Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Werewolf XVIII: Dimensional Clash: Wolves/Outlaws Win!

Great. More wording based technicalities on alignment and roles.

First off, Verblakes, your claim that the latis are good Pokemon and Giratina is a bad one is completely invalid. Names/Characters are never meant to imply alignment or intent in the first place. Plus then there's the whole argument that there is no such thing as an inherently bad Pokemon etc etc. Yet we have a Giratina with a win condition "Pokemon Win", listed as independent. Currently, anyone with a Pokemon claim should be treated as non-town. What this means for the town is difficult to say as yet.

I also find it odd that the Pokemon have their own win condition, whereas the redwall characters have been dispersed between factions. Based of the title, I'd assumed there were characters from many different fictional series, randomly distributed throughout a number of different factions. Yet it seems HIGHLY unlikely that, for example, any redwall characters with a Pokemon Wins condition, or any Pokemon without it.

Regardless, I think what we can assume is that the Pokemon are not Wolves. Neither are the enforcers. They should not be our highest concern. I don't see any major killing roles coming from either faction (Pokemon just seems unlikely, and enforces sounds like some sort of policing squad). The wolves should remain the main priority.

Could someone inform me what TKotRT means? I think I missed that.
 
Ah ok.

See again, I would guess that at least one of them would be an enforcer, others town, and maybe one unknown defector as scum. I guess we'll have to wait and see if they have their own win condition.
 
If lynching me will give us information that we need, then I can understand this. We so far know of one character from a few (was it 5?) different factions. However, I know Pokemon are not the wolves, based on my role PM. I cannot be nightkilled on certain nights, which means that there are other factions who are out there that want to nightkill. Why would a Pokemon target a Pokemon? Now, we know of a bunch of different factions, and so far the only one (unless I missed something) that had a confirmed win condition aside from "town wins" was a Pokemon. But we have to look at Giratina: he hates humans, and would want them destroyed. Latias has nothing against them.

I'm not quite sure what I think of jellyfisher's being killed. Maybe some sort of vig that hides identities, maybe some sort of sacrifice role like Giratina, I don't know.

Oh, Vegitalian, why must ye hang from the castle wall? Bringing mystery to one and all? Little peom aside, I'm not sure of what I think about this. I think he had some sort of power role and got roleblocked or something of the sort.

Also, who are our inactives? I think it's time we pressure them.
 
Benzo said:
Jellyfisher- Seems odd that he just up and died, like vaporized into oblivion. Lost world perhaps?
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Possibly Lost World, though not probable since Giratina's dead. All we know is Jelly's gone and we don't know his alignment.

Vablakes said:
Now, we know of a bunch of different factions, and so far the only one (unless I missed something) that had a confirmed win condition aside from "town wins" was a Pokemon. But we have to look at Giratina: he hates humans, and would want them destroyed. Latias has nothing against them.
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We know for sure that we have the following win conditions:
  • Enforcers Win
  • Pokemon Win
  • Town Wins
Most likely on the list as well will be a "Wolves Win" win condition, but we have yet to see one. Also, we have yet to see if KotRT have a separate win condition.

And you know, Celebi was a good and nice Pokemon too, until it was caught with a Dark Ball and used for evil (sorry for the spoiler y'all). Saying something like, "But Latias is a nice Pokemon!", isn't going to get you cleared from suspicion in this game.
 
1. scorri is a SHE, and her idea of a name claim was a bad one.
2. The first post has a color specifically for wolves. I infer that there's a wolf win condition based off of this.
3. Also from the first post, it seems that the Pokemon win condition counts as independent.

Vablakes said:
If lynching me will give us information that we need, then I can understand this. We so far know of one character from a few (was it 5?) different factions. However, I know Pokemon are not the wolves, based on my role PM. I cannot be nightkilled on certain nights, which means that there are other factions who are out there that want to nightkill. Why would a Pokemon target a Pokemon? Now, we know of a bunch of different factions, and so far the only one (unless I missed something) that had a confirmed win condition aside from "town wins" was a Pokemon. But we have to look at Giratina: he hates humans, and would want them destroyed. Latias has nothing against them.

I'm not quite sure what I think of jellyfisher's being killed. Maybe some sort of vig that hides identities, maybe some sort of sacrifice role like Giratina, I don't know.

Oh, Vegitalian, why must ye hang from the castle wall? Bringing mystery to one and all? Little peom aside, I'm not sure of what I think about this. I think he had some sort of power role and got roleblocked or something of the sort.

Also, who are our inactives? I think it's time we pressure them.
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Things that make me uneasy about this post:

1. Being immune to night kills on certain nights doesn't necessarily clear you. Killing roles aren't restricted to wolves (see: Giratina, who happens to be a Pokemon). I'm accustomed to games where harmful third parties (and once in a blue moon, mafia) get some sort of kill immunity, but I am not sure how common that trend is on this forum.
2. We've seen three different win conditions so far, and the Enforcers don't look like a friendly bunch.
3. Why are you attempting to clear yourself on flavor? If Brome the Healer's role PM is any indication, we're not necessarily going to clear people based on name.
4. My guess is that jellyfisher was targeted by a janitor (kills and hides the body). Alternately, jellyfisher is some sort of self-janitor, but I have yet to see that in any of the games I've played in.
5. Certain inactives (Crimsonsky, for example) aren't going to respond if they're nowhere near a computer. I think reading backwards would be far more helpful (I don't have time for that right now).

