blastoise options

[celeni]

black kyurem is the play for me. i have been doing great with it. lugia ex was too difficult to time. i would have to retreat something to use him. lugia just doesnt have stopping power. too many games of waiting to power lugia up in one turn to avoid x-ball.

 

[Vegeta ss4]

black kyurem is the play for me. i have been doing great with it. lugia ex was too difficult to time. i would have to retreat something to use him. lugia just doesnt have stopping power. too many games of waiting to power lugia up in one turn to avoid x-ball.

Its actually VERY easy to power him up. Scramble switch is YOUR friend here.

 

[Otaku]

3-0-3 Blastoise
4-4 Raticate
2 Kyurem
2 Keldeo EX
2-2 Ninetales

4 Juniper
3 N (Still prefer over Colres)
2 Skyla
3 PLH
3 Devolution Spray
3 Catcher
3 Candy

4 DCE
10 Water

And you still have juggle room. You could even drop a couple water energy to add other stuff. The ninetales/DVS just ensures hitting the Pokes you want with Raticate; just read it as extra Catchers. PHL makes them a one shot. Kyurem cleans up the ones you maim when you don't have PHL that make it back to the bench. Keldeo to save your Catchered Blastoise and to do big damage a needed. Pretty straight forward really.

Why would I need "extra Pokémon Catchers"?

Raticate should be used to score 3HJOs against Pokémon-EX. If there are not three Pokémon-EX to drop, fall back on the other attackers.

Edit: Took two days, but realized I forgot quotation marks to signify I wasn't questioning running Pokémon Catcher but the need for Ninetales, described in the quoted text as such. Added them in for anyone late to the party. Yeah, communication fail on my part.

 

[PKM4]

I can tell you right now that having the Lugia Ex in your deck makes it much more cluttery. The Black Kyurem Ex works wonders. It OHKOs every Ex in the format even with Eviolite attached. I'd be using Keldeo Ex for non-Ex's and then bust out Black Kyurem Ex for other Ex's. Another advantage is that Mewtwo Ex can't hurt the Black Kyurem Ex that bad because you are discarding three energies. I'd go with BKEX all the way with two, possibly three Lightning Energy and one Energy Search.

 

[pokemonjoe]

3-0-3 Blastoise
4-4 Raticate
2 Kyurem
2 Keldeo EX
2-2 Ninetales

4 Juniper
3 N (Still prefer over Colres)
2 Skyla
3 PLH
3 Devolution Spray
3 Catcher
3 Candy

4 DCE
10 Water

And you still have juggle room. You could even drop a couple water energy to add other stuff. The ninetales/DVS just ensures hitting the Pokes you want with Raticate; just read it as extra Catchers. PHL makes them a one shot. Kyurem cleans up the ones you maim when you don't have PHL that make it back to the bench. Keldeo to save your Catchered Blastoise and to do big damage a needed. Pretty straight forward really.

What is PLH? Do you mean PHB (the abbreviation for Poison Hypnotic Beam, the Japanese name), or HTL (the abbreviation for the English name)?

 

[AzUK]

Poison Laser Hypnosis.

 

[waynegg]

Where is your search? With that many basics Colress probably would yield a pretty big hand with the proper amount of ultra/level balls

I said there was room to add more cards and do some changes, if you had READ what I said. All I provided was a skeleton list.

 

[Otaku]

So... about those Ninetales?

 

[Vegeta ss4]

I think it would be a fun league deck. It's damage output in my mind isn't great, it also requires too much of a flip for extra damage.

 

[pnoodle5]

Black Kyurem EX is much better than Lugia as a situational card.

You've got a more conditional card that might only grab 2 prizes anyway, who knows what you are up against, VS a card that preeetty much gets the KO on everything and, not needing any Scramble Switch hijinks, is rather more straightforward.

 

[waynegg]

Ninetales just gives you much more consistency in attacking the pokemon you want to attack instead of just whatever your opponent brings up. It's only there for the Ability. And it's easier to search for.

I think it would be a fun league deck. It's damage output in my mind isn't great, it also requires too much of a flip for extra damage.

How is the damage output too low? Raticate takes everything down to 10 (or one shots everything with Laser) and Kyurem finishes off any straglers while not giving your opponent the chance to pull 2 prizes for one KO because Keldeo isn't too needed.

 

[Vegeta ss4]

I was replying to the idea of a ninetails deck, not raticate.

 

[Otaku]

Ninetales just gives you much more consistency in attacking the pokemon you want to attack instead of just whatever your opponent brings up. It's only there for the Ability. And it's easier to search for.

