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Author
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Topic: Converting Engery...
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Porygone3
Member
Member # 73689
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posted July 05, 2003 05:08 AM
Long ago a rather odd rulling appered about Porygon2 (Engery Convet) Being that Porygon is one of my six fav pokemon (Diglett, Dugtrio, Ditto, Porygon, Porygon2, SoLrock) it grabed my attention. The rulling was in essance something like this (from memory) "When you convert engery with Porygon2, the basic engery card becomes an engery card that provides that type of engery, but for game play it is still the orginal engery card."
What does all that meen? Simpley that Ho-Oh could not do Rainbow Burn for 110. (You would convert a basic engery into a Dark engery card to add 10, and convert one into Mettal to add 10 again, this rulling made doing this impossible.)
What else did this change? Well: basicly the usefullness of Porygon2 suffered, only multi-colored decks that dont care about extra effect could use it. But... I saw a flaw...
What happened to the basic engery when you converted it? It was still "there" Sure your water engery card now provided fire engery, but where was that watter engery? If you had a Crystal Engery on it; the watter engery was there again as the Crystal engery "Checks" for the basic engery attached: and you've got a watter attached. Therefor: Your Crystal engery is Watter and your Converted Watter is Fire. (Lost yet?)
Wait a sec though, if thats true... what happens when say.. you've got a Megunum out that makes all grass engery count as two... Humm...
You convert your watter into grass. Now Megunum "sees" that grass and wild grouths it into 2 nice grass for you.. Easy... but hey, lets not forget that watter is still there.. so wait... lets have some fun, why not have a Grass engery in the first place... and just convert it to grass... then... uhh oh...
Well it goes on and on from there, my wonderfull floating engery rulling. What is my stragity or question? well; was this ever clarfyed?
Because... as far as I know...
I've still got floating engery.
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Erica total 24, thats right, 24.
Dunsprace total 41.
I've gotten 98 on that Machoke at work game. I beat Driving Corasola.
I almost beat the record in Hold Down hip hop. I got 2000 or so in Kinglers day. I got 7 in Rapadash's dash. Butterfree's Flower Power 4700. 123 In Jumping Dodoro. My all foil deck is finished.
"I've got floating engery."
"I've got counter productive Powers."
"One heart can make a diferance."
"Rock the world baby, rock the world."
"Roll out!!"
From: USA | Registered: Mar 2002
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Big_Pappa_Poke
Member # 3495
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posted July 05, 2003 07:00 AM
You are right about Crystal energy. Crystal checks the basic energy CARDS attached. So if you have a water and a Crystal attached and you convert the water to fire, the Crystal will still provide water. But it can NOT provide fire.
Sorry, but you are wrong about Meganium. Meganium makes "basic (G) energy cards" provide two grass energy. If you convert a water energy to provide grass, it is still a water energy card, so it will not become two grass energy, just one.
So it doesn't look like that energy is floating so high. Sorry.
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From: Portsmouth, OH, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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WizPoG_Pop
Member # 113762
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posted July 05, 2003 07:25 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Big_Pappa_Poke:
You are right about Crystal energy. Crystal checks the basic energy CARDS attached. So if you have a water and a Crystal attached and you convert the water to fire, the Crystal will still provide water. But it can NOT provide fire.
Sorry, but you are wrong about Meganium. Meganium makes "basic (G) energy cards" provide two grass energy. If you convert a water energy to provide grass, it is still a water energy card, so it will not become two grass energy, just one.
So it doesn't look like that energy is floating so high. Sorry.
Remove the basic and change the phrasing to:
quote:
Meganium makes "(G) energy cards" provide two grass energy.
With this wording, it doesn't work as Porygon3 says.
If it had the "basic" in there, it actually would work as Porygon3 says!
Registered: Nov 2002
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Big_Pappa_Poke
Member # 3495
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posted July 05, 2003 10:49 AM
Sorry. It should have been "each (G) energy card."
Notice, it doesn't say "each (G) energy."
I didn't have the card in front of me as I do now. ![[Bored]](../tcg/graemlins/dozey.gif)
Thnx 4 the correction, Pop. Sorry Porygone3, but it STILL doen't work.
[ July 05, 2003, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Big_Pappa_Poke ]
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Evolution - Second in the World in Team Limited
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From: Portsmouth, OH, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Spectreon
Member # 60305
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posted July 05, 2003 10:50 AM
only a handful of cards check if the energy is a "Basic____ energy", most just check if it is providing a certian type of energy.