From what I've seen, I'm still wary of Vablakes, and am starting to be wary of scorri for suggesting the name claim. I'd like it if Glaceon would stop telling us details about his role, seeing as he has a grand total of zero votes on him. Lastly, HI LEVITY (she's also from my neck of the woods)!

With that, I'm off. See everyone in a few days!
 
Good call on PP101, Vablakes. I had missed that one.


Regardless, I think what we can assume is that the Pokemon are not Wolves. Neither are the enforcers. They should not be our highest concern. I don't see any major killing roles coming from either faction (Pokemon just seems unlikely, and enforces sounds like some sort of policing squad). The wolves should remain the main priority.
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I'd like some other players thoughts (AT, PH, DP, SS7, and anyone else who has an opinion) on this. We have lots of win conditions in this game, how highly should we prioritize wolves? Do we keep likely Indys around for the chance at killing wolves? What about enforcers?
 
elipse said:
2. We've seen three different win conditions so far, and the Enforcers don't look like a friendly bunch.
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Why do the Enforcers not look like a "friendly bunch"? So far, the only role we've seen from them has been one that saves a targeted player from dying, which seems pretty friendly to me:
elipse said:
1. Once during the night, you may choose one player who has a different alignment than you. If that player dies that night or during the next game day, you will learn that player's role, their role will not be publicly revealed and they will be returned to the game after one night. Once you have used this role successfully, you may not use it again.
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Diaz said:
I'd like some other players thoughts (AT, PH, DP, SS7, and anyone else who has an opinion) on this. We have lots of win conditions in this game, how highly should we prioritize wolves? Do we keep likely Indys around for the chance at killing wolves? What about enforcers?
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If we focus on taking out Indies, the Wolves will just eat us for breakfast. I suggest we focus on scum hunting, but keep an eye on our Pokemon friends.
 
Diaz said:
I'd like some other players thoughts (AT, PH, DP, SS7, and anyone else who has an opinion) on this. We have lots of win conditions in this game, how highly should we prioritize wolves? Do we keep likely Indys around for the chance at killing wolves? What about enforcers?
Click to expand...

I think that wolves should still be high priority, however, with that being said it's probably in the wolves best interest to get Pokemon and Enforcers lynched during the day, so there's a decent chance that they'll wind up siding with the town a decent amount of the time. I think Indies should as always be regarded with caution, though they vary in how dangerous they actually are. I still am going to refrain from making any judgement on the pokemon faction, as we only have one dead pokemon (and a known evil one at that) which we are basing it off of. I would rather wait until we see more of the to judge their threat level to the town.

Not really sure what to think of the Enforcers yet.... Are they like their own separate wolf group? Are they the ones responsible for Jellys death? It seems they have some rather strange powers as well, like bringing non enforcers back from the dead. So, perhaps Enforcers win is not dependent on the ration of enforcers/everyone else left? If not, then what could it be? Any ideas?
 
Diaz said:
I'd like some other players thoughts (AT, PH, DP, SS7, and anyone else who has an opinion) on this. We have lots of win conditions in this game, how highly should we prioritize wolves? Do we keep likely Indys around for the chance at killing wolves? What about enforcers?
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Just finished reading though everything.



Based on the flips that we saw, as well as the Night occurrences, I have a few thoughts.


Right now it appears that there are 1+ factions with Night Kills. The most obvious of these is the wolves, (obviously separate from the "Enforcers" and "Pokemon" factions.) Jellyfisher's death could be due to any number of scenarios, ranging from good to extremely bad. With Brome's roleflip, I'm completely out of my league with the amount of role madness in this game. At this point, we have no choice but to assume complete role madness.

To directly answer your question. Wolves take priority. They are the ones, traditionally, with a Night kill associated with them. That means that they are the most immediately dangerous.


However. Because the "Enforcers," "Pokemon" and whatever OTHER win conditions are in the game, we cannot disregard them. I feel it is unwise to assume anything at this point.

To use an analogy: As we saw in WW XV, the danger of the Sith could have been game-ending, because we had no idea what their actual win condition was. I had come up with an assumption of their win condition, which seemed to fit the evidence, and pushed for their lynch over top of the wolves. However, they were less of a threat than I thought they were.

In our situation, again, we have no idea how these "3rd Parties" can claim victory. Nor do we know truly how dangerous each faction is. Nor will these factions tell us what their win condition is. What we know now is that there were 2 NK's. But, we cannot prove anything using that. It could have been two Wolf NKs, two indie NKs, 2 Vigs, or any number of combinations and possibilities.


Thus. I'd still say that the wolves take priority due to their kill. But we cannot overlook the possible and imminent threat of the 3rd parties who can kill or win without kills of their own.
 
