Lucario tech - Strategy and scans for each card

Discussion in 'Deck Help and Strategy' started by Magic_Umbreon, Jan 4, 2008.

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  1. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    Lucario Tech


    Win/Loss: 5-2




    DECKLIST



    Pokémon: 14
    2 Absol SW 21
    4 Riolu DP 61
    3 Lucario DP 6
    1 Lucario LvX NDP 12
    2 Sableye CG 10
    1 Minun SW 32
    1 Absol ex PK 92

    Trainers/Supporters/Stadiums: 29
    4 Pokédex DP 111
    2 Castaway CG 72
    2 Buffer Piece DF 72
    1 Strength Charm DF 81
    1 Timespace Distortion MT 124
    1 Scott PK 81
    3 Roseanne's Research SW 125
    2 Team Galactic's Wager MT 115
    1 Team Galactic's Mars SW 126
    2 Super Scoop Up DP 115
    1 Warp Point CG 84
    4 Celio's Network CG 73
    2 Lake Boundary MT 112
    2 Professor Birch PK 80
    1 Professor Rowan SW 123
    1 Master Ball PK 78

    Energy: 16
    4 Multi Energy PK 89
    3 Darkness Energy MT 119
    9 Fighting Energy PK 108




    STRATEGY



    Absol

    Absol is a card I'm sure everyone's heard about; you can't miss it. Absol's raid is useful here to damage Banette who otherwise might give the Lucario line a hard time. Baleful wind is a solid, early game disruptive move to slow down your opponent while you draw and search for setup.


    Riolu

    Although wild kick is dependant on a coin flip, it can set up a lot of pokémon for a KO once Riolu evolves. 60HP is nice as is the retreat cost. A solid starting pokémon that once again sees a lot of play for a reason. Wild kick can be fuelled by 13 of the energies in the deck for a potential turn one win.


    Lucario

    What I like most about Lucario is that it has an attack for every number of energy attached from one to three once levelled up. Aura sphere is a strong, efficent attack and provides very useful sniping while feint is just nice and easy for if you want to attach energy elsewhere. Again, the theme present in the deck remains of light retreating pokémon with Lucario's low single retreat cost so you can easily drop an Absol to raid or anything else and save energy for fast damage later.


    Lucario LvX

    My favourite card since I first saw it, everything's 'right' about it. While Gallade is superior in a good few ways, Lucario LvX's ability to use Lucario's attacks gives it a wide range of options to suprise your opponent. Stance is a great poké-power and comboes with the card itself's close combat attack. Level Up, do 80 and don't sufer the +30 side effect from close combat. Simple, easy. 110HP means you'll survive things and with buffer piece you have equivalent endurance of Blissey, Empoleon or Gallade. Smash things with this or spread damage while you build up another.


    Sableye

    Disable is a useful attack against many pokémon with only one decent attack. Examples include Blissey, Absol, Gallade and random things like Stantler or Beduw. If you stack darkness energy onto it, the damage from disable will pile up quite nicely while you attach energy to the rest of your bench. The colourless resistance and lack of weakness give it a little bit of durability but it can run away when you want it to with that low retreat cost. Excavate is the other main reason Sableye is included. Knowing what you'll draw next is a great advantage to have. Cleaning your deck of cards you won't need means your draw ends up a lot better. A good few cards here, such as Master Ball and Pokédex will be of much greater use after excavate. If a good card is there, you can grab it otherwise you'll have a range larger than before.


    Minun

    Drawing two is a great help and Minun doesn't even need to be in play or in your hand when a pokémon of yours is KOed. Just search it out and play it the turn after something is KOed and give your hand a nice boost. Best of all, Minun can stay there for the next opportunity for a quick draw. Remember, that it does not combo with super scoop up (read the poké-power carefully).


    Absol ex

    Ah, so much fun and game-changing. Easily obtainable from your deck, the ability to move counters at your command has many uses. One is to pile the damage done by Aura Sphere to the bench on one pokémon. If you can KO the defending pokémon even if it had 30 more HP, then save those counters and place them where another poké is in KO range. E.g. the defending pokémon has 90 max HP and has taken 40 from aura sphere. By playing Absol ex, you can take 30 from the active to KO the 50HP basic you targetted with Aura Sphere on the bench, then use close combat on the active for two KOs!