One useful (havent figured out the best way to implore this yet thoguh) is Energy Trans. You Convert a Water, Psychic, Fire, Lightnning, or Fighting to Grass, and move it where you will. It was semi helpful with Sphere TMs. Move a basic fire to a Pokemon, the Sphere Checks what the card actually is, not what it is providing, and then goes from there.
Here is a good question, can you convert a converted Energy??? Say change it to grass, then change it back to fire with a second Porigon2
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From: Lavender Town, Kanto | Registered: Jan 2002
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Big_Pappa_Poke
Member # 3495
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posted July 05, 2003 10:56 AM
Interesting idea with the Spheres, Spectreon.
There should be no problem converting the energy a second time with a second Porygon2. The second conversion would take precidence over the first.
Even if there were, if you can put a special condition on the first Porygon2, the energy transforms back to what it originally was. (But who would want to go to the trouble?)
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Adventure, excitement... a Jedi craves not these things.
Would you like a chocolate covered Pretzel?
From: Portsmouth, OH, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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yoshi1001
Member # 825
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posted July 05, 2003 10:58 AM
quote:
Here is a good question, can you convert a converted Energy??? Say change it to grass, then change it back to fire with a second Porigon2
I don't see why not. The way the card is worded, you'd just be converting it again. Of course, if the first Porygon 2 had a special condition...never mind. ![[Wink]](../tcg/wink.gif)
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From: Janesville, Wisconsin | Registered: Feb 2001
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dkates
Member
Member # 113463
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posted July 05, 2003 02:39 PM
It's because of things like this that I think any card that does anything "non-standard" (like Porygon2), it should be playtested, at least in a theoretical fashion, before it's printed and released. That would probably catch most broken or confusing cards.
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Every time I think I can't say anything stupider, I prove myself wrong. Maybe I should just stop thinking.
From: Houston, TX | Registered: Nov 2002
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Porygone3
Member
Member # 73689
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posted July 05, 2003 09:22 PM
Ah; well Megunum checks for G engery. So if you convert a G engery to G. You only get one not the other G... @_@ As for Using Engery Trans or the Spheres. Sorry, but you cant do eahter due to the fact that its not a basic grass. I'm pretty sure those two cards check for the basicness of the card. And finaly, yes you could convert a converted engery. However the "floating" part comes in when you've converted the converted engery; if thats possible. (Convert a Water into fire; convert that Water into grass, is it fire or grass... @_@)
It will never end I'm sure. As for attacks; lots of them check for how meny engery cards you have attached. So the question becomes, do you check for the basic engery and the engery you converted to...? Bigeggsplosion go!!
Maybe I should bring up my other quote: on conflicting powers? Nah...
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Erica total 24, thats right, 24.
Dunsprace total 41.
I've gotten 98 on that Machoke at work game. I beat Driving Corasola.
I almost beat the record in Hold Down hip hop. I got 2000 or so in Kinglers day. I got 7 in Rapadash's dash. Butterfree's Flower Power 4700. 123 In Jumping Dodoro. My all foil deck is finished.
"I've got floating engery."
"I've got counter productive Powers."
"One heart can make a diferance."
"Rock the world baby, rock the world."
"Roll out!!"
From: USA | Registered: Mar 2002
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NoPoke
Member # 42315
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posted July 07, 2003 12:39 AM
The wordin gon the cards is what causes the problem...
energy is used in two different ways.
if you substitute a nonsense word for 'energy card' (I use 'flooby') then it isn't so hard to unpick Meganiums behaviour. what you are doing is separating the two distinct uses of 'energy'.
----The rulling on HooH is effectively an errata.
Both Porygon2 and hooh use the same words. ie they both refer to the 'type' of basic energy card attached.
HooH should be read as ....10 more damage for each different basic energy card....
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From: Crawley England | Registered: Sep 2001
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qmech99
Member
Member # 123578
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posted July 07, 2003 02:06 PM
Porygone3, I've yet to see an arguement of yours that makes sense. You seem to write a load of drivel, then hold it up for inspection and expect someone to say 'good boy' and give you a pat on the head. I realise enow that I'm losing the plot so I'll make it short - if there's a genuine problem, then present it in the clearest way possible, but if there isn't one then stop trying to create them by using convoluted sentence structures.
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From: UK - Derbyshire | Registered: Jan 2003
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