counter drafting actually means something-. In the way we played at the Stadium, everyone just took the cards that went with their deck because they didn't have a large chance of playing the other people they drafted with.
The way I think it was supposed to originally go (in pod, Top 8, Redraft) was the best way. I don't know what happened as far as that goes for the tournament changing. Perhaps one of the MTs would enlighten (Or in DMTM's case, endarken, lol) this case?
Anyways, what do you think?
It was a blast either way.
Charwolf
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Just call me Prof. Char ;)
Charizard is the coolest!
I'm going to Origins, the East Stadium Challenge and the Central Stadium Challenge!! Awright!
Proud Member of the Firefighters
Never Surrender!
From: Sutton MA US | Registered: Feb 2001
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Professor_Sanochu
Member # 70005
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posted March 17, 2002 07:51 PM
I also agree it was the best going 3 and 2 having a chance at the top 8 but coming in 12th from op match win % was a bummer. I would have had fun playing agianst my drafting pod scince my first match win was from some one in it I would have had a chance at making top eight maybe. Well it was the best I ever did in a large tournament. and the seven draw in rock paper scissors for misty;s duel was great. MTM DMTM Wizards.. everyone it was a blast. I was wondering if you can set up another one at the Gym challenge in PA for a trip. ![[Smile]](../tcg/smile.gif) It would be fun and it would save me the time of coaxing my family to take a trip to seattle this august because after helping judge in the main tournament till lunch and hanging out with all the MT's was a great fun. I was rather exited. I hopefully will be a master proff by August and we will see what happens from there.
And all that competed save your draft decks if you have them intact. I wanna start a topic on what decks you made and why you made them. Well back to physics paper.
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I once traveled the ravaged land of Pokemon you now travel. I have mastered that land and now I stand a teacher, a Professor of Pokemon. But Always will I be a Master.
From: Millstone NJ | Registered: Mar 2002
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SNESWhiz
Member # 225
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posted March 17, 2002 08:09 PM
Are you saying that pods were cross-paired? The DCI rules specifically prohibit that.
Excerpt of DCI UTR Rule 71:
quote:
Players within a pod may only play against other players within that pod.
There's even a thread on the DCI Judge mailing list that shows why it's not a good idea. See http://oracle.wizards.com/scripts/wa.exe?A1=ind0109a&L=dcijudge-l . Most people felt that cross-pairing was bad, though a few did think it was OK.
BTW, the DCI Judge mailing list is a good resource for judging information. Unfortunately, there's a whole lot of Magic stuff mixed in with it. Also, you can't subscribe to the list unless you're a DCI certified Magic judge, though you can read it at http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/dcijudge-l.html .
On the other hand, if I'm misinterpreting your message, just ignore this message ![[Big Grin]](../tcg/biggrin.gif)
Quotes from DCI Judge list:
quote:
Hopefully not. Cross-pairing the pods is a horrible, horrible idea. It
makes a farce out of drafting, because players with different card pools are
forced to cope with an entire card mix that they could neither access nor
influence. One pod will, without fail, completely work over the other pod,
if crossed... merely because the card mix tilts slightly more powerfully for
one.
quote:
I appreciate your opinions on this subject Judah, though I respectfully
disagree with several of your points. I feel my job as a judge and the job
of the DCI is to facilitate a fair and level playing field. Cross-pairing
is never a level playing field. I agree that pods of 12-15 players are not
optimal, but there IS player interaction in terms of the draft of cards,
all be it much less than an 8 player pod. Even at this slight level, it is
a qualitative jump from the absolute void of player interaction in separate
pods.
[ March 17, 2002, 08:17 PM: Message edited by: SNESWhiz ]
From: Chesapeake, VA, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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yoshi1001
Member # 825
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posted March 17, 2002 08:15 PM
Yes, SNESWhiz, but to paraphrase what I told MTM at GenCon, "Guess who decides DCI policy?" Maybe it was a bad idea. It's unlikely that any pod would have a big advantage, but at least a few rounds should be played at the start within the pod.
