Discussion in 'Random Topic Center' started by TheGeneral, Jan 21, 2010.
Haha I gotcha. See you at states.
I used to be a YGO player but i quited and went for pokemon cards. My friends say it was childish but pokemon cards to me are more fun. I quited YGO because they can somehow just T1/T2 you and 4000 of your life points is gone. But somehow... it seems that pokemon is also moving to that ERA especially with all the DONK decks floating around... To play
YGO, make sure you need a lot of $$$ then you are fine with it. Because BCIF are very expensive most of the time...
...that sounds like the TV show.
I think you might enjoy Pokemon's atmosphere more.
Pokemon is WAY more expensive then yugioh, yeah the decks in a whole cost less in pokemon up front, but after the rotation you might as well through the pokemon deck away cause its not worth anything. in yugioh you can buy 3 destiny draws for like 50-70 bucks but the wont rotate you can use cards from the first set in yugioh. people in pokemon complain about yugiohs ban/limit list but pokemon has a MUCH bigger ban list cause they rotate cards. lightsworn isnt BDIF right now cause everyone is sideing light imprisoning mirrors, and main decking royal oppressions. I would wait before you invest anymoney into the game until the new format comes (limit list is out) which is next month in sometime. but you can go ahead and get staples together like stardust dragon and other syncro cards. http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page <<<<<<< theres a site that gives decklists that top at regionals and stuff so you can look at what the pros are useing. as a deck right now i would suggest twighlight, its kinda like lightsworn but it gives you more options is light imprisioning mirror is on the field. on last thing word amounst the pros is since the yugiohs contract switched holders the new holder is planning on makeing stuff less rare (example honest comeing in tin like boxes) and since its less rare its cheaper, when crush card virus come out as a rare it made my day
The Destiny Draws in Yugioh might not actually get banned, but one of two things will happen -
1. They'll get banned/limited-to-1
2. A new card will come out that obsoletes Destiny Draw or a new archetype will come out that totally hoses your deck and makes them worthless anyway. No rotation = rampant power creep.
You still have to keep up with new sets in Yugioh because the newer cards are better and better. Rotation isn't the only thing that keeps people buying product.
If you're interested in Yugioh, I'd suggest you look into the Pegasus League format - it's basically a rotating format.
edit: Also, when Crush Card became a rare, it also became banned anyway shortly thereafter so... so what?
There are top deckers and cheters in Pokemon too. So what's your point. The game is what you make it. If you go in with a positive attitude and treat people with respect, then players will do the same. We can set a example for the game. Don't judge just by what people say that has happend to them in the past. Decide with your own heart what is right.
I know you wanted to get our opinion, but when you post stuff like this on a Pokemon fourm, this debate is always going to be one sided. So I don't think this is a fair judgment at all.
responses in bold (except where it says "banned anyway" that was you)
also i do recamond playing 2 card games cause they help you learn different things, like yugioh teaches you timeing and card/field advantage, which alot of people in pokemon dont fully understand because pokemon has claydols but in yugioh where there isnt an insane amount of draw power you learn how to hold things in your hand, which can help translate into pokemon when you claydol gets killed or you are faceing plox
Rescue Cat Synchro still requires that you get an Extra Deck that's still a good $100, and one of the better Synchros wound up getting... SHOCK... banned! [Edit: And... topped? So what, anything can top. Most regionals/SJCs have at least one good Rogue deck in top 16. You know what though? Samus has "topped" in an ENORMOUS amount of Smash Bros. Melee tournaments, but hasn't won a single majour tournament... topping doesn't mean crap. another relevant example, people once touted a Cyber Jar control deck, it won a couple regionals... but only one guy was able to do it and later admitted he stacked his deck to re-draw Cyber Jar. sounds cool]
Also, I play three card games, thanks.
Also, even Yugioh now supports a rotating format. Go look up Pegasus League.
