Discussion in 'Deck Help and Strategy' started by Wood811, Aug 4, 2008.

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  1. Wood811

    Wood811 New Member

    4-2-3/1 Luxray la/dp
    1-0-1 Togekiss
    2-2 Claydol
    1 Rayquaza

    4 Bebe
    4 Roseannes
    4 Quick
    2 Dusk Ball
    2 Bucks
    2 warp point
    4 Candy
    3 pluspower
    2 nm

    11 Electric
    5 Fire

    You beatdown with luxray doing 40,100,40,100 etc. and then using the dp one for disruption. Togekiss is for a midgame energy boost which would probably be needed. Claydol is for drawpower. rayquaza for a quick ohko. The pluspowers and bucks are for those pesky 110 hp pokemon. On paper it looks like it can beat amu, kingdra, and leafeon. Any thoughts?
  2. revdjweb

    revdjweb New Member

    sorry but i think luxray is a tech (and an average one at that), not the basis for a deck. it can't withstand getting hit by the ubitquious claydols, let alone gallade, armaldo, etc. fighting weakness has got to be the single worst kind of weakness to have. meanwhile any number of stage 1 decks will outspeed it T2.
  3. butlerforhire

    butlerforhire New Member

    The DP Luxray is a tech (by association with the line here, and elsewhere-- if anyone used it--soon to be replaced by the infinitely superior and reusable Lumineon), but the LA one has a lot of potential IMO. Let me explain.

    First of all, Claydol is virtually never used as an attacker, and the +30 weakness only means Gallade OHKOs it with one less prize flip which really isn't that big of a deal... since it is a OHKO machine regardless of weakness. I can't speak for Armaldo because I really don't think it is going to pop up much if at all (has a fossil basic, hurt by grass which should be one of the most popular types, etc.), and besides that, the whole "weakness as downfall" is a bad argument when it's only +30, especially since only one of the cards you listed is ever really going to be seen as an attacker.

    Speaking of weakness, one of Luxray's big strengths (ah, see how I juxtaposed terms like that?) is how it has the ability to OHKO both Empoleon and Kingdra without any help from PlusPower/Buck's, and both of those Pokemon are going to be FAR more ubiquitous than Gallade or anything else of the fighting type next format. I think it is safe to make that prediction. On the issue of speed-- this current build isn't designed for a turn 2 Shock Bolt followed by immediate recharge, but it can be. With Shinx's Charge plus two energy drops (1 turn 1, 1 turn 2), you've got just as great a chance as having that ready to go turn 2 as Kingdra or a lot of stage 1 decks have of getting their stuff out. All you need is a Shinx opening, 2 energy in hand, Rare Candy and Luxray or a means to get it. With Energy Pickup as well as a recharger/buffer like Rotom (MD), you can do 100 with consistency, such as every other turn, swapping Luxray for it and building it back up while keeping it protected at the same time. Empoleon snipe? Whatever, it gets OHKOed the next turn regardless and follow-up Empoleons don't have the Scramble comeback option anymore. Plasma also helps with the recharging and can finish off stuff you Shock Bolted but weren't able to KO, or to set something up for a later Shock Bolt. The ability to Plasma turn 2 with a Bucks/PlusPower and KO a lot of starters, from Piplup to Horsea to Chatot to Baltoy to Chimchar, is also not the hallmark of a "slow" card. If you do that, without the threat of being Scrambled next turn and KOed in return, your opponent is looking at a big Shock Bolt/likely KO from you on your next turn as well, which means they'll be two prizes behind in a matter of a few turns. That is a way to gain board control quick and it is again not the hallmark of a slow card.

    As for suggestions aimed at improving this list, I would basically drop the Togekiss and the Rayquaza as well as the fire energy, obviously, and add some Rotom (MD). I'd also make sure the Shinx were LA, for that amazing Charge ability. I'd get some Call energy in here both as insurance and so that you can have an energy attached to Luxray that won't get discarded when you Shock Bolt. That is one way that you can do a second Shock Bolt immediately with a successful Energy Pickup flip. Speaking of that card, I'd add 4 here. I'd also add 4 Felicity's Drawing, as raw draw and because the discard it requires combos with both Rotom (MD) and Energy Pickup. When Cyclone energy comes back with IFDS, I'd add some of those in as well to give you more energy that won't be discarded by Shock Bolt and also because the disruptive effect can be really great if you time it right, at any point in the game.