The entire concept behind the deck is to score priority OHKOs, which most of the time will be Pokémon-EX. Pokémon-EX are worth two Prizes, so if at least two of your OHKOs are Pokémon-EX, you would still just need four copies of Pokémon Catcher to do this.

If your opponent is not relying heavily onPokémon-EX, you can still trade single Prize Pokémon for single Prize Pokémon, and just need to strategically hit your opponent to reduce their own offensive capacity. Considering four Pokémon Catcher allows you to do this up to four times, and in both this and the preceding scenario you are likely to hit at least one target without needing Pokémon Catcher.

While some games you will need more than four copies of Pokémon Catcher, one has to consider how often this will happen, and what running a 2-2 Stage 1 line costs; running Ninetales eats up four slots and reduces consistency for everything but having access to a pseudo-Pokémon Catcher. It is easier to search out than Pokémon Catcher but not than Devolution Spray.

So your re-usable psuedo-Pokémon Catcher is eating up seven slots! For the sake of argument, I will assume you are running no extra search for it, and merely multipurposing the same search you would use for Raticate and that you simply don't search out Vulpix or Ninetales until you absolutely must to avoid running low on Raticate supplies.

Seven slots allows for a fourth Pokémon Catcher and maxing out Skyla, and still has room for more draw power. Since there is a risk of multiple Pokémon Catcher stuck in your Prizes, let's go with a Town Map. We also have avoided giving an opponent access to more easy Prizes this way: most turns Ninetales is only safe because your opponent needs to take out Raticate and force you to build another... but decks with spread (even if it is only to a single Benched Pokémon) haven't disappeared yet and wreak havoc with the Devolution Spray strategy.

Now, I am all for finding a good use for Raticate, so let me offer a suggestion that is probably necessary for your Skeleton list: Ditto. A healing card (probably Max Potion) is also needed. If Ditto is OHKOed... so would the Rattata. If Ditto survives but is damaged, you can Max Potion it since you probably have no Energy on it anyway, then Transform to Rattata and Evolve to Raticate (mentioned more for casual readers of the conversation - I know you already knew the combo). This would even behoove most of your other cards, since a Ditto on the Bench is a good place holder for Evolutions.

I would also consider Rescue Scarf with fewer Raticate and Rattata; lowers the risk of starting with an easily donked Rattata, and Tool Scrapper isn't often run in multiples so even if the first one is discarded, the others probably won't be. Do pack Super Rod though just in case.

 

[waynegg]

While some games you will need more than four copies of Pokémon Catcher, one has to consider how often this will happen, and what running a 2-2 Stage 1 line costs; running Ninetales eats up four slots and reduces consistency for everything but having access to a pseudo-Pokémon Catcher. It is easier to search out than Pokémon Catcher but not than Devolution Spray.

What about those games (and they happen fairly often) where you can't seam to draw into Catcher when you need it, but searching a Pokemon would be a snap? Or are you suggesting that you should just Skyla even though being able to Juniper would be the best play to get you set up for the next turn?

 

[Otaku]

What about those games (and they happen fairly often) where you can't seam to draw into Catcher when you need it, but searching a Pokemon would be a snap?

You OHKO their Active Pokémon?

Is it possible your lack of Pokémon Catcher "when you need it" comes from your deck being full of extra Evolutions and support for said Evolutions, when you could be running other cards so you don't need to draw into as much? That you can't afford to just use Skyla to search because you're so busy setting up two Stage 1 Pokémon and a Stage 2?

Or are you suggesting that you should just Skyla even though being able to Juniper would be the best play to get you set up for the next turn?

You are telling me that when you run this deck, an uncommon occurrence is common, indicating either the idea isn't very good or that your build already has issues. Focusing on a single scenario that shouldn't be a major issue and likely shouldn't even be a minor issue makes me wonder if the deck you propose simply shouldn't be. Your opponent should be struggling to throw up Defending Pokémon that are neither Pokémon-EX, Energy rich, nor Evolutions; Pokémon Catcher should often only be needed once your opponent realizes what you are doing.

I would also consider Escape Rope; if the deck is scoring OHKOs as intended, your opponent should not have a lot of good alternate targets on his or her Bench.

 

[celeni]

i have been playing blastoise/black kyurem ex mirror matches lately. it adds depth. came up with two functional combos to use him in a blastoise deck. i am impressed so far. i like how black kyurem gives blastoise the power to completely swing a game into your favor by black ballista 2 turns back to back. this is something only rayeels was able to do. more testing to prove stable.

as for lugia ex i am putting him in a completely different deck. hope for good results.