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Personal Petition: WoW Safety

I'm not going to tell you whether or not to play WoW, but I'm going to tell you what WoW really is. The fact is WoW's current players are predisposed to lie. This, however, was written by someone who cleared Naxx, created a new character (and subsiquently hit 70) when BC came out, and quit.

WoW is a game designed entirely on the principle of keeping people playing the game for as long as possible by any means possible. It functions by building a powerful social environment that does a good job of drawing players through the excessively boring parts of the game.
The first 69 levels of gameplay will be filled with extended periods of boredom followed by the ecstasy and excitement of an instance, with other stretches of boredom. The constant gear upgrading keeps said boredom exciting, however and is enough to keep most people playing. Failing that, the prospect of 10-, 20- and even 40-man raids keeps potential buyers excited, assuming that better playing is to come, as long as he/she/it toughs it through the rapid yet mind-numbingly boring level treadmill. The game is intimidatingly large at first giving the impression that there's variety and excitement to be had as the game goes on. It is during these first 69 levels that most people falsely proclaim the greatness of this game.
After a few days, weeks, months (depending on how fast you are -- there are people like myself that can do the level treadmill in a few days), you're level 70 and you've considered the ~$70 you've given Blizzard at this point to be a worthwhile investment. It is at this point that WoW's nature becomes implicit on the inside, and apparent to virtually everyone else. All of a sudden, the constant gear improvements stop and marginal changes in equipment (epic l00tz) become more and more distant. At first, you're eased into the crack cocaine equivelant that is raiding by the raiding-lite dungeons (in BC, that'd be Karazhan and the early 25-mans) and you realise that, despite the long periods of simply doing absolutely nothing of any fun (mat grinding, profession training, playing the market, epic flying mount, et certa), raiding is damn fun and seemingly worth the effort. But as you get into more serious raids where one mistake out of a 25 person group means literally weeks of wasted effort (it amuses me how people don't realise why the respawn timer is there), the raids, the enjoyment, get even further apart. Outside of raiding there's little to do of any entertainment (Battlegrounds being one of the few legitimately enjoyable excercises in the game but they have virtually no useful returns anymore and Blizzard has all but made twinking entirely pointless) that doesn't come with a massive wait time -- Professions come with whopping cooldowns, arena points arrive once a week (Blizzard's not stupid, they know it takes about 15 minutes to play 10 games), daily repeatable quests are largely the only good source of reputation for some factions and can only be done once a day, heroics (further exemplification of the raiding lite philosophy) can only be done once daily and are once again largely the only reasonable source of reputation for some factions (try getting thrallmar rep doing nothing but regular Shattered Halls like I had to do)... surely you get my point.
Eventually, after you've nearly completed your gear set and you're just living between raids, you realise that you've become what every other WoW player becomes: An individual that by all accounts hates the game but still logs on a daily basis. You contemplate quitting, but really, all that wasted effort? All of those hours put into the game, gone? On top of this, the social pressure of knowing that you let down a massive guild of people, your companions, your brothers/sisters in arms. Peer pressure becomes a powerful weapon in Blizzard's arsenal, and it's usually only when people decide to quit in groups that people truely stop playing (like my friends and I did). But you know you're not going to quit -- the high of a raid, the satisfaction of the marginal improvement, it's all there, and it's all for only $15 a month. You get so close to completing your gear, you hate the game so much but there's just a bit more...
And then the expansion comes out. New content. More raids. More gear. Everything you worked for replaced by fedex quest rewards. All of that effort, all of that time, gone in a flash, when some blood elf hands you a staff that's exponentially better than anything on the face of the earth prior to the expansion. And then it all starts again. The grind, the raiding, the rush, the enjoyment, the hatred. But it won't be long until there's more content, more ways to improve.
And the funny thing is, having written that, long after many of my friends and I, diehard WoW players at times, had quit the game and realised what was really going on, I still frequently feel the urge to play the game again, to go on the website, renew my subscription, and jump back into the action. And if I was a weaker person, I probably would.

Barring all that, just know this. WoW isn't a game to be played for two weeks -- it has the ability, moreso than most other games, to become a device of dominion and addiction. Know what you're getting into.

EDIT: IT's inaccurate to equate the money WoW's cost you in the money spent. It's much more accurate to measure it in how much money you could have made by not playing WoW.

Also, RO is fun in the right places (IE not on p2p servers).
 
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It's really a phsycological game. if you know how to win the game then you can play WoW without fear.

I personally agree that 1 man screwing up in a 25 man raid costs players heaps of work, which adds a REAL serious nature to raiding- yet, nonetheless, people still keep optimistic and have fun with it. World of Warcraft is not time consuming if you're productive in the time you do play.

