Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

UK Nationals: horrible decision- comments please...

Weeelllll............. Since I was judge of the 11-14 age group and this problem concerned the 15+ I am not qualified to comment on it, just to say that I think perhaps Graeme,Irwin and PUI/TPFG should really put their heads together and come up with an agreeable solution! Furthermore perhaps the amended records should be made available to satisfy everyone that Irwin didnt miss out!
Anyway apart from that congratulations to everyone that took part ( judges,players and TPFG staff ) for a terrific event. Except for the aforementioned controversy the event went fairly smoothly with a few minor hiccups. I dont think I have ever attended a major pokemon event where there havnt been a few niggles!!
Congratulations to Jake Arnold in the 10-, Yacine Sekkoum 11-14 and Freddy K in the 15+. All worthy winners!! And of course special congrats go to Team Battlenet from Norwich who put up a very,very respectable showing for their first major tournament!! Well done Tariq,Giga,Adam,Bruce ( who took the draft event ) Marcus ( the demon charizard collector! ) and especially to my son Shaun ( PokePup1 ) who blitzed the 10- age group with a 5-0 in the qualifying stage, a 2-0 in the semi final and only just lost out 2-1 in the final which was apparently a very good and tight match! Got the invite to Worlds, now just got to get the money!!
I sincerely hope that everyone enjoyed themselves ( I think they did in my judging group 11-14 who were all perfect sports!) Irwin, I also hope you get your problem resolved. I'm sure something can be sorted!
Anyway, great event and now bring on Worlds!!!
 
irwinmalek said:
Not even the people who actually RUN POP over at PUI.
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You have to make the head judge's decision final, anything else could drag decisions on the result of tournaments on for ages.

I agree that it would be good for you to get the actual file to see what would have happened with the rigt result entered, but odds of you making the top-8 is very poor. You would need to be in the top-2 of the people on 9 points to make the top-8, these spots are almost universally taken by players who lost in the last round.

This is a function of the way resistance works in Swiss tournaments. These players had better or same record as you after rounds 1-4 and thefore met people with better records than you did, so you most likely had an inferior resistance even before the last round. The last round would then (typically) have reduced your resistance (because your opponent last to you) whereas the players that lost the last game increased their resistance (because their opponent won). Please note that this analysis is no guarantee, it just shows what would happen in the vast majority of cases.

Which rounds did you win of the first 4? You might have a chance if you won the first two and lost the second two, you are a certain out if you lost the first two, anything in between is possible but unlikely.
 
I won the first game, and two others, but as someone already has said, my tiebreaker WAS high before the last round of Swiss.

This still doesn't actually prove anything, and the TRN file would be of absoloutely NO use to me as I have no access to the Nintnedo software.

Thanks for the suggestions though. More input anyone?
 
annisarich said:
even if put in the top 8 nothing sure about winning and getting into the trip?
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And at no point did I say it was...

I have said that I would have had a chance.
Others have said I would have had a good chance.
As I HAVE said, we will never know :(

I'm not asking for a free trip just because there is a chance I may have been in the top 8. That would be insane, and I am not insane.

I'm asking for peoples' opinion on the decision.
 
I hope that you get a response soon from PUI to help resolve things between yourself, Graeme and TPFG. I like what TheGame6666 (Martin) said and think that route forward would be the most productive.

I know that it's upsetting Irwin but we all have to respect the fact that Graeme's decision is final - but I hope perhaps PUI with thought will consider making an exception in this particular case after weighing everything out, and resolve things amicably by giving an invitation at least to make up for some of the stress you've had to go through. I really do.

Perhaps we'll see you at the Grinders though as time unfolds. Who knows.

