The Intentional Draw System Is Unfair and needs to be Balanced Out!!

[FireFighter095ReBorn]

Hi,
Im never one to complain in this game and i give myself all the fight when it comes to decks and competition but i have been nagged so much by this issue in the game since nintendo has taken over and even in wizards tiems. The Intentinal Draw System.

In worlds i was screwed out of a chance to compete after an amazing 4-3 record due to the system. In many events i was screwed by a simple 2-3 slots due to the intentinal draw system. i know buddies at worlds that missed the cut due to players who draw round 6+7

I know in this game we need an intentinal draw system to balance power but to make them unlimited is just completly wrong and if anyone can allow this to continue its a travesty. I Dont complain about anything in this game and win or lose i take my spot respectidly. I just fell if you win or lose nomatter what you should never draw to move on becayse if you do you are not as world caliber as you should be.

At worlds i remember after round 7 there were players doing a 2 ID that would allow them in and that is even more unfair then 1 ID. It was alot to say 1 draw can get you in but 2 draws is ridiculous and my buddy was screwed by that issue in getting a top 32 spot.

My dream is to have the system banned and to have all players forced into playing all the way through in order to go on but i know by rules of gaming its impossible so i propose this:

My buddy told me if you cant defeat it, balance it out so here is his idea:

Tell players you can draw but only in the first or last round.

You draw once and then play the rest,this gives a fair and even game for all and dosent break the system all together. I and my buddy fell its a good and fair decision on the system that will make the game fair and balance out the syatem so no one gets screwed out of a shot at top 8-16 at major tournmants

I hope nintendo can read this and fix it because if they dont by the time november arrives there will be major issue with the draw system.

I hope many people, dont attemp to bash me here or attemp to attack me,give fair and open opinions on this topic.

 

[Prime]

I don't like ID at all. IMHO, it should not be a choice.

 

[mysterioustrainer]

I must logically disagree. Strategy is bound by four factors for Pokemon

1. The meta gaming
2. The deck building
3. The game itself
4. The tournament itself (where IDing and strategical conceding apply)

Everyone wants to play to win and therefore should have all the rights of being able to draw in order to reach that. Basically I hate to say it, you really just have to fight harder to make it in. Sounds tough but I am just giving pure honest opinion.

Also not allowing players to draw at all or even restricting when to draw just doesn't even function for a competive event. Its like saying you have to play all rounds or drop, which to me is unattractive. I just don't see it happening.

 

[Prime]

I don't play to win. Winning is an added plus, but I play to have fun. So I must disagree with your theories.

What's wrong with having to play all the rounds? Did you not enter the big tournament to win it like you said? And yet, you don't want to play all of the rounds?

 

[Hot Mustid]

Iding is a strategic part of the game. If someone were to pay attention to the scores and realize that a 4-2-1 record would have gotten in, why would they play all 3 games without trying to id one of them? (joe this isnt implied at you since I know you were 3-3 in the 6th round) This is implied towards my friend ben. He went 4-0 and then lost all 3 rounds after that. He didnt even realize that if he had 1 id instead of a loss he would have made it in. I remember he telling me that in round 5 he wouldve ided but he had a "god hand" and lost anyway. I think he was happy that he didnt make it in anyway since he got to be staff. But Ids are a part of the game. If you are too oblivious (or dumb) to take advantage of them, then you dont need to. just dont complain about them.

 

[Master_Prof_Juggie]

Giday

Lets put yourself in this exmple ...

You & your buddy are playing the last round of Worlds ... An ID will get you both through, but a loss for either, will only get the winner through.

Taking that into account ... would YOU now want to ID ??

I like the ID ability in an event & have used it a number of times.

I turn up to tournaments of all levels to play & enjoy the experience with other people that enjoy the same game ... Sure, winning prizes is the ultimate goal.

Being able to ID to allow myself the chance to play even more games without the possibility of losing & missing out ... has to be an added bonus.

There will always be players that get upset when this system works against them & i've had it happen to me too many times to remember, but i still feel it's an intrical part to the competitive nature of the more serious events ...

Should i or shouldn't i ... will i be truely safe if i do ...

My vote is keep the Intentional Draw !!

 

[FireFighter095ReBorn]

Iding is a strategic part of the game. If someone were to pay attention to the scores and realize that a 4-2-1 record would have gotten in, why would they play all 3 games without trying to id one of them? (joe this isnt implied at you since I know you were 3-3 in the 6th round) This is implied towards my friend ben. He went 4-0 and then lost all 3 rounds after that. He didnt even realize that if he had 1 id instead of a loss he would have made it in. I remember he telling me that in round 5 he wouldve ided but he had a "god hand" and lost anyway. I think he was happy that he didnt make it in anyway since he got to be staff. But Ids are a part of the game. If you are too oblivious (or dumb) to take advantage of them, then you dont need to. just dont complain about them.

I have never nor will i ever say that its not a stragical part of the game what im saying is i fell it needs to be balanced out so not to allow unlimited ID's. Yes its gonna stay but it should be limited to a rule of Id once in a tournament so anyone who can id to get in can get in but no one drops 2 ID's just to move up. If you arent in it to play it all the way through then why be in it??