Ahahaha forgive me; I've never played a game with this many players before so I'm a little overwhelmed. But expect an actual reply from me later, and thanks for the welcome! I'm going to have to take some elaborate notes to get all of the player names right,
 
DarthPika said:
I think that wolves should still be high priority, however, with that being said it's probably in the wolves best interest to get Pokemon and Enforcers lynched during the day, so there's a decent chance that they'll wind up siding with the town a decent amount of the time. I think Indies should as always be regarded with caution, though they vary in how dangerous they actually are. I still am going to refrain from making any judgement on the pokemon faction, as we only have one dead pokemon (and a known evil one at that) which we are basing it off of. I would rather wait until we see more of the to judge their threat level to the town.

Not really sure what to think of the Enforcers yet.... Are they like their own separate wolf group? Are they the ones responsible for Jellys death? It seems they have some rather strange powers as well, like bringing non enforcers back from the dead. So, perhaps Enforcers win is not dependent on the ration of enforcers/everyone else left? If not, then what could it be? Any ideas?
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Hi all finals week is DONE WOO,

If their win condition is different doesn't that automatically make it that they're their own separate group? Could someone sum up what has happened at night? This thread moves pretty fast and makes it hard to keep up with everything if not I understand that too.
 
DragonClyne725 said:
Why do the Enforcers not look like a "friendly bunch"? So far, the only role we've seen from them has been one that saves a targeted player from dying, which seems pretty friendly to me:
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Since their win condition is "Enforcers win" and not "town wins" then they can't exactly be helping the town win. I don't know if we should prioritize finding wolves over everythign else if we have several other factions. After all, more Indies have won these games than wolves. assuming pokemon have the win condition of "pokemon win" then that means they must at least indirectly oppose the town so shouldn't we go after them also? Especially with a pokemon claim that has been acting suspiscious (Vablakes)
 
RE:Diaz -

I am willing to lynch anyone who doesn't have a Town Wins condition because we can only speculate as to what their actual win conditions are. Clearly, the wolves would be better as they are our known enemy, however any other faction could be just as dangerous.

Eclipse, CrimsonSky is not an inactive. He just posted to say he would be gone for a few days, which was more than a few days ago. He has more explaining to do.
 
I am sorry but I am going to need a replacement. I am having problems keeping up with this thread. Sorry for this inconvenience.
 
Ok, so scorri has been thinking. Last phase before the modkills, scorri and others were planning on lynching Vablakes. Vablakes has claimed to be a Pokemon. We have seen a Pokemon flip as a non-town wincon. scorri does not see any reason why scorri should not vote Vablakes now.

I think that wolves should still be high priority, however, with that being said it's probably in the wolves best interest to get Pokemon and Enforcers lynched during the day, so there's a decent chance that they'll wind up siding with the town a decent amount of the time. I think Indies should as always be regarded with caution, though they vary in how dangerous they actually are. I still am going to refrain from making any judgement on the pokemon faction, as we only have one dead pokemon (and a known evil one at that) which we are basing it off of. I would rather wait until we see more of the to judge their threat level to the town.
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scorri also does not like this post. The flipped wincon was "Pokemon win" and scorri does not see how this is not a useful lynch. If Vablakes flips with a "Pokemon win" wincon, scorri will probably be looking into DarthPika more.

VOTE VABLAKES
 
Levity said:
Ahahaha forgive me; I've never played a game with this many players before so I'm a little overwhelmed. But expect an actual reply from me later, and thanks for the welcome! I'm going to have to take some elaborate notes to get all of the player names right,
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There's a first time for everything. I'll get up a big post later this game day.
 
Wow, this thread moves fast.

I must say that I wasn't expecting to see Redwall characters. It is rather amusing to me, seeing as I just started reading the series(Actually I've only read the first book, as I have no way to get the others at this time...). I don't remember any of the characters that have been revealed so far being in the first book.

We have a possible two indies in our hands: PP101, and Vablakes, depending on whether or not they have a "Town Wins" or a "Pokemon Wins". I must say, that must make it quite difficult for the Pokemon who have "Pokemon Wins" as their win condition to figure out who is an indie and who is a townie, provided that they can't win along side the town, of course.

I find it hard to tell by what Pokemon you are what your win condition is. This is Werewolf, not the movies, and, if I might point out, Latias is just as willing to knock out your Pokemon as any other Pokemon is in the games. This means that being Latias DOES NOT CLEAR YOU. No, I am not yelling, I'm just writing in uppercase so that you see it.
 
I rather go after the werewolf faction as they are the only definitive faction that can kill at night. It looks like there is another faction or independent that can also kill at night as evidence by two deaths last night. However, we are totally in the dark who or what other faction is doing the killing in addition to the werewolf. If we can weed out the killing roles at night, the town should be, in theory, in really good shape especially if we can keep some of our investigative role(s) alive.

So my preference in order of lynch targets are 1) werewolf, 2) enforcer and pokemon. I believe either the enforcer or pokemon faction has a killing role, but I have no clue as to which one. From the night update, there was a person wielding a shiny metallic object, possibly a weapon; as he was shown to have cause the pain and suffering of either Kayle or Jellyfisher.

Also in the night update, a person was seen carrying a person up to a battlement and tying him up. The only person mention being tied up in the night update was Vegalitian.
 
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