Lame-U (L-AMU): Testing the Pixies

Discussion in 'Cards: Strategy and Rulings Discussion' started by Prime, Aug 9, 2008.

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  1. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    I thought about where I'd post this. There had been a big discussion in multiple threads about the consistency of AMU, or UMA, or whatever you call the deck. So I threw together a list, printed off some scans of the cards, built the deck, and played it at league today. The list I used was this:

    Now, before this thread gets moved to the Deck Help section, please realize that I am only posting this list as information regarding my testing and it helps to know what I am playing so that you can understand why I might have had my problems.

    I know the list isn't the best, and I wasn't shooting for it to be the best. A player can learn quite a bit from a mediocre list. Having "the list" would only slightly improve the consistency, and slightly modify the results. Honestly, I don't believe in "the lists" anyways, since I don't feel there is a perfect way of building a deck, and I think each player is going to have changes that suit them best.

    So, like I said earlier, I tested the deck out at league. Here were my results.

    I found that if you went first, the most you could level up on your second turn was 1 of the pixies. Because the deck ran very few basics, I found myself starting with 1 basic a lot. I also found myself starting with basics and not wanting to put them down before the game started because I wanted to activate their Poke-Powers during the turn. This was definitely true for Uxie (LA) and Azelf (LA). Because of that, it took even longer to get all the lv.X in play. If I went second, I was able to use trainers and supporters and I was able to get all the basics in play more often. Going first half the time makes the deck take a bit longer to setup.

    I've read all over this board that it's easy to setup 3 lv.Xs by turn 2-3. BULLHOCKEY. That's all I gotta say about that. I think out of 6-8 games, I was able to get all 3 out by turn 2-3 in one game. I just didn't have the resources to do it, and didn't have the resources to keep my hand full of...resources. With no big draw in the deck, I found myself with very small hands, and with no real way to keep the deck rolling. I know that Claydol is there to refill my hands, but if you use your resources to get out all the lv.X, what resources do you have to get out the Claydol? If you use some of your resources to get out Claydol, how do you take out the threat the opponent is building? You CAN'T do both. There was many games that I lost because I just ran out of resources and couldn't keep the deck rolling. There were a few times when I would lose a lv.X and couldn't replace it because my hand was full of lame stuff and Claydol doesn't help a big hand of lame stuff, it just helps a small hand.

    Is it possible to get all three lv.X out on your second/third turn? Sure! Is it consistently happening? Heck no and honestly, I don't think having "the list" would change much of that. Unless you draw god hands, and have the perfectly right pixies to keep your hand refilled, and are able to get the Claydol out with all three Pixie lv.Xs, the deck just runs out of

    Poke Radar was the biggest dud I've ever seen in my life. I whiffed on it 99% of the time, pulling no Pokemon whatsoever. I think I pulled a single Pokemon twice, and neither were lv.Xs. The one time I could had pulled an entire line of Claydol, I made the mistake of playing Bebe's Search first, and had to randomize the deck afterwards. With only 16 Pokemon in the deck, and often time 1 or 2 of them being prized, Poke Radar was a bad decision for the deck.

    My bench was full 100% of the time. I had to keep it full in order to setup. I had to have Claydol out, with 3 lv.X, and usually had more than 1 of a few of the Pixies for backup. I would drop the extra pixies early game for an added "umph" that the setup really needed after I burned through all the resources in my hand. Dusknoir would eat this deck alive. That is an understatement. And don't give me the excuse that you would beat the Dusknoir deck before they could hurt you. All they need is Duskull+Rare Candy+Dusknoir, and your toast. There goes your Mesprit lv.X with 2 energy on it back into your deck.

    The Pixie's abilities were fantastic. I almost always had free retreat, and almost always was using Uxie lv.X's Trade Off Poke-Power. But it took time to get out the Uxie lv.X, so it wasn't like that added setup acceleration was there from the get-go. I used Uxie (LA)'s Set Up Poke-Power a few times, but I found later in the game, if your hand was full of lameness, Uxie's Poke-Power didn't help a single bit. I think I used Azelf (LA)'s Time Walk Poke-Power the most. Quite often did I find some interesting Pokemon in my prizes, and being able to exchange them was golden. I remember one game, I actually grabbed a prized Claydol and was able to setup a Claydol next turn. Even Azelf (MT)'s Downer Material Poke-Body came in use a little against Destiny type decks and early game basics trying to Call for Eevees (Eeeve MD) or use Baltoy's Psychic Balance attack. The effects were nice, and they all helped some, but they definitely didn't set themselves up with the effects. I still needed plenty of resources to do that.

