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Author
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Topic: Japanese latest Rulings for ADV!!! (Double Battle Ruling included)
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vincent0906
Member
Member # 10398
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posted February 11, 2003 03:56 AM
Hey!Man! Did all you guys miss my new Japanese rulings? Now i translate it to you now!
Because the newest ruling for Japanese player is too long, so i only share the new rules and the changed rules to all of you!
I will post the double battle ruling later.
-------------------------------------
New rule:
1. ex Pokemon
---If your ex pokemon is ko'ed, your opponent
draw two prize instead of one.
-------------------------------------
Changing in old ruling:
1. Stadium Card
---You can only play one Stadium Card per turn.
2. Darkness Energy
---The text has been changed to:
"Darkness Energy provide one [D]. If the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy attached to
attack opponent's active Pokemon and the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy attached to
is Dark type or have 'Dark' in it's name,
That attack does 10 more damage. If the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy is attached to
isn't 'Dark' type or have 'Dark' in it's name,
this effect does nothing."
3. Metal Energy
---The text has been changed to:
"Darkness Energy provide one [M]. If the
Pokemon which Metal Energy attached to
is 'Steel' type, damage from pokemon attack
is reduced by 10. If the pokemon which metal
energy attached to isn't 'steel' type, this
effect does nothing."
4. Mulligan (have i spell wrong? ![[Confused]](confused.gif) )
---If your opponent hasn't any basic pokemon in
his/her hand in the beginning of the game,
You draw one extra card(or 0) instead of 2
before.
5. First round
---In the first round, the first player cannot
draw one card before his/her turn start.
6. Retreat
---You can only retreat once per turn.
---You can retreat your active pokemon even your
bench is full.
7. Confusion
---The new punlishment of getting 'tails' in the
confusion check when confused pokemon attack
is "put 3 damage counter on that pokemon"
instead of 20 damage.
---Confused Pokemon can retreat as same as
'healthy pokemon' instead of need a coin flip.
================================================
Double Battle Rule:
1. Each player can have 2 active Pokemon when
play.
2. If a player has 2 or more Pokemon in play,
the player must have 2 active Pokemon.
3. During Mulligan, If a player have 2 basic
Pokemon or more, the player must put 2 pokemon
into play as active Pokemon. If only 1, just
put 1 into battle field.
4. You can only have 4 bench Pokemon at most.
5. Each player's round, the player can only
retreat 1 of his/her active Pokemon once.
6. Each player's round, only 1 of the active can
attack.
7. When announce an attack, state which of your
Pokemon attack and which of your opponent's
Pokemon is the target.
Get shocked? ![[Devilish]](graemlins/diablo.gif)
[ February 22, 2003, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: vincent0906 ]
--------------------
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http://www.hkpokemona.com
Hong Kong Pokemon Alliance
From: Hong Kong | Registered: Mar 2001
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ScythKing
Member # 26665
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posted February 11, 2003 04:54 AM
quote:
Originally posted by vincent0906:
I think these ruling can shock you all!
Yup! Sounds like Magic with no draw for the player who goes first. And the ruling on Dark and Metal? That reeks! And the final straw is the confusion change 30 for confusion???? ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
What were they thinking?
--------------------
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From: Chattanooga, TN USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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PhoenixSong
Member
Member # 120501
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posted February 11, 2003 05:50 AM
I don't buy it! These rule changes are crazy!
From: FL | Registered: Jan 2003
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Psychic Player
Member
Member # 121292
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posted February 11, 2003 08:05 AM
don't worry!
that's only japan!
point 5 is a really good changing!
and the ex rule is also good, the stadium card rule too!
the rest is ![[Dropjaw]](graemlins/dropjaw.gif)
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steelix rulez
From: VIENNA | Registered: Jan 2003
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted February 11, 2003 08:27 AM
nuh uh...
BE careful, I think Nick15 et al where looking at translations of possible future sets and vincent here did say that HE would work on translating some rulings/cards...
SO ENJOY dark/metal (retreating only ONCE per turn???) because I wonder... I wonder... new text versions voids the text of previous cards...
--------------------
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SHUT UP & DO something about it
From: The here, BUT WHERE shall we go? | Registered: Feb 2001
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yoshi1001
Member # 825
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posted February 11, 2003 08:33 AM
Yes, but remember in the video game changing Pokemon costs you a turn, and don't forget the card game is (loosely) based on the video game.
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AIM: yoshi1001
From: Janesville, Wisconsin | Registered: Feb 2001
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CPUSrchDiscarding2forOak
Member # 37400
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posted February 11, 2003 10:19 AM
The EX rule I can understand...stadium is a bunch of hooey, the only one retreat is just wrong...if they release this kind of D/M here then it DESTROYS Arithmetic...
