Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

What counts as "play space"

vaporeon

Moderator
With this new forum being here, I thought I'd ask this. At a states I played in last year, a player flipped a coin and it landed outside his play area, so he claims. I watched him flip the coin instead of watching my game and saw that it landed outside his play mat. He called a judge over to get a reflip on the tails he go and he was allowed to reflip it. To me, a play area is considered both my opponents and my play space, ending at the players play space next to use and off the table. Pretty simple to me with no need to rule shark but can be a issue in tournament play.

Now, how is this suppose to be handled? This is more he said, she said but what counts as play space? Is it just your playmat if you have one, your side of the table are both players play area?

On a personal note, I dont think he would have called a judge over had he flipped heads.
 
I dont think he would have called a judge over had he flipped heads

Exactly what I was thinking.
I'm very hesitant to ever allow a reflip unless the coin/die is clearly out of the area or unreadable due to leaning at a 45 degree angle for exactly this reason.

Generally speaking, it is "the play area" that the rules refer to, not "your play area" (have to double check this). So it includes both players in-play areas and I'd give a leeway to bordering areas.

As you note, most calls for a reflip, whether from a player or their opponent, are only going to be on determinations that went against them if they were to be counted. If a judge automatically or easily rules a reflip, they have just changed a critical roll from "flip a coin" to "flip to coins, both must be heads" or "both must be tails" and that's something to work to avoid.
 
Here's the quote from the TCG Rules and Formats guidelines:
Coin flips that land outside the playing area (off of the table or in another game’s playing area) are considered invalid and must be flipped again.

So, in my opinion, it has to be off the table or into another game's (not the opponent's, a whole other game's) play area before I will rule for a reflip. Anything other than that, and I'm ruling it a valid flip.

I've also seen flips ruled invalid just because they bounced off of one or the other player's arms. Those should be valid as well, as long as the arm or body part remained motionless, so as to not consciously direct the roll or flip.
 
This is what I was thinking. The play area should be the immediate area of you and your opponents game so to hear a judge say if its off the playmat, it does not count was weird. I do think there was judge on judge bias there since the player who did it was a judge himself.
 
I take a more general view of "the play area." Even if the coin or die ends up next to the active Pokemon in the game at the next table, I'll count it. So long as it doesn't go off the table, and both players can see the result from where they are sitting, it counts. Without this perspective, a flip of the coin at some of the theme deck prereleases (lots of juniors) I run will chew up 10 minutes of game time just trying to get the coin to land in the right area. This would also be a concern when players are seated really close to each other.
 
I tend to agree with pokeMATHter. If both players can easily see the flip result, and the coin isn't at a really weird angle, then I'd call it a legal flip.


Head judge all age groups Canadian Nats 3 years running. Head judge Nats Masters division the next year. Former PTO.
 
To me, a play area is considered both my opponents and my play space, ending at the players play space next to use and off the table.
This sounds right.

A playmat is not the boundary of a game. There is flexibility. To invalid a flip, the result should land clearly into another game's play area: next to or on the other game's active pokemon; between the other game's active and bench area or on the other game's benched pokemon; on top off a deck, discard pile, or prizes used in the other game (and I mean completely landing on them, not simply touching one of them).

VA Winter Regionals 2014, Masters division floor judge.
 
Without this perspective, a flip of the coin at some of the theme deck prereleases (lots of juniors) I run will chew up 10 minutes of game time just trying to get the coin to land in the right area. This would also be a concern when players are seated really close to each other.

Everything is looser at a Prerelease! Especially with Juniors.
 
Without this perspective, a flip of the coin at some of the theme deck prereleases (lots of juniors) I run will chew up 10 minutes of game time just trying to get the coin to land in the right area. This would also be a concern when players are seated really close to each other.

Everything is looser at a Prerelease! Especially with Juniors.
 
[sarcasm] If judges think the playmat is the boundary, then lets use those 8 foot long playmats =) [/sarcasm]

If the roll/flip can be easily verified by the players, then it is valid, meaning they can see it from a sitting position.
If the roll/flip bounces off a player, its valid
If the roll/flip bounces off a player who knocked it around, then it is invalid.

You know, if a player tries to invalidate a flip due to location of die/coin, then I would alert my judges to watch that player, and if another flip (which is in their favor) ends up in the same spot, declare a re-flip for the same reason, lets see if the player complains about that =).
 
[sarcasm] If judges think the playmat is the boundary, then lets use those 8 foot long playmats =) [/sarcasm]

If the roll/flip can be easily verified by the players, then it is valid, meaning they can see it from a sitting position.
If the roll/flip bounces off a player, its valid
If the roll/flip bounces off a player who knocked it around, then it is invalid.

You know, if a player tries to invalidate a flip due to location of die/coin, then I would alert my judges to watch that player, and if another flip (which is in their favor) ends up in the same spot, declare a re-flip for the same reason, lets see if the player complains about that =).
 
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