Cheating in Pokémon TCG

[ShadowGuard]

maybe the better discussion topic would be why would a player NOT call a judge when a situation like you describe in the OP occurs?

i hear/read this all the time, it seems: this happened, so-and-so is 'known' to be a cheater...but nobody wants to call a judge over at the time the problem(s) happens!

sure, you 'handled it' yourself THIS time...but that doesn't get the bad habit corrected, nor a pattern of issues with a particular player tracked with either the judges or P!P, who could actually DO something about it..

'mom

Well, that's true and should be the first thing you do, but there are situations were it isn't possible.
a) if you realize later you have been cheated - happened to me at Prague Cup 2010 were my opponent used a card to counter me that I later found out wasn't in his decklist
b) if the judges are either not well trained or even biased and just can't or don't want to do anything

In general, it is true and a player should at least contact a judge after the match if his opponent acted suspicious. That wouldn't help him win the match but give the judges a hint to watch him without warning the player, and also without making the thing public (since it could be just an error).

But to come back to the thread, what I mentioned above is the only time where I'm certain my opponent cheated. Fortunately, cheating isn't such a big issue in Pokémon as it is in YGO or Magic. And, we have a really good judge at most big tournaments in my region who is also head judge at our nationals.

 

[Pooka]

I was the one involved in the game described in the OP. I know for a fact my opponent did everything on accident, and I knew exactly what cards went back into his hand, so the situation was resolved easily. Weird things happen sometimes where you don't remember what's happening exactly; we are human, and we make mistakes. It was an honest mistake that was caught and resolved immediately.

As for the topic of cheating itself, there always is going to be an opportunity for people to cheat in card games. In some degree, there is an honor system between players that must be established. Most of the time, trying to catch someone cheating boils down to a "he said/she said" situation where it's one player's word against the other. I don't know if there is anything you can do to prevent this, but we are fortunate to have (for the most part) a community of players that understands that both players have an obligation to play fairly.

 

[Top Cut Comics]

Now it's something I'll pay attention to more often, just in case.

This was the very thing I was afraid a topic like this would start.

As a store owner, I see players from all sorts of games. Some games actually warrant this type of concern. Pokemon however is not one of them. I would hate to sit at the tables across from someone who believes that there are nothing but cheaters playing this game. I think bringing a topic like this to the forefront and outright accusing someone of cheating base on your perception is rediculous.

I think there is a clear dividing line between cheating and mistakes. Simply watching a video, can you truely tell the difference? I sure couldnt.

I do not think that the community as a whole believes that there are players in this game that outright cheat. As a player who has been around the game for 12+ years I can, IN FACT, tell you that this is NOT the case.

Sure, there will be individuals who make bad choices for whatever reason, but NO ONE comes to a POKEMON event anticipating a way to cheat the game and the players across from them.

There are games that have that sort of thing going on. I guess untill you have seen it you wont appreciate how great our player base truely is.

Btw, disagreeing with your position does NOT mean I am trying to ruin your thread. It clearly needed a different direction.

Jimmy

 

[jjkkl]

Played against a guy with five Rainbow energies. When I called him out on it, he said "nah I used a Flower Shop to get them back".

:|

Oh man, what a guy.

 

[Top Cut Comics]

Played against a guy with five Rainbow energies. When I called him out on it, he said "nah I used a Flower Shop to get them back".
.

So my questions are, why'd you let it happen? in this scenario you seem like the educated player...
Was a judge called?
Is this player a newer player who dont know the rules?
Was this a premier event or some local play?

This to me seems like a player who didnt know any better. I sure hope someone took the time to show him the error so it would not happen again in the future.

Jimmy

 

[Shen]

I believe (or would like to believe) that most instances of cheating in this game originate in the way that was described in the OP. The player makes a mistake and has to make a decision about whether to come forward with it, or keep silent. IMO it's a different kind of cheating than someone going out of their way to manipulate the game in their favor. The kind of cheating we're talking about is probably less common because of the great judges we have. Seriously, the judges that get involved with this game are the reason why cheating is not so prevalent. We have excellent judges (at least in my area) that will take the time to resolve an in game issue in the FAIREST way possible. If there is a mistake that can easily be resolved, the judges are there for you.

For example, I one time accidentally played 2 supporters in one turn, the second being Bebe's Search which I had used to search out a Pokemon and evolve one on the field. It had no immediate effect on the game state, and I didn't catch it until after I attacked. Before my opponent started his turn I admitted my mistake and called a judge, who in turn contacted the head judge of the event (Troy Lesky, some of you may know him on here as TLesky). He worked with us to repair the game state at the cost of a prize penalty.

Now, I've heard horror stories of players making similar, minor mistakes which resulted in much harsher penalties... but they are pretty rare. Most of the time, our judges offer us fair penalties (because we all make mistakes). Imagine if they just ruled every mistake a game loss... everyone would try to get away with cheating, because they'd be discouraged from admitting their mistakes. My advice is to just call a judge, and appeal to the HJ as soon as you notice a mistake either by you or your opponent. This resolves things before they get out of control.

EDIT: That's not to say that the judges aren't good at resolving ALL types of cheating We have some pretty sharp ones... picking out marked sleeves before deck checks are even performed and catching people stacking decks while they're shuffling.

 

[Josh_the_great]

If ur opponent cheats CALL A JUDGE! It is really that simple
Posted with Mobile style...

 

[jjkkl]

So my questions are, why'd you let it happen? in this scenario you seem like the educated player...
Was a judge called?
Is this player a newer player who dont know the rules?
Was this a premier event or some local play?

This to me seems like a player who didnt know any better. I sure hope someone took the time to show him the error so it would not happen again in the future.

Jimmy

Nah, he legit had five Rainbows, and then lied about using a Flower Shop Lady (which he didn't have).

