Shino Bug Master
Front Page News Editor
Thanks for the info Pop! Does this change the ruling on SMeargle Portrating Engineers by chance? Thankfully it doesnt really matter as much anymore.
Pump up smash? How will it be ruled
- Thread starter thepokemonnetwork100
- Start date
Thanks for the info Pop! Does this change the ruling on SMeargle Portrating Engineers by chance? Thankfully it doesnt really matter as much anymore.
Otaku
Active Member
Works for me.
I mean, now its a basic established fact and if someone uses Pump Up Smash but attaches less than the full two Energy, it is (to me) the same end result as if they had issued an errata stating it was "up to". At least for this specific ruling. We'll see if other issues arise later.
I mean, now its a basic established fact and if someone uses Pump Up Smash but attaches less than the full two Energy, it is (to me) the same end result as if they had issued an errata stating it was "up to". At least for this specific ruling. We'll see if other issues arise later.
thepokemonnetwork100
Member
obviously this means not verification but does this change the fact attaching 2 is mandatory
There's a subtle difference, if I understand the ruling correctly. If there were a card in play that forced an open hand (there are none in the format that I know of, but there are a few in Unlimited), then the player WOULD be forced to attach energy if they had them.
King Piplup
Active Member
To me it's effectively errating it without technically errating.
Kayle
Active Member
Well, your opponent can't prove that you had more than one (or no) energy to attach.
It's become like failing a search in your deck.
The game is designed to 'forget' which cards are or were placed in a privat zone, which is why you can fail a deck search even though you just used Pokemon Communication. Same will aply to the hand. Even though you just used energy retrieval, it wouldn't count as 'public knowledge' that you had them in your hand and therefore you can 'fail' attaching those energies.
psychup2034
New Member
I wouldn't be so quick to jump to a conclusion. The bigger question is, "Is the hand still a 'private zone' when a game effect (like Fossil Omanyte's Clairvoyance) makes the contents of one hand always available for both players to see?"
I don't think there's an answer for this question yet.
The situation you describe with Energy Retrieval is completely different than the situation Tash is talking about!
It will work the same was as any card effect that tells you to reveal a Private Zone, such as your prizes.
Do what the card says to do.
bullados
<a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?
And now that this has come down, this is the way I will rule it. I like this ruling better as well. Jives more with how I'd like to see the game ruled.
I may be wrong, but I think their question is when the hand is public knowledge and two energies are present can the attaching energy still be optional? Do what the card says to do makes sense as an answer, but making sure the same question is being answered. It to me sounds like it is still optional, but I could see the argument for the opposite holding true.
...are there actually any cards whose effects would change if something in the prizes became public knowledge?
Otaku
Active Member
From what I can recall, only cards that specify "face down" Prizes have an issue when an effect reveals (flips up) Prizes, which I would take as making the flipped up Prizes "public". That's me though; we already know I have issues with some rulings (Simwar brought up one that I still find, the "unknowable deck").
Skitty
New Member
It's great to see a ruling on this before Battle Roads. :biggrin:
But now it brings up another question. If your hand is now a "Private Zone" and can fail Pump Up Smash, then couldn't you play Rare Candy and then fail that for the same reason?
psychup2034
New Member
You can't play a Trainer-Item card for no effect. (This cost of playing a card is not part of the effect.) Playing Rare Candy with no Stage 2 in hand would have no effect, and thus is not allowed. The fact that your hand is a private zone does not change the fact that you can't play a Trainer-Item card for no effect.
Attacking is different than playing a Trainer-Item. If there is a valid target, attacks can be used regardless of whether there is a net effect or not. The restriction on attacks is generally that they can't be used when there is no valid target. For example, Eelektross' Slurp Shakedown can't be used when your opponent has no benched Pokemon.
However, Terrakion EX's Pump-up Smash can be used even if the attack would do no damage and you have no energy cards in your hand, assuming there is a valid target (which there always will be). For example, Pump-up Smash can still be used if your opponent has an active Sigilyph and you have no energy cards in your hand; there would just be no net effect.
Shino Bug Master
Front Page News Editor
Usually, i would agree with your first statement, but i dont think its true. If you read the text on Rare Candy, its quite interesting. "Choose 1 of your Basic Pokemon in play." This is the ONLY requirement to the card, outside of its new first turn and new basic rulings. I can chose Carnivine on my bench as a Basic Pokemon and fufil everything Rare Candy forces em to do if he has been there a turn. The very next line starts "If you have a Satge 2 in your hand that evolves from that Pokemon, put that card on the Basic Pokemon." This s a conditional effect is it not? Choosing a Basic Pokemon is a preformable action, even if it doesn't acomplish anything.
Consider how coin flip cards work, i'll choose Recycle in this case. "Flip a coin." Again, the only part of the card that is mandatory If you play Recycle you cannot not flip a coin. "If heads, put a card from your discard pile on the top of your deck". It says nothing about what happens if its tails, because cards now are assumed that if the result intended is not achieved, the card fails. How is that different from rare Candy. You pick a target, find you have no target and the card fails and is discarded, just like a Tails flip on Recycle.
Also, looking at cards you can't play to no effect, like Max Potion. Very, very different text. "Heal all damage from one of your Pokemon." Already, it is starting with a much more direct conditional statement. It is telling you you cannot select a Pokemon that has no damage to heal, because its all in the requirement. "Then, discard all Energy attached tot hat Pokemon." Again, there is no if statement to back that it could be played to no effect. Everything on the card is instructional, leaving no room for playing the card as an empty effect.
I mean, Terrakion ex doesnt even give you leeway. It tells you to attach those darn energy! And we're saying you can hold them against what the card says with it being a private zone. Rare Candy shouldnt even needa privatezone, but with it, has a much stronger case than Terrakion does.