~fK
 
Graeme is the Best Head judge in the UK and im sure many people agree who have played in any of the tournys he has watched over. On this occasion he was provided with information from the score keeper to SUGGEST that irwin would not make t8, maybe he was wrong in doing so. However he is a firm and important figure in POP in the Uk and i hope he can take more experience from the event and the situation himself and Irwin are now in.
THIS does not meen i am taking sides just that i feel Graeme should be respected for his decision on the day as it was a Brave if so wrong 1.
I also think that Irwin and alot of the london league have contributed alot to the game in the UK and it would be a ..... errr VERY BAD THING if he was not compensated in sum way for the blunder made by the scorekeeper.
IRWIN SHOULD GET AN INVITE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :clap:

...amph... :cool:
 
These are the ammended standings after round five with the corrected result for Irwin's final game:

Rankings (Round5)
Rank Player Score Wins Losses Ties TieBrk
1 Chris McGivern 13 4 0 1 57%
2 Faisal Khan 13 4 0 1 45%
3 John Hawkins 12 4 1 0 38%
4 Ian Fotheringham 11 3 0 2 60%
5 Nitesh Doolub 11 3 0 2 50%
6 Geoff Woodhead 10 3 1 1 56%
7 Ben Ward 9 3 2 0 65%
8 Stuart Wright 9 3 2 0 56%
8 Mick Arnold 9 3 2 0 56%
10 Gordon White 9 3 2 0 54%
11 Jonathon Sanchez 9 3 2 0 52%
12 Irwin Malek-Chair 9 3 2 0 48%
13 Tariq Sagaiar 7 2 2 1 64%
14 John Fotheringham 7 2 2 1 64%
15 Stephen Purnell 7 2 2 1 45%
16 Kraig Liston 6 2 3 0 56%
17 Dennis Hopgood 6 2 3 0 48%
18 Chirs Callaway 6 2 3 0 44%
19 Liz Roberts 6 2 3 0 40%
20 Emma Bruce 6 2 3 0 40%
21 Stephen Kish 6 2 3 0 37%
22 S ORourke 6 2 3 0 32%
23 Adam Gadin 6 2 3 0 32%
24 Russell Murray 3 1 4 0 44%
25 Alison White 3 1 4 0 36%
26 Martin Giggs 0 0 3 0 60%
27 Giga Jovi 0 0 5 0 34%

I hope this settles the matter.

Lee the scorekeeper is one of (if not then THE) top scorekeepers in the country. He did not plan to use DCI reporter on the day and did not have only an hours practice before the event - let's scotch those untruths firstly.

Lee is a verteran of 1000+ Magic TG sanctioned events and has been known to run a 132 player tournament ON PAPER ALONE and still get rankings and pairings right as when the computer did it afterward - that is how good he is !!! Before anyone raises the point, yes two results were incorrectly entered on the day but that was more down to my crappy handwriting than anything else and the unfamiliarity with the TMS style results slips. There are few other people I can ask to work out a result in their head and know the answer I get is not going to be a 'best guess' but the actual answer; unfortunately most of you are not familiar with the Magic TG scene so he was unknown to you.

To set the record straight he had a full day trainng on the system with Jarod from POP who came over from the USA for the event. Jarod is taking Lee's recomedations on how to improve TMS back to the US with him and let's hope a few of them get picked up and implemented. TMS did crash 5 times during the event but how many of you noticed ??
 
The judgeing at the UK pokémon nationals was rubbish. Some of the 10- players new more then the judges did. There was a case with a rare candy. Someone play a ralts one turn then next turn evolved it then evolved with rare candy into gardevoir. I no you cant do that. Also the prizeing was rubbish. 4 people under me got better prizes then me. In the whole the nationals was rubbish. Being the fact in Birmingham and most of the people came from the south of England, the competition didnt really find the real champion.
 
I was not at the UK National (that why Freddy has won :lol: ), but I think something interesting may be learned from what happened.

In main events, rankings should be made public between EACH round and time should be given to the players to check their points before the new pairing is made.
After, let's say, 10 minutes after the publication of the rankings, the results are considered as definitive and will not be changed anymore.
Players would have a responsibility too, as we all know that typing a wrong result can happen to any of us.

About what happened to Irwin, I don't underdstand that judges, TO or Jarrod do prefer to leave a mistake made by a member of the staff uncorrected instead of taking the time to correct it.
Organisational problems if they correct it ? Maybe, but it's the staff's job to cope with tournament organization and problems that can happen.

We, and Irwin, will never be sure of his result. Would he have made top 8 or not, I don't believe that, honestly, anybody can tell without correcting the result and see what happens.

