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Author
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Topic: Pokemon TCG is dead as a commercial project
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W Churchill
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Member # 137572
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posted April 24, 2003 08:40 AM
Now,this post will probably be deleted but still:
For 2 years Wizards didn't make any profit on the pokemon,the number of potential customers lowered trice.I can explain it by 2 reasons:
1.The games market fell this year by a lot,pokemon along with it.
2.Pokemon was moved from the market hits(though it wasn't found a succesor as "THE MEGA-HIT OF THE SEASON"
But Wizards doesn't shut the game,contrary it makes new sets.Why?Well, I find only one reason,it counts on you gentlemen,the fans of the game.So I think in the near future pokemon won't be shut,though it doesn't bring any porfits. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
P.S.All of the opinions expressed in this post are personally mine and may not be agreed with by Wizards officals.
[ April 24, 2003, 08:47 AM: Message edited by: W Churchill ]
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TeamRocket-4-Life
Member # 79138
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posted April 24, 2003 08:51 AM
quote:
For 2 years Wizards didn't make any profit on the pokemon
One has to wonder where you are pulling your "facts" from, due to the lack of detail given...
quote:
the number of potential customers lowered trice.
Interesting how a statistic of people that might buy product is available, given that anyone in the world is a potential customer. Was the global population slashed twice or thrice over? (Sounds like one of the Judgements from the Great Tribulation)
And I think the mods will agree on this:
Why does everyone assume their posts will be deleted? True, I imagine this will get locked shortly after the oncoming statements, but hey. Nothing needs to be censored on this post so far...
[ April 27, 2003, 04:47 PM: Message edited by: TeamRocket-4-Life ]
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From: Novi, Michigan | Registered: Apr 2002
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IPGeek21
Member # 184
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posted April 24, 2003 09:06 AM
Uh I am pretty sure they've made money.
IT SEEMS that they learned from the ROCKET saga
*don't ask BUT you may know*
If their economic forecasters did a MUCH better job for following sets, IMO Heroes/Challenge felt like low points in the game BUT THE GAME REBOUNDED tremendously with the Neo1 Genesis series...
NOW, beyond their control, the licenses is no longer theirs later this year...
AND, COMPANIES are not in this due to the goodness of their heart but the $$$.
THAT the MT's are AWESOME people?
Well that's been a plus...
MAYBE I should delete this on PRINCIPLE?
Nah...
BUT I really have to question your facts without evidence, AND if you had that kind of evidence, THEN you would be in breach of your EMPLOYMENT with WotC.
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WizPoG_Pop
Member # 113762
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posted April 24, 2003 09:49 AM
I've heard of recent sets being sold out and having to be reprinted, so someone is buying these things....
This post in general sounds like a bunch of gibberish, though, and doesn't seem to have a basic understanding of the business of TCGs.
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Skywolf1
Member # 1448
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posted April 24, 2003 10:23 AM
As one who follows the trends of this brand, I find it rather interesting, that according to the lastest issue (April of 2003) of InQuest Magazine, which is regarded as one of the premiere names in TCG magazines out there, and also one that prints a "What's Hot" column in each monthly issue, the top 3 selling TCG's were:
1. Magic: The Gathering
2. Yu-Gi-Oh
3. POKEMON
So, while I am not an expert in TCG trends, I do trust InQuest as a source for Trading Card Games, so rather then interject my two cents in, I would invite you to simply pick up a copy of InQuest, and see for yourself.
Skywolf1
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From: Las Vegas, Nevada USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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W Churchill
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Member # 137572
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posted April 24, 2003 10:36 AM
About the $$$ I have one simple question.If wizards make porfits from pokemom why is it giving them up to Nintendo.Nintendo doesn't specialise in TCG and never made them before.Quite interesting? Concerning pokemon on the 3d place:side from MAGIC,POKEMON and BASEBALL nobody from the general public knows about any other TCG games so if you think that if pokemon on position №3 is a huge success I'd consider THE BARNEY SHOW is the greatest hit and the most profittable TV programm.
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"England does not have perpetual friends or foes,it has perpetual interests"
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DMTM
Member # 10
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posted April 24, 2003 10:44 AM
Hmm...can't really say much except your initial statement is false.
We do value our customers however.
But I cannot let this post go by without refuting your initial statement. ![[NoNoNo]](graemlins/nonono.gif)
DMTM
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From: Seattle, Wa, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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W Churchill
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Member # 137572
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posted April 24, 2003 11:08 AM
quote:
Hmm...can't really say much except your initial statement is false.
We do value our customers however.
But I cannot let this post go by without refuting your initial statement.
If one company gives the rights on its product to the other company than it's obvious that the current product didn't bring profits.So I don't see anything false in my initial statement.
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decay_187_life
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Member # 125934
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posted April 24, 2003 11:12 AM
Wizards isn't just handing the license of Pokemon TCG over to Nintendo, however, Nintendo is "taking" it away from them due to differences in negotiations I'm assuming.
Someone needs their facts to get straightend out.