    Pokédex

    When you pick up a pokédex, it's as if you're given the choice of what to pick up from two cards. Best of all, unlike pokénav, the card you don't want is out of the way for other pokédices (haha what a crazy plural!), master balls, draw from mars or birch, minun's minus charge and sableye's excavate.


    Castaway

    Use castaway to keep your hand balanced with tools, energy and supporters. Not very helpful against the baleful wind of Absol because after you play the energy your trainer-saturated hand will burn away. Nethertheless, it's useful to hang on to so you can search out tools for the appropriate moment such as doing the extra damage required to KO a pokémon.


    Buffer Piece

    You don't want your pokémon to be KOed and buffer piece means they may well survive an attack they otherwise wouldn't. Particularly useful for Sableye who becomes considerably less fragile and not so vulnerable to the attacks you don't disable.


    Strength Charm

    You play strength charm when your attack is just 10 below what it needs to be to KO. It's a suprise to your opponent who thought their pokémon was safe for one more turn and turns their game on its side.


    Timespace Distortion

    One of the ways you re-use Stance. Also useful if your tech basics end up in the discard due to your own discard, being KOed or discarded by Absol or Umbreon*. When a Lucario of yours ends up there, it's a lot more efficent to retrieve and evolve then to get a new one with a supporter.


    Scott

    Can be used for pulling lake boundary and specific supporters from the deck where appropriate. I haven't actually played it at the tourney I tested this list at but I didn't face Blissey etc.


    Roseanne's Research

    My favourite supporter at the moment because it seems to be good all round at pretty much any point in the game. Putting another riolu on the bench, drawing with minun, shifting the game with Absol ex, there's lots this can do and even get you out of an energy drought. Currently, three are in here because you only need so many basic pokémon and for energy, castaway is generally a better choice as it can setup a supporter for the following turn.


    Team Galactic's Wager

    Shuffling your opponent's hand back is crucial and if you have less in your hand it's a worthy gamble. Lots of your deck is "disposable" by that I mean you can play things like master ball, buffer piece or warp point to free your hand and improve your draws. This is primarily for Birch, but together with Sableye's excavate you can keep very careful, tight control of your deck's contents and draw nice hands even if you lose the RPS. Two was a conservative estimate but it's been so useful I might add another.


    Team Galactic's Mars

    Just one, but a great threat when searched with Castaway or Scott. If you excavate right, the draw two has a much wider range and you'll still get something useful while attacking your opponent's hand can help if you're using Absol.


    Super Scoop Up

    Re-use Sableye, Absol ex or Lucario Level X's poké-powers or return important energies and recover your pokémons' HP. Scoop Up your active for free retreat as well. Doesn't combo with Minun but for everything else it's a useful surprise card.


    Warp Point

    Retreat when you otherwise couldn't or simply to save energy. Cessation crystal can be temporarily shut off when it is on their bench, so warp it away when needed.


    Celio's Network

    There's enough ways to get Absol ex, so this is preferable to Bebe's Search. The main use of Celio's Network is to evolve your Riolus by fetching Lucario or level up to Lucario LvX.


    Lake Boundary

    Helpful against Blissey to give big power to your fighting attacks or to OHKO Banettes with Absol's raid. This stadium is even more useful if you include pokémon of other types, such as psychic to hit Gallade and opponents' Lucarios hard. The ability to counter opponents' stadiums is small but potentially helpful. Strategies such as Speed Stadium and the elite four stadiums from power keepers will weaken your opponents' pokémon slightly when removed.


    Professor Birch

    Birch has given me consistently high drawpower though is not of best use after Minun. Use if before Minun however and you can draw 9 cards in one turn giving you almost every option you'd need. Particularly useful to recover lost ground if you lose at galactic's wager or after losing cards versus Absol or Mars.


    Professor Rowan

    Useful in some situations amd can be searched out when necessary. The card you save will differ dramatically from game to game to fit in with your plan.


    Master Ball

    Very efficent, low resource high return trainer. Comboes with Sableye's excavate to give it more range. An easy way to pull Lucario and its LvX from your deck or to assist in swarming.


