Dang...I just received a reprimand for cbd using a profanity lol. Seems I used it to quote without noticing he did it. At least it was a friendly reminder
Same. Apparently quoting profanity isn't allowed. Who knew
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Prerelease raichu unearthed???
- Thread starter garyis2000
- Start date
Same. Apparently quoting profanity isn't allowed. Who knew
raichuforyou
New Member
Couldn't it be authenticated if PSA were to compare it to a Pre Clefable stamp? I mean there has to be a way to get it graded. They've graded things like the Dark Persian error and other things that weren't supposed to be released. I suppose the difference is that the Raichu never really made it out...
garyis2000
Member
Well said raichu4u. The microscopic comparison method with like stamps on clean surfaces will tell the tale...one way or the other. It may take a personal visit and a major pitch but its possible.
No legitimately rare card, even those much rarer than the supposed preraichu have stayed out of the publics auction grasp. In fact, this is true of even the rarest of our sports cards.
Is the pre raichu for real? I don't buy it, but I would love the opportunity to
Is anyone able to contact David and ask for a better scan/image of the per-release raichu? Since he is a fellow collector I'm sure he would be happy to. I think that may be the only way to finally put this to rest.
The card is real. There are two articles on the Gym, both Pokepop and Pokemom have personally seen it, Rusty had talked to an ex WOTC who even gave a rough estimate of how many were made, and we know of a person who owns one!
Believe what you want, but the card is real.
The card is real. There are two articles on the Gym, both Pokepop and Pokemom have personally seen it, Rusty had talked to an ex WOTC who even gave a rough estimate of how many were made, and we know of a person who owns one!
Believe what you want, but the card is real.
garyis2000
Member
It's not unreasonable to assume that if a dozen copies of a card existed from as recently as the 1990s at least one may have surfaced for sale on public auction. Adding some incentive like an over value offer would make it even more likely to flush one out. But...nothing.
The explanation may be that there were no Raichus MISTAKENLY stamped "prerelease". Did a WOTC employee intentionally stamp one as part of a pitch or presentation though? Or maybe he was just messing around? Maybe! But then it would fall under a different category...one that would drop it to little value.
Many of us were intrigued by Geraldo Riveras opening of Al Capones vault. It made it all the way to prime time. Then......nothing.
Is the truth behind the PreRelease Raichu another Al Capones vault or is it another King Tuts Tomb?
Well, i'd like to know before too much time passes and opportunity is lost.
I can see only two ways to be certain. One is unearthing an uncut prerelease stamped sheet with a raichu on it or getting PSA to do a comparative test then slabbing it.
Relying on the word of a former WOTC employee or seeing the card in a fellows binder at a tourney or show is just not enough provenance for most people to dump a wad of bills on.
I check my inbox daily for someone to take me up on my offer. I'd love to own this if its deemed a legitimate error...so much so that I'd even overpay for it cause I figured it was the only way find one.
But, still nothing.
The explanation may be that there were no Raichus MISTAKENLY stamped "prerelease". Did a WOTC employee intentionally stamp one as part of a pitch or presentation though? Or maybe he was just messing around? Maybe! But then it would fall under a different category...one that would drop it to little value.
Many of us were intrigued by Geraldo Riveras opening of Al Capones vault. It made it all the way to prime time. Then......nothing.
Is the truth behind the PreRelease Raichu another Al Capones vault or is it another King Tuts Tomb?
Well, i'd like to know before too much time passes and opportunity is lost.
I can see only two ways to be certain. One is unearthing an uncut prerelease stamped sheet with a raichu on it or getting PSA to do a comparative test then slabbing it.
Relying on the word of a former WOTC employee or seeing the card in a fellows binder at a tourney or show is just not enough provenance for most people to dump a wad of bills on.
I check my inbox daily for someone to take me up on my offer. I'd love to own this if its deemed a legitimate error...so much so that I'd even overpay for it cause I figured it was the only way find one.
But, still nothing.
Darkrai*
Member
None have or (probably) ever will be sold through a public platform like ebay...those (who I know of) who have one in their posession gave a promise to the former owner not to resell, especially not publicly. And even if they didn´t, they wouldn´t ever think about selling. I wouldn´t either.
Think about it, the card was top secret, no one was ever allowed to talk about it for years...if someone would sell a legitimate one on ebay it would destroy the mystery surrounding the card, imo.
