Hide and Seek...

[|PoKeY|]

oh ya i forgot to mention

O and BTW if u have a Ninja up, than Aggy's attk is useless right? And if you can't attk, let your opponent deck themselves! That's why it's always good to have a backup plan. lol

If you had read the cards b4 posting, you would have already known that Shedinja only prevents damage and effects to Shedinja, thus allowing the benched pokemon except shedy, to be vulnerable to damage.
So they could just surge ur bench to death.

 

[SwampertEX]

First, I would drop Ancient Ruins. You've got 9 supporters in this deck. That's quite a few and chances are that you won't get many opportunities to us Ancient Ruins.

Second, I think you've got too much energy. The only thing you really need to power up in a single Gengar and then use the rest of the energy for retreating Shedinja.

Third, beware of Ampharos EX. Shedinja only has 30 HP and if you're getting hit with 10 each time you attach energy (in order to retreat Shedinja (you won't always have a Switch or Warp Point)) you're going to run out of HP pretty quick. Consider teching in a Potion or two.

The power is nice, but it's not something you're going to be relying on. As a matter of fact, this deck would be just as good if Gengar had no power whatsoever.

From my perspective, there are 3 major decks right now: Gardevoir, Ampharos, and BAR. This deck is dominant against Gardevoir. I've had success with it against Amphy, and my daughter went 1-1 against BARs. We're play-testing it right now against those 3 decks (created from CC-winning and high-finishing deck lists posted on Pokegym) and it's doing well against all 3. Can it consistently beat Gardevoir? Yes. Can it consistently beat Ampharos? It's going about a 75% clip right now. BAR? Not sure. There's a lot of bad BAR out there and a lot of people who have copied BAR decks are don't play them well. Against those, this deck will probably be ok. But if you run up against a good player with a highly-tuned BAR, probably not.

I agree w/ some of your statements, but some not so much... First off, I only have 6 supporters in this deck. I agree w/ the nrg statement and will most likely add some Smoochum/Magby (prolly not Magby b/c of Ruins). Another reason why I play ruins is to get rid of HPS and LPS and other Stadiums my opponent might be leeching off of.lol I also agree w/ your statement about Ninja and I will try to find room for healing. Thx alot for your input, I appreciate it it's prolly helped the most yet. lol So here's the improved deck:

Hide and Seek... v2 (E-on)

Pokemon: 19
3 Gastly (Exp)
3 Haunter (2 Exp, 1 SK)
3 Gengar (Exp)
3 Nincada
3 Shedinja
4 Smoochum (AQ)

Energy: 12
9 Psychic
3 Warp

Trainers: 31
4 Root Fossil
4 Claw Fossil
3 POR
3 Shaman
2 Ancient Ruins
3 Master Ball
3 Switch
3 Warp Point
4 Potion/Moo-Moo

That's the deck. Any more suggestions?

 

[davechri]

Dang, you're right. For some reason I thought Rare Candy was a supporter.

Six supporters? Ok, I'm with you. I'd keep Ancient Ruins.

Looks good.

This may just be a personal style thing, but I am not so crazy about the whole baby thing. They were great when you could Focus Band them, but without it, they're one coin flip away from a KO and, more importantly in this case, a prize. I've got to ask "What do I gain by hiding behind a baby (let's say you have 4 in the deck) versus hiding behind a Fossil (let's say you add 4 Mysterious Fossils)?"

Do either of those baby's attacks improve this deck?

I would just think hard about that in the context of your opponent being one coin flip away from getting a prize.

Nice deck though (and good discussion).

 

[SwampertEX]

Dang, you're right. For some reason I thought Rare Candy was a supporter.

Six supporters? Ok, I'm with you. I'd keep Ancient Ruins.

Looks good.

This may just be a personal style thing, but I am not so crazy about the whole baby thing. They were great when you could Focus Band them, but without it, they're one coin flip away from a KO and, more importantly in this case, a prize. I've got to ask "What do I gain by hiding behind a baby (let's say you have 4 in the deck) versus hiding behind a Fossil (let's say you add 4 Mysterious Fossils)?"

Do either of those baby's attacks improve this deck?

I would just think hard about that in the context of your opponent being one coin flip away from getting a prize.

Nice deck though (and good discussion).

BTW the first version of the deck had no Ninja 2 Myst fossils and 4 Smoochum and it worked purdy well. Smoochy saved me from PLENTY Blaze bench attks and I'm not sure but even if you attk the bench, don't you have to flip for the baby power? And to answer your question, no the babies attks don't help the deck, but they help and AWFUL lot more than you would think. Even if your opponent does get a prize from Smoochy it gives you a better chance of using Gar's power and if it isn't knocked out, your opponent wasted an attk and is Gengar bait next turn. lol I really like ancient ruins in this deck 4 mor reasons than 1. First it basicaly gives me a solid 1 card every turn no strings attached. Second, it can slow your decking process. For instance, if I ran a whole buncha supporters, I would risk decking myself b4 my opponent and then loose my backup strategy and the game. Thx so much for your imput! I like a nice healthy discussion (Not ARGUMENT, discussion) every once in a while. TTYL
-Swampy