    Multi Energy

    Pays for the attack costs of the deck very well, fuelling Absol's raid or aura sphere together with a fighting energy.


    Darkness Energy

    Useful for doing extra damage with the deck's darkness type pokémon. Save it for them and the extra damage may well not be expected and put your opponent in a tricky position.


    Fighting Energy

    The energy required by the Lucario line, a high quantity is included to make Riolu's wild kick likely and an early Aura Sphere for strength and disruption. Both roseanne's and castaway will return this energy. Absol's baleful wind can be paid for with this energy too as can Sableye's disable (two other great starters here).




    TECH IDEAS



    • Absol ex can be included or removed based on personal preference but I have included and described it earlier because for me it is a staple part of the strategy. Same goes for the other basics in my list.
    • Shuppet's ascension can be paid for with any energy in the deck, making it another great starter although it's considerably lower HP than the other deck's basics is a risk. Useful resistance however.
    • Banette can take down a troublesome Absol with its Ghost Head attack. The second attack may help against psychic-weak decks particularly with lake boundary in play but would make energy costs tricky.
    • Shuckle's poison is useful but needing two energies is expensive. The addition of grass energy if multi is not depended on may reduce consistency. Helps against Flygon ex delta species and other active pokémon with annoying poké-powers or poké-bodies.
    • Gallade is a beast capable of massive damage. If rare candy is included, it can also benefit Lucario meaning it can be levelled up a turn earlier than otherwise. Not that skipping:
    • Kirlia is necessary as it can help you setup with multi or a basic psychic search out by roseanne's or castaway.
    • Double rainbow energy can give a Lucario the ability to attack earlier than your opponent might have expected and saves an energy attachment that can be placed elsewhere. Overall, for me this advantage is outweighed by the disadvantages of Aura Sphere's double reduction, many basic pokémon in the deck that it cannot be attached to and being disabled by crystal beach.
    • Latios ex delta species can retreat for free with its pokébody and can be used as a water type attacker with multi energy. Anything with bench sniping will gain two easy prizes from it though.
    • Cessation crystal to shut off pesy poké-powers and bodies but demands very careful use,
    • Crystal Shard can get around resistance and make use of pokémon's colourless weakness.
    • Latias delta species is the other half of a lati-lock disabling poké-bodies such as Magmortar's healing, Ampharos's jamming, Bastiodon and Dugtrio's bench protection, Garchomp's rainbow scale and Electibvire LvX but not much else. Spearhead is an alright opening move and can guard against riolu's wild kick but otherwise it's very metagame specific.
    • Cyclone energy is another way of forcing a switch to get rid of cessation crystal while helpfully providing energy for some but not all of your deck's starters.
    • Basic darkness energy allows you to use Absol's raid setup completly by Roseanne's or if Absol is gained otherwise, castaway returns darkness.
    • Mismagimus suggested by FriedBlaziken to exploit the psychic weakness and energy-heavy attackers like Gallade. Misdreavus is a nice mini-Absol too.
    • Mew suggested by FriedBlaziken could copy Gallade's attack for massive damage and comboes with the deck's disruptive discarding of opponents' cards to copy as well as burning your hand to work like Birch.
    • Clefable: you metronome psychic cut and flip all your prizes and take 1 for the gallde you pwn, you'd need a couple dres to speed it up since boost doesn't fit with lucario - thanks to TODDakaESTEBAN




    CLOSING WORDS



    Please give feedback, tech ideas and criticism is highly appreciated. Thanks for reading. :)



    .
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2008
  2. pokeball S

    pokeball S New Member

    This Is A Realy Good Dek It Has Potential But Toss The Rowan Andmaster Ball For More Wagers


    Gooooooooooodddd Luuuuuuuck
    Check Out This Is My Dek Its Realy Gooooooooooooodddddddd
     
  3. Blaziken 1111

    Blaziken 1111 Active Member

    You do realize that you have only one way to poison them. Anyway this seems like fun to play.
     
  4. Darkwalker

    Darkwalker New Member

    I think your trainers need a bit more focus, and I really don't get the Toxicroak at all. A random 1-1 Muk line might be better with the various rainbow energy people play. I would think you should max Super Scoop Up out to hopefully be able to reuse your heavy hitter (Lucario Lvl X) over and over. You could also use a SSU on an Absol Ex to use his power again.
     
