Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Life without Claydol?

After Claydol is gone, we have Uxie, which IMHO, is much better than Claydol. It may not be more consistent, but with UXie Lv.X, it is a good drawer and a great attacker. IT will see play in every deck. But I won't really miss Claydol, but I would have missed it if Plox was still legal with the DREs and Scrambles.
 
SPARTA said:
That's nice, I see 2-3 decks in the previous format who were remotely good without Claydol, AMU, Scizor, and one could argue Gigas didn't need it. Outside of that, I see no deck in the previous format that would not work better with Claydol in it than without. Arguing that you saw few Claydol in ONE CITY is hardly a remotely decent argument.
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Gengar and Dusknoir said 'sup.

I barely saw Claydol in SIX cities. Does that hold a better argument to you?
 
Scipio said:
Gengar and Dusknoir said 'sup.
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Dusknoir and Claydol could easily benefit from Claydol more than they would miss the two spots it takes up. My arguement was there were no decks who could more benefit with Claydol than without, you posted two decks who would love to be with Claydol. Good job.

Scipio said:
I barely saw Claydol in SIX cities. Does that hold a better argument to you?
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Why would it? That would be your area, not the metagame as a whole. I saw Claydol at every city in 90% of decks. As a whole, there were many more decks relying on Claydol than solely replying on draw without it, and an even higher percentage of decks that won who relied on Claydol.
 
PokemanMaster said:
After Claydol is gone, we have Uxie, which IMHO, is much better than Claydol. It may not be more consistent, but with UXie Lv.X, it is a good drawer and a great attacker. IT will see play in every deck. But I won't really miss Claydol, but I would have missed it if Plox was still legal with the DREs and Scrambles.
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After your Uxies get power sprayed a few times, come back here and tell me that Uxie is better than Claydol. :p
 
Claydol/Uxie is not needed by any deck.
Claydol/Uxie is needed by every deck when every other deck plays it to.

A Claydol/Uxie deck beats a non Claydol/Uxie deck most of the time (there are exceptions).
A Claydoless/Uxieless deck stands on even ground with another Claydoless/Uxieless deck
 
Absoltrainer has the same thought as me.

Once it out, it's out for everybody, just add 4 more draw supporters. It's not that big of a deal.
 
There's always something around to keep our decks fairly consistent.

04: Delcatty/Oracle was in the format, and the supporters were pretty solid (Copycat/Steve)

05: Pidgeot came out, as well as Magcargo. Supporters still solid.

06: Pidgeot still around, Cargo still around. Supporters solid. Holon Engine out. Possibly the most consistent format in the Nintendo era.

07: Still have solid supporters and Holon Engine. No real Pokemon to set up, except for like Meganium d and other random things (if I remember correctly).

08: Claydol comes out and Pachi/Call are released. Solid supporters.

09: Claydol/Uxie/Call. Weak weeaaaak Supporters.

Steven's Advice is probably the best drawing Supporter we've ever had, this format would be 10x times better if we had it still, I'm convinced. Cynthia's just doesn't cut it.
 
SPARTA said:
That's nice, I see 2-3 decks in the previous format who were remotely good without Claydol, AMU, Scizor, and one could argue Gigas didn't need it. Outside of that, I see no deck in the previous format that would not work better with Claydol in it than without. Arguing that you saw few Claydol in ONE CITY is hardly a remotely decent argument.
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It was a State Championship, not a City Championship. They have already started in Europe, and of course they are played with Platinum. The Speed Machamp decks didn't run Claydol iirc, and all those Galactic decks didn't as well.

I didn't say that no-Claydol decks are better - I personally like Claydol, and ironically, a standard 2-2 Claydol line is the best armor against the popular power and hand disruption, as provided by Power Spray and Giratina PL. What I wanted to point out is that there are several competitive decks that do very well without Claydol.

The problem is, most of those decks rely on early-game. Any setup-decks would suffer from the lack of Claydol.
 
Yeah, Uxie can get power=sprayed... but a good list with Uxie can prevent that (deck with TGW). You can also power spray Claydol. Uxie can more or less get a lot of cards. Claydol doesn't attack, but Uxie and Uxie Lv.X can. Uxie can level up, while Claydol can't. Uxie X has Zen Blade, while Claydol's attack is average. And lastly, Uxie Lv.X has Tradeoff, which help with topdecks. Claydol doesn't do that.
 
getjosh said:
I would like to get some feedback regarding life without Claydol, should it go out in September. Or even, what the game was like before Claydol GE?

I started playing Pokemon during the release of Majestic Dawn, so Claydol has always been a part of the game for me. My Gym leader, Mr. Raichu, put it like this; In order to be a successful Pokemon player, you must do what successful Pokemon players do - run Claydol.

So in nearly every deck that I have built, I have had a 2-2 Baltoy - Claydol line. Currently I am toying with an Amphros - Manetric deck and I am trying to stay away from Poke-Powers. During the test games at home I always tend to struggle with the lack of the Claydol draw engine. (This was true with the Scizor deck I built.)

So, I am looking for a system, or draw engine, to use that is not dependent on Claydol. I realize what an awesome card Claydol is, and that not much can compare to it, but any ideas, suggestions, or strategies sure would help.