 

[SwampertEX]

Hide and Seek... v3 (E-on)

Pokemon: 17
3 Gastly (Exp)
3 Haunter (2 Exp, 1 SK)
3 Gengar (Exp)
2 Nincada
2 Shedinja
4 Smoochum (AQ)

Energy: 12
9 Psychic
3 Warp

Trainers: 31
4 Root Fossil
4 Claw Fossil
3 POR
3 Shaman
2 Ancient Ruins
3 Master Ball
3 Switch
3 Warp Point
3 Moo-Moo Milk (Got me outta a few tight situations)
2 Strength Charm
1 Town Volunteers

This deck is gr8. I had a couple Gengars out in my last game and my opponent had 3 prizes so he kept bench attking Gar w/ Kingdra and I moved all but 10 dmg to Root Fossils and eliminating the dmg. this deck's record is now 3/2. I'm proud of it and I'd like to keep getting suggestions. O and FYI I won against the King. Thx!
-Swampy

 

[duanojo]

"What do I gain by hiding behind a baby (let's say you have 4 in the deck) versus hiding behind a Fossil (let's say you add 4 Mysterious Fossils)?"

A Mysterious Fossil is an almost certain KO, while I have had a baby stall for three to four turns many a times before being knocked out. Even though you don't give up a prize on KO, the Fossil is gone for good then. It's not hard to get a baby back onto the field from your discard if you need to. Plus, you either have to discard the Fossil or switch it out if your opponent doesn't knock it out. This, is IMO, a waste of cards. Finally, babies are easier to get out of the deck using Master Ball or Dunsparce.

And, if the attacking Pokemon is confused, that's even better than Focus Band because the attacker also does damage to itself.

 

[davechri]

A Mysterious Fossil is an almost certain KO, while I have had a baby stall for three to four turns many a times before being knocked out. Even though you don't give up a prize on KO, the Fossil is gone for good then. It's not hard to get a baby back onto the field from your discard if you need to. Plus, you either have to discard the Fossil or switch it out if your opponent doesn't knock it out. This, is IMO, a waste of cards. Finally, babies are easier to get out of the deck using Master Ball or Dunsparce.

And, if the attacking Pokemon is confused, that's even better than Focus Band because the attacker also does damage to itself.

We may just have a difference in style, but I'll just add a couple of things.

1. If you have a baby stall for 3-4 turns, you're getting very lucky on the flips. Do you really want to build a deck based on that?

2. You need to run enough Fossils to be able to get them when you need them. And you tactically choose between putting a Fossil up or a Shedinja up (or even bringing up something else to sacrifice so you opponent can get down to 3 prizes so you can Chaos Move).

3. How is the attacking Pokemon confused? Am I missing something or is there a card in this deck that confuses the Defending Pokemon?

There's more than one way to skin a cat. For me, I'm just not a fan of the babies in this new format. But that's just me. I've seen other people do well with them. And I know other people building variants of this deck that I just wouldn't do well playing, but it's working great for them.

I think it all comes down to playing style and expectations. The reasons above are nothing more than my reasons for not going this direction. Others' mileage may vary.

 

[SwampertEX]

We may just have a difference in style, but I'll just add a couple of things.

1. If you have a baby stall for 3-4 turns, you're getting very lucky on the flips. Do you really want to build a deck based on that?

2. You need to run enough Fossils to be able to get them when you need them. And you tactically choose between putting a Fossil up or a Shedinja up (or even bringing up something else to sacrifice so you opponent can get down to 3 prizes so you can Chaos Move).

3. How is the attacking Pokemon confused? Am I missing something or is there a card in this deck that confuses the Defending Pokemon?

There's more than one way to skin a cat. For me, I'm just not a fan of the babies in this new format. But that's just me. I've seen other people do well with them. And I know other people building variants of this deck that I just wouldn't do well playing, but it's working great for them.

I think it all comes down to playing style and expectations. The reasons above are nothing more than my reasons for not going this direction. Others' mileage may vary.

Remember who your talking to here. I'm the Fluff master for E-on and don't you forget it! rotfl I played a Fluff deck in MOD and won at my league for like a month strait. I was undefeated, but I got sick of it. Plus I like the excitement and the idea that the whole game may be descided on a single flip. It is definately a difference in style and nothing more. lol I was thinking of adding the Magby/HPS a few times, but I like ruins SOOO much better. it saved my butt a few times. Thx for responding, but PoKeY, I appologize if I hurt your feelings, but I didn't mean to offend you. I just lost my head w/ that post about u and I'm sorry. And in the future, plz don't IM me to harass me, IM me to talk or have a healthy discussion (NOT AN ARGUEMENT). Thx
-Swampy

 

[davechri]

Remember who your talking to here. I'm the Fluff master for E-on and don't you forget it! rotfl I played a Fluff deck in MOD and won at my league for like a month strait. I was undefeated, but I got sick of it. Plus I like the excitement and the idea that the whole game may be descided on a single flip. It is definately a difference in style and nothing more. lol I was thinking of adding the Magby/HPS a few times, but I like ruins SOOO much better. it saved my butt a few times. Thx for responding, but PoKeY, I appologize if I hurt your feelings, but I didn't mean to offend you. I just lost my head w/ that post about u and I'm sorry. And in the future, plz don't IM me to harass me, IM me to talk or have a healthy discussion (NOT AN ARGUEMENT). Thx
-Swampy

I'm reminded of a quote from "Jerry McGuire" when Cuba Gooding Jr. says to Tom Cruise "You know the difference between me and you? You think we're fighting, I think we're finally talking!" (Or something like that).