Think about it, the card was top secret, no one was ever allowed to talk about it for years...if someone would sell a legitimate one on ebay it would destroy the mystery surrounding the card, imo.
garyis2000
Member
The sad thing is you just might be right brother.
Same. Apparently quoting profanity isn't allowed. Who knew
Oops sorry you guys!!! I didn't even know there was a profanity rule here, time to brush up on the rules!
Next time I'll choose my words better
garyis2000
Member
Just crazy. Even with a big payday on the table not a peep from the mythical prerelease raichu brigade. That's pretty telling if you ask me.
Maybe I should offer 5 1st base boxes?
Maybe I should offer 5 1st base boxes?
FrostyFluxy
New Member
Gary, your offer was more than generous but you have to remember something, not everyone in this world is swayed by money. There are collectors out there that will not sell, ever. So just because no-one answered your prayers to buy one doesn't mean they don't exist. Especially in the time you have given any potential sellers to sell (three days), do you realise the time it took for one to become available to a incredibly limited market. I would suggest the best thing to do is be patient, stop posting here on the Pokegym as the collectors may not even be here and go out there and find one privately.
garyis2000
Member
That may be like going out and searching for Bigfoot:lol:
Its quite odd that several here seem to think there's like a dozen or so out there but one has never come up for public auction...AT ANY PRICE.
Trophy pikas, illustrators, mega battles et all; have all popped up many times over the years and there's supposed to be fewer of those. At some point in time anybody could have owned any of those. They deserve the mystique.
But no...the supposedly more abundant pre raichu becomes the hobby's centerpiece and most desired card. It's the Wagner T-206 of the pokemon world. All other more deserving cards are relegated to second tier status. Why? Where are they? Like that video of Bigfoot we've seen a few pictures of raichu, but videos and pictures can easily lie.
It's absurd! It's madness. Not one person in the entire world, not one former WOTC exec or line worker needs money? Even the highest end collectors buy and sell. You all do. So why haven't any ever been listed on the worldwide block? Even for a ridiculous amount?
Do they want anonymity? Well a simple PM would be fine with me. I'd be discreet.
Bigfoot? Yeah...probably!
What you guys don't understand is money isnt everything. For instance David Persin probably makes more money than most of us. He doesn't need money! He rather have the card than any amount of money simply because he already had money and it would be hard for him to get another one. Many of us do resell but people like David Persin won't sell any of his trophy cards simply for the fact he has enough money and the cards mean more to him. If I was wealthy and I had an offer like that, I wouldn't bother selling.
---------- Post added 05/09/2013 at 10:02 AM ----------
Not to mention some of the most reputable people like Scott and Pokepop have seen one so why do you question them. It's sort of disrespectful.
---------- Post added 05/09/2013 at 10:02 AM ----------
Not to mention some of the most reputable people like Scott and Pokepop have seen one so why do you question them. It's sort of disrespectful.
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I'm think I'm with Gary, I don't see the harm in asking. It's stirred up a really interesting conversation at the very least and made for a really entertaining thread. I think interpreting the air of "devil's advocate" as personal offense directed at anyone would be a mistake, but perhaps I'm in the minority there.
garyis2000
Member
Not at all. They both believe what they saw looked authentic. They both believe what somebody told them was true. Unfortunately that doesn't make it so. I've seen tons of what I believed were authentic items turn out not to be.
Here's a strange story. I had two baseballs signed IN PERSON by Mickey Mantle in 1990. I recently submitted them both and ONE CAME BACK AS A FORGERY. What??? I SAW the Mick sign it. I still don't know what happened but a switch must have been made at some point over the last 23 years. They looked seemingly identical until PSAs closer inspection.
---------- Post added 05/09/2013 at 11:05 AM ----------
Wow, somebody with an open mind:thumb:
As you get older you learn to question things. It's safer to protect yourself and your investment dollars. It's a good lesson to learn and advice that's needed here on the gym. Not only obvious frauds are frauds
There is resistance though as liquid implied. My views are rarely appreciated and I never seem to get "likes"...but that's ok. If we were all the same with no differences in opinions this site would be rather boring
FrostyFluxy
New Member
PSA are only humans after all, whether we like it or not. Well, they do have a few machines here and there but still. Even though they are 'experts' in their field, it doesn't make them 100% right, 100% of the time. If you were there and watched him sign it then it is legitimate. End of. Do you really question that someone somehow switched your signed card?
Just as a helpful thing to do when getting autographs. When I was at the PGA tour, even though I didn't know all of the people who I was getting autographs from I video recorded everything that was done. This way if I ever sell etc. I have proof that no-one can deny it's legitimacy.
