Feraligatr
New Member
GLB very well said !!! I couldn't agree more. The support we have received from PUI is nothing less than AWESOME!!! The best thing of all is it will keep getting better !!!
so what do you guys think of nintendo
- Thread starter GodTrainer
- Start date
- Status
Glumanda
Rulings Compendium Translator
Adv1sor said:
Why have the PLAYERS to get worked out something? Are we earning money by selling pokemon cards? I don´t think so. The distributors and PUI do.
There are some main problems with International OP:
* Some distributors do not want to invest something in a "dead game".
Take Switzerland as an example. In Switzerland there are NO leagues with promo cards because the distributor don´t want to pay for them. And don´t tell me that the players can arrange somehow with the distributor. They say No, and that´s it. Problem with this is that PUI has no threat to throw at them. WOTC could simply say: Support all of our games, or we will take all our games from you. This would mean no MTG...
* Some distributors do something, but are hindered by PUI.
German distributor phoned several stores to bid them to hold City Championships. Very good impression for the stores, if they have no CC material because PUI is not able to send it on time.
I´m very sure, German distributor would have happily let the Top 4 of Stadium Challenges and Nationals be qualified for Worlds (with only the winner be qualified with flight, the rest would be qualified without flight). When were they told that they could do so? On the day of Worlds. Very nice. If PUI would have been able to communicate the regulations and possibilities in a proper way, I would have been qualified for world. So I had to be a spectator. A master piece of organisation, indeed.
On the other hand, PUI decided right between Hawaii and Orlando. If it would have been Hawaii, there would have been by far less international players.
The results of Worlds show us the state of International OP. Japan has very good OP with many tournaments and many training possibilities. So the players are top. USA has very good OP with many tournaments, way too much prizes and many training possibilites. So the players are top.
Europe and rest of world? There were the one and another player getting into the Top 32, but in the whole the rest of the world played no role. And that is no wonder. OP in Europe is not existing with the exception of the regions where some people show some engagement (parts of Germany supported by German distributor, marcello in Italy, some grandfathered professors in UK, some grandfathered professors in Netherlands and Belgium, harassed by their distributors, maybe somewhere in Norway, too). I still think, Worlds have been US Nationals II with the invitation of some few friends. Nice, that we had 28 nations there. But if 20 of them have only 1 or 2 participants there, the phrase "international event" is highly exaggerated.
Country breakdown:
USA: something like 300?
Japan: ca. 24
UK: ca. 12
Germany: 8
Netherlands: something like 5?
Canada: ??
All other countries: 3 or less.
Sorry, this is not really international.
Look at Magic Worlds. The results there proof that the game is equal everywhere, that everyone in the world has the same chance to play in tournaments and qualify and they have the same training possibilities, so that you have a really good mixed international event. THIS really IS an international event.
To put in it a nutshell:
Goodies of PUI:
* Prereleases worldwide
* Good tournament structure in US
* 15+ is back!!!
* Worlds
Slops of PUI:
* disfunctional tournament software
* no judge certification (= professor program)
* rest of world only gets very few support, measured by the amount of US support
* distributors in Europe are allowed to do what they want
* material is not sent on time
* regulations are not worked out or suddenly change
* only half of the emails are answered
and so on, and so on.
What I expect PUI to do in the next year:
* Write a functional TMS.
* Bring the Professor Test online.
* Bring the rest of the world on the same support level the US is, even if this means that the support in the US has to be slightly lowered.
* Demand the distributors to do a good job.
* Country breakdown (i.e. invitations) at Worlds should be adjusted to player numbers in the countries.
NoPoke
Active Member
PokePop said:
exactly so.
I wont be running any more large pre-releases in the UK unless something significant changes. I'll run 8 player pre-releases because that is where the support is from the OP provider. Less financial risk and less hassel too: you don't even have to report them it seems!
When you ask for support and product and are turned away you go elsewhere. Much of the UK league suport has come from our friends in the USA . Or putting it another way. The UK leagues are being supported by like minded FANS in the USA. (thanks to all involved)
So the distributor turns you away and then complains when you go elsewhere? LOL
---------------------------------
It seems that the local distributors and their agents would prefer to see league kits go to non-existant leagues and end up on ebay rather than to a potentially increasing player base. Why so you may ask? Because supporting players costs money. Whereas a 'league' selling material on ebay is guaranteed not to rock the boat or have the temerity to ask for more when their player base increases.
My sales have been destroyed by the actions of the OP provider. Who also just happens to have a direct sales operation. Misuse of monopoly position anyone?
So Speak not of what you know little Advisor. yes there are always two sides to any story but that doesn't mean that the alternative is always good news. Heck if it was good outside the USA don't you think that someone somewhere would say so? The only European country that may have decent OP is Norway, and that might have a lot to do with it being delivered by a FAN like us.