Also, you badly oversimplified the limited-to-1 situation. Sometimes when they Limit or Ban a card, it outright kills the archetype... for example Chimeratech was strong at first and the Chimeratech itself was like $50, then they Limited both Future Fusion and Overload Fusion, surprise now your entire Chimeratech deck is worthless COOL!
Amphy, from what I've seen on here (and from league), the common opinion is the same. I posted on THIS forum because I know many players from here also play yugioh, and a few started out from yugioh and transitioned to Pokemon from there. Your statement of "WELL THERE'S CHEATERS IN POKEMON OMGGG" doesn't help what everyone is getting at. I have heard from many people that the reason people keep cheating in yugioh is because if they get caught, the punishment isnt as harsh (if you actually read last page). In Pokemon if you cheat, you will most likely receive a game loss and/or dq. THAT'S MY POINT. I came on here to ask everyones opinion, whether good or bad. I wanted to know. So if all you're going to do is whine about how people are bashing yugioh, then stay out of this thread.
responses in bold
side bar: in a completely unrelated topic this is just to help disprove the stereo type pokemon players have about yuigohs "unfair" ban list yugioh has banned 43 cards, and limited 78 so effected the playablilty of 121 cards. i just got off pokebeach counting (yes i made sure not to include energy and other reprints) Pokemon has banned a little under 3,000 cards not including promos and POP sets. i counted 2994 but i might have missed a few but i doubt it will make a huge difference in the comparison. so 121 comparred to 2994.
this is at thegeneral: please dont belive all the stereo types about yugioh it is a fun game and there are alot of honest people in it
I said Extra Deck not Side deck, I meant the Synchros. Christ.
Dark Strike Fighter was a win condition. They banned the one that wins you the game directly, just like so many other cards that win you the game. The few games I played during that format, I remember people using Dark Strike Fighter during main phase 2 to finish me off A LOT. Best Synchro? Easily.
Who cares how recent it is? Yeah, I'm talking about stuff that happened five years ago because I thought you'd like to hear a relevant yugioh-based example. I haven't followed the game closely in the last four years because the game sucks pretty hardcore and isn't fun to play in tournaments at all, so I can't give you more recent examples - though I know for example during the extremely DAD-centric format there'd always be one or two non-DAD decks in the top 16 (that wouldn't make it to top 8). But yeah, way to dismiss my point entirely because you can't actually counter it.
Way to strawman and ignore my point. The Cyber Jar example was a single deck that somehow won a couple tournaments, but it only made it to the top because the guy admitted to stacking his deck to make sure he re-drew Cyber Jar. I'm saying the only reason his deck broke "the format" was because he cheated. I'm not saying the people that make top 16 or whatever with rogue decks like Rescue Cat are cheating, I'm saying that while they'll occasionally top because of lucky draws, they won't ever win because the top deck is always too strong in Yugioh. Because they have access to too many power cards and too many ridiculous combos. BECAUSE THE CARD POOL IS TOO LARGE. BECAUSE THEY DON'T ROTATE.
You know, I don't exactly know why I'm even continuing this because this gigantic run-on sentence is nearly impossible to decipher, but lemme explain something to you here.
I actually did still follow the game a little bit after I quit (at the time I still had good friends who played), and this was right around when Chimeratech was released. I remember Chimeratech taking quite a few locals and reading about how it topped several SJCs and made a pretty good splash in tournaments, and people on Pojo were whining constantly about how they only limited Future Fusion and not Overload Fusion so Chimeratech was still too strong.
Yeah there's answers to tons of stuff but what do you do when they drop Heavy that same turn? Also half your own examples are totally irrelevant - Zaborg, Smashing, Fissure, Lightning Vortex - none of those worked on Chimeratech because you'd already lost when the Chimera hit the board. I didn't list Chaos Sorceror because this was right after Chaos Sorceror got banned (I know because I quit a month after he got banned). DD Warrior Lady and DD Assassin wouldn't work against Chimeratech because they'd get run down by a different creature clearing the way for the Overdragon. Solemn Judgment wasn't played at all yet during that format either (and at the time was a $2 super rare lol)... so that leaves Mirror Force, Sakuretsu Armour, Widespread Ruin, and Torrential Tribute.