I am ALL over Jumpluff. Decent HP (forget that he's Stage 2, it's the Power that make him), resistant to water, free retreat - he's AWESOME.

And my first cut at a Gengar deck was a Gengar/Jumpluff/Shedinja deck.

IT STUNK! I did not get Jumpluff out one single time in the entire tournament.

I had to come up with Plan B and the Fossils was it. I still prefer the CONCEPT of the Gengar/Jumpluff deck, but 2 Stage 2 lines is just too much I think.

 

[duanojo]

3. How is the attacking Pokemon confused? Am I missing something or is there a card in this deck that confuses the Defending Pokemon?

I was talking about my version of a Gengar deck which uses SS Golduck's power to confuse the opponent. With HPS, I use Golduck to confuse, then retreat and attack with Gengar, and then put in Magby to block.

 

[SwampertEX]

Hide and Seek... v4 (E-on)
(A.K.A. Baby Porter)

Pokemon: 13
3 Gastly (Exp)
3 Haunter (2 Exp, 1 SK)
3 Gengar (Exp)
4 Magby (EX)

Energy: 12
9 Psychic
3 Warp

Trainers: 35
4 Root Fossil
4 Claw Fossil
4 POR
3 Shaman
2 HPS
3 Master Ball
3 Switch
3 Warp Point
3 Moo-Moo Milk (Got me outta a few tight situations)
2 Strength Charm
1 Town Volunteers
3 TV Reporter/Copycat

I know i was arguing the whole "Ruins" thing, but I thought I'd try sumthin different. lol Babies saved me the game SOOOOOO many times and Ninja REALLY didn't help w/ the Bench attk so I descided to go ALL baby. This also helps me Mulli for the perfect hand. w/ only 7 REAL basics, there's a good chance I'll Mulligan. Any suggestions are welcome. Thx
-Swampy

 

[Rabid Raichu]

I'm trying out a version of this right now -- the major difference is I'm working with only

2 Gastly
2 Haunter
2 Gengar
1 Aerodactyl Ex

That's right, 7 Pokemon TOTAL.

I include Mysterious Fossil as extra fodder for my opponent, so why not throw in the Colorless Aero Ex?
That and Crystal Shard give me some insurance against the Dark Pokemon. The Aerodactyl, powered up, is also a OHKO against most of those pesky Dragons.

I end up with 7 Pokemon, 12 Psychic Energy and 41 Trainers. I'm still testing the trainer mix, but it shows some promise -- and I don't mulligan as much as I want to -- attributable to my poor luck!

 

[SwampertEX]

Umm dude, why in the world would you even THINK of adding a Dactyl??? NOONE plays tools and even if they did, it wouldn't affect me THAT much. and why would you wanna hide behind a Dactyl neways??? it's 2 free prizes for your opponent. Also, I tried Shard, but it didn't work out 4 me. Thx for the suggestion, but no thx, I think I'll pass...
-Swampy

 

[davechri]

Swampert, are you running into much bench damage? I've not been too concerned with it because I haven't really run across too much of it. (None, actually)

I'm fiddling around with the "all ball" trainer engine right now. I don't know how it will play, but I like the idea.

The thing that strikes me about this deck is how thin you've cut the energy. How's that working out for you?

 

[SwampertEX]

Swampert, are you running into much bench damage? I've not been too concerned with it because I haven't really run across too much of it. (None, actually)

I'm fiddling around with the "all ball" trainer engine right now. I don't know how it will play, but I like the idea.

The thing that strikes me about this deck is how thin you've cut the energy. How's that working out for you?

I have played a couple Kingdra decks and I won against them as I stated in an earlier post. And even if King is attking ur bench ur opponent still has to flip. and if I do get damaged I move damage on to root fossils or Moo-Moo it away. Cutting the energy is workin out okay, I miss having more nrg, but w/ more draw, I'm finding it easier to get three on Gengar. The extra nrg is now used soley for Gengar. Some is used to switch Fossils, but only the Warp. Thx for the chat.
-Swampy

 

[Pablo]

well this deck looks good, just as good as my Wailord deck, we both hide and rn but ull be doing 10 to my wailords each time so chances are ull deck before something happens but still looks good

-MuD

 

[davechri]

Mudkip, why do you say we'll be doing 10 damage to Wailord?

As for the energy, once you have 3 on Gengar, you really have no need to power anything else up. If I had a guaranteed way to get 3 energy right up front, I'd probably just run 7-8 total.

 

[Dendrobatida]

Dave, I think he's referring to Wailord -ex just super deep diving again and again.


-Jake

 

[davechri]

Thanks Jake.

Are you going with the gang to South Carolina this weekend?