Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Why are people scared of Dusknoir LV. X?

Once Torkoal is active, it dies. Simple as that. Heck, plenty of decks can kill it with a valueless stage 1. You then put up Dusknoir and I guess I'll try it again. Each Torkoal is a wasted prize, is it worth two prizes just to achieve a 20 damage spread to their pokemon?
 
Would you rather sacrifice your main attacker or energyless basic pokémon? Yeah, thought so too. Each Warp point is also a wasted card with Torkoal, as most decks will deal OHKOs to your Dusknoirs anyway - as you will want them damaged when you start attacking with them.

Let's take Kingdra... You have worked your way to get 120 damage on Dusknoir Lv.X. With Torkoal in bench, would you:
1. Waste a Warp Point, kill Torkoal, take another 120 damage from Dusknoir to any of your pokémon
2. Kill the active and take the stadium, aware that you might not get counter for it in next 2-3 turns, which inevitably may cost you the game?

Sacrifice for better position is a common tactic in strategy games.
 
Ignatious said:
Once Torkoal is active, it dies. Simple as that. Heck, plenty of decks can kill it with a valueless stage 1. You then put up Dusknoir and I guess I'll try it again. Each Torkoal is a wasted prize, is it worth two prizes just to achieve a 20 damage spread to their pokemon?
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Why is it assumed that you will always have the counter stadium you need right after Ectoplasm initially hits? How do you deal with Damage Even taking out your Claydol (s) followed by a Wager or even something like Exeggutor LA's Psychic Strategy (I mention this card because I think it does have potential with Ectoplasm. Giving them a hand possibly as low as 0--which can easily be accomplished by playing your own hand down, obviously-- with no Claydol support will all but ENSURE Ectoplasm sticks at least for a handful of turns in addition to cutting off all their resources/support.)? Do you realize that if you miss even ONE turn when trying to counter Ectoplasm everything you have in play will have taken 40? Add another turn and it's 60, and so forth. Add Bronzong MD and Spiritomb to the mix and you're going to be taking a lot more, regardless of whether or not you eventually do get rid of Ectoplasm since Pain Amplifier is always going to be hitting all of your Pokemon for the rest of the game (barring freshly benched stuff after you do get [temporarily] freed from Ectoplasm).

I don't mean to suggest Dusknoir lv. X is an invincible card that's always going to stick and that has amazing match-ups versus everything, but I think you're going off of best-case scenarios here in your analysis of how to approach beating the card/deck that just will not always go through.
 
butler has a good point, but this is the case with ANY deck. EVERY single deck has strong and weak points, and no other deck no matter how advantageous the match up can have good or bad set up, or maybe someone's playing with a wild unexpected tech like that exeggutor, but even such techs have to be played carefully. Instead of worrying about WHY a deck is uber or broken, get creative with how you should play your deck differently to combat the issue. Sometimes you just need to do different things. Would you play Gengar the same way against an AMU deck and a Blaziken deck? didn't think so.
 
My point about anything being able to hit Torkoal, and successfully kill it, was clearly not read. Furthermore, Not always will the Dusknoir underneath the LvX be the good Noir. AT times, players need to settle for the DP Noir, because that's all they have. That's hardly an argument, but true none-the-less. As a more powerful argument, I'll bring up a tech that will be in pairs in every good Kingdra list. Unown G. What exactly will you hit for 120? Claydol is protected, and Kingdras HP is 130, making for a 2HKO, or it is KOed by Dusknoirs stadium, which is irrelevant, as Kingdras are ALWAYS replaceable, but Dusknoirs NEED 2-3 and a ton of damage to have any solid effect on the game. Torkoal also eats a bench slot, for the entire game, until KOed, so Torkoal and Claydol equal half of your field vs. any deck with a stage 2 (Dusknoir tech is everywhere). Fine, I won't even play Warp Point, but when we begin to swap KOs, I'll eat your only attackers in mere turns, with whatever deck I'm using.

Kingdra isn't a very good example on either end, anyway, because of all the decks in the format, Dusknoir's 20 damage spread is the least effective against Kingdra. Kingdra would actually rather just KO Dusknoir than fondle around with warps.