And you know what? Just like today's format, you're a total idiot if you try to attack for game into facedown cards when you don't know what they are. Trunade, Heavy, MST, Dust Tornado, Phoenix Wing...
If your examples of stopping attacks worked as well as you say, nobody would ever be able to attack for game lol.
You're also still badly missing my point.
Yugioh's banlist sucks. Yeah Pokemon has some 3000 cards that can't be played in tournaments, but you know when you get cards exactly when they're expected to leave the format. With Yugioh, you never know for sure. I personally knew a guy that dropped over $300 for a set of three Card Troopers barely two weeks before the card got Limited to 1, completely nuking the card's value and turning his tournament investment into kindling. Card Trooper is playable again in Pegasus League now which is nice, except that said friend quit the game the instant it happened because he was furious about his investment being literally swept out from under him.
And having to remember an entire expansion worth of cards that are either banned or limited is insane. It's so much easier for cards to cycle out over time at fixed intervals, it makes for much easier bookkeeping and organisation.
When the card pool is as large as Pokemon's or Yugioh's, you generally NEED to start getting rid of cards for the health of the game, both for the sake of the format and for the sake of the playtesters having to test new cards against tens of thousands of other cards in enormous combinations (which is where problem cards usually arise, when forgotten cards suddenly combine too well with newer cards which the playtesters couldn't have thought of).
From what I've read on Yugioh forums, people that have tried Pegasus League format have LOVED it because there's much more variety in decks and much more flexibility in deck building because you aren't inundated with staple cards you HAVE to run because they're that good.
Also having half your deck be one-ofs (because they're limited to 1) makes consistency hard and makes lucky topdecking far too common, something that pissed me off badly every time I tried to play the game "Good job, you drew Brain Control with no cards in hand or in play, and stole my big guy that I spent all my resources getting out... game 2?" makes for such a fun experience, lemme tell ya.
responces in bold
Rescue Cat is one example.
It was barely played at all for years, Then new cards and mechanics come along.The result? A ridiculously broken OTKO deck, followed by the inevitable bans and restrictions . . .
I don't want to diss another card game nor want to make this a spam post. But YuGiOh seems to me, a battle of who has the most money and there are like only a few competitive decks that you can play, seems pretty boring.
Wait, how is that an OTK you summoner munk a cat cat for an airebellum and black panther then synch either the airbellum and panther for brionac (which is def. the better play)and return their field to thier hand and then swing for 2300. or synch them all for mist wurm field goes to thier hand and swing for 2500? niether wich are OTKs
have you actually sat down and played it? not heard what others say or watched but actually played it? thier is a lot of math involved figuering out the odds of thier face downs, chance they will mill a JD, if they are holding Gorz, how much of a chain of tunes they can put out if you are playing against zombies and if you can survive it. t also teaches field advantage and timeing like no other game. i dont want to turn this into a spam thread either but i think alot of how people view the game is based on stereo types. final thought if it was such a awful game that had no skill and truely was the worst thing ever why does it have it such a huge fallowing?
OTK was possible with Synchro Cat, though it isn't easy:
Summoner Monk -> Summoner Monk ->Rescue Cat -> 2 x Airbellum -> Synchro Summon DSF + Arcanite Magician.
Regardless, the deck was stupidly broken.
But in any case, you ignore the real point: a previously unused card (Rescue Cat) becomes a huge problem because of interactions with new cards and mechanics which leads to bans and limitations.
Random Kid said he couldn't think of an example.
I provided one.
trying to be a good yu-gi-oh player is like trying to be a good roulette player without a system.
I play yugioh and if you want to be slightly competitive then plan on spending 500 at least but can be about 1000
this is very true, this explains perfectly why the same kids win all the tournoments
The same way people win consistently at roulette. Rampant cheating and huge initial capital invested.
Separate names with a comma.