Thankfully, this never happened in any competitive sense, but if it did, I would have been slightly more peeved. Just slightly.

 

[Magmarizer]

The worst I've had to deal with is this one guy who always tries to argue the rules in his favor. Like arguing the rules of his opponents Fainting Spell when he has used a Gengar deck previously. He also tries to use other card games rules to prove his points. It is really annoying because we know he know the rules.

 

[Ness]

Cheating in card games has existed centuries before any of us were born. If you expand your horizons to play other card games, you'll quickly learn that Pokémon has a more honest, friendly base than any other card game you'll encounter. There's always a few bad apples in anything that draws thousands of people. Don't let them discourage you from enjoying a great game.

 

[mikeg542]

This was the very thing I was afraid a topic like this would start.

To tell you the truth, with the amount of cheating I've experienced in my 6 major tournaments and league for pokemon, I'd say it's one of the worst games for it. If you didn't explain your situation further, my first gut reaction was you wanted players to remain not vigilant to take advantage.

How could you ever say you were afraid that this thread would cause people to be aware of and check for cheating?

It happens. Period. And having people know that and watch for it (not assume it, but be vigilant), will make the game nothing but a more fair and enjoyable play experience.

 

[TheRolesWePlay]

To tell you the truth, with the amount of cheating I've experienced in my 6 major tournaments and league for pokemon, I'd say it's one of the worst games for it. If you didn't explain your situation further, my first gut reaction was you wanted players to remain not vigilant to take advantage.

How could you ever say you were afraid that this thread would cause people to be aware of and check for cheating?

It happens. Period. And having people know that and watch for it (not assume it, but be vigilant), will make the game nothing but a more fair and enjoyable play experience.

However when topics like this arise then some people might start accusing others of cheating. Being vigilant is fine, but what some of us are afraid of is the way some people will try to stop it.

 

[Rambo1000]

i never thought anyone cheated at pokemon until this past nats.

 

[CFOURCOLTSFAN]

I was the one involved in the game described in the OP. I know for a fact my opponent did everything on accident, and I knew exactly what cards went back into his hand, so the situation was resolved easily. Weird things happen sometimes where you don't remember what's happening exactly; we are human, and we make mistakes. It was an honest mistake that was caught and resolved immediately.

As for the topic of cheating itself, there always is going to be an opportunity for people to cheat in card games. In some degree, there is an honor system between players that must be established. Most of the time, trying to catch someone cheating boils down to a "he said/she said" situation where it's one player's word against the other. I don't know if there is anything you can do to prevent this, but we are fortunate to have (for the most part) a community of players that understands that both players have an obligation to play fairly.

yeah i mean weird things tend to happen in games and i agree w/ this(aka trying to afterburner from hand, i have no idea what i was doing)
but like even in testing games the most random things happen, so if it's not intentional there's no reason to get stressed out about, actually cheating happens, but usually it's hard to "prove", and for the most part i feel like it isn't a huge part of pokemon compared to other tcg games.

 

[mikeg542]

Who cares if you are accused of cheating? If you aren't a sketchy player and don't cheat, it will do absolutely nothing to you and will probably hurt the credibility of the accuser. If you do cheat, however, then having all the players saying 'cheating isn't a big part of the game and we shouldn't talk about it' is the biggest boon ever. It makes it easy to get away with.

 

[Otaku]

Does cheating happen in Pokemon? Of course. You have some people who intentionally cheat. Just remember not to casually throw accusations around, and if you make a serious one be ready for the consequences if you prove wrong... and be civil about it.

 

[MagnEels]

Hi

Why need to Cheat TCG? I don´t get

Winning isn´t most important thing, playing is more important
It need to be fun.. I wanna win games, Of course but I never cheat for win

I just wanna play fair games, not cheating
I know someone people trying to cheat

Someone tried to cheat me, he tried to get 4 Basic Pokemons with Collector but I saw that before he cheated me

That´s not fair game If someone cheat, do they fear for losing or something?
If someone trying to cheat you, CALL A JUDGE!!

 

[Rambo]

I don't usually call judges after an incident a while ago at a nationals where my opponent made an incorrect ruling, of evolving on his first turn, and after calling a judge over, he gave the wrong ruling and lost me the game. Although this was 6 years ago so I should probably let it go by now.

People cheat all the time, even in ways that aren't necessarily considered to all to be cheating. I know people, not naming names that realise they can only win on a time limit and spend excessive amounts of time shuffling the deck, breaking the rules. Some people don't know ruling of how long you can shuffle your decks for, or find it hard to check if they actually are taking a long time, so won't call a judge over.

A lot of the time the issue of calling a judge over comes from personal confidence/knowledge of the player on whether or not to call a judge, some people recognise this and try to exploit it. So I feel it is an issue worth talking about.

 

[Victory Bell]

I think people throw the word "cheating/cheater" WAY to much in this game. Often it's just an accident. Every time my opponent has forgotten to show me the Pokemon for Comm, I catch them. It has always been a Pokemon. No cheating intended.

Not to say cheating isn't a problem. A "judge" from my area said to me a while ago that Pokemon had more cheating in it than a game like Magic. I thought it was funny/hypocritical that the PTO she worked under does nothing to try to prevent it. I haven't had my deck checked at a local event IN 5 YEARS. And (not to brag) but I top cut pretty consistently. I could be playing 5 collector for the longest time and NOBODY WOULD EVER KNOW providing I was smart about it (theoretically of course). But according to that judge she could somehow manage to catch me if I did that... according to her. Cheating does happen, in my opinion very rarely on purpose. But it's up to players and judges to be vigilant.

My issue with my region's lack of deck checks is another problem entirely.

 

[Nugget_]

^Hi Dylan! How goes it?