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AIM: yoshi1001
From: Janesville, Wisconsin | Registered: Feb 2001
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EeveeTrainer
Member # 697
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posted March 17, 2002 08:20 PM
I personally agree with Charwolf. We should have drafted and played within our own pods. Because the point of Rochester Drafting is that you know what the others are pulling and thus counter drafting becomes very clausable and very important. It's much less important when you play outside your pod because no one else is really going to try and counter anyone if they have only a small chance of playing against them. Thus the skill factor isn't quite as prominent. It goes alot back onto the luck thing. Luck of the pack and of the draw too. But all things aside it was alot of fun and I would most definately do it again. I enjoyed working alongside the master trainers and Judging in the Booster Drafts that ran throughout the day. Although I'm not all that wild about that STUPID Misty's Rare Goldeen that I was forced to draft!!!! ::regains lost composure:: Sorry about that. Anyway. I'm hoping to hop down to Origins for any Professor events that maybe shooting around down there. Not to mention maybe getting a few more Eevee's signed by more of the Staff. Even though MTM added the glasses and beard to it.
-Saturn Knight
From: Maple Shade/NJ/USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Professor_Sanochu
Member # 70005
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posted March 17, 2002 09:03 PM
Yes we did cross pods only to cut down on time. I found that out alittle into the draft so I stoped drafting grass mid-way and startig drafting in planing and switched to water psychic. Sab's abra and kadabra all the way! not to mention ESP misty's psyduck and misty's poilwag woth bubbles. Well it still was fun but pods would have been better. Thats why I think there should be another draft at the gym challenges on for trips. No prizes we all pay 10 and we all draft and stay in pods. Justing giving me and others another chance to travel to Seattle!
Did I mention MTM was great in letting us help and DMTM was also great for helping too. Oh well back to convincing my family seattle is a good vaction spot in august.
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I once traveled the ravaged land of Pokemon you now travel. I have mastered that land and now I stand a teacher, a Professor of Pokemon. But Always will I be a Master.
From: Millstone NJ | Registered: Mar 2002
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FireFighter09
Member # 3040
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posted March 17, 2002 09:12 PM
I could of been better playing against everyone in my pod because i knew what everyone had but the MT'S felt randomizing it was better. I dident like it randomized. I wanted to face off in my own pod. MT'S for the chicago SC please if you can use the rules of drafting and let the people who draft in the pods play in that pod against eachother As for the draft myself i was 18th. I fell good but i wish i could of done better. If i can make it to chicagos SC ill try harder. Ill admit the draft was very hard and i larned first hand nomatter what stradegy you go in with the chance of pulling out top 8 is VERRRRRYYYYY HARRRRRRDDDD!!!!!!! In chicago i know ill be there so i know ill work harder to do better and this time i know what to use and how to plan. Erika's jiggly was screwed by brocks diglett and erika's bellsprout was hit and killed by it too so i know next time i gotta play 50 HP pokemon and not alot of colorlus. Ohh well. POP: For all of us it was a bit weird but i gotta say you were right in knowng the MT'S wanted to randomize us after drafting as to make it just a little bit harder and more challenging.
One thing i was shocked at was a girl who pulled off a broks ninetails/vulpix and a bailes ninetals/vulpix dropped out after round 4. ![[Eek!]](../tcg/eek.gif)
Another shock was the end for chartwolf. He is such a great player and a great drafter but when he ended rochester i was like ![[Dubious]](../tcg/graemlins/dubious.gif) ,this is odd.
I have an autographed dark gengar by all the MT's there,pokepop,senseo,purity,ech,tom hanley and charwolf. Thanks MTM for writing hair and glasses on my dark gengar!! ![[Crowd]](../tcg/graemlins/invasion.gif)
[ March 18, 2002, 06:03 AM: Message edited by: FireFighter09 ]
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"No Surrender"
Motto of the FireFighters.
First Master Professor From New York and Pnnsylvania!
Top this record:
ECSTS 2000
ECSTS 2001
Milford Gym Challenge 2001
WCSTS 2001
ECSC
CSC
Milford Gym Challenge 2002
WCSC
Origins 2002
Wolrds
GenCon
Coming soon:
Origins 2003
Gencon hopefully
Need someoen to share room cost with at gencon. if you can help email me at [email protected] ^_^
From: Pittsburgh,pa 15212 | Registered: Mar 2001
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PokePop
Member # 8
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posted March 17, 2002 10:03 PM
I have to agree that the cross-pairing threw me for a loop. It certainly defeated part of the reason for Rochester: knowing what your opponent is cooking up and preparing for it or counter drafting.