    Snowpoint Temple was nice, and was irritating. Against regular decks, it saved me a few times. Against Destiny type decks, it helped my opponent too much, and I couldn't discard it when I needed to. I really felt like throwing in a Lunatone GE to discard the stadium and do 20. I could have taken a few easy prizes in one game if I could had discarded the stadium.

    I know people have denied it, but the deck is definitely based around Mesprit lv.X's Supreme Blast. I won games today by just Surpreme Blast, and you desperately need it to win many games that go into mid-late game. Of course, the deck can do other stuff, but other stuff doesn't win you games. Big damage wins you games. The only other way I was able to deal decent damage was switching between two Uxie lv.X using Zen Blade over and over again. I sometimes would Warp Point to reset Zen Blade's effect when I only had 1 Uxie lv.X in play. But the 60 damage only really helped against basics. 60 didn't OHKO 100HP+ Pokemon when I needed it to. All the other attacks, on all the other Pixies were just damage fodder. I would deal 20 here, 20 there, 20 here, 20 there, and make little to no impact on the game whatsoever. So what if they can't retreat next turn? They are going to KO me!

    Also, I found the two energy attacks on the non-lv.Xs to be not very inviting. I think the only one I used was Mesprit (MT)'s Teleportation Burst attack, because it allowed me to hit for small damage and get the heck out of there before it got KO'd. I had to get the heck out of there because many times my opponent would have a decent threat built up before I could deal with it effectively. I often time found myself giving up prizes to setup on the bench, which is very hard with lv.Xs and having to come active to level up and then retreat to the bench.

    I think I won more games than I lost, but it definitely took a lot of effort and thinking to do it. Very few games did I find my deck rolling over the opponent, like many people portray this deck to do.

    By the end of the day, I nicknamed the deck Lame-U (L-AMU) because I felt it was so overhyped and not even that consistent. I learned this through testing the deck out, so nobody can argue I haven't played a single game with the deck. Another person at my league nicknamed it Triple-X (XXX) because of the 3 lv.Xs you have to get on the field.

    I'm going to keep testing the deck out, because I think the deck has a lot of potential, but I really wanted to post my first day results online because I feel too many people overhype the deck, and make it seem like the next mesiah for the card game...when honestly, it's just a good idea. It's NOT easy to get out 3 lv.X, regardless of what people will tell you. Even if they are basics, it takes a mininum of 2 turns to get them out. Many stage 2's can be faster than that thanks to Rare Candy.

    I've love to hear the results of other people trying the deck out, but I know what I will get more of. "Oh your list Lame-U deck setups all 3 lv.X on turn 2 consistently...blah, blah, blah". If you are going to post something like that, don't bother. If you want to post your experience with the deck, please do so. But be honest, and be unbiased in your experiences. People only learn from the truth, not the brainwashed information some people want others to believe.

    Knowledge is Power! Save the Planet! It's GRRRReat! <_<
  2. DarthPika

    DarthPika New Member

    As I said before, don't waste space on stadiums, pokeradar is useless, go for consistency. Why have ppower when you can do 200damage? Needs energy switch+pickup, Claydol isnt needed in this deck, and sorry to say it but your draw SUCKS.

    I know you wern't going for the best list, but to really see what the deck can do and see the consistent t2/3 2/3 lv.x in play you really need a good list.
  3. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    So, you are telling me to take out the only non-trainer setup support I have, and add in more trainers? You know how top-deck dependent that would make the deck?
  4. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    ya right DarthPika

    my teamate Robert tried out AMU with no Claydol and no other techs it did terribly

    The deck has no consistant power, when it can only do 200 damage every other turn hopefully while doing ok powers like shutting of pokepowers of the opponent's. When kingdra can easily swarm 3 kingdras in a row the deck won't be able to keep up. Face it the deck is totally overhyped. I will admit that the deck is decent, but for the money you need to pay for it and how risky it is to play it, it just isn't worth it

    and I like that calling the deck Lame-u prime. However I do believe ur list is indeed much worse than the average AMU list, I thank you for telling everybody how bad AMU really is.

    ALL AMU IS IS FLASHY, and anyone who thinks differently will fail at most BRs to kingdra. I don't care if AMU is big in Japan, it is 2nd out of 2 competitive decks

    To get T2/3 AMU with no claydol you would need

    warp point
    call energy
    3 Lv.Xs
    2 psychic energy
  5. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    How was my list much worse than the average AMU list? I pulled the pokemon line directly from the words of DarthPika on this forum. The trainers are no brainers. The quantities could be worked on, but I can guarantee that most of those cards go into every AMU list.

    Call Energy could have been used, but so many attacks costs psychic energy, that it would be hard to power certain attacks. I will try it though.
  6. mrdraz07

    mrdraz07 New Member

    LOL...I think this deck really does need an amazing list to function well. And a mind like a steel trap.
  7. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    I could probably get the best list from my other teammate alex (Garchompx12). He gave me the BR winning Kingdra list from Japan so I am sure he can get you the BR winning AMU list.