* spits blood!*
Rainbowgym
Active Member
And Again a topic shows the big differences in OP in and outside the US.
Advisor
A win-win relation or even better a relation has to be build on trust and giving the other space to create a win situation. If one party of a relation is afraid that meaby someone else beside himself could become better of that cooperation, than there is no relation.
Even worse if one party thinks he is the one who should earn all the profits and not willing to let other party have a little profit out of a situation both party are working on, there is no win-win. That's a win - get lost situation.
Advisor
A win-win relation or even better a relation has to be build on trust and giving the other space to create a win situation. If one party of a relation is afraid that meaby someone else beside himself could become better of that cooperation, than there is no relation.
Even worse if one party thinks he is the one who should earn all the profits and not willing to let other party have a little profit out of a situation both party are working on, there is no win-win. That's a win - get lost situation.
Adv1sor, I do mostly agree with what my European friends have written.
We may not forgrt one thing. PUI/Nintendo are selling their product in the USA. For the European distributors, Pokemon is one of the products they sell, and it's not making a lot of money compared with some of them.
The division of the European market is another big difference. I may understand that a distributor in a country like Belgium gives only 1 trip to Worlds because the market is very small (population of LA approx).
Why can't we have a win-win relation ? For different reasons. Most distributors don't believe in the Pokemon product. They know that the support they have is not good and they don't want to invest time and money in an almost dead product (once again, they have other products that bring a lot of money) in these conditions.
So, from their point of view, I don't think they're really interested in POP. I've talked to, or heard from, different distributors, and this seems to be confirmed everywhere, except maybe in France where POP was dead since 2001.
In addition to that, they all know that the people who want to help have a big experience with Wizards and are very well informed of what happens in our Pokemon world. It's really easier to do their own little business, without too much problems, instead of working with people who will push them in the direction of a good OP which will be more expensive in terms of time, money and involvment for them.
About people buying cards in the US and selling them cheaper than the distributors.
The first time a big business has been made with the USA was for Expedition because one company didn't want the set to be released in Europe. That company was ... Nintendo !!!
If some players buy their boxes in the USA, you may not prevent them of trying to pay as less as possible, especially when the difference is important. 80 USD (+ shipping) for a box in the USA is a normal price on the web. If you buy the same box in a shop in Belgium you'll pay between 140 and 160 USD, and the distributor sells the box at USD 110.
That's for personal use. I'm maybe wrong, but except that 'Expedition period', I don't think that TO's do business with it.
We may not forgrt one thing. PUI/Nintendo are selling their product in the USA. For the European distributors, Pokemon is one of the products they sell, and it's not making a lot of money compared with some of them.
The division of the European market is another big difference. I may understand that a distributor in a country like Belgium gives only 1 trip to Worlds because the market is very small (population of LA approx).
Why can't we have a win-win relation ? For different reasons. Most distributors don't believe in the Pokemon product. They know that the support they have is not good and they don't want to invest time and money in an almost dead product (once again, they have other products that bring a lot of money) in these conditions.
So, from their point of view, I don't think they're really interested in POP. I've talked to, or heard from, different distributors, and this seems to be confirmed everywhere, except maybe in France where POP was dead since 2001.
In addition to that, they all know that the people who want to help have a big experience with Wizards and are very well informed of what happens in our Pokemon world. It's really easier to do their own little business, without too much problems, instead of working with people who will push them in the direction of a good OP which will be more expensive in terms of time, money and involvment for them.
About people buying cards in the US and selling them cheaper than the distributors.
The first time a big business has been made with the USA was for Expedition because one company didn't want the set to be released in Europe. That company was ... Nintendo !!!
If some players buy their boxes in the USA, you may not prevent them of trying to pay as less as possible, especially when the difference is important. 80 USD (+ shipping) for a box in the USA is a normal price on the web. If you buy the same box in a shop in Belgium you'll pay between 140 and 160 USD, and the distributor sells the box at USD 110.
That's for personal use. I'm maybe wrong, but except that 'Expedition period', I don't think that TO's do business with it.
NoPoke
Active Member
maybe the title of the thread should be changed from Nintendo to PUI?
I had forgotten that the Official Nintendo view on the e-card series was that they should be delayed untill the launch of the e-reader accessory. still waiting for the e-reader in Europe *shrug*
I had forgotten that the Official Nintendo view on the e-card series was that they should be delayed untill the launch of the e-reader accessory. still waiting for the e-reader in Europe *shrug*
Last edited:
I feel that I will never be able to be happy with Nintendo as long as they keep throwing the international support out the window. I'm sorry, Worlds sounded awesome, the new league sounds awesome. But when I think about the many people that are fellow poke-players over seas that aren't able to hold tournaments or leagues because they have no support, even though they want to so badly, I feel very sad, and very mad at Nintendo.
