My "Bite Back" MF Deck

Discussion in 'Deck Help and Strategy' started by SteveP, Oct 28, 2003.

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  1. SteveP

    SteveP Active Member

    After Sandstorm was released, I toyed with building a deck that would bite back every time a Pokemon is attacked and damaged. After some play-testing and fine-tuning, I've come up with the following deck that can consistantly compete with almost any top 10 deck except for Gardevoir (Gardevoir is almost broken in modified format):

    Pokemon (21)

    4 x Growlithe (Fire Veil)
    3 x Arcanine (Fire Veil)
    4 x Carvanha (Rough Skin)
    3 x Sharpedo (Rough Skin)
    4 x Cacnea (Poison Payback)
    3 x Cacturne (Poison Payback)

    Trainers (21)

    4 x Potion
    2 x PokeNav
    2 x Energy Restore
    1 x Town Volunteers
    2 x Lanette's Net Search
    2 x Professor Elm's Training Method
    2 x Oracle
    2 x Professor Oak's Research
    2 x Copycat
    2 x Lady Outing

    Energy (18)

    4 x Multi Energy
    7 x Fire
    7 x Water


    I'm finding that players who would normally attack with small-damage attacks on their initial basics tend to hold back these attacks until they can power up to their big hitters. This often gives me the time to do the same. And, due to having 3 types in my deck, I can often power up their weakness and 1-hit KO them anytime they KO me.

    Against Fire decks, Sharpedo is absolutely devastating. It can 1-hit KO just about anything. Arcanine almost always gets in successive 60-damage attacks too, not too shabby for only 3 energies. And, at the start of the game, Cacturne's/Cancea's Posion Payback is an excellent defensive tactic, and Feint Attack is a great game-finisher.

    The trainer engine is probably a bit high in the Supporter count, making the deck a bit slow at times. But, like I said above, I'm finding that some players actually slow down their early-game attacks when playing against this deck.

    Anyway, I've found this to be one of the funnest decks I've ever constructed. I probably wouldn't use it at a major-level tournament, but I'm seriously considering using it at a local tournament this coming weekend.

    So, any suggested to make the "bite back" theme in this deck any better?
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2003
  2. Mitsirugi

    Mitsirugi New Member

    looks cool,I would change the potion with moomoomilk but thats just me other than that its fine,looks like its fun to play with,thats what it all about :cool:
  3. SwampertEX

    SwampertEX New Member

    Gotta play Boost nrg with Cacturne. Take out 2 potion and 2 PokeNav. I like the idea, but I'd also make the Multi nrg Rainbow nrg. Oh and when Muk ex comes out this deck is toast...
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2003
  4. Joe Monkey

    Joe Monkey New Member

    I like this deck. I would get rid of two potion and add two moomoos. :)
  5. dkates

    dkates New Member

    Yeah, consider switching 2 or all of your Potions to Moo-Moo Milks. Plus, consider dropping the Pokenavs for Switches. Also, consider dropping one each of your Basics for Claw Fossils. Drop the Elm's Training Methods for a Copycat and an Oak's Research. Also, with only 2 Energy types, you don't really need Lady Outing, so make them either third copies of Lanette's Net Search and Oracle or Power Charges.
  6. mysterioustrainer

    mysterioustrainer New Member

    I played against this deck and the trick is to simply keep attacking and take the risk of Burn and Poison. The more you can keep the pokemon from evolving the better you are off.
  7. Pidgeotto Trainer

    Pidgeotto Trainer New Member

    I have a similar deck with Sharpedo/Arcanine/Espeon. Espeon can counter Gardevoir (ex) and in late game can do huge damage. I thought he was better than Cacturne. With either Boost is great. I even try to play either Delcatty pr Furret in my deck at a 2/2. It has meant Sharp/Ar-k/Espy were all 3/2 lines with a Lure Ball or 2 so I can choose which pokemon I want to bring back again depending on the opposing deck. Just an idea. :)
  8. psycodad

    psycodad New Member

    Hey Steve
    I have a deck I posted a while back that is similar. I play espy instead of the shark. Anyways here is what I would do. I would add mirage stadium. It forces a flip for retreating and works well with the poison and burn. I do not use lady outing nor do I use oracle in this deck. I also do not use energy restore. I like TV in this deck. I also like shaman in this deck. I like to play birch with shaman because with shaman you will find yourself frequently with small hands. I would suggest this trainer list.