I've never run a National, and I will never run one. But at my poor little local tournaments, when I make a mistake (and it has happened with more than 30 players), I do correct it, even if I have to make a new pairing and if some players are unhappy.

A player has won ? He deserves 3 points, period. Would that change the rankings ? It doesn't matter, it's just a question of fairness.
 
PokemonSteve said:
The judgeing at the UK pokémon nationals was rubbish. Some of the 10- players new more then the judges did. There was a case with a rare candy. Someone play a ralts one turn then next turn evolved it then evolved with rare candy into gardevoir. I no you cant do that. Also the prizeing was rubbish. 4 people under me got better prizes then me. In the whole the nationals was rubbish. Being the fact in Birmingham and most of the people came from the south of England, the competition didnt really find the real champion.
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Did that player call for the head judge if they were unhappy with the table judge ruling ??
 
'Pokemon Steve' i happen to think the judging was excellent... and wat do u meen the real champ was not found ? 3 very great players won and no credit should be takin away from any of them!!! :mad:

anyway wat age did u play in ? i havent ever heard of u?

...amph... :cool:
 
Thank you for posting these results, somewhat....late, maybe?

I guess what I am saying is, they shouldn't have been posted on the board, they should have been posted ON THE DAY, when the mistake had been pointed out. None of this would have happened.

Would it really have taken that much of your time and effort?

I am happy to see these results, but the fact remains that, for the last 2 days, I've had no idea WHERE I placed, WHY I don't know yet, and WHAT to do...

My e-mail has already gone out to Dave over at PUI, and I am afraid to say that at this stage I will continue with my enquiry with PUI as ti why this has happened.

As many have pointed out, this has caused undue stress, all of which could have been prevented.

I AM grateful to you for posting these results, yes, but this really doesn't change much for me.

As I said, the last 2 days, I have spent ages wondering about what has happened and why.
I spent the latter half of Saturday not understanding the decisions that had been made, and in an irresponsible manner, I should add.

It's now not a matter of what happened, but the whole principle of it. I still firmly believe that the wrong decision was made on the day, by a long way....

Let's see what PUI have to say about it, having considered what happened, the way it was handled, and peoples' individual opinions on it?
 
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irwinmalek said:
On a side note, Pokémon Steve, that was me who played the Ralts -> next turn -> Kirlia + Rare Candy -> Gardy/Gardy EX, and yes, that was allowed, as the judges pointed out.
Rare Candy can only be used on a basic, you can't use it after you have evolved to stage 1 READ THE CARD !!!. Steve was right - Caution to IMC for illegal Play ...... :rolleyes:
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After reading the vast numbers of posts, it seems this situation has caused somewhat of a stir and if not distress for IMC. If this was point out on the day it would have saved alot of unwanted argument and chaos.
 
Oh and while I'm at it - change that signature Irwin, nationals was over two days ago !!! (in case you hadn't noticed)
 
hi all,

if anyone important from like PUI or watever will know that although Irwin may not have made the cut it is the fact that wat if he had made the cut but the same decision was passed anyway and a good friend of mine was dis-allowed a place at worlds...

it may seem a biast view but i will stick with him all the way 100% knowing that the way he was made to feel on that day NO1 should have to go through, I have never seen him so upset and i dont think he should be left un compensated for the position he was put in.

the least they can do is give him an INVITE....the LEAST :mad:

...amph... :cool:
 
Irwin, it was bad, but atleast now you know. It should have been fixed at the event, and I guess that is the big problem now.
 
Thinking back on what Toonpark has also said, the judging DID seem to be somewhat inconsistant.

Nitish brought up a point about one of his results being entered wrong. Toonpark correctly says that this was fixed... Can you see what I'm getting at? Is there any reason that that particular result was changed, wheras mine, which was in the same tournament, less than one or two hours later, was not changed?

Anyway, the event was fun except for after this whole situation happened, it was actually quite amusing at one point when I talked to Jarrod and challenged him to a game. His response: He was trying to get his mind off Pokémon... Lol..

I'm talking to PUI propeerly today, as I think the whole Indepandance Day celebrations...
 
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