Master_Prof_Juggie
New Member
Giday
My view from little ol New Zealand (home of Te Awhi who got 30th at Worlds 15+), but includes ALOT of things that DONT happen here, as noted below.
Pros ...
I'd have 3 levels ... Grand Master Professor, Master Professor & Professor.
Each level can only be attained by being the previous level for a set period (Prof to Master 6 months, Master to Grand 1 year) & passing the exam with a higher pass mark required. The exam would be 100 questions & each pass level would be Prof 70%, Master 80% & Grand Master 90%.
Fail a level when trying to move up & you stay the your current level & can only try again after a stand down period (Prof 2 months, Master 4 months & Grand 8 months). Retesting would be every year on the aniversary of the level you are on. Fail to pass the requirements for your current level & you drop down to the next level, with the same conditions as the stand down periods (this is different to Magic which has no retesting).
I'm currently a Master prof & might fail to keep that status under this system, but this would create respect for the Professor Program (I'd be proud to make & retain any level). It would lead into rewards like ONLY Professors staffing / judging the Major events (Worlds being the obvious ... starting with PUI staff then Grand Master Profs, Master Profs & finally Profs until it's fully staffed).
Grand Masters could be included as part of the Rules Team & be consulted (via email if required) in any meetings of the team. Players would respect any rulings as they would know what it takes to become a professor of any level.
Thats my 10 cents (high inflation here)
My view from little ol New Zealand (home of Te Awhi who got 30th at Worlds 15+), but includes ALOT of things that DONT happen here, as noted below.
Pros ...
- Continuing to make this game !! Where would we be without it ??
- Pre Releases ... Major props !!
- Trips / Invites to Worlds for Intl players.
- Having a schedule of major tournaments leading up to worlds. (Nationals only here)
- OP, although it also appears in the Cons.
- Resetting of the Rankings each year
- Major differences between US & Intl (events, prizes, leagues, opportunities, OP organization as a whole)
- NO Communication between PUI & Intl TO's / Professors
- Greedy & Arogant Intl Distributors / not following Norways example & getting active with support
- League support (NO books, Badges, proper promos)
- TMS software ... even the latest version (1.16) drops players with byes ... just to name 1 fault of many !! ARGGGGGGHHHHH !!!!!
- OP, as someone else said in another post somewhere ... why does Magic the Gathering succeed & prosper ... I say because it's stable & it's TO's / Judges are respected by players & Wotc.
- 1st turn SUPPORTER rule !! My god, how could they destroy the game this way. Anyone want to flip to decide the outcome ??
- 1st turn evolutions !! Powerful decks got even faster, sure ATM Rock is a counter, but seriously ... nope
- Intl TO's & Professors deal solely with PUI, USA ... the local intl distributors are then directed by PUI on what is required & sent where.
- Fixed & Published box prices + entry fees for Worldwide Pre Releases / Prize support !! Use US$ as the price with each OP country & their prices in a list below that. The only allowable difference in entry fee being upto $5 US to cover currency flucuations after the product is ordered. No more greedy distributors getting their markup, as players & TO's would be able to check the exchange rate themselves.
- Equal prize support for ALL !! have a set formula to work out what each major event will have, with extra product added for CC, GC, SC, Nats & Worlds ... very simple to work out (1 box for every 25 players, using a % to decide how they're used) Include exactly how the TO / Judges get paid with product as well.
- Professor Program with regular retesting & multiple levels like the Magic system. I'll explain more below
- Change the 1st turn evolution & supporter rules back
- FIX THE TMS SOFTWARE !!
I'd have 3 levels ... Grand Master Professor, Master Professor & Professor.
Each level can only be attained by being the previous level for a set period (Prof to Master 6 months, Master to Grand 1 year) & passing the exam with a higher pass mark required. The exam would be 100 questions & each pass level would be Prof 70%, Master 80% & Grand Master 90%.
Fail a level when trying to move up & you stay the your current level & can only try again after a stand down period (Prof 2 months, Master 4 months & Grand 8 months). Retesting would be every year on the aniversary of the level you are on. Fail to pass the requirements for your current level & you drop down to the next level, with the same conditions as the stand down periods (this is different to Magic which has no retesting).
I'm currently a Master prof & might fail to keep that status under this system, but this would create respect for the Professor Program (I'd be proud to make & retain any level). It would lead into rewards like ONLY Professors staffing / judging the Major events (Worlds being the obvious ... starting with PUI staff then Grand Master Profs, Master Profs & finally Profs until it's fully staffed).
Grand Masters could be included as part of the Rules Team & be consulted (via email if required) in any meetings of the team. Players would respect any rulings as they would know what it takes to become a professor of any level.
Thats my 10 cents (high inflation here)
Last edited:
- Status