He states that he quit WoW because he is a strong person- it's not al about bieng able to resist, it's about bieng smart in how you play the game. WoW is not difficult to work out. knock off 2 levels a night- 1 at the higher levels. One level should take a few hours of gameplay. Leveling is vital as it teaches you how to play your class and operate in a group and solo function- sometimes it's redundant, sometimes it's boring- but every game has it's dull bits. Once you're 70, you can knock off 2-3 dungeons in 3 hours and learn the new content AND what you need to do to progress (this varies from dungeon to dungeon) and still look like you have no life because of all your epics, yet go out the next night with your girl or whatever.

I do admit though the flaw is if you only play games 1 hour a night, WoW is not the way to go.


EDIT: if he quested and ran dungeons properly at 60-64 he wouldnt have needed to run Shattered Halls for Thrallmar Rep XD
 
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It's really a phsycological game. if you know how to win the game then you can play WoW without fear.

I personally agree that 1 man screwing up in a 25 man raid costs players heaps of work, which adds a REAL serious nature to raiding- yet, nonetheless, people still keep optimistic and have fun with it. World of Warcraft is not time consuming if you're productive in the time you do play.

He states that he quit WoW because he is a strong person- it's not al about bieng able to resist, it's about bieng smart in how you play the game. WoW is not difficult to work out. knock off 2 levels a night- 1 at the higher levels. One level should take a few hours of gameplay. Leveling is vital as it teaches you how to play your class and operate in a group and solo function- sometimes it's redundant, sometimes it's boring- but every game has it's dull bits. Once you're 70, you can knock off 2-3 dungeons in 3 hours and learn the new content AND what you need to do to progress (this varies from dungeon to dungeon) and still look like you have no life because of all your epics, yet go out the next night with your girl or whatever.

I do admit though the flaw is if you only play games 1 hour a night, WoW is not the way to go.


EDIT: if he quested and ran dungeons properly at 60-64 he wouldnt have needed to run Shattered Halls for Thrallmar Rep XD
I played on a server with a 7:1 horde to alliance ratio. It was a new server, I was the third person on it to hit level 70. I had no one to run with. Blizzard did squat about it. Our battlegroup had two hour que times for WSG on WSG weekend. AV popped once in my three month foray on the server. To get any enjoyment out of BC I had to get a paid transfer because Blizzard was too lazy to fix their servers.
It's called Shattered Halls, look it up. IT took them about eight months to fix the BG problems. That's about all they did.

I did not quit because I was a strong person. But I know that if I, personally, was a weaker individual I would have started playing again.

If you can knock off a level a day in the sixties (with the obvious exception being 60) without putting some sort of serious effort into it I commend you. And I never said that leveling wasn't easy. Because it's very easy. That's the point.
2-3 dungeons in three hours? Yes, if the only dungeon you do is SV. Sha'tar dungeons are long and in a good group take an hour minimum (granted, I've never seen a group do botanica in an hour, or the arcatraz for that matter). If you play three hours a day it'll take you about a year to be raid-worthy. Also guilds that do not have kara on farm (ie have never cleared it) have to put a significant effort in to clear it. And they can only take ten people -- why would they take Mr. Casual -- IE you -- who isn't geared, prepared, hasn't played nearly as much with the guild, isn't as good with his class... when they can take the obsessive freak who hangs out with his guild all day and has a floorplan of Karazhan on his shirt? And assuming they do take you, why would they take you any further, considering you're not only not willing to schedule your life around the game but you're also barely serving the benefit of the guild as it is. When it comes to WoW, the people who say they "raid casually" were either once addicts, are liars, or aren't very sucessful at the game.
Some things you do won't necessarily be time-consuming in terms of the time you have to put into it. But a month of playing and a month of "barely active" is the same to Blizzard. You won't be sucessful at the game if you play it casually. The game's designed that way.
 
That is a wall of text. That said...

The first 69 levels of gameplay will be filled with extended periods of boredom followed by the ecstasy and excitement of an instance

Translation: "The game only begins at level 70."

Eventually, after you've nearly completed your gear set and you're just living between raids, you realise that you've become what every other WoW player becomes: An individual that by all accounts hates the game but still logs on a daily basis.

I'll simply post my thoughts on this matter in the form of quoting another online discussion which really sums it up:

Creating barriers to exit is a double-edged sword. Commercially,
it makes sense in the short-term to retain users but eventually the
users will realise they are not playing the game because it is fun
but because of commitments. The user no longer wants to log on
but has to make a presence regularly to ensure assets do not
depreciate or the guild keeps going. Eventually, the user will come
out of denial and realise. Once a user leaves the game because of
this mechanism, the user will remember the earlier stages of the
game fondly and the later stages with much distaste with slim
chances of returning.

