Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Did the prize increase result in increase attendance in Jr & Srs. A study please read

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I feel that it is no longer a family game anymore and I know Tcpi does not dictate the prices of the secondary market. But guess what they do dictate whether or not they print a card as a secret rare and the raritys of these cards.

I think you massively overestimate how much control TPCI has over those things, actually. I daresay PCL most likely dictates a lot of it.

For example, do you think they enjoyed making the CoL shinies have the same rarity as primes? Everybody on the continent knew it was a train wreck going in, so why would they still make that decision? Because they likely had it made for them.
 
I think you massively overestimate how much control TPCI has over those things, actually. I daresay PCL most likely dictates a lot of it.

For example, do you think they enjoyed making the CoL shinies have the same rarity as primes? Everybody on the continent knew it was a train wreck going in, so why would they still make that decision? Because they likely had it made for them.

Whoever has control over these things needs to make some changes. We just assume that the people at TPCi make some of these decisions. If The Pokemon Company international isn't the company making the decisions about what happens in THE POKEMON TCG, then who is? Someone is to blame for discriminating against the largest portion of pokemon customers, and I can't imagine that someone isn't working at TPCi
 
I think you massively overestimate how much control TPCI has over those things, actually. I daresay PCL most likely dictates a lot of it.

This is a topic that has never been addressed publicly so it is conjecture on both of our parts. Why does Japan have Pokemon Catcher in one of their theme decks and we dont? You really think PCL tells TPCI how to release the English cards? Really?
 
As a fellow parent, I'd like to debate this for a moment. I also despise those trophies that everyone gets, because it does nothing to prepare them for true disappointment or encourage them to try harder. Not everyone can win. Instead, the opportunity is there as a parent to reward your own child if you think they performed (and even behaved!) well. Troll and Toad was the vendor on hand in Indiana, a parent could easily buy a prize for their own child. I don't believe Pokémon has to do this for us.

It's also worth mentioning there often are raffles and coloring contests and other activities, as well as the prizes winnable in side events.

If you still don't agree, what kind of prize would have been appropriate?

I do think it's important for kids (and adults) to learn that no matter how hard they try, sometimes you just can't win.

Having said that, I also think that for Pokemon to encourage its youngest players to attend, those players need to feel like they had a fun time at regionals. We did have raffles at regionals (San Jose, CA) but side events with token prizes for the juniors probably would have been nice as well - items like stickers, erasers, or whatever you can get for a couple of pennies.

When a 6 year old walks away from regionals at the end of a long day, would they be so concerned that they went 2-4 or would they be excited that they got a really cool Psyduck sticker? As a parent, I would be a lot less inclined to go to the next regionals if my kid didn't leave with a good feeling (even if he lost).

It's like the badges and stuff you get from league. How many masters (and older seniors) are really interested in those trinkets? But the youngest kids LOVE that stuff - if they think they can get something, they'll keep returning.
 
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I do think it's important for kids (and adults) to learn that no matter how hard they try, sometimes you just can't win.

Having said that, I also think that for Pokemon to encourage its youngest players to attend, those players need to feel like they had a fun time at regionals. We did have raffles at regionals (San Jose, CA) but side events with token prizes for the juniors probably would have been nice as well - items like stickers, erasers, or whatever you can get for a couple of pennies.

When a 6 year old walks away from regionals at the end of a long day, would they be so concerned that they went 2-4 or would they be excited that they got a really cool Psyduck sticker? As a parent, I would be a lot less inclined to go to the next regionals if my kid didn't leave with a good feeling (even if he lost).

It's like the badges and stuff you get from league. How many masters (and older seniors) are really interested in those trinkets? But the youngest kids LOVE that stuff - if they think they can get something, they'll keep returning.
This, this, and this! I was walking around nor-cal regionals (hanging out mostly). I walked around the juniors division just as the tournament was ending. Out of all the children, many were happy, but one little girl had a HUGE smile on her face. She was telling her parents about how much fun she had. She won 4 or 5 things from the raffle. I later found out that she went 0-X, but she had the best day ever. She will most certainly be coming back to as many tournaments as she can.

This is how we should be increasing the juniors and senior divisions. If we want to help the size grow, everyone needs to feel like a winner. Rummaging up old knick-knacks from Pokemon history (2004 Worlds door keys for example) and giving them to the players is a great way to make everyone feel like a winner. Even the useless beachballs and pencils were helpful in this way. A long long time ago, I went to a tournament (can't remember where) where the loser of the first round walked away with something small (a beach ball) while the winner walked away with a win. The first round (and the last round) are the two rounds with the largest amount of feel-bad from my experience. Having a not-winner prize for first round and random goodness in the last round is great to ensure that everyone is a winner. Being able to walk away from the tournament saying "look what I won" is a great way to increase repeat attendance... even if the person didn't actually win it. This psychology works for masters too, but the knick-knacks need to be bigger. Masters typically end up giving the beach balls and pencils to the youngins.