    Trainers (21)

    3 x Potion
    2 x PokeNav
    2 x Town Volunteers
    2 x Lanette's Net Search
    2 x Professor Elm's Training Method
    4 x shaman
    3 x Professor Oak's Research
    2 x birch
    1 x mirage stadium
  9. SteveP

    SteveP Active Member

    Thanks for the recommendations.

    Regarding MooMoo Milk, I've always wondered why lots of players think they're better than Potion. Statistically, they're identical, and depending on luck, they're either better or worse. Personally, I don't like coin flips, so I'd NEVER replace Potions with MooMoo. I'd add MooMoo if I had room, but I'd NEVER replace. Thanks anyway for that suggestion.

    Regarding the suggestion to replace Multi with Rainbow Energy, I respectfully disagree. In the case of Arcanine, sometimes I actually WANT to turn off the Multi effect so that I don't have to discard them. FYI, my first version of this deck used Rainbow until if found out how better Multi was for the deck. Plus, Multi doesn't have the damage effect.

    Dave, I like the Mirage Stadium and Shaman ideas. Now those truly improve the "Bite Back" nature of the deck. However, I personally don't like to go over about a dozen Supporters, so I'll see how I can fit in the Shaman (maybe take out Oracle). Regarding Espeon, I suppose it depends on the Meta. Right now, I'm the only Gardevoir player, and fire is more prevelent. But, I'll keep the Espeon idea in mind if Psychic starts to show up.

    SwampertEX (and Pidgey Trainer) thanks for the Boost idea. I was really having problems with making Cacturne work. I think you might have solved my problem. Thanks bunches.

    Craig, not evolving is a risky move against this deck. But, if that worked for you, great. That Blazey/draw deck of mine you used Saturday, I've playtested my "bite back" against it and Sharpedo consistantly destroys it. Maybe I SHOULD add Eggsy to that deck Blazey deck.

    So, here's what I'll do:

    - Remove Lady Outing and Oracle
    - Add Boost Energy
    - Add Mirage Stadium
    - See if I can put in Shaman/Birch
    - Prepare an Espeon variation in case the Meta changes

    Thanks everyone.
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2003
  10. Pablo

    Pablo New Member

    Muk-ex wont kill this deck, since it only stops POKE-POWERS, not POKE-BODYS. Read the translation again.
  11. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    Poke-Powers do NOT include Poke-Powers and Poke-Bodies. Pokemon Powers include Poke-Powers and Poke-Bodies. If it says it shuts off Poke-Powers, then it only shuts down Poke-Powers, not Poke-Bodies, or even Pokemon Powers.

    Think of it as a classification system. Pokemon Powers are the main department but Pokemon Powers are split into two sub-departments, Poke-Powers and Poke-Bodies. Neighter influence the other one but when some influences the main department, the sub-departments are influenced as well.

    Pokemon Powers<
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2003
  12. SwampertEX

    SwampertEX New Member

    Hey, I came up with the Cacturne/Boost idea on this thread! :mad:
  13. SwampertEX

    SwampertEX New Member

    By the way, says differently about Muk ex. It says that Toxic Gas shuts off all PokeBODYs :mad: . Click here and see for your self.
  14. Pablo

    Pablo New Member

    well then, i guess we will just have to wait for the official card. I read at fakecard that it only shut off poke-powers.
  15. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    Yeah we will have to wait to see the english version.
  16. SteveP

    SteveP Active Member

    Sorry SwampertEX. I've edited my previous post to reflect credit to you as the first person to suggest the Boost idea for Cacturne.
  17. psycodad

    psycodad New Member

    If you are playing boost and want to play water, you may want to consider merill/azumarill. Boost rocks on azumarill.
  18. SwampertEX

    SwampertEX New Member

    Thanks Steve! ;)
  19. Steven B

    Steven B New Member

    Hi everyone! :)

    Cool deck! :D :pokeball:
  20. SteveP

    SteveP Active Member

    psychodad, yah but taking out Sharpedo dimishes my "Bite Back" theme. The boost is there only for Feint Attack KOing of benched Pokemon, so I'd probably only add 2, too few to use for both Cacturne AND Azumarill. Nevertheless, the free-retreat/paralyzing Marill is certainly one of the best basics out there right now.

    dkates made a suggestion to add Switch. My Pokemon are all 1-energy retreaters. If I add Mirage Stadium, I suppose Switch (or Warp Energy) is necessary. Man, I wish Pokemon decks had a 60-card minimum. I can't fit everything into my deck like I can for my Lord of the Ring decks.
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2003
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