Thanks
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You could try these cards:
Draw Cards
Prof. Oak's Visit
Cynthia's Feelings
Lookers Investigation
Felicity's Drawing
Prof. Rowan
Team Galactic's Mars
Team Galactic's Wager
Buck's Training
Chatot
Porygon2
Lopbunny
Search Cards
Bebe's Search
Roseanne's Research
Cyrus's Conspiracy
Luxury Ball
Great Ball
Quick Ball
Sableye
Furret
Poke Drawer

Everything thats in bold players use alot of in their decks. If you play a lot of supporters Porygon2 is great even though he might go out with Claydol after worlds. I hope this helps.:thumb:
 
amphy#1 said:
You could try these cards:
Draw Cards
Prof. Oak's Visit

Useless, 3 cards and no other advantage is pathetic compared to Claydol and Uxie's draw power. TV Reporter at least allowed you to rid yourself of something no longer useful.

Cynthia's Feelings

Good card, but mostly useful for recovery. Not to mention straight draw is always better than shuffle and draw.

Lookers Investigation

Overrated, you either wasted your supported to gain no benefit and give your opponent 5 new cards, or you get 5 cards. And once again, Straight draw > Shuffle and Draw

Felicity's Drawing

Only useful in decks that manipulate the discard pile, but yeah this is pretty much the best straight draw we have.

Prof. Rowan

Useful with Uxie or one of the Poke + cards. Otherwise situational.

Team Galactic's Mars

Draw two cards off a supporter. And give your opponent the ability to draw more with Uxie/Claydol. Only useful in a VERY fast discard deck, or one capable of killing Claydol AND hand control (Empoleon being the only one I can think of).

Team Galactic's Wager

Useful hand control, Unreliable without Claydol.

Buck's Training

Terrible, never use.

Chatot

Not as useful since we lost Steven's Advice, people just don't have 10+ card hands like they used to.

Porygon2

Terrible due to the lack of useful supporters/uselessness of Porygon Z.

Lopbunny

A stage one useful only as Anti Spread with a Sub Par draw attack. I'd sooner use Furret

Search Cards
Bebe's Search

Used in every deck.

Roseanne's Research

Used in every deck.

Cyrus's Conspiracy

Love this card.

Luxury Ball

At least 1 used in every deck

Great Ball

Glad this got reprinted, much needed search

Quick Ball

Giving your opponent your deck list = MEH

Sableye

Useful with T Tar, who is not as useful anymore.

Furret

As brutal as his attack is, I would sooner setup Claydol than him. He might be useful should the format turn into pure power lock/anti setup.

Poke Drawer

Needs 2 to be useful, best for Mid/Late Game recovery

Everything thats in bold players use alot of in their decks. If you play a lot of supporters Porygon2 is great even though he might go out with Claydol after worlds. I hope this helps.:thumb:
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Replies in bold. Nice post though.
 
i really don't need claydol. in all of my decks that i have played for a while, only one of them needed claydol. i actually top 16'd w/ a darkrai deck in nationals last year, and with no claydol. your supporter engine is sometimes more reliable than claydol when you have a really good one!
 
SPARTA said:
Replies in bold. Nice post though.
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He asked for other options other than claydol, or uxie and I made the list.

Half of that stuff that you said was'nt usefull is usefull. You guys have been spoiled so long playing claydol, and uxie that you forgot how those cards help you, and when claydol and uxie are gone guess what you're going to play.... thats right folks!! those krappy cards!! You might as well start playing with them now because when Amphy and Power Spray get a hold on ya your gonna wish you had them.

"That's the bottom line... cause Amphy#1 said so."
 
amphy#1 said:
He asked for other options other than claydol, or uxie and I made the list.

Half of that stuff that you said was'nt usefull is usefull. You guys have been spoiled so long playing claydol, and uxie that you forgot how those cards help you, and when claydol and uxie are gone guess what you're going to play.... thats right folks!! those krappy cards!! You might as well start playing with them now because when Amphy and Power Spray get a hold on ya your gonna wish you had them.

"That's the bottom line... cause Amphy#1 said so."
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Almost all those crappy cards are getting Rotated out. Uxie will be in the format as long as those other cards will be. Next format we also get Volkner, which outclasses all of those draw cards.

Power Spray is useful in SP decks, in which case you simply setup Claydol, they lock it, THEN you drop Uxie. If they have 2 Power Spray, then they got you good and you take it like a man, thats the price you pay for reliable draw.

You failed.
 
amphy#1 said:
He asked for other options other than claydol, or uxie and I made the list.

Half of that stuff that you said was'nt usefull is usefull. You guys have been spoiled so long playing claydol, and uxie that you forgot how those cards help you, and when claydol and uxie are gone guess what you're going to play.... thats right folks!! those krappy cards!! You might as well start playing with them now because when Amphy and Power Spray get a hold on ya your gonna wish you had them.

"That's the bottom line... cause Amphy#1 said so."
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This format has no good draw, and decent shuffle/draw with the exception of cynthias(great shuffle/draw).
 
Why does everyone fail to relize that we are going ot get volkner's philosophy before we potentialy lose claydol. That card completely replaces claydol in my eyes with a decent trainer line.
 
Blaziken 1111 said:
Why does everyone fail to relize that we are going ot get volkner's philosophy before we potentialy lose claydol. That card completely replaces claydol in my eyes with a decent trainer line.
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I have said that 3 times in this thread. One time was, in fact, two posts above yours. Perhaps if you payed attention more....
 
I couldnt care less what people think about claydol. I dont like the rotation, because if you get a good card or deck you like than you cant use it for long.I dont have tons of money like alot of people do and I cant afford to go and by all the new sets. So half the time i finally get my deck completed and what do you know all my cards are illegal. so whats the point in buying these cards if they are going to be useless in a couple months, its a waste of money. I know you guys will say, oh this keeps the game going and it is fun to make new decks. This is just my opinion. This game should be like other card games where there is a banned list (cards you cant use)and all other cards from diamond and pearl and on can be used. what do you think?
 
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