    The way I see it, this is a deck that should try to get a turn 2 Luxray either doing 100 or getting a KO with Plasma/damage enhancers followed by as many Shock Bolts as you can, utilizing the switch-and-recharge allowed by Luxray's free retreat and Rotom's Dual Trans.
  4. revdjweb

    revdjweb New Member

    funny that you reject the 'weakness as downfall' argument against luxray yet in the very next paragraph you cite hitting weakness on kingdra/empoleon as one of luxray's charms.

    it doesn't work both ways.

    and i disagree with your analysis about an ascendant grass/water metagame . yes there will be more, but that's because the game is 80% psychic right now which is a grostesque distortion which cannot last. but neither of us can prove our arguments in this venue so that's neither here nor there. ;-)
  5. The Machampion

    The Machampion New Member

    First off. I really like your list. I Dont have any changes

    Secnd off all i hope ure teamm aplication goes well.
  6. butlerforhire

    butlerforhire New Member

    Actually, saying that Luxray's weakness is not a fatal downfall is not the same as saying that weakness on other Pokemon that match Luxray's type and allow for a OHKO is insignificant. I didn't say weakness is a non-issue in the game. It just so happens that Luxray is able to OHKO two of the big, touted-to-be-popular Pokemon for next format, one of which has already been running rampant this format and so there's no reason to believe it won't continue to. It can "work both ways" in the sense that weakness is not going to likely be a big issue for Luxray whereas for certain other cards (ahem, Kingdra and Empoleon) it enables a OHKO every single time, with no way to prevent it other than Bubble Coat.

    I don't see any reason not to expect a rise in grass and water next format, especially after IFDS. There's Shaymin lv. X, Scizor, Cherrim, Vespiquen, Bellosom, Vileplume, Torterra, Leafeon lv. X, two Sceptiles with abilities to abuse, Tangrowth, Kingdra, Empoleon, possibly Glaceon lv. X in an attempt to fill the power lock void, Tentacruel, Lumineon, and so forth.

    Anyway the main thing I wanted to say is what I already said in my original post, which is that in my opinion Luxray has potential to come out quick and then be consistently refueled with the right list, and its ability to take down Empoleon and Kingdra in one hit is just a nice added bonus (not to mention anything in the also much-touted "AMU" with a Buck's/PlusPower or without Snowpoint Temple in play). It will need a lot of testing like any other deck, especially considering the format change etc., and of course it has weaknesses (not necessarily talking type-wise here...), but it shouldn't just be counted out altogether.
  7. Zumanity

    Zumanity New Member

    You must not pay attention to potential decks for the next format if you can say grass/water wont be run alot. You have all the leafeon variants, torterra, empoleon, kingdra, tentacruel, glaceon, even starmie will see play. Also I don't see gallade being played that much, and armaldo...yea, he's "cool" but grass weakness + its not too hard to push out 70dmg. BTW, these cards that will see play are weak to electric:
    Kingdra, Empoleon, Kyogre, Yanmega, Tentacruel, Starmie, Togekiss, maybe even Honchkrow.
    Not only that, but if they have a lv. x in play, your have a very very high chance of OHKO anything on the field with shock bolt

    As far as the deck, IMO:
    Drop togekiss/rayquaza/Pluspowers

    A 1-0-1 Togekiss isn't worth it, especially in a deck where your discarding a lot. Rayquaza will just take up energies your Luxray needs, and Pluspowers, well you obviously don't need them with LA Luxray's attacks as they are enough without PP. A DP luxray tech I thought about was with Dusknoir, play luxray, make them play a bench, dark palm one of their good pokemon.

    In the Luxray deck i'm building, i'm trying to fit in some other type of energy with the electric. The reason is, once you shock bolt for 100 you would only discard 2 electric energies if you have a different type than electric, then you can attack next turn by attaching a energy and shock bolt again the turn after.

    In place of the Togekiss/Ray, i'd suggest the MT raichu to pull out some energy for free, also not a bad attack really.
  8. mozartrules

    mozartrules New Member

    I agree that the weakness isn't critical IF we accept that Gallade and Armaldo is the most played fighting Pokemon. Gallade OHKO everything anyway and Armaldo 2HKO everything and the the weakness doesn't make that much of a difference.

    We may see some Gliscor decks, but the +30 is again not very critical (Luxray is a 2HKO) and the free retreat will be a plus because a Gliscor deck will be status effect based.

    Good luck with this, we need a comptetitive electric deck for a more balanced metagame.
  9. Wood811

    Wood811 New Member

    4-3-4 Luxray la
    2-2 Claydol

    4 Bebe
    4 Roseannes
    4 Quick
    3 Bucks
    4 Candy
    4 nrg patch
    2 nm
    4 Pokedex910

    11 Electric
    1 Fighting
    4 Heal(idk what its called but the one that removes 1 dmg counter.)

    Fixed. Looking at the replies and another thread, heal seems more logical than call because in most situations you won't want to waste a turn setting up when you could be attacking. The fighting is for another nrg to attach to luxray incase you don't have the heal in hand. Pokedex is a good deck thinner and helps in getting the rare candy. And remember the luxio can t2 most basics and some stage 1's.
  10. manaphy trainer

    manaphy trainer New Member

    I would run some rotoms MD, and take out rayquaza and togekiss line cause it's pretty pointless.
    KEEP claydol, run raichu MT, and run energy pick up, night maintenance, and pokemon drawers,
    like bebe's, roseanne's, etc.

    This is what I run...