From: Buffalo NY...Supz0rz | Registered: Feb 2003
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WizPog_PokeMom
Member # 113273
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posted April 24, 2003 11:13 AM
How can a company "give away" rights to something they don't OWN in the first place?
Pokémon was never Wizards of the Coast's game, per se; it was a licensee of The Pokémon Company. TPC owns the game and decides who produces it outside of Japan.
Dare I say "don't feed the trolls"?
[ April 24, 2003, 11:15 AM: Message edited by: WizPog_PokeMom ]
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TeamRocket-4-Life
Member # 79138
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posted April 24, 2003 11:24 AM
quote:
If one company gives the rights on its product to the other company than it's obvious that the current product didn't bring profits.So I don't see anything false in my initial statement.
Others have said it, but I'll say it again:
Besides TPC, Nintendo has always had partial ownership of the Pokemon franchise: This is why their name is on everything Pokemon: even the WotC printed cards.
WotC was never an "owner" of Pokemon.
Thus, your above quoted statement is false as well.
That's 0 for 2, I'm afraid...
quote:
Concerning pokemon on the 3d place:side from MAGIC,POKEMON and BASEBALL nobody from the general public knows about any other TCG games so if you think that if pokemon on position №3 is a huge success I'd consider THE BARNEY SHOW is the greatest hit and the most profittable TV programm.
You've forgotten a lot of other popular TCGs out right now: Lord of the Rings, for one (which I am suprised is not in the top 3; it's beaten MtG before...). Comparing TCG's to TV shows is not a good analogy either. For instance, Barney & Friends is a non-profit show. And it's probably not in the top 400 for ratings. That's 0 for 3.
It's also kind of amusing that instead of basing your statements on evidence, you're twisting the ideas behind our counterpoints...
[ April 24, 2003, 11:29 AM: Message edited by: TeamRocket-4-Life ]
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From: Novi, Michigan | Registered: Apr 2002
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W Churchill
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posted April 24, 2003 11:36 AM
quote:
It's also kind of amusing that instead of basing your statements on evidence, you're twisting the ideas behind our counterpoints...
I'm not.And I give one simple and obvious evidence which you try to twist.If pokemon was a proffitable product then Nintendo would never take it from WoTC because Nintendo as a partial owner would get profits as well.I think that's quite obvious.
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WizPog_PokeMom
Member # 113273
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posted April 24, 2003 11:45 AM
Let's see: would you like to have X percent of the profits from the kid next door's lemonade stand, who you are paying to sell lemonade for you...or 100% of the profits, if you do it yourself? Hmmmm...
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Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Nov 2002
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TeamRocket-4-Life
Member # 79138
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posted April 24, 2003 11:45 AM
Let's think, shall we?
quote:
If pokemon was a proffitable product then Nintendo would never take it from WoTC because Nintendo as a partial owner would get profits as well.I think that's quite obvious.
Here's a quiz: If Nintendo partially owns a franchise, would they get more money for themselves if
A) Cards are printed by a 3rd Party, creating a profit split
B) Nintendo prints cards themselves, and recieves a bigger profit share
It's a toughie, I know.
[ April 24, 2003, 11:48 AM: Message edited by: TeamRocket-4-Life ]
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Surrender Now or Prepare To Fight!
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Amen, Brother
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From: Novi, Michigan | Registered: Apr 2002
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WizPoG_Pop
Member # 113762
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posted April 24, 2003 11:45 AM
quote:
Originally posted by W Churchill:
quote:
It's also kind of amusing that instead of basing your statements on evidence, you're twisting the ideas behind our counterpoints...
I'm not.And I give one simple and obvious evidence which you try to twist.If pokemon was a proffitable product then Nintendo would never take it from WoTC because Nintendo as a partial owner would get profits as well.I think that's quite obvious.
Oh really?
So, by your logic, Nintendo has decided to toss a ton of money down the toilet by developing a whole new company division to handle the product directly and not make any profit on it.
....OR....
it has decided that it is more profitable that it thought it would be and wants to keep all of the profits for itself rather than only get a small franchise fee.
Which one makes more sense... ![[Evil Smirk]](graemlins/Up_to.gif)
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Orange Soda
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Member # 19838
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posted April 24, 2003 12:17 PM
No one's commented on this:
quote:
Nintendo doesn't specialise in TCG and never made them before.Quite interesting?
Didn't Nintendo print the Japanese e-Cards, and is currently printing Japanese ADV cards? I think that's true, but I'm not sure.
Either way, it's not like Nintendo just handed over the Pokemon liscense and said "Do whatever you want". They would have kept a close eye on it, so I'm sure they would have learned a few things from the way Wizards works.
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Pkmnrulz241. I already told you...
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Member # 82005
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posted April 24, 2003 12:42 PM
quote:
I'm not.And I give one simple and obvious evidence which you try to twist.If pokemon was a proffitable product then Nintendo would never take it from WoTC because Nintendo as a partial owner would get profits as well.I think that's quite obvious.