  5. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    Muk's energy cost is high, its retreat high and its basic has less syergy with Absol. Toxicroak can do decent damage to anything weak to psychic; poisn is really useful for shutting things down 'cause of its body. It's experiMENTAL. Yep.

    Less than three hours time I'll be using it at my CC. It's going to go bad I know :(
     
  6. If Absol is the starter your looking for than go with 4. If not than go with zero.

    Last Resort is a great song. Add the words maybe youtube link?
     
  7. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    I didn't know it was a song; whatever. I took out the toxicroak line for a minun and wager for my CC today. Replaced the now redundant psy energy with another fighting.

    I'm in the masters now and came a very close second against Absollade (won 1 out of the best of three, lost from a bad start).

    As a summary of what I learnt:

    • The deck is very consistent and the lone trainer techs work amazingly well.
    • Absol and Sableye were not quite as useful as I thought but the special darkness work well, particularly early game. Excavate makes the deck smooth.
    • Multi works really well even though I didn't face Banette and only really needed fighting. It's nicde to keep your opponent guessing and gave me some slack.
    • Minun is spectacular. All day it has been a saviour for me, getting me out of tricky situations and balancing my hand. I reccommend it to everyone.
    • Birch has offered me consistently high draw power or otherwise been discarded by excavate or TV Reporter. So much in the deck can be dropped out the hand easily.
    • I'm getting really nice shuffle draws from keeping my deck clean.
    • Absol ex helps a lot. It comboes with Aura Sphere to help me stack up damage versus the bigger HP cards.
    • Super scoop up works with the level x a lot better than I thought and made everything a little easier.
    • 4 Pokédex should be staple. Build your deck around it, not them into your deck. It's almost as good as Bill! In a draw 2, you typically only want 1 and pokédex gives you the range of Bill while keeping your hand ok for Birch. Comboes with excavate insanely.
    • I need more hard-hitters, the deck's a little dependant on Lucario X's close combat. Gallade here?
    • Wager is great here, I'm really considering three instead of the two I played because it works great.
    • Light basics are the way to go. 1 energy is an acceptable cost and made everything a bit easier than heavy machamp line pokés.
     
  8. Good . Very Good.
     
  9. Rashad

    Rashad New Member

    have you thought about adding more switches and pluspowers cause this seems like it doesn't do alot of damage
     
  10. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    I thought the same but maybe a Gallade line would solve the damage problem better. Switch isn't needed because of the low retreat costs all round. If I needed that, I'd play warp point as that also stops cessation crystal and buffer piece (if not attached to the bench).
     
  11. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    Gallade doesn't sound very good, because if you run gallade, you would need to run candies etc.
    Maybe Mismagius? It's a good tech against gardy, gallade, blissey, magmortar etc.
    And, i reckon a stage 1 that can do a lot of damage would be better than gallade.
     
  12. Rashad

    Rashad New Member

    or a banette line
     
  13. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    That's listed under the techs. I'll add Mismagimus and of course give credit.
     
  14. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    hey Magic Umbreon. i tried this today with:

    4-3-1 lucario/lvx
    1-1 mismagius
    3 absol
    1 plusle
    1 minun
    1 sableye
    1 absol ex
    1 mew sw

    my energy line was

    6 fighting
    4 multi
    2 basic dark
    1 psychic
    2 dre
    1 scramble

    it works really well and plusle is good because you can get back the desired energy. i would probably make it 2 scramble now though because early spread from lucario ensures a mismagius scramble ko.
     
  15. ToysRUsKid

    ToysRUsKid Active Member

    What do you do v. a Magmortar?
     
  16. FriedBlaziken

    FriedBlaziken New Member

    I just tried playing against magmortar and its hard because 110 hp is hard. i lost both games
     
  17. Darkwalker

    Darkwalker New Member

    The Lucario deck I use occasionally looks very close to this. The biggest difference is I have a 3-2-3 Shiftry Ex (CG) line in to take care of Power based decks. The Shftry Ex also functions as a bench sniper and sweeper late game. Adding a heavy line in here would really change the deck, but a 2-1-2 or even 1-0-1 tech might work (with 2-3 Rare Candy).
     