Still, it was great fun and I think we all need to get a few of these under our belts to get good at it.
"Wowwwww! What? I'm not talking about the cards, I'm just excited about the event" - DMTM as two Erika's Dratini are laid out on the table from a pair of packs.
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"This kind of makes you miss the compendium..." - Martin Moreno
The Compendium: http://pkcompendium.hypermart.net
Registered: Feb 2001
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Professor_Sanochu
Member # 70005
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posted March 17, 2002 10:39 PM
Well everyone is adding in their on DMTM quote i need mine. I briefly overhead him saying. "I went to the Dunkin Dounuts and when I asked they said what a Maple Bar?"-DMTM in between matches at Prof Draft. I found that funny. If only I could be a MT.
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I once traveled the ravaged land of Pokemon you now travel. I have mastered that land and now I stand a teacher, a Professor of Pokemon. But Always will I be a Master.
From: Millstone NJ | Registered: Mar 2002
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snarglefarger
Member # 59465
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posted March 18, 2002 03:10 PM
I totally agree with you Charwolf, it should of been in the pods. My pod didn't get the best pokes, not like the other people I saw with R. Mewtwos (okay it was just one), Misty's Dewgongs, and whatnot. My Starmie couldn't stay alive long enough. Also I kinda defeated the purpose of counter drafting cuz you probably wouldn't face the same people from your pod anyway. BTW Charwolf, were you the one that said facing you was like an automatic win? I think I was your second match... Anyway I still had fun, but it just took a long time to draft.
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Don't listen to me cuz I'M JUST ANOTHER RANDOM!!!!!!!
From: Connecticut/New Jersey, nj on weekends and the summer | Registered: Jan 2002
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ScoundrelNY
Member # 56269
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posted March 18, 2002 04:36 PM
Well it was easy for me to remember Charwolf.
I was the one he beat at the end.
(I had no energy and could only play that stupid dive bomb).
That was a good game though.
But man you should have seen my face when you came back for the win. ![[Dropjaw]](../tcg/graemlins/dropjaw.gif)
Anyway I was glad it was randomized. I still counter drafted some of the folks in my pod. (Sorry Derek Bearzy wherever you are). But heck it was my first time playing any form of draft much less Rochester it was a good experience and would prefer it that way all the time.
ScoundrelNY
From: Yonkers, NY | Registered: Jan 2002
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Charwolf
Member # 40
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posted March 18, 2002 04:52 PM
Group Therapy! WOOT! I was all random when I said "^_^ I get to win with my favorite pokemon! ^_^" That was rather rude of me- sorry about that...
I wasn't the one who said I was an auto-win. I said that if I got the bye for losing so much, it would probably play Grass/Water and beat me anyways lol
DMTM Quote for our table-
Allen opens last packs of draft, lays out 6 premium draft cards
DMTM Glances over....
"Oh, wow....."laughs hysterically?
That was SOO funny
That and when he said "Draft the Transparent Walls!" lol
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Just call me Prof. Char ;)
Charizard is the coolest!
I'm going to Origins, the East Stadium Challenge and the Central Stadium Challenge!! Awright!
Proud Member of the Firefighters
Never Surrender!
From: Sutton MA US | Registered: Feb 2001
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Rocket's Sandshrew
Member # 56166
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posted March 18, 2002 07:48 PM
Wow...sounds like a lot of fun. I can't wait for the professor events at colombus on saturday...
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What? They banned slowking?
Good Job. :)
From: Dancing on NG Gatr's Grave... | Registered: Jan 2002
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Big_Pappa_Poke
Member # 3495
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posted March 19, 2002 12:31 AM
Sorry to break it to you, there is no professor event at Columbus, just a 15+ modifies side tourney.
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** The preceding message was brought to you by the nEw WeEzInG oDoR **
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Winner - Skyridge SBZ Dayton 15+
Never give up. Never surrender.