    4/3/2 Luxray line
    2/1 Claydol
    3/3 Raichu
    2 Rotom

    20 pokemon (you'll need it, trust me, it helps)

    3 night mainteneace
    2 roseanne's research
    3 Bebe's search
    2 Professor Oak's Visit
    4 Energy Pick-up
    2 Technical Machine TS-1
    2 Team Galactics Mars

    20 Trainers

    20 electric energy

    20-20-20 that's the name of my deck, but it works, and it wins...
  11. Brawler

    Brawler <a href="

    20 L energy is WAY too much.

    Raichu MT tears away at this deck. Makes it worse.

    Rotom is too slow for any kind of energy recovery.

    Run this:


    4 Shinx LA
    3 Luxio LA
    4 Luxray LA

    2 Baltoy GE
    2 Claydol GE

    1 Azelf LA(Helps with prizes)


    4 Bebe's
    4 Buck's
    4 Pickup
    4 Rare Candy
    2 NM
    1 TSD
    3 Rosanne's
    3 Felicity
    2 Warp Point
    3 TGW

    Energy: 14

    10 L
    3 Call
    1 Health(Helps heal that extra 10 so Kingdra now 3HKO's you.

    20 energy is WAAY too much.
  12. zthunderz2

    zthunderz2 New Member

    I think that Raichu would be helpful
    as with a 1-1 dusknoir
  13. butlerforhire

    butlerforhire New Member

    I disagree that Rotom is too slow. It just takes one turn to get Luxray primed while also providing a non-Luxray buffer during the refueling process. Running straight Luxray like in your list, you're going to be using the Luxray line as buffers or relying on Plasma and Energy Pickup in the hopes that your active can get repowered in time before it gets KOed. Sometimes you'll be able to do that with no problems especially if you get a good lead, but not always and Rotom provides another option in these instances. It's just a nice mid to late game insurance card.

    Until the IFDS Magnezone with Super Connectivity comes out, I think Rotom is probably the best way to replenish the almighty Shock Bolt.
  14. jconti2818

    jconti2818 Member

    I have been field testing a Luxray based deck now for the past 6 weeks and some observations from my experience:

    1. As much as I love Raichu, it only slows the deck down. Raichu may be perfect for another deck just not this one.

    2. Rotom works on many levels: recharging your bench, a decent starter if you have another Pokemon on your bench, and toward the end, he is my sacrifice card so that I can use Cynthia's Feelings the next turn for eight cards instead of four.

    3. Cynthia's Feelings works great here since unless you get a fast start you are probably going to beat most good decks in a close match and can use the extra cards at the end of the game (and it doesn't run the risk of helping your opponent the way TGW does).

    4. Most people are not emphasizing Luxrays greatest abilitiy, Rivalry! Despite my Fighting Weakness, I remained competitive against Gardevoir/Gallade/Cresellia because Luxray just loved every time my opponent had a Level X in play which gave my Luxray that 50 boost.

    5. The earlier Luxio has decent attacks but free retreat as well--I found these worked better. In addition Chatot is a decent free retreat starter early game.

    6. I eventually settled on LA Luxray only after trying different combinations since very once in while I was stuck with a benched Rotom with 4 energies, etc.

    This deck may never win me a Battle Road but it is decently fast and fun to play. And isn't that what Pokemon should be about sometimes?

  15. Blaziken 1111

    Blaziken 1111 Active Member

    Hey your list is really similar to my list

    8 Electric
    4 Fire
    4 call enrgy

    Try this for energy. It should work a lot better.
  16. Wood811

    Wood811 New Member

    4-4-3 Luxray
    2/2 Uxie

    4 Call energy
    7 Electric
    4 Psychic

    4 Bebe
    4 Roseanne
    4 Quick
    4 Energy patch
    3 bucks
    4 Pokedex
    3 lakeboundry
    2 nm
    1 tsd

    I found I had to focus more on luxio than luxray considering discarding 1 nrgis better than discarding 2. Uxie is like my claydol but can ohko basics to get me that quick ko. lb is because this deck auto loses to gg really bad. I figured ohkoing a gallade would be helpful. I tested it and its really solid, still not sure on the togekiss.

    That IS the play. Uxie and a more central focus on luxio.(t2 70 is still good believe it or not.)^.
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  17. Blaziken 1111

    Blaziken 1111 Active Member

    I'm sorry but I tested your list and I may have no idea how to play it but first Uxie is practically no draw power. It gives you 2 turns and that's all. The lv.x is kinda good but not really enough support and hard to get out. And luxio as the main attacker... I really don't like it. It may get a kill T2 but should never be the focus of the deck. It can get a prize with LB in play but it just makes is so much easyer for kingdra to get the prize you took and that means you have to charge up another luxion/ray to get another prize. Meanwhile kingdra is taking more prizes while getting set up. Havn't tested any other matchups but I just don't see this working. I would play 4-3-4 luxray.
  18. Hatter™

    Hatter™ Active Member

    ur supposed to make it a hatter deck lol LuxHatter or w/e :p naw lol

    anyway, make all of the luxray LA
  19. Wood811

    Wood811 New Member

    Blaziken1111 the way I play it is I level up the uxie and usually retreat unless the opponent is unable to score a ko on it. I edited the list by taking out togekiss.
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