As for the counter stadium point, again, Unown G being in all of my decks, and in many other top decks, Claydols will ALWAYS be safe. Furthermore, Wager is a bad card now, it's too situational. By running that card, I worry about Dusknoir's set up in the first place, as every little deck slot needs focus, and Wager doesn't help set-up much at all.

Bronzong has little effect vs. decks with main attackers without powers, such as Kingdra, Luxray, Froslass, Raichu, Machamp, Magnezone (non LvX), and Magmortar (non LvX). Unown G limits its spread to the claydols, so Zong will many times do no more than 20 spread before giving a prize. Worth it? Sometimes, sure, but Dusknoir + Zong does not make for incredible spread. If you want that, just run Froslass/Bronzong. Decks also don't have bench space for Spiritomb, Dusknoir DP is tech-able in nearly every deck, playing Spiritomb either risks your field being wiped, or limits your already small bench space. Spiritomb just doesn't cut it in today's format.
 
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Plox..........stops it dead! Knock out the pokemon with psychic lock. Straight to the discard pile :)

What happens if you have Dusknoir LvX out as a stadium card and then you get psychic locked does stadium still activate between turns......as it is "between" turns?
 
Psychic lock stops neither the lvl X's power from activating (as it happens during YOUR TURN) nor "cancells" an active dusknoir stadium.
 
thats right, anything that happens during your own turn or between turns gets around Psychic Lock. And on another note, it stops PLAYERS from ACTIVATING pokepowers. Once dusknoir is in play as a stadium, there is no pokepower to activate, since it's not a pokemon. It's the effect of a stadium.
 
I'm laughing at the fact that not a single person using incorrect punctuation and capitalization in this thread has any idea what they are talking about.

Dusknoir is a beast if you have no ways of hitting the bench and cannot consistently take it down in one shot. So decks like Luxray, Raichu, and T Tar kinda laugh at it.
 
I run this with the stormfront tyranitar...

30 damage to everyone via t-tar's spinning tail (more to the active if i've got special darks, and i usually do), and then 20 to everyone via dusknoir X by the time my next turn hits.

I very often end games by taking 4 prize cards at once with spinning tail, in conjunction with dusknoir X. use the dusknoir with the body that damages all their pokemon with energy, and you've got the perfect killing machine. Put him active, and your opponent'll be FORCED to kill him, and right afterward comes the spinning tail.

You'd have be NUTS not to fear this card.
 
[R]Visitor;1262131 said:
I run this with the stormfront tyranitar...

30 damage to everyone via t-tar's spinning tail (more to the active if i've got special darks, and i usually do), and then 20 to everyone via dusknoir X by the time my next turn hits.

I very often end games by taking 4 prize cards at once with spinning tail, in conjunction with dusknoir X. use the dusknoir with the body that damages all their pokemon with energy, and you've got the perfect killing machine. Put him active, and your opponent'll be FORCED to kill him, and right afterward comes the spinning tail.

You'd have be NUTS not to fear this card.
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t tar and dusky in the same deck? that worries me...

i quite like dusky, but it can quite easily lose. something like scizor can really cause problems for it
 
Oh gosh.

Its been years since I've played this game and I don't even know what most of the new cards do, so I couldn't possibly comment on its worth in the format. Are any of the non-Lv.X Dusknoir cards any good that they would be played as an attacker (and thus be in a position to be knocked out whilst active)?

If this card is a threat to the extent of damaging the format then I wouldn't be hesistant to running something like the old Hidden Legends Milotic to counter it. The smart player will always adapt. Is there anything along those lines in any of the recent expansions?
 
There are 4 playable Dusknoirs. ALL of them are good in one way or another, though the more recent ones are better attackers.

Noir can be countered. It's not unbeatable by any means.
 
CaptainSolo said:
Oh gosh.

Its been years since I've played this game and I don't even know what most of the new cards do, so I couldn't possibly comment on its worth in the format. Are any of the non-Lv.X Dusknoir cards any good that they would be played as an attacker (and thus be in a position to be knocked out whilst active)?

If this card is a threat to the extent of damaging the format then I wouldn't be hesistant to running something like the old Hidden Legends Milotic to counter it. The smart player will always adapt. Is there anything along those lines in any of the recent expansions?
Click to expand...

no Milotic like card. Only Poke Healer, Dawn Stadium, but no where near close to what Milotic did.
 
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