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From: Portsmouth, OH, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Johnny Blaze
Member # 234
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posted March 19, 2002 05:19 AM
quote:
I also agree it was the best going 3 and 2 having a chance at the top 8 but coming in 12th from op match win % was a bummer.
I also was 3-2 at the end but didnt make the final cut. I ended up in 11th winning 24 Booster packs of NEO Destiny. Not too shabby.
One of my 2 losses that didnt get me in came down to a coin flip of course! It was against Frank Moore and his Giovanni's Gyrados and my Brock's Graveler. If I would have flipped heads I would of damaged his Misty's Poliwag on the bench to knock it out. Of course I flip tails and then his Gyrados attacks for the win.
Who ended up winnning? We left after the prizes were given out. I was a little disappointed that we didnt play in our own pods but it was a great event none the less.
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Johnny Blaze at the 2000 ECSTS
MTM vs. Johnny Blaze at the MBI2
From: Clifton Park, N.Y. | Registered: Feb 2001
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timsmith
Member # 29365
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posted March 19, 2002 05:38 AM
Frank Moore drafted G. Gyrados too? That's interesting.
The draft was mad fun but mad long. I don't think I would of done better if we stayed in the pod. Though maybe I would make some many stupid mistakes...
*slaps himself*
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I love you all.
IM: darklian
Almost always open for a battle.
From: Connecticut | Registered: Jun 2001
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gengrr
Member # 9755
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posted March 19, 2002 09:25 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Johnny Blaze:
Who ended up winnning? We left after the prizes were given out. I was a little disappointed that we didnt play in our own pods but it was a great event none the less.
This guy named Greg Sauk. According to PokemonZeo, he was one of 3 to take and pass the Prof. Test that day. Two people from our pod made top 8, me (4-1, I was across the table on the left side from you) and Patrick (5-0, he was on your side of the table left side). That was a lot of fun, and I hope I can make it to Central Stadium.
![[Evil Smirk]](../tcg/graemlins/Up_to.gif)
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ORANGE RULES!!!!
5th Place in Rochester Draft at NJ Stadium Challenge
Top 25 Global Limited Pokemon
From: Middleburg,FL,USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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FireFighter09
Member # 3040
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posted March 19, 2002 09:28 AM
I think the winner name was greg sought but i may of messed up the last name. John,you gotta rememebr to say bye to us before you go. Its been tradition withn yoru crew to get going without saying good bye and we never know whne you left. Good going on 11th. I will be in chicagof ro teh next event.
i learned very easily fire/grass with sabrina's mr.mime can easily run over a draft
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"No Surrender"
Motto of the FireFighters.
First Master Professor From New York and Pnnsylvania!
Top this record:
ECSTS 2000
ECSTS 2001
Milford Gym Challenge 2001
WCSTS 2001
ECSC
CSC
Milford Gym Challenge 2002
WCSC
Origins 2002
Wolrds
GenCon
Coming soon:
Origins 2003
Gencon hopefully
Need someoen to share room cost with at gencon. if you can help email me at [email protected] ^_^
From: Pittsburgh,pa 15212 | Registered: Mar 2001
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general surge
Member # 584
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posted March 19, 2002 11:39 AM
my pod definately got screwed by the random pairings. we had experienced drafters and were doing some good counter drafting. had we known the pairings would be random we probably wouldn't have done that. oh well.
Prof Sanochu: i was the one talking to him when he said that(unless he said that to someone else too).
my DMTM quote:
"Oh my god! That is a.. um.. nice sabrina's gastly. And I'm only saying that because it evolves to Gengar." as we laid out some packs with some REALLY good cards in them.
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General Surge aka the Amazing Tails Flipper
aim: generalsurge
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Random Loser:God I hope not ...talk about lack of self esteem"
"Me: Hey Mike are you ready for the Stadium Challenge in Secaucus?
Mike: Whoaaa! It's in Secaucus?! I thought it was in New Jersey!"
From: West Haven,Ct USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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LuMaga1
Member # 1870
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posted March 19, 2002 01:13 PM
For the most part, I have the same feelings as most of the other players about playing within our pods. I'd say more, but there is nothing more I can say about it except that it was a blast and I can't wait for the next one!