Confusion just got messed up. Another HORRIBLE change from "do self-damage" to "place damage counters on". Metal should be PREVENTING that damage.
*sigh* And unfortunately, Pokemon turns more and more into Magic...
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What, like the pro-archetype attitude is supposed to be restricted to THIS company, and THIS TCG?
All card games run on archetypes. Magic is 90% archetypes. YGO is 90% archetypes. Pokemon was, for the most part, all archetypes before and during MF2. Pokemon will be archetype-based during MF3. Pokemon will be archetype based when it is under Nintendo.
Viva la unoriginality!
From: West Mifflin, PA | Registered: Aug 2001
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DOMCGI
Member # 20344
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posted February 11, 2003 10:52 AM
I feel ok on those change of the rules.
1. No multi Stadium per turn is not a big deal.
2/3. Metal and Darkness energy card only give special effect to Metal and Darkness pokemon. Darkness change is not a big problem because most player will not use this on non-darkness pokemon. Metal change will take away the Metal Chansey, Arcanine, Zapdos and made them less powerful. As the Metal Chansay being so good in the Unlimited format for a long time, this may be time to give a change.
4. Draw 1 card reduce the penelty of mulligan. Not a big problem.
5. First round no draw is very good.
6. Only 1 retreat per turn made Special Condition more powerful. TPC just want the Special Condition become a more important factor in the game. They already did this by "Poison disable Pokemon Power". It also reduce the important on free retreater. I feel ok on this.
7. "Place 3 counters" is balanced by "no filp retreat" and "not apply weakness/resistance". As in rule 6, TPC just want the Special Condition become more important.
Overall, I do not oppose on those change. It may be fun to see how it affect our game.
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An Old Pokemon Trading Card Game Player.
Pokemon Professor: Score of 40/50
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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Gym Leader Blaine
Member # 5977
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posted February 11, 2003 11:57 AM
It will be interesting to see, if these rules are real, if or when they will be added to WOTC stuff.
--------------------
"One day I will be the most powerful Jedi ever!" - Anakin Skywalker
darkmt_mike presents the speaker with question 83 from gym_leader_blaine:DMTM who would win in the battle in Gengar VS Jango Fett?
darkmt_mike says, "Hmm. think Gengar uses the Force so I would bet on him."
Salt Lake City Professors Web Site
From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Mar 2001
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RaindanceKing
Member
Member # 33601
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posted February 11, 2003 12:53 PM
Yo people, its only in JAPAN! Theres nothing to worry about! ![[ROFL]](graemlins/roflmao.gif)
From: Cerulean City (AKA, Oregon) | Registered: Jul 2001
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SteveP
Member # 14743
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posted February 11, 2003 01:17 PM
I've always thought that Japan understood their game better than we did. They designed the game. They know the original intent of the rules and cards better than us. They know best when cards and rules are being abused in order to take advantage of any loopholes. The biggest complainers about rule changes are those who don't like their loophole abuse disrupted. I find it interesting that some players seem to think THEY know what's best for Pokemon and NOT the original designers. ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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Proud member of Team PokéParents - we play Pokémon with our kids!
From: Colorado Springs, CO, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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DOMCGI
Member # 20344
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posted February 11, 2003 02:01 PM
TPC can push WotC to following their way. Band Slowking is an example.
Even it is only affecting Japan now, I believe it could affect us in the nearly future.
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An Old Pokemon Trading Card Game Player.
Pokemon Professor: Score of 40/50
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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GymLeaderPhil
Member # 455
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posted February 11, 2003 02:50 PM
quote:
Originally posted by vincent0906:
6. Retreat
---You can only retreat once per turn.
---You can retreat your active pokemon even your
bench is full.
7. Confusion
---Confused Pokemon can retreat as same as
'healthy pokemon' instead of need a coin flip.
Those of you saying they are wanting to strengthen the power of special conditions better review the removal of the flip to retreat when confused.
I think the ruling to only allow one retreat per turn will shake up the game the most... Personally, its a bad call from my viewpoint, despite claims from SteveP that the Japanese know OUR metagame... I would love to see the Japanese come over here and watch a North American or Europian World Championship. The ONLY event the Japanese game designers have seen North American and European decks and play in was at the Tropical Mega Battle where there was only a handful of players there. Far from any scientific proven fact that just because Johhny from New York played at the TMB with a haymaker the rest of the continental United States does also...
Our game is MUCH diffrent from Japan's Game.
