Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Can Kingdra survive in this metagame???

The Metagame in Battleroads and City's was perfect for Kingdra to take control of. 60 and 20 to a bench starting at the first turn was good enough to beat most decks. now with the g pokemon out, its not as great as it was at one point. Toxi G can 70 with poison on T1, Dialga G can do 20 T1 and Lock. Palkia G can do 50 and 10 spread on T2. Honchkrow can do 60 on T1 with Spec. dark and crobat. Now with all of this at a G decks disposal, it doesn't make kingdra seem so high and mighty. Discuss.
 
kingdra's still a good deck. it can beat most things, it beats mchamp (which is an SP counter), it beats gengar, sometimes, (same as 'champ) and then it's only REALLY bad matchup should be SP's... actually only dialga G because of SP metals.
 
Kingdra is going to have a tough time at Regionals. And that tough time will become even tougher after Rising Rivals is released. Unfortunately for Kingdra, the time of un-interrupted set-ups is at an end. Kingdra does still have a lot of potential. There are some techs that can keep it going through Regionals, at least. But, it seems to me that this deck is on life-support, in a lot of ways.

The good news, that does seem to be opening the door for some Fire-themed decks that had previously been somewhat under-rated because Kingdra wiped the floor with them.
 
i don't see how kingdra works with mesprits but anywho

kingdra can beat machamp, and gengar, which are 2 of the best none sp decks, it loses to gigas which loses to machamp and probably gengar so it's not really tier 1 IMO maybe in the right metagame,

kingdra loses to sp because without powers you cant swarm or attack, and there is no t1 donk on an sp basic,

overall kingdra is at best tier 2 behind gengar and gigas,
 
Todd - Too bad you werent at Milford States. Kingdra was 1st + 2nd in Jr's, 2nd in Sr's and took 1st place in Masters. So yeah Kingdra is still really viable and will be at Regionals, beleive me there are enough techs that can be put in Kingdra to make it a real viable deck still. We have 2x- 2nd place Trophies and a 1st place Trophy to prove it!!
 
Kingdra CAN surrive in this metagame......I played Kingdra at States and got 3rd. I played the basic decklist w/ a speacial tech.
vs. Galactics
Its a 60-40 match up, even if they power spray you you can still swarm and they wont stand a chance
Besides Gengar there is not much other decks can do against Kingdra
 
Kingdra has good/decent match ups against nearly every deck that is being played. It is by far, the safest play, imo. It smashes random rogues, goes even against SPs and Gigas, and has an advantage over Gengar and Machamp. Even though Kingdra can't KO Palkia and Dialga in one shot, 60 immediate damage is quite annoying, and can be difficult to overcome, playing 3-4 consecutive Poke-Turns. Machamp and Kingdra, when combating do nearly the same thing, only Kingdra has more maneuverability, less energy requirements, and hits the bench for every attack. Gigas can give Kingdra some problems, but with Machamp tech the match up becomes easy, assuming you can pull off a few heads. Gengar is the most tricky deck to play against, and must be played carefully. By swarming Kingdras and playing Claydol with an Unown G as your only pokemon in play with powers, Kingdra severely hinders Gengar's ability to damage anything (with discarding trainers). Eventually Uxie is sent out to restore for the KO, and gets sent to the bottom of the deck.
 
kingdra's still a good deck. it can beat most things, it beats mchamp (which is an SP counter), it beats gengar, sometimes, (same as 'champ) and then it's only REALLY bad matchup should be SP's... actually only dialga G because of SP metals.


No that's all wrong. Machamp and Kingdra are very similar in their own ways but Machamp has is slightly better, Machamp has more brute force but with Kingdra it doesn't. Yes you have Aqua Stream but If you want a speedy build, you can't fit in too much energy.

It doesn't beat Gengar I got second with States yesterday with gengar going something like 4-0 to Kingdra and they where all good players that have got top four at Nats. You can't turn one them its impossible all they have to do is any of the following...

Pitch dark you, No trainers which means no Rare Candy and no turn one

Call energy, Having three or four basics on their field turn one

and of course having more than one basic or even starting with a high Hp basic Pokemon is also impossible

AND they could always go first Gengar's match up is 75-25 and Machamps is 55-45

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Kingdra + 4 Mesprit + SSU is the way to go ... without that, I see no way Kingdra can top cut/win.


Yes very true, Super scoop up is really good in Kingdra and immence with Mesprit and Uxie


Now there is a way Kingdra can make G match up alot easier Azelf MT! It stops AMU and G and against G they are Sooo slow.

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What he heck?. Gengar CREAMS! Kingdra it's a great matchup.

Exactly what I was thinking Gengar owns Kingdra!
 
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For Gengar to beat Kingdra the gengar player has to hit heads on Fainting Spell. No heads no victory.