In other words, once you quit WoW, you likely aren't going to want to go back. All the peer pressure in the world doesn't help if your guild members are people you only know online and can say to with a straight face, "You know what? Screw raiding, it just ain't fun." Some people get tempted to return, and lots more don't. It's that simple.

All of that effort, all of that time, gone in a flash, when some blood elf hands you a staff that's exponentially better than anything on the face of the earth prior to the expansion.

I love power creep. It's so much fun to see the design mentality that new has to mean more powerful or players aren't interested. Combine that with "the game only starts at endgame" and you've got a lot of bad yet scarily mass-marketable design. Basically it means that you have to do nothing but top yourself with each new thing.

And you know what? With WoW's playerbase, this is true.

Also, RO is fun in the right places

Hah, no. I tried playing on a free server with slightly (but not insanely) higher exp rates than normal. It still took damn forever to gain any levels, and there was nothing new to look forward to each level except the occasional change in hunting grounds and possibly new equipment. It was an exercise in tedium, just slaying the same junk over and over.

After talking to the higher-level guy who got me playing and seeing that there was no substance to the game (apparently "it gets more fun later on"), I quickly quit and didn't look back.

AV popped once in my three month foray on the server.

I read that as Absolute Virtue. And for anyone who doesn't know what that is: When he pops, you don't want to be anywhere near him.
 
I played on a server with a 7:1 horde to alliance ratio. It was a new server, I was the third person on it to hit level 70. I had no one to run with. Blizzard did squat about it. Our battlegroup had two hour que times for WSG on WSG weekend. AV popped once in my three month foray on the server. To get any enjoyment out of BC I had to get a paid transfer because Blizzard was too lazy to fix their servers.
It's called Shattered Halls, look it up. IT took them about eight months to fix the BG problems. That's about all they did.

I did not quit because I was a strong person. But I know that if I, personally, was a weaker individual I would have started playing again.

If you can knock off a level a day in the sixties (with the obvious exception being 60) without putting some sort of serious effort into it I commend you. And I never said that leveling wasn't easy. Because it's very easy. That's the point.
2-3 dungeons in three hours? Yes, if the only dungeon you do is SV. Sha'tar dungeons are long and in a good group take an hour minimum (granted, I've never seen a group do botanica in an hour, or the arcatraz for that matter). If you play three hours a day it'll take you about a year to be raid-worthy. Also guilds that do not have kara on farm (ie have never cleared it) have to put a significant effort in to clear it. And they can only take ten people -- why would they take Mr. Casual -- IE you -- who isn't geared, prepared, hasn't played nearly as much with the guild, isn't as good with his class... when they can take the obsessive freak who hangs out with his guild all day and has a floorplan of Karazhan on his shirt? And assuming they do take you, why would they take you any further, considering you're not only not willing to schedule your life around the game but you're also barely serving the benefit of the guild as it is. When it comes to WoW, the people who say they "raid casually" were either once addicts, are liars, or aren't very sucessful at the game.
Some things you do won't necessarily be time-consuming in terms of the time you have to put into it. But a month of playing and a month of "barely active" is the same to Blizzard. You won't be sucessful at the game if you play it casually. The game's designed that way.


not geared? not experienced?

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bloodhoof&n=Lionheartex

I am in a guild which is up to Curator, yes, but other guild in TK/SSC ask me to MT for them occasionally. I may look casual but I know what im doing. The groups I group with can clear a dungeon per hour. Bot is the only one that really takes longer. This is how I can play 3 hours a night and still do well. It's called time management. Raids are an obvious exception. Some nights i'll stay on longer just to chat in IF wth friends.
 
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The Arcatraz is longer and harder than Botanica. And doing non-heroics becomes non-beneficial as soon as heroics are avialable.
As of posting the Armory's down for maintenance. However, based on you saying your guild is up to Curator, I'd imagine that you're probably not even into full teirs yet and if you are you're not much further than T4 which isn't exactly a noteworthy feat. Being on the BC equivelant to UBRS seven months after the expansion came out isn't exactly what I would call being succesful at the game. Granted, as the armoury is down, I'm simply making assumptions.