*I appreciate your opinions Gary, and I don't doubt you exactly. I just think you should have a more open mind and believe there is a possiblity that they are out there. I believe it purely because there is little proof, but proof nonetheless.
Just as a helpful thing to do when getting autographs. When I was at the PGA tour, even though I didn't know all of the people who I was getting autographs from I video recorded everything that was done. This way if I ever sell etc. I have proof that no-one can deny it's legitimacy.
*I appreciate your opinions Gary, and I don't doubt you exactly. I just think you should have a more open mind and believe there is a possiblity that they are out there. I believe it purely because there is little proof, but proof nonetheless.
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Anyone who deals in autographs knows that it is not as concrete as grading/authenticating cards. Unless you were there witnessing the signing, it is an educated guess, which in PSA's case it is very educated, but not a complete 100% guarantee all the time.
The PreRaichu is Not the Honus wagner of pokemon. That is hands down the Illustrator. The Illustrator sells consistently more than any other card. Even if you were to buy the raichu with you offer, it is contrived.
What strikes me as being very odd is that you willingly believe that there are legitimate square cut cards but not this Raichu. What evidence is there for a legitimate square cut that has more merit than the Raichu?
The PreRaichu is Not the Honus wagner of pokemon. That is hands down the Illustrator. The Illustrator sells consistently more than any other card. Even if you were to buy the raichu with you offer, it is contrived.
What strikes me as being very odd is that you willingly believe that there are legitimate square cut cards but not this Raichu. What evidence is there for a legitimate square cut that has more merit than the Raichu?
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garyis2000
Member
Square cuts are easily obtained now from after market uncut sheets so in my opinion the original replacement square cuts have no better value. The only evidence from before was a few of us use to send in cards for replacement and those square cuts were returned. But again, that means nothing anymore
All I need to ask myself is would I rather have a PSA 10 illustrator or a PSA 10 PreRelease Raichu and its not even close. The Raichu, if it exists, is the far more valuable collectible. Plus there's a mystique involved. Maybe, ill start a thread asking this question
---------- Post added 05/09/2013 at 12:33 PM ----------
No fluxy, it was totally swapped out cause it was a forgery and quite good one. I had a couple card shops back then with many employees and maybe savvy customers. Heck, if Chris Angel (my neighbor btw
can make an elephant disappear then someone could switch out a baseball lol.How can you tell if a square cut is legitimately made or not? How can you feel comfortable buying one without knowing 100%? That is what I was getting at. If you are ultra concerned about the raichu's authenticity, to the point where you are saying what I have seen is not the real deal, how can you be ok with any square cut that has no real way of distinguishing it as legitimate?
Everyone can have their opinion on what card they like more, but the Illustrator is the most valuable as far as sales go. If you ask someone which card they would want if they had the opportunity to buy it, I guarantee it will be the Illustrator more than the Raichu.
There is plenty of mystique behind the Illustrator. It has a unique illustration, the only card to feature the word "Illustrator" at the top, a unique symbol on the bottom of the card, all of this connects to the purpose of its distribution. The PreRelease Raichu is a Base Raichu with a common Prerelease stamp...
Like most english cards they are variations or reproductions. Even the English pikachu Trophies are reproductions of the original japanese Trophies. In my experience, most serious collectors want unique illutsrations. Which is why there is a much greater demand for the original japanese trophy cards. Their illustrations are unique, very few in number and they connect completely to their purpose of distribution.
Everyone can have their opinion on what card they like more, but the Illustrator is the most valuable as far as sales go. If you ask someone which card they would want if they had the opportunity to buy it, I guarantee it will be the Illustrator more than the Raichu.
There is plenty of mystique behind the Illustrator. It has a unique illustration, the only card to feature the word "Illustrator" at the top, a unique symbol on the bottom of the card, all of this connects to the purpose of its distribution. The PreRelease Raichu is a Base Raichu with a common Prerelease stamp...
Like most english cards they are variations or reproductions. Even the English pikachu Trophies are reproductions of the original japanese Trophies. In my experience, most serious collectors want unique illutsrations. Which is why there is a much greater demand for the original japanese trophy cards. Their illustrations are unique, very few in number and they connect completely to their purpose of distribution.
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garyis2000
Member
As I said, most people can no longer tell original WOTC square cuts from newly sheet cut ones. Hence they're of no extra value.