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Sugar Ray
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From: New York | Registered: Feb 2001
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Professor_Sanochu
Member # 70005
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posted March 19, 2002 02:43 PM
Well I think we all miss th draft and want more to happen. If only it was possible for Gym Challenge TO's to hold these events for trips too.
Well maybe if we look in to flight costs and holtel rooms we can get a bunch of profs to register for drafts at certian challenges and we all pay part of the cost as entree fee. Well just an idea.
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I once traveled the ravaged land of Pokemon you now travel. I have mastered that land and now I stand a teacher, a Professor of Pokemon. But Always will I be a Master.
From: Millstone NJ | Registered: Mar 2002
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Alaka-Deka
Member # 2032
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posted March 20, 2002 01:44 PM
I was in that pod with you GSurge, and PokePop. We also had Dave Brooks and I'm not sure about the other kid's name across from PokePop. We had a good draft, and certainly had some good packs. Well, as best as you're going to get in a draft. But the opening of the pods definitely threw everyone for a loop.
The idea of the pods is to balance the cards as best you can for the game, to take away from the 'pre-con' and move it to an 'on-the-feet' game, stretching the imagination of the players. Sure, someone in the pod will draft the Rocket's Mewtwo, Erika's Vileplume, the clefairy's, and others (in Gym Drafts) but there are other combinations that are absolutely amazing. In a pod you have to watch the draft. You're supposed to. And crossing the pods takes that part of it away. Now you have decks that weren't developed together playing each other. You'll find more than one deck that is nearly identical, instead of 8 players with 8 decks the way you get in a pod draft.
Now all that aside, MTM and DMTM made the choice, most likely, for time. Redrafting and playing out the pods would have taken longer, and they were tired, and it had already been a full day. No foul on their part. This was after all, the first professor draft. Only two judges for 6 pods and about 20 games. It's a rough way to play. But it was fun!
I drafted decent, left my energy a bit low, and didn't do well, 1-4. But I had a great time, from playing those games, to being the that wacky draft pod LOL. Sheesh, if it wasn't DMTM's comments, it was PokePop's, or PokiDad's. And with MTM and DMTM calling the draft for two different sets of table numbers, DMTM had to do his best to ignore MTM's calls LOL, it was a riot.
![[Bounce]](../tcg/graemlins/jump.gif)
Would I do it again? IN A HEARTBEAT. Maybe even in Chicago, or some as-yet-to-be-disclosed site...
~Deka
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While force is often prefered, the strongest weapon is still intelligence.
From: Boston, MA / San Antonio, TX, US | Registered: Feb 2001
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DMTM
Member # 10
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posted March 20, 2002 02:58 PM
I always do my best to ignore him, but it never seems to be enough. ![[Wink]](../tcg/wink.gif)
I think it is safe to say that given a perfect set of circumstances it would be best to play in your pod and re-draft. However time was not on our side this time.
We did what was best given the circumstances.
I must say that I was very impressed with your ability to pick up Rochester so quickly. How it works that is.
It was a genuine pleasure for me. Thanks to all of you who helped me remember where I was when calling out the draft. You know who you are.
And for those of you who actually drafted Transparent Walls...well I'm sorry.
DMTM
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Frodo_Baggins - "Like the guy said "Get out of the box""
From: Seattle, Wa, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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PokePop
Member # 8
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posted March 20, 2002 03:09 PM
And one great big "Huzzah!" to the MTs for doing a great job running their first big event without the services of DSL. The events could not have gone smoother (also due to the various Profs. stepping up to help out).
Now, if only I had gone with Misty like I did at the MBI1...
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"This kind of makes you miss the compendium..." - Martin Moreno
The Compendium: http://pkcompendium.hypermart.net
Registered: Feb 2001
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Big Daddy Snorlax
Member # 11
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posted March 20, 2002 03:21 PM
I've seen a number of posts concerning specific parts of the Event, but what I haven't seen is any kind of count of participants. How many Trainers played in each of the main tournaments? How many Professors player in the Professor Draft? How many people admitted that Maple Bars are in fact Donuts? ![[NoNoNo]](../tcg/graemlins/nonono.gif)
BDS
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From: Oregon | Registered: Feb 2001
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