  18. TODDakaESTEBAN

    TODDakaESTEBAN New Member

    a deck that has shiftry and lucario as main pokemon sounds weak to gallade and gardy,the most dangerous power based decks that you know you'll face in like 3 rounds of swiss alone,is the uk metagame dominated by gallde as well because it's kind of like metanite last year but more people play it and more people win with it, if you can make it to the top cut being weak to gardy and gallade, you probably won't beat the 3 gardy gallades that will comprise the rest of the top 4, i can see that shiftry would make them not want to tellepass, that could be cool, and exs kind of mess with gallade because they have to waste resources when they take 2 prizes at once

    are you still playing absol? if so are you playing the special ds, i would encourage you to use basics with all the multis, however the deck would work a lot more reliably with no absol and straight fighting, or even if you keep absol just keep 1 or 2 tech basic ds, because all of your "tech" pokemon function with fighting but lucario really doesn't function with anything but fighting, multi works but you don't need it for your 2 absols, did you play a lot of bannette decks because if they are a threat by all means do what you think helps, the 4 multi and 3 basic darkness are a little over the top to provide the 2 single darkness energy requirements of the deck but that may just be me

    Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

    have you tryed clefable dp, you metronome psychic cut and flip all your prizes and take 1 for the gallde you pwn, you'd need a couple dres to speed it up since boost doesn't fit with lucario
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2008
  19. Magic_Umbreon

    Magic_Umbreon Researching Tower Scientist, Retired

    Oh thanks so much for all the comments, I really really appreciate it :)

    Awesome ideas, but is basic dark really useful here? I was hesitant to include dre/scramble/boost initially because 1. attacking turn one is a big part of the deck and 2. clashes with multi 3. With my decks, I usually calculate personal "damage boundaries", this reasons my inclusion of absol ex and strength charm as well as the special darkness. This is something I might write a bit about some time but basically, -10 is a big deal here because of Aura Sphere. On Mismagimus it gets rid of the ability to OHKO a three energied Gallade with a strength charm.

    I'll really look into that pokémon setup, it's a neat concept. Plusle isn't quite to my taste as I like to play lots of shuffle draw and depend on supporters for energy so night maintenance might work better for that.

    Lose most probably. I haven't faced Magmortar yet and to my knowledge it's not too popular in the UK. Close Combat and Absol drop could OHKO a Magmortar that hasn't levelled up, or a combination of feint and close combat. (Links in conveniently with the reply above about the deck's damage boundaries). Mew* could copy baleful wind (don't know if that's used in Mag. but it's a general use) or possibly hit for extra damage against Magmortar or Magmar with a multi. The costs include colourless, so maybe it might be able to do them with basics too?

    If they depend on special energies, would Shuckle come in handy as poisoning it with its high retreat may help and disabling the poké-body?

    I've beaten Absollade with it, which has 130HP but not enough times. Versus high-HPed decks is always tricky because it depends a lot on the Riolu flip if you start with it.

    How about a 1-1 Alakazam tech? I like Abra's play search and the discard from Power Cancel works great with Birch and the general flow of the deck. I think prevention is better than cure but with either idea, candies are a slight hassle. Alakazam's Psychic Guard attack requires them to flip over 4 prizes for the KO, which is potentially useful but the damage just isn't quite enough.

    I've always liked Nuzleaf CG but it's maybe a little too risky with the Gallade around. I wouldn't imagine taking two counters is such a worry for Gardevoir and versus Minun and such they can just opt out of not using it.

    My comments in bold italic. I love the Clefairy SW to evolve into it. Personally, again just my tastes I'd go with scramble to trigger Metronome because it can work in one turn and more importantly I'd generally want to KO a fully powered Gallade, before it's not so much a threat otherwise. In such situations, I tend to be behind on prizes. Scramble is nice for Lucario LvX whose close combat is not always easy to pay What really attracts me to this idea is that because Psychic blade will do so much damage, any damage already on Gallade can be moved off with Absol ex. I don't like the retreat cost but it's alright.

    FriedBlaziken's Mismagimus is my favourite idea, the more I think of it the more it appeals in a fighting and scramble only build.
     
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