The gastly trainer lock is annoying but doesn't actually take prizes. The moment you can't lock the opponent empties their hand of trainers and gets set up. Gengar may be ahead on setup but its damage output is very low against an intelligently played Kingdra.

I don't see how it is anything like 75-25 in Gengar's favour.

Azelf MT doesn't stop G decks. At least not a half decent G deck.
 
OK, first of all - I agress with DCF7 and Gengar PWNS . Gengar creams Kingdra.

I've just attended 4 tournaments over the weekend, and my Gengar did really well against good Kingdra builds. My brother won every match against Kingdra with Gengar also.

Uxie and Claydol with Unown G are all easy 1HKOs, and if 4 Gengar are KO'd per game, thats 2 prizes on average. Kingdra can't play around fainting spell, and also run loads of trainers.

Gengar is 75-25 against it and Machamp 55-45. Machamps Level X makes the difference.

I can't explain it and I don't know why - but I feel Kingdra is alot less powerful and less feared than it was during BRs. So many decks can play around the standard direct damage. Mespirit and SSU are needed in the deck, IMO and an Azelf MT tech. Its still playable, but Tier 1? No.

Bad matchups include - Gengar, Kingdra, T-Tar, Dusknoir, Shaymin/Leafeon Varients and other stuff that I can't think of.
 
over here in New england its still going strong, like mr blaze said it took milford

kingdra is fast, hits descent an can be very very sneaky with the right techs

i think we will see allot more of kingdra to come

the unk
 
Shadow Room can't ohko an unown G protected Claydol or Uxie. Well maybe it can in the UK LOL. Poltergeist will be doing nothing or next to nothing too.

Gengar is a decent deck but it is not 3:1 odds on favourite vs Kingdra.
 
No that's all wrong. Machamp and Kingdra are very similar in their own ways but Machamp has is slightly better, Machamp has more brute force but with Kingdra it doesn't. Yes you have Aqua Stream but If you want a speedy build, you can't fit in too much energy.

It doesn't beat Gengar I got second with States yesterday with gengar going something like 4-0 to Kingdra and they where all good players that have got top four at Nats. You can't turn one them its impossible all they have to do is any of the following...

Pitch dark you, No trainers which means no Rare Candy and no turn one

Call energy, Having three or four basics on their field turn one

and of course having more than one basic or even starting with a high Hp basic Pokemon is also impossible

AND they could always go first Gengar's match up is 75-25 and Machamps is 55-45

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Yes very true, Super scoop up is really good in Kingdra and immence with Mesprit and Uxie


Now there is a way Kingdra can make G match up alot easier Azelf MT! It stops AMU and G and against G they are Sooo slow.

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Exactly what I was thinking Gengar owns Kingdra!

I agree with this to a certain point. I think that the Champ matchup for Kingdra is 60/40 and Gengars matchup against kingdra is 55/45. Gengar does have a slight advantage over kingdra if it has a good hand, even if it has an OK hand. Machamp has a 20% advantage over kingdra IMO. maybe 15% percent.
 
Well, over 5 tournaments - me and my brother both ran gengar and between us lost to a Kingdra once ( played by someone who reguarly Top 8s at Worlds. )
 
Kingdra really struggles against decks that can tank. That means Torterra (not played much), Gigas (still some around) and . . . Dialga G with Special Metal :eek:
 
Uxie and Claydol with Unown G are all easy 1HKOs, and if 4 Gengar are KO'd per game, thats 2 prizes on average. Kingdra can't play around fainting spell, and also run loads of trainers.

Those would be the only two prizes, if that, that Gengar should ever take. Claydol with an Unown G, coupled with a swarm of kingdra.. Gengar has no attack options with Shadow Room, and Kingdra can easily control the trainers in its hand with Dragon Pump. Furthermore, By placing the 20 bench damage on Gengars, they are left with 90 HP. After taking a normal Dragon Pump they are then left with 30 HP. Uxie with a PP then KOs the said Gengar while ignoring Fainting Spell. If a Gengar has not been hit with the original 20 damage from Dragon pump, simply hit it while it's active, doing 60, followed by 40, followed by a Crobat G, to get a free attack in on a new active pokemon. If the extra attack isn't worth the prize that Gengar could take from it, just use the Uxie method. Before Gengar gets a Kingdra below 60 HP (or even sooner), retreat Kingdra for a fresh one, and eventually attempt to scooped the damaged Kingdra up.

65-35 in Kingdra's favor.
 
I still believe Kingdra to be very risky. If you go first against most decks they will shut you down/t-2 you basically giving them the game. If Kingdra can survive the turn 2 to 3 onslaught that most decks can deliver then it has a possible chance at winning. Still at most it can deal 60-90 damage because the deck is not focused around the first attack as much as at used to be, and that minor amound in this format just doesn't cut it. It loses to random grass deckas as well. Kingdra is still playable with the right techs though.
 
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