    I just can't see Amu functioning well though
  8. ShinySwampert

    ShinySwampert New Member

    How could you not use Uxie MT? Mind Off and Memory out are great disruption. 30+ Sleep for one? MT Sprites are better attackers than LA sprites.

    You definitely don't need Claydol.

    What are you going to do if you run into Mewtwo Lv.X? Attack with Claydol?

    Call Energy is a bad idea. You're using "play from hand" powers. They'd be nullified. As you said, Call is also bad for your energy requirements.
  9. Burninating_Torchic

    Burninating_Torchic New Member

    Sorry but I just have to ask this... have you actually PLAYED any games with this supposedly super consistent list of yours?
    IMO, your post looks just like what prime was saying he didn't want to see.
  10. Black Mamba

    Black Mamba New Member

    an amazing list of this deck makes it a mediocre deck at best.

    And regular lists make it... not so good.

    Because if its T4 and you don't have your ENTIRE setup out (which is far too much of the time), this deck just falls apart at the seams. Even Kingdra tears it up!
  11. DarthPika

    DarthPika New Member

    Yes... I have done quit a lot of testing with it. :/

    If any deck is over hyped and just flashy, its Kingdra, not AMU.
  12. yoyofsho16

    yoyofsho16 New Member

    You have to keep in mind that you are doing this in league, an unlimited format.

    Remember that any deck with DRE and Scramble is WAY faster than a DP-on deck. Hands down.
  13. BloodDraek

    BloodDraek New Member

    you probably did testing against a deck of 4 skitty and 56 energy lol

    OH and Kingdra is flashy. Pfft

    I have done testing with it and it can stand up to Plox with DREs and Scrambles, which is a format much faster than the format of 08-09. Have you even done testing against a good kingdra list (Japanese).

    I am sick and tired with all the bashing of ebery viable deck of next format. We will see at Battle Roads who is really the champ
  14. ~`Flygon`~

    ~`Flygon`~ New Member

    Froslass is better than both of these decks....
  15. Zumanity

    Zumanity New Member

    I like the Azelf & Uxie the way they are. For the Mesprit, I would say go 2 MT mesprit because to make sure you have free retreat without moonlight in play. Mesprit LA has a good power, but i don't think it helps more than the free retreat.
    Without scott I'm not sure how i feel about snowpoint and trying to rely on it.
    With that amount of pokemon, i don't think poke-radar is the way to go, honestly i'd say switch out the radars or dusk for quick balls. I'm not positive, but i think between roseannes,bebe's,and quick it should be suffice for grabbing pokemon.
    If the deck is really based on supreme blast ( i havent tested the deck yet so i dont know) would energy switchs help out? that way after you supreme blast, you can e switch, attach, and blast again? dont know if that works.
    The last thing is, have you considered GE Pachirisu? that way you can grab all three with 1 attack, that is if the deck can go without using the "coming into play powers". And as silly as it may sound, would a mid-late rotom tech ever work with this deck?
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2008
  16. mrdraz07

    mrdraz07 New Member

    I'm completely dismissing this deck until it's tier 1.

    Prime, your list is pretty bad. There's no supporter draw, and this deck desperately wants Cynthia's. PokeRadar is horrible, as you yourself said, and Dusk Ball isn't much better. Pluspower could easily be Buck's. The deck is set up so that if it doesn't get set up early it never will, and drawing more cards should fix that.
  17. butlerforhire

    butlerforhire New Member

    Honestly I don't think it sounds silly. Recharging is obviously great, but being a buffer between big Pixie attacks is another thing the card would have going for it. With Rotom active following a Supreme Blast instead of another Pixie-- unless of course that Pixie is capable of getting a KO or doing something really useful while not being vulnerable to a KO from your opponent on their next turn--you would be able to keep your Lv. X trio safe for a turn, barring bench damage of course but only a few cards can actually one-shot a Pixie on the bench and spread shouldn't add up too much if you can Supreme Blast every other turn anyway. If you had Snowpoint in play and had already taken out a big threat with Supreme Blast, an 80 HP Rotom might not even get OHKOed, allowing the same one to come back out again for the same procedure after your next Supreme Blast.

    I think being able to rebuild Mesprit lv. X without having to send up another Pixie in the interim period to possibly get KOed and ruin the triangle would help the deck a lot.
  18. Dr. Mason

    Dr. Mason New Member

    PokeRadar is good in decks witgh a high Pokemon count.(20-24)

    Yeah Prime, not to be offensive, but it is a kinda bad list. Any Mewtwo X will steamroll it. I usually play 2-2 Mightyena and 4 Multi with it, Enabling Mewtwo punishment, but even that doesn't matter here.