Marril, the expansion releases do a good job of getting bitter taste individuals such as myself back into the game despite the horrid memories that they have of the game (granted, this new expansion probably won't do that as well as BC did). I would even venture to say that the majority of players that quit ultimately come back at some point if only to quit again.
In terms of RO, the only enjoyment I get out of the game is WoE. Leveling and gear-finding is tedious which is why I do it sparingly (even though I play on a 5/5/3 server). WoE, however, is a lot of fun and the experience of a tight WoE is seldom matched in the videogame world because WoE puts you in direct competition with other large groups of players and essentailly mandates that you know how to play your class and work as a team. I would never pay for it, however, as it something that occurs only once a week.
 
The Arcatraz is longer and harder than Botanica. And doing non-heroics becomes non-beneficial as soon as heroics are avialable.
As of posting the Armory's down for maintenance. However, based on you saying your guild is up to Curator, I'd imagine that you're probably not even into full teirs yet and if you are you're not much further than T4 which isn't exactly a noteworthy feat. Being on the BC equivelant to UBRS seven months after the expansion came out isn't exactly what I would call being succesful at the game. Granted, as the armoury is down, I'm simply making assumptions.

In regards to being succesful, I can only go so far as my guild is willing to go- which, unfortunately for personal reasons I am stuck with. But for one who plays 3-4 hours a night on average, it's not a bad effort. my piont bieng is it's still achievable to do well in World of Warcraft, and still play moderately and have FUN with the game while downing (or starting to down) high end content. Kara, yes, is not much of an achievement, but other guilds let me go with them into SSC and TK, as they will always be a Tier ahead of my guild so there's no conflict with me raiding with my guild and theirs on different nights.

Ultimately, i'm trying to argue if you know what you're doing you don't have to play more than 3-5 hours MAX a night to get a grasp of the game and it's end content. Take it from a Pally tank lol. All it takes is 10 minutes to ask a few individuals tips on playing your class or leveling your profession and you're all set.


And Heroics is all I run in terms of 5 mans. UB and Bot are the only ones that are really lengthy. Arc isn't too bad imo. All my badges are spent on healing gear (140 Badges o_O;) because the tanking stuff has been dropping.

Thing is, after you get decent gear. 5 mans aren't a waste- you can use some gear from there still (mind you, I am a hybrid class- I have 3 sets to work on so I can ALWAYS use something lol). What's not used we DE and split the g we make so we don't have to farm gold by grinding.
 
Marril, the expansion releases do a good job of getting bitter taste individuals such as myself back into the game despite the horrid memories that they have of the game (granted, this new expansion probably won't do that as well as BC did). I would even venture to say that the majority of players that quit ultimately come back at some point if only to quit again.

I'd venture a guess at this simply being a case of thinking, "Well, maybe this expansion will make the game likeable again." In other words, Blizzard simply preys on the fond earlier memories of the game and the gullibility on the players' part in thinking that it'll be better this time around. Or maybe this time around. Or wait, new expansion, maybe this one will help me recapture that sparkle of fun I used to have...

But, sadly, it never does.
 
It's more the fact that the BC beta had significantly less steep of a raiding curve that the non-expansion game was known for.I can see why, but 20/20 hindsight I guess.
 
Well I played WoW and I recently stopped my service. The leveling took too long for my tastes. I didn't want to spend the time to level as it wasn't fun and it never really got to a fun point, it just lead to more leveling. I thought I'd be happy when I got my first mount, but it really didn't make that much of a difference. I LIKED being able to solo things A LOT but a lot of the time when I wanted to find a group to do something, it was very hard and it would waste a lot of my time just waiting for the group to fill up. The game has so many items and a lot of things to do, but to really appreciate each thing, you were needed to be at higher levels. I created multiple characters and got each to about lv10-20. After that point, they just weren't fun to play and the game was getting too hard without any real advancement in my character to match the increase in difficulty. I was able to get a character to the mid-40's in level, but like I said, it was the same difficulty just with new baddies to kill.

I've played Guild Wars and I didn't like how you couldn't solo anything (without henchies), and how you had to group to accomplish anything in the game. That is why I was interested in WoW to begin with.

I've tried Dungeon Runners and I felt the game was very lame. I've tried Runescape, and I enjoy how you can do fun things like cooking, etc and also fight too. I've tried so many other MMO's, it's not even funny. WoW was the best one but it had its problems too. They all have their problems. The person that says that one MMO has less problems than another MMO is a person who just can't see the truth of their "beloved" game. They all have problems and no game is better than the other. You just have to find the game that fits your style.

I don't even play games on my computer anymore. I just don't have the time. But by far, WoW was my favorite MMO experience.
 
I've played Guild Wars and I didn't like how you couldn't solo anything (without henchies), and how you had to group to accomplish anything in the game. That is why I was interested in WoW to begin with.