No, It's not obvious. Like everyone else said, there is money involved. It's not like Wizards of the Coast just came out of nowhere and said, "Sure! We'll produce your cards for free! Whatever we make, we'll send it straight your way!" Wizards recieves a large chunk of the profits from the games, and what Nintendo might be getting out of it as we speak may not have just been cutting it, hence, they decide not do allow WOTC any more licensing rights to the game come soon. And, thus, they make more profit by producing and distributing the cards themselves. Start basing your facts on the truth, rather than your vivid imagination. Heh... Pokemon not making a profit whatsoever. Heh... what a joke!
...Oh, and there is a little button on your keyboard called a "space bar." It's that big, long thing right in front of you. Try hitting it after you place a period at the end of your sentences.
[ April 24, 2003, 12:45 PM: Message edited by: Pkmnrulz241. I already told you... ]
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NoPoke
Member # 42315
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posted April 24, 2003 01:01 PM
anyone know the Russian for TROLL? take a look at the profile! W Churchill indeed LOL
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From: Crawley England | Registered: Sep 2001
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yoshi1001
Member # 825
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posted April 24, 2003 02:26 PM
quote:
About the $$$ I have one simple question.If wizards make porfits from pokemom why is it giving them up to Nintendo.Nintendo doesn't specialise in TCG and never made them before.Quite interesting?
Last time I checked, Nintendo started off in the late 1800s producing playing cards. Not that it matters, of course. People like you aren't worth dealing with.
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From: Janesville, Wisconsin | Registered: Feb 2001
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RaNd0m
Member # 73173
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posted April 24, 2003 04:03 PM
The fact that Nintendo hasn't run a TCG before (or rather, recently) doesn't really mean much. They've watched what Wizards has done with the game.
Not to mention, Pokemon is the ONLY TCG they will be focusing on. That being said, don't you think they might spoil us a bit?
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GymLeaderPhil
Member # 455
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posted April 24, 2003 06:15 PM
quote:
Originally posted by RaNd0m:
The fact that Nintendo hasn't run a TCG before (or rather, recently) doesn't really mean much. They've watched what Wizards has done with the game.
~ RaNd0m
Nintendo is really not the company picking up the license per se. Pokemon USA is the one with who is deeply involved with the game.
With that being said, Pokemon USA is going to be an awesome new company to pick up the license to the game. I've talked with several involved with the future of 15+ organized play and they do care about what we have to say. Just like Random said, they are watching us and what we express about the current program that are being maintained by WotC.
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From: Where ever the ladies take me | Registered: Feb 2001
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farbsman
Member # 53992
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posted April 24, 2003 06:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by W Churchill:
About the $$$ I have one simple question.If wizards make porfits from pokemom why is it giving them up to Nintendo.Nintendo doesn't specialise in TCG and never made them before.Quite interesting? Concerning pokemon on the 3d place:side from MAGIC,POKEMON and BASEBALL nobody from the general public knows about any other TCG games so if you think that if pokemon on position №3 is a huge success I'd consider THE BARNEY SHOW is the greatest hit and the most profittable TV programm.
Actually nintendo started out as a card company back in Japan. Sunday The Learning Channel did a report on Video Game history and they mentioned the history of nintendo and the fact they use to make a card game and they had done that for 50 years before doing video games. Yoshi was right on what he said according to the show I watched. Where are you getting your information from? It seems all wrong to me.
Edit: here is the link to Nintendos history on there website showing they started making TCG back in 1889 http://www.nintendo.com/corp/history.html
[ April 24, 2003, 06:41 PM: Message edited by: farbsman ]
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From: Northern Indiana | Registered: Dec 2001
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WizPog_PokeMom
Member # 113273
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posted April 24, 2003 07:18 PM
Mmmm...just FYI, Hanafuda is not a trading card game; it's a card game, played with one deck and several players (...and yes, I played it often when I was younger, with my grandparents and other relatives ![[Smile]](smile.gif) ). Interesting page; thanks for the link...
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Nothing endures in this world. Everything changes according to karma. But, like the ocean, underneath the restless existance of the countless waves there is one boundless stillness that embraces and gives life to all the moving waves. Namuamidabutsu...
From: San Diego, CA --location of WCSTS-2001 and West Stadium Challenge 2002 | Registered: Nov 2002
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farbsman
Member # 53992
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posted April 24, 2003 08:10 PM
quote:
Originally posted by WizPog_PokeMom:
Mmmm...just FYI, Hanafuda is not a trading card game; it's a card game, played with one deck and several players (...and yes, I played it often when I was younger, with my grandparents and other relatives ). Interesting page; thanks for the link...
Sorry about that 'mom, my mistake, but it does show they have produced sucessful card games before though.
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From: Northern Indiana | Registered: Dec 2001
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ukpokemonpro
Member # 518
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posted April 25, 2003 02:08 AM
MMM a new member 24th April .. posts what looks and smells like a TROLL and we all jump .. LOL
NoPoke got it right this guy has either not bothered finding out any facts or is just trolling ..
Either way the whole thing is a joke .. let him go back to playing yukioh and we'll get on with the our fun TCG..
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