Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Note Taking with Time Walk

Status
Not open for further replies.
Mike Liesik was very clear.
We asked a few different questions to be certain.
The upshot is, if you're writing notes, those notes must be clear and understandable to the opponent.
No code.
If you don't want them knowing something, best not to write it down as notes.
I'm not arguing, but that rule would only make sense to me if taking notes was obligatory. If someone wants to keep track of the game for whatever reason, why must the other person see the notes?

But at any rate, don't write something down that will help them; how hard is that?
 
Lol.

You could still reorder the prizes to get the much need one on the front and the least in the back... Lol.
 
Do notes have to be complete to meet the ruling? For example, suppose I have 2 energies, 1 Trainer X, 1 Trainer Y, and 2 Pokemon in my prizes after Time Walk. I could arrange the cards and list just the 2 trainers, and maybe one of the two Pokemon. I can remember the other cards without my notes.

Prizes in order:
Pokemon A
Pokemon B
Energy
Energy
Trainer X
Trainer Y

My Notes:
Prizes: Pokemon A, Trainer X, Trainer Y

Just thinking out of the prize box,
Jeff
 
Do notes have to be complete to meet the ruling? For example, suppose I have 2 energies, 1 Trainer X, 1 Trainer Y, and 2 Pokemon in my prizes after Time Walk. I could arrange the cards and list just the 2 trainers, and maybe one of the two Pokemon. I can remember the other cards without my notes.

Prizes in order:
Pokemon A
Pokemon B
Energy
Energy
Trainer X
Trainer Y

My Notes:
Prizes: Pokemon A, Trainer X, Trainer Y

Just thinking out of the prize box,
Jeff

nope, that would be "code"

it is really clear, there are no loopholes, ur opponent would have to know exactly what it is means. Unless I guess I told my opponent what Energy A and Energy B are. Like if I wrote Ax for Zelf lvl X and i then told them that it was Azelf lvl X but shorthand, that might be ok, but other than that, you cant use any form of code, it really is quite clear in the links.

Ror
 
I'm not arguing, but that rule would only make sense to me if taking notes was obligatory. If someone wants to keep track of the game for whatever reason, why must the other person see the notes?

But at any rate, don't write something down that will help them; how hard is that?

The rules state that IF you take notes, your oppo CAN look at them. Ergo, they have to be able to UNDERSTAND THEM too. Note taking is a privilege in the rules. It can be taken away if you are taking toooooo long to write them out.


As for listing 2 or 3 of your 6 prizes only.....I don't personally see a problem with that as long as you state exactly what the 2 or 3 prizes are. ie Empo, RC, Zong and nothing else listed.

Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

Excuse me for finding that a bit... ridiculous. Now maybe just MAYBE I can understand the note taking aspect of that, but would you be not allowed to SAY that to your opponent? How about if you tell your opponent that you have a Wager in your hand? Are they going to call the judge over and make them check to see if you actually have the card in your deck or not? How about if your list does run Dusknoir, but that's not the prize? Is the judge going to check your prizes after time walk to see if you're telling the truth on each of them?

I'm not trying to find a loophole to "cheat" at this game, it's pathetically unnecessary. However, checking the integrity of a player's statements in a way that would divulge information to the other player seems kind of... wrong. Clear me up on this.

IF there is a Q about the integrety of the notes, a player can ask a Judge to check the list/deck. Now, I would HOPE the player would be HONEST with the Judge and not waste everyone's time by listing things HONESTLY on their notes. If you are called on it and you have used "dubious" or "misleading" info on PUBLIC knowledge info, it may end up being a "sad panda day" for you!

As for the usual pre tourney Qs from other players..."Whatcha playing today?" You can answer that anyway you want......they dont have the RIGHT to know that. They will know what you are playing once the games START. You always have the right to say "That is none of your business" or "A 60 card deck of pokemon cards" and just smile!

Keith
 
Last edited:
if you got a problem with it don't play the card, otherwise write the info and share. why are people making such a big deal about this. I don't write down notes as I just rearrange the prizes so that it is easier for me to remember where they are. I pick them up, take a pokemon, and then place the cards in an order that it is easier for me to remember where they are. That way I don't need notes and this method is approved (my league leader has no issue with this that I am aware of).
 
KoM - ur method is approved

People are upset because they want to remember the info via notes so they dont have to commit it to memory on top of the other things they are keeping track of and that information is critical at times and you dont want to have to remember what prizes and where. Its such a hassle

It upsets me because I feel what i write is being censored. Maybe it is just the activist in me that wants to scream 1st amendment or something silly. The fact is, that while playing POPs game at POPs events we need to do what they say, like no iPods during matches. I would love to play my iPod, it helps me think. But POP says i cant. I just feel that what i write/how i write shouldnt be an issue. But as I write it becomes part of the game state and the field in a way and should therefore be open to everyone's sight and understanding.

Ror
 
It does say in the rules that "Notes taken during a match may be reviewed by either player at any time during the match." From 2008-2009 Pokémon Organized Play Tournament Rules
 
Also, I was wondering if the same note-taking principle applies to cards such as when using Omastar's Primal Swirl, writing down the evolutions that went back to your opponent's hand.

Or for next set, when Gengar uses Poltergiest to look at your opponent's hand, can you write what you saw down? I wouldn't think the it-hasn't-come-out-so-we-can't-make-a-ruling-on-it would apply since Pokemon have had Poltergiest has been on past cards.
 
If "dubious" tactics or using trickery on your opponent isn't aloud, does that mean we can't change facial expressions, cheer, sigh, etc., as we draw cards, prizes, etc. to make them think we drew something good, or bad?
 