Not really. There are some times when my Heroes get too annoying, and I just Kick them and go on a solo run of attacking various monsters and getting quests done on my own, still unsure of if there's a way to do PvP solo, but if there is, it'll be a heck of a lot easier and more fun than with other people or NPCs.

As for WoW, the fact of the matter is it doesn't make sense to play a game that I know very little about and that is somewhat confusing and difficult to explain according to my friend LordZangoose when I've got a game that another friend of mine can explain to me very easily, that includes much more group interaction and promotion of such, no costs, simple installation that requires near nothing in the way of personal information, and allows me to take four different elements and some prayer magic to wipe out monsters whenever I please, as well as heading off for some PvP action in my spare time and kicking butt that way.
 
Seriously? The leveling took too long? I've gotta say, that's a new one.

You've got no evidence to support your claim that it's possible to be casual and sucessful. The game mitigates that possibility with the extreme limit on resources required for the endgame and the low droprate in general on mats required for sucessful raiding.
 
Seriously? The leveling took too long? I've gotta say, that's a new one.

You've got no evidence to support your claim that it's possible to be casual and sucessful. The game mitigates that possibility with the extreme limit on resources required for the endgame and the low droprate in general on mats required for sucessful raiding.

Well, only proof I've got is my word and i'm not a lying man.

All it takes is time management and a bit of research. Once you know where to get everything it's easy to get if you have a close group.
 
Well, only proof I've got is my word and i'm not a lying man.

All it takes is time management and a bit of research. Once you know where to get everything it's easy to get if you have a close group.
But you, a casual player that is borderline on not being considered casual (three hours a night) are badly geared and in Karazhan. So are you saying you play knowing full well that you manage your time badly?

And, Paladins are horrible MTs. Any guild that uses a paladin for a MT won't get very far either.
 
But you, a casual player that is borderline on not being considered casual (three hours a night) are badly geared and in Karazhan. So are you saying you play knowing full well that you manage your time badly?

And, Paladins are horrible MTs. Any guild that uses a paladin for a MT won't get very far either.

yes, which is why BT guilds are using Paladins as MTs

clearly you're bitter about the game for whatever reason, and can't see that times do change. Casual players can raid pretty hard when needed. A lot of people are seeing this now.
 
Yes, Paladins do have the potential to be great MTs but the standard Paladin compared to the standard Warrio has nowhere near the same tanking ability. The character isn't predisposed to tank; look at how guilds that do it right use Paladins as MT and you'll see what I mean. They're not main tanks in the conventional druid/warrior sense.

Times don't change. Blizzard isn't stupid. Casual players raid casually and aren't successful at the game; players like you. You're a very disillusioned individual if a) you think 3 hours a night is casual and b) if you think that being at Curator (possibly the only boss in Karazhan that presents some sort of threat because players screw it up all the time) is being a sucessful player. I am not bitter about the game, I made a lot of good friends playing WoW and I enjoyed a lot of my time playing. But people deserve to know what the game is really about because the current players of the game will unknowingly lie to them (kind of how you're doing right now) and the former players of the game are generally disregarded and are few and far between (and often compared to the absolute morons that claim "WOW IS ADDICTIVE AVOID IT LIKE THE PLAGUE" who have never played WoW before).
 
This thread makes me lul.

WoW only really starts to suck if you raid 5 hours a night 6 nights a week. I did that for over a year, and during the course of that time I stopped playing Pokemon, never went outside, and rarely socialized with friends. Other than raiding though, it's just a matter of self control. Raiding is super addictive because you go there for the purples, and every time you want more purples, to become better and better. No matter what anyone says, there's always a part of a raider that only shows up because they want purples. It's up to you if you sit there all day playing and afterwards feel that you just wasted all your time doing nothing.

Also, Kyfogre22, it really depends on your definition of casual/success. There are some people who are very casual, yet they believe they're very successful when they go into Karazhan and kill bosses such as The Curator. And that's because they are successful considering how casual they are. Times are pretty much changing too. There's still a ton of end game raiding but alot of things are being added for casual players to make the game easier for them, like Gladiator gear and Daily quest rewards, things like turning in Illidari marks for Flasks, etc.

I'm saying this stuff as a player who quit only because raiding 5 hours a night was taking a toll on my RL. The rest of the game is not like that so don't be told otherwise. Just lrn2selfcontrol.
 
I was going to make a joke about Rusty Buckets and fishing in FFXI, but nothing witty's coming to mind. Ah well. It's still a better game than WoW.
 
Hehe. I've never played it so I wouldn't know :p. Right now for me it's all Pokemon and Metroid Prime Corruption. That game is freakin extreme.
 
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