This will affect Modified and Unlimited. This means the speed of the game will be reduced with stationary Pokemon like Cleffa, Scyther, etc. Double Gust will see little play. Switch will be used more.
Additionally, according to the translation, we now can retreat Pokemon without worrying about the five Pokemon limit on the bench... I feel like I'm playing Magic folks! If I wanted to play Magic, I'd go and play Magic.
Alot of legal work probably went into blocking the half CardE/VS and Neo/Base/Etc Rule for deck construction here in North America and Europe. I hope the same goes into effect to some of these new rulings which have LITTLE to do with our playing enviroment and will cause CONFUSION to existing players.
Well, maybe I'm just blowing my casket over nothing... I dont even know if these translations are accurate because everything is poorly spelled and I dont know the person who provided them, no offense. I doubt WotC has even recieved any of this information too since it is very recent.
All I have to say is... just because Magic is the top grossing card game currently does not mean every single person plays it and should have mechanics from it added into another game. Thats like saying since Monopoly is such a hot selling item, I think we should replace Chess pawns with die cast shoes or cars from Monopoly.
-Phil
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THIS is truly thinking outside of the box!
Check out Florida's Pokemon Website
From: Where ever the ladies take me | Registered: Feb 2001
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PokePop
Member # 8
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posted February 11, 2003 02:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by GymLeaderPhil:
Additionally, according to the translation, we now can retreat Pokemon without worrying about the five Pokemon limit on the bench... I feel like I'm playing Magic folks! If I wanted to play Magic, I'd go and play Magic.
-Phil
I lost you here Phil. Why don't you worry about the 5 Bench limit? You still have 6 total Pokemon in play. I don't follow you.
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"This kind of makes you miss the compendium..." - Martin Moreno
The Compendium: http://pkcompendium.hypermart.net
Registered: Feb 2001
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Gym Leader Blaine
Member # 5977
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posted February 11, 2003 02:59 PM
I wonder if the one retreat per turn counts also when you double gust or used a traing like switch to do it?
--------------------
"One day I will be the most powerful Jedi ever!" - Anakin Skywalker
darkmt_mike presents the speaker with question 83 from gym_leader_blaine:DMTM who would win in the battle in Gengar VS Jango Fett?
darkmt_mike says, "Hmm. think Gengar uses the Force so I would bet on him."
Salt Lake City Professors Web Site
From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Mar 2001
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The Anaconda
Member # 63417
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posted February 11, 2003 04:08 PM
I doubt it since that's using a trainer and not retreating.
I don't know about the rest of you but I personally like every single one of these new rules. This makes everything a lot more complex and will cause some more strategy to be involved in the game in stead of luck. I'd be really happy if WoTC introduced these new rules to our game.
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From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Feb 2002
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SteveP
Member # 14743
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posted February 11, 2003 09:39 PM
Yes, Anaconda, my point exactly. The rule changes ABSOLUTELY improve the game, whether it's played in Japan OR elsewhere.
GL Blaine, yah, if the 1-retreat rule includes any method of going to the bench, now that would be interesting. I can't imagine it being anything other than a natural retreat.
GLPhil, regardless of the metagame in whatever region of the world, occassionally, the designers find ways to improve the game to make it more complex and challenging, and also patch flaws or loopholes in the game to make it less breakable.
I absolutely welcome change in order to stimulate variations in the way we play. Otherwise, I get bored too quickly.
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Proud member of Team PokéParents - we play Pokémon with our kids!
From: Colorado Springs, CO, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Crobat1
Member # 85086
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posted February 11, 2003 09:51 PM
The retreat rule totally undermines the current use of Double Gust.
When one has a Steelix and Kabutops on the bench with a baby active, one can no longer bring the Steelix up--and double gust--to get a chance to use Kabutops against your opponent's most dangerous Pokemon.
The one retreat rule means that you cannot afford to retreat before you double gust.
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From: Binghamton, NY | Registered: May 2002
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Pscyther
Member
Member # 126758
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posted February 11, 2003 10:20 PM
I agree with Anaconda and SteveP
Change is good! Shake things up a bit ![[Evil Smirk]](graemlins/Up_to.gif)
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There's nothing quite like 4 heads on a Fury Cutter 8)
From: Maryland, USA, Terra | Registered: Feb 2003
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The Dark Llama
Member
Member # 75434
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posted February 11, 2003 10:49 PM
For any of you that are confused about all this, here's an explanation to why ALL of these rules are going to be WONDERFUL in the future.
quote:
1. ex Pokemon
---If your ex pokemon is ko'ed, your opponent
draw two prize instead of one.