 

[Prime]

Giday

Lets put yourself in this exmple ...

You & your buddy are playing the last round of Worlds ... An ID will get you both through, but a loss for either, will only get the winner through.

Taking that into account ... would YOU now want to ID ??

Okay, you two draw, but at the same time, 10 other people do too, knocking you both out of the top 16. A win for either one would have put either of you in the top 16.

Or how about this.

Your buddy has won all his matches and is clear to the top 16. You on the other hand have lost one match and an ID won't put you to the top 16. You barely beat your opponent just to find that you didn't make the top 16. 20 People ID'd and bumped you to 20th place. TOo bad you actually played and won your match but in the end lost to people that didn't even play their game.

How do you like ID'ing now?

 

[Hagrid23]

Well, this subject is about to be moot. We heard from a fairly reliable source at Worlds that the scoring system is going to change soon, effectively removing the ID.

 

[FireFighter095ReBorn]

I guess when you do wish upon a star dreams come true. I heard jimmer be reallllllllly tight lipped about it saying no more then 5 words on the subject at worlds so i guess he knew about this and was trying to keep it under wraps. Good to hear the ID system is under review to be removed.

 

[yoshi1001]

Well, this subject is about to be moot. We heard from a fairly reliable source at Worlds that the scoring system is going to change soon, effectively removing the ID.

That's good. The main problem with IDing is it promotes ill will at a time in which adreniline is high-not a good recipie. It's basically a ticking time bomb.

And if IDing is such a skill, how come virtually everyone seems to be able to figure it out so easily at tournaments?

Basically, people who support IDing actually do so based on a logical fallacy that it gives them more control. In reality, they create a system which is based on a smaller number of random events (which is actually a bad thing since the sum of the impacts of the random events is still the same, and therefore each random event more significant and less likely to cancel out) followed by a single "choice" whose outcome exists solely to benefit those who come out ahead in the expedited event. In other words, IDing shortens the tournament and therefore makes it more random and less skillful.

The real problem isn't that the game is more random, it's that people are making it more random, as opposed to an inanimate or faceless object.

 

[)v(ajin_ipg21]

ID's exist in other games, it's just another aspect to the tournament experience and strategy. It does provide 'control', why endanger your chances of not making a top cut?

Of coure that means SOMEONE will not, oh well... that's the tournament experience...

I'd be shocked if it were no more...but quote: I've got nothin'...

 

[yoshi1001]

"It does provide 'control', why endanger your chances of not making a top cut?"

Sounds more like at atmosphere of fear than of control. Besides, why should one group have total control at the expense of another simply because they benefited from a more random system?

"ID's exist in other games, it's just another aspect to the tournament experience and strategy."

No offense, but we're talking about a decision that takes only basic math skills to make (granted, the game itself isn't always rocket science)-I don't think it's more strategic than the strategy it replaces.

Besides, you can market the game-ID's are considerably harder.

 

[SteveP]

Agreed. I'll bet POP does something to eliminate IDs (or at least diminish their impact) before the next Championship Series begins.

There are solutions (they've been discussed at length previously). Hopefully, POP will come up with one that the majority will like.

 

[TheCrossFormatKid]

ID's arent a problem, its as simple as that. And even if IDs are eliminated, people will just not draw any prizes in games that they wish to draw in on purpose, effectively creating an ID on time.

 

[FireFighter095ReBorn]

They can try that but then it will result in a sudden death showdown till soemone draws a prize declairing a winner or loser. There is no more partial points on draws or time.

 

[SteveP]

ID's arent a problem, its as simple as that. And even if IDs are eliminated, people will just not draw any prizes in games that they wish to draw in on purpose, effectively creating an ID on time.

You're assuming that kind of situation can't be resolved. I can come up with at least 3 ways to resolve that (not caring whether you like those resolutions or not).

1. Flip a coin to see who wins.
2. Assign 0 points for a draw.
3. Drop both players if it's obvious they're ID-ing.

Does anyone know if they allow ties in the Japanese tournament system? If not, I suspect we can adopt whatever system they're using to eliminate ties.

 

[Prime]

I like ties. Both players slugging it out until the end and in the end, both can't beat each other. That's fine. But ID's are different. The players don't even play the game when they ID. Why should not playing the game allow you to rank higher than those that did play the game but lost?

 

[Darkash]

Well, this subject is about to be moot. We heard from a fairly reliable source at Worlds that the scoring system is going to change soon, effectively removing the ID.

Thank god! I have always HATED the ID system, because, for those who are undefeated/one loss, it effectivly lets them play one round less then everyone else, and still make top 8/16/32/whatever.

P.S.: 4-3 Joe? Ouch! I feel your pain.

 

[Rainbowgym]

Both my kids could get into top 32 with an ID, but I didn't allow them.
I told them you are there to play, so you will play.
Finally both won that last game and entered top 32 without an ID and that's how it should be.

But I feel the same disaffection with byes. I don't like those either.
You should never enter a new tournament with already a win. (and as I understand the US nationals you could even enter with 2 byes).
Once you win a tournament you get the prices belonging to that tournament and period. At a new one you should just proof from the same position as the other players that your skills will bring you high. And not getting an advance because of a former tournament.