Do notes have to be complete to meet the ruling? For example, suppose I have 2 energies, 1 Trainer X, 1 Trainer Y, and 2 Pokemon in my prizes after Time Walk. I could arrange the cards and list just the 2 trainers, and maybe one of the two Pokemon. I can remember the other cards without my notes.

Prizes in order:
Pokemon A
Pokemon B
Energy
Energy
Trainer X
Trainer Y

My Notes:
Prizes: Pokemon A, Trainer X, Trainer Y

Just thinking out of the prize box,
Jeff

This is pretty much what I decided to do, except for the A, B, X, Y part, that seems codey. How about:

Basic Pokemon
Stage 1 Pokemon
Energy
Energy
Supporter
Trainer

I'll trust my memory for the details, and my luck for the energy pull. It's accurate and non-deceptive.
I don't find reordering works so well, what you think you'll need next, you might not!

Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

Well, it's not my ruling so I can only try to express the thought that has gone into it.

Basically, it is taking the floor rules at face value.
When you make notes, both players get to use them.
If they are not clear or are deceptive, then you are not meeting that requirement.

See, that's the problem. Basically, rroaryh was taking the rules at face value.

First off, I agree the rules deal with deceptiveness, that's uncool.

Your opponent may review your notes, ok. The fact they must be legible, understandable, in 8pt.
font, is not addressed at all, thus the question. Indeed, I think the ruling is unsatisfying because
Mike went against 'face value' to say that notes could be taken at all for Azelf's Time Walk.

"Notes should be restricted to changes in the game state." Maybe I'm wrong, but looking at prizes
does not affect game state. I'd like to make this very clear: I'm not here to question Mike's ruling,
it's fine with me, I'm all for us playing by the same rules.

Here's the problem I have, and the reason I reluctantly write this. rroaryh asked a simple question
and requested some reasoning for it. The tone in many answers is sickening:

"Quit trying to game this."

"It's about as clear as it can get."

"What part of Liesik's post did you not understand??"

"Dont ruin it for the ones that do it for tourney reports, etc."

"Just... for God's sake. Write them and share them."

"Note taking is a privilege in the rules. It can be taken away...."

Over-react much fellas? Geez, the guy was only asking.

Finally, PokePop, I choose to reply to your response only because it provided me a convenient seque
to make my point. Really I appreciate your attempts to clarify the ruling and give rroaryh a response.
What I don't appreciate is condescending and accusatory nature of replies that questions like this
inevitably generate.
 
Last edited:
Finally, PokePop, I choose to reply to your response only because it provided me a convenient seque
to make my point. Really I appreciate your attempts to clarify the ruling and give rroaryh a response.
What I don't appreciate is condescending and accusatory nature of replies that questions like this
inevitably generate.

You don't have children....

One of those responses is mine. I love roary to death. He's in my league and he's a GREAT GREAT guy. If you're gonna lose, he's the one you'd have fun losing to...

So, I doubt he took my comment as "sickening" ...

And many of those responses you quoted above are completely out of context...

Rory and his brother asked a question ...

Then ... people just plain got STUPID about "what if I just .. " loopholes. Even ROARY got tired of those.


Kids are not willing to accept and abide by the rule. it's a rule. It's been made. Just like 'draw only one card at the beginning of your turn' .. you HAVE to do it.

So, we (and roary) are saying .. dude... live with it. Stop beating a dead horse.

That's all I was saying with :
""Just... for God's sake. Write them and share them."

People, sometimes, need to nod, accept and play along the way it's supposed to be played.

ON A SIDE NOTE ...

For those of you who REALLY don't want to give complete information to your oppoenent. You COULD put LIMITED information such as
"Trainer, Trainer, Supporter, Stadium, Pokemon, Pokemon"

Someone asked if they could do this and PokePop supplied the following answer:

"I would have no problem with a player revealing limited info like that, T or P.
The notes have to be clear and accurate. There is no requirement that they be complete."
 
Last edited:
You could always let me write the note. I have such a terrible handwriting that everybody needs my dictionary to translate it. you do have to pay shipping costs and 1 dollar tax.
 
Last edited:
POP is doing this to be fair to all players not to censor you. Taking notes is an option. If you choose to use that option then POP needs to guarantee that it does not give one player an unfair advantage.

My concern with it is that a player's prizes are not common knowledge but if you write it down then your opponent now knows those cards as well. Time Walk to me is similar to using Bebe's to retrieve a Pokemon from your deck. Most players on their first time searching their deck will look all the way through to see if something is prized, etc. That knowledge is not common. But if you need to write down, "LV X is prized," so that you don't waste a Premier Ball, well, your opponent will know it too. I don't think the intent of Time Walk was to let your opponent know your prizes just yourself. But since there is an option for note taking and it needs to be fair then I think POP has made the fair call. I don't want to think about how they will handle this one at Worlds! Maybe a copy of the Battle Dictionary at each table?
 
Last edited:
I don't want to think about how they will handle this one at Worlds! Maybe a copy of the Battle Dictionary at each table?

Well, there wasn't any "wrist play" at worlds.
I doubt we'll see people writing notes on this at worlds either.
The top players generally are able to keep track of a lot of info without notes. That's why they are top players.

I just started using Time Walk myself.
It's a little difficult to keep track of what cards are where in the prizes, but I find I can do it without notes.

If one thinks that they need notes to do it, then the downside is that they will be sharing that info.
It's the choice that has to be made.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top