If you haven't seen the EX Tyrannitar, that's sad. This was the T-tar that got everyone angry because it is the first card to have more than 120 HP. It has 150 HP, 4 Retreat, Weakness to Grass AND Fighting and does 80 damage for FFCC. The high retreat, and double weakness help balance this card out, and now, if you want to use them in your deck, your opponent will benefit from your strength because they get an extra prize now too.
-------------------------------------
quote:
Changing in old ruling:
1. Stadium Card
---You can only play one Stadium Card per turn.
THis will most definetely end the constant questions on whether or not playing more than one Stadium of the same name is allowed. It'll also limit the use of that Prygon2
quote:
2. Darkness Energy
---The text has been changed to:
"Darkness Energy provide one [D]. If the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy attached to
attack opponent's active Pokemon and the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy attached to
is Dark type or have 'Dark' in it's name,
That attack does 10 more damage. If the
Pokemon which Darkness Energy is attached to
isn't 'Dark' type or have 'Dark' in it's name,
this effect does nothing."
This ends the idiots attaching a Darkness to Tyrogue and Light Azumarril to do lots of damage and get some great benefit from it.
quote:
3. Metal Energy
---The text has been changed to:
"Darkness Energy provide one [M]. If the
Pokemon which Metal Energy attached to
is 'Steel' type, damage from pokemon attack
is reduced by 10. If the pokemon which metal
energy attached to isn't 'steel' type, this
effect does nothing."
No longer can someone leave Chansey (or other High-HP pokes) with a Bunch of Metal on them to stall. BE ORIGINAL WITH YOUR DEFENSIVE IDEAS!
quote:
4. Mulligan
---If your opponent hasn't any basic pokemon in
his/her hand in the beginning of the game,
You draw one extra card(or 0) instead of 2
before.
This makes it so if you get a ton of mulligans, your opponent's hand isn't something like 40 cards by the start of the game.
quote:
6. Retreat
---You can only retreat once per turn.
---You can retreat your active pokemon even your
bench is full.
As said above, no more abusing Double Gust or Switches or Babies free retreat.
quote:
7. Confusion
---The new punlishment of getting 'tails' in the
confusion check when confused pokemon attack
is "put 3 damage counter on that pokemon"
instead of 20 damage.
---Confused Pokemon can retreat as same as
'healthy pokemon' instead of need a coin flip.
THe confusion rules will balance each other out, first, the first one keeps people from using confused aerodactyls or Gligars to not do anything to themselves even while confused. the second makes it less of a pain since you don't need to flip for confusion.
[/QB][/QUOTE]
--------------------
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From: San Diego | Registered: Apr 2002
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nick15
Member # 142
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posted February 11, 2003 11:16 PM
[finds a reason to update PA! tonight] ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Three words can easily define how I feel about these ruling changes. "Holy farking smeg!" True, it's only for Japan, but I'm sure it'll leak it's way into our game. Lemme do my own edjuhmacated review:
1. Stadium Trying to prevent over use of a particular stadium card, eh? Can't do two Healing Fields per turn.... maybe for the better.
2/3. Darkness/Metal Energy: Yeeghads. What's the point of them without the drawbacks? But then again, the advantages aren't universal either. Evening things out, are we? I personally don't mind either way, Darkness/Metal Pokémon really don't lose out much. Personally though, I expect to see these cards being released with different names when released in English (ie Energy Removal versus Energy Removal 2). At least there won't be any more evil Tyrogues. Hmmm.... EEEEVIL Tyrogues. [gets a new fake idea]
4. Mulligan: Sounds like Magic. Hmmm....
5. First Round: Sounds like Magic again.
6. Retreat: ONCE?! Consarnit. Well, it WILL make things more interesting, I'll give them that. And Switch will probably now be a staple of every deck as well.
7. Confusion: Confuse a Baby and they're farked. I like that! And the retreat bit.... iffy. Maybe it'll work hand in hand with the whole you-can't-retreat-more-than-once-per-turn. "Hmmm.... should I heal my confused Pokémon and bring up a crappy one from my bench, or should I just take a chance and maybe do 30 to myself?"
Shocking? Indeed! Annoying? I don't think so. For some reason, I accept these changes with open arms. [ducks a glass bottle thrown at his head] Seriously! [ducks a bar stool thrown at his head] No really, these changes, although radically different, seems to make a heck of a lot more sense than previously. As if TPC rounded out a few corners. Wow.
But let's see... ADV has cards that are actually GOOD, the card design looks like Magic, mulligan and drawing rules emulate that of Magic as well... [puts two and two and two together] Did Wizards have a hand in all this? (I'm not implying anything, mind you. This is just speculation!) Either that, or TPC is REALLY GOOD at emulating Wizards.