    No, this is one of the few decks where Claydol isn't needed. Really, you just slow yourself down.

    Also, I play one of each each Level X after some experience. TSD/NM and a Bebe's is just the better way...Allows you to have the pokes you need out more consistently.

    Heck, I'd suggest Quick Ball. Guaranteed Pokemon every time, at least. Don't hesitate to lay Azelf T1 either, you may get exactly what you needed. If you DO want to play Claydol and not rely on setup powers, wait for Great Ball reprint and use it. Sorry if you don't agree witht his, everyone else. You're free to make childish attacks at my opinion ^^
  19. Prime

    Prime Content Developer<br>Blog Admin<br>Contest Host

    Okay people, if my list is so bad, post a better one. Seriously. It doesn't help the conversation by saying my list is bad over and over again.

    Most of the replies in this thread are absolutely not what I was looking for. I was looking for people that have actually PLAYED the deck to post and give their experiences with it. I wasn't looking for two sentence explanations to why my testing is flawed. I was looking for a good conversation.

    yoyoofsho16: I'll mention the decks I ran into. Not a single one ran DRE/Scramble, I believe. I played against Darkrai/Weavile/Eeveelutions, Darkrai/Weavile/Lickitung, Magmortar, and Zapdos/Aerodactyl/Rotom/etc. Definitely not tier 1 decks, and I don't believe a single one of them abused DRE/Scramble. There were a good amount of basics, and Snowpoint Temple did help my opponent a lot.

    See...that's the kind of conversation I'd like to see happen. Not people stating facts with no experience attached to it. That helps nobody! Nobody learns from everyone throwing around facts like they are frisbees.

    Let's talk about my trainers. What trainers are key and what aren't?

    • Roseanne's Research - I think it's important, but with so many ways to grab Pokemon, and it being a supporter, I could definitely see 3 of this played instead of 4.
    • Bebe's Search - I played 3 because the only real use of it was to grab Claydol. Of course, it can grab everything else, but every trainer can grab everything else.
    • Premier Ball - Maxed out at 4 is important imho. 4 Didn't clutter the deck up at all, I found in my testing.
    • Dusk Ball - Despite what some people say, I found this card to be very consistent, and it combos well with Claydol. Going 7 cards down is much nicer than 5 cards down with Poke Radar. But I could see how this could be a dud since it doesn't guarantee a Pokemon.
    • Poke Radar - SUCH A DUD! I whiffed on this 99% of the time. There just wasn't that many Pokemon in the deck, especially after I had searched many out turns before.
    • Plus Power - Totally needed imho. The deck doesn't do enough damage half the time that can stand on its own. The 200 is nice, but that's only one attack. The 60 is nice, but I had to double plus power twice at league to score a crucial KO on a 80HP pokemon. I would definitely max these out.
    • Snowpoint Temple - I found this to be great and not so great. Great that it helped me not get KO'd as much (which is vital in this deck) and not great that it helped many of my opponent's Pokemon not get KO'd as much. I'm iffy on the card. Might take them totally out.
    • Warp Point - Needed in 4s, I feel. You will never get the god hand of all the stuff and the warp points needed to get all 3 out on turn 2 (well...never say never) but it's useful for disruption, which I found useful and it's useful to reset the 60 attack's effect.
    • Night Maintenance - I didn't find this to be that useful. Premier Ball did most of the work for me. Since I ran 3-1 of a lv.X and 2-2 of 2 others, I found myself only needing to Night Maintenance every now and then. I definitely wouldn't max this out. 2 seems fine.
    People have suggested draw cards. Okay. But there isn't that many fantastic draw cards anymore. I could see Wager, but half the time I don't have out a Claydol to cover myself and EVERYONE at my league is running Claydol in their deck. Rowan might not be bad, to keep a card and get 4 new ones. I still feel Cyntha's is too situational, but I can definitely try it. Prof. Oak's Visit is decent, but nothing super special.

    Someone at league suggest Quick Ball, and I really like that idea. It's a guaranteed Pokemon and that is needed in this deck, even if it's a Pokemon I don't need. I am going to try that out.

    I can't run Great Ball since it's not legal at this point (DP-LA). For all those haters bashing my list because it doesn't have some cards from IFDS, realize that this isn't a future deck, it's a now deck. Stop testing the decks that won't be legal for 3 more months and start getting ready for Battle Roads.

    Don't like my list? Suggest a better one. I will test it out and put my results in here. But don't bash and run. That doesn't help anyone.
  20. Ardoptres

    Ardoptres New Member

    Yeah, or we could just look in the Coro Coro magazine ourselves.

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