Has TPC won a new fan? Maybe... but only because these changes sound like as if Wizards did them for TPC, rather than having TPC arrive on these conclusions by themselves (which I personally doubt is the case).
....
IPGeek21:
BE careful, I think Nick15 et al where looking at translations of possible future sets and vincent here did say that HE would work on translating some rulings/cards...
Remember that link I posted a little while back to the new rulings that looked like the DCI's Floor Rules? This is what was translated. This IS real, as far as vincent here claims it to be (as opposed to something he conjoured up).
----
GymLeaderPhil:
All I have to say is... just because Magic is the top grossing card game currently does not mean every single person plays it and should have mechanics from it added into another game.
Mind you, just because a gaming standard is in Magic, it doesn't mean that it's a Magic-only concept. Take the whole concept of... oh I don't know... decks, hands, drawing, discard piles, and so forth. Those were first in Magic, I don't see people complaining about Pokémon being TOO MUCH like Magic because of those.
I personally don't think that a lot of these rulings are done BECAUSE it's in Magic. Magic just happens to have a lot of different standards that makes sense to a degree. I mean not being able to draw if you go first is fair in ANY game, because it's the cost of being able to go first.
And even if say sideboards are added to Pokémon (in Match Play), I wouldn't oppose of it because it WOULD be useful in the game as well (I don't like the idea of sticking in metagame/type specific cards in my deck considering that not all the decks I play are the same ones.)
I know a lot of us play Pokémon to escape Magic (I'm probably the posterboy of that in my own town), but I don't believe that just because this ISN'T Magic we shouldn't be able to take advantage of certain gaming standards that Magic uses.
.....
Anyways, I like these new rulings.
[ February 11, 2003, 11:20 PM: Message edited by: nick15 ]
--------------------
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From: Dukhovskoknabilebskohatsk, Russia | Registered: Feb 2001
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Big_Pappa_Poke
Member # 3495
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posted February 12, 2003 12:30 AM
First, the mulligan rule is NOT like Magic, because the other player GAINS 1 card, the mulliganing player does not lose one. Though I agree, it's as close to the Magic Mulligan rule as they could put into Pokemon.
Second, the confusion/retreat rule is absolutely stupid. Why even bother having confusion (let alone make it more damaging) if you can just retreat it?
Third, the first two don't matter one hill of beans unless the rules change HERE. I don't play in Japan and I'm sure most of those reading do not either.
It is weird that they are making Pokemon "more like Magic" a game geared toward the adult crowd, when they want to keep Pokemon a "kids' game" here.
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From: Portsmouth, OH, USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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nick15
Member # 142
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posted February 12, 2003 02:36 AM
BPP:
You can retreat a Confused Pokémon for free, true. But you won't be able to bring it back out. Unless you have a switch, it'll be stuck on your Bench until your next turn. Which means removing Special Conditions by retreating has gotten a heck of a lot more strategic.
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From: Dukhovskoknabilebskohatsk, Russia | Registered: Feb 2001
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vincent0906
Member
Member # 10398
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posted February 12, 2003 04:44 AM
At the week before, Ibought abox of ADV!
I got Electabuzz, Chansey, Hitmonchan and Sneaselex from these box !
My friends also bought some of them too...
So, after i post the Chinese Version of the ruling,I play ADV deck with my friend ofcourse using this newest ruling...
We tested both new ruling and Double Battle...
It's cool ~~~~~~~!!! ![[Crowd]](graemlins/invasion.gif)
Pokemon Card Game is a strategic card game, these new ruling can make it more strategic! ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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My Pokemon TCG homepage:
http://www.hkpokemona.com/gengar
I need to apply for the open exam, so my site was closed temporary.
http://www.hkpokemona.com
Hong Kong Pokemon Alliance
From: Hong Kong | Registered: Mar 2001
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ScythKing
Member # 26665
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posted February 12, 2003 04:49 AM
quote:
Originally posted by nick15:
[QB[puts two and two and two together] Did Wizards have a hand in all this? (I'm not implying anything, mind you. This is just speculation!) Either that, or TPC is REALLY GOOD at emulating Wizards.[/QB]
Well you know that Magic was designed by a mathematician and the entire mechanics of playing a collectable card game is patented by WotC. We know that TPC has pushed its weight around on its product, so maybe WotC is asserting itself on the game mechanics. Just a thought.
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-=>* ScythKing *<=-
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There are 10 type of people in the world.
Those that understand binary and those that don't.
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From: Chattanooga, TN USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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