Once again, reducing the amount of Junior and Senior feel-bad is definetely the way to go. One mom at a cities last year high fived every junior that won a game. By the end of the tournament, you had juniors competing merely to win that high five (everyone ended up getting the high-five by the end of the tournament). This high-five, while a useless prize, became worth more and more by the time the tournament went on. At the beginning of the tournament, it was cool and fun. By the end of the tournament, everyone who hadn't gotten it wanted it badly. This wasn't a normal high five either. When one of the juniors highfived this judge, everybody knew about it. It was a big deal. By the end of the tournament, every junior won this high five, so there was absolutely no feel-bad. They all earned something, so they all walked away happy.


So yeah... that was way longer than I intended it to be. Onto the on-topic stuff :p



Pokemon is growing month by month. Straight numbers don't mean much when you take this into account. I honestly think we should be comparing the rate of growth of this year's regionals when compared to the rate of growth of last year's regionals and the rate of growth of the regionals before last year. A few factors changed, so our data is pretty much incomplete and trying to draw conclusions based on this one event will end in disaster. I think we should really start crunching numbers after all 3 regionals take place this year. Compare the total attendance to the total attendance of last year and the year before. The total attendance will definitely increase, but by how much? If the rate of attendance growth flattened out, that is where we might find issues. If it didn't flatten out significantly, we can conclude that the change had little effect on regionals attendance. If the J/S rate of attendance growth increased, the plan was successful. We just need to look at the expected growth of these events and the actual growth. Even with all the necessary data, a few things changed (3 regionals vs 2), so it is difficult to draw hard conclusions, but we can still draw some conclusions. Just wait to judge before we get a good sample of regionals (at least wait until the 2nd regionals is over).
 
For reference, at the Philly Regional Championship, I know that there was at least a drop in attendance for seniors.

Earlier this year there were 105 seniors at Philly, this weekend there were 78.

I don't remember the numbers for Juniors from earlier this year, but the fact of the matter is that TPCi still didn't increase attendance in the younger divisions with their ludicrous decision on prize support.

There were A TON of seniors who aged up to be fair.
 
Anyone looking at specifically the psychology of the actual people who got 2nd-4th place are looking at it incorrectly.

The prizes are always "really" for people who don't win them: was the presence of the prize enough to entice you to go after it, even though you didn't get it? What the data suggests here is that it really doesn't for Juniors and Seniors.
 
Not necessarily. I feel this thread could help sway TPCI's decision for prize support for this coming winter regionals.
I attended the fall regionals for VGC up in Toronto and Juniors had a record 3 players in their division. Had I decided to bring my younger cousin up to play that would have been a free $500 stipend for him. Instead the $500 in that divison went to waste. All divisions should really have equal prizes so that Masters don't feel left out. I know that even if I won a stipend and I was a junior player my parents would never let me go there since they are strict.

There was actually 4 Juniors but he dropped after 2 rounds.
 
No. With a decreased number of regionals per time, there's an increased distance between many players and an event. What should be happening is less total people on one date across all events, but more players per event. As a result, by the end of the season, there should be higher attendance numbers in total. I think what I said is true so far.

Indiana
October 2012
  • Masters- 329
  • Seniors-98
  • Juniors-52
  • Event Total-479
April 2012
  • Master-198
  • Senior-63
  • Junior-54
  • Total: 315
NorCal
October 2012
  • Masters-253
  • Seniors-89
  • Juniors-30
  • Total-372
April 2012
  • Masters: 185
  • Seniors: 82
  • Juniors: 54
  • Total: 321
Texas
October 2012
  • Masters-261
  • Seniors-77
  • Juniors-58
  • Event Total-396
April 2012
  • Masters - 259
  • Total: 429
Can't seem to find anything on PA or ON aside for last year but PA this year:
Pennsylvania
October 2012
  • Masters: 300+
  • Seniors: 78
  • Juniors: 60

Last year there were almost 100 Seniors iirc. (I'm a Senior so I'd know) In the end there were less because some dropped.

As for age divisons yes we do need a 4th, but I don't think you need to cut to a 30+ age group.
I would like to see 10-, 11-15, 16-20 and 21+ that would even things out better.

I like that. It eases Seniors into Masters, and makes the Senior division (11-15) bigger by one year (therefore harder).

However, maybe make it:

<13
13-17
>17
 
I like that. It eases Seniors into Masters, and makes the Senior division (11-15) bigger by one year (therefore harder).

However, maybe make it:

<13
13-17
>17

I don't think making the Junior division older is the right move. The younger players wouldn't stand a chance against the 12 and 13 yr olds.
 
One interesting thing that I noticed was that to get any points, Jrs and Srs have to perform in the T16. Yes, they get more prize support for Nats, but that means nothing if they don't get their points to qualify. They have way more of an issue than Masters division when it comes to actually qualifying. If you don't get T 16, you get nothing. Other than at Nats, Jrs and Srs rarely have over 128 in their divisions...not even at Worlds this past year. Points are prizes, too.
 
One interesting thing that I noticed was that to get any points, Jrs and Srs have to perform in the T16.

Actually, Jrs didn't hit the 64-player cutoff at any of the Regionals, so they only got Top 8 at best. In fact, if the numbers we're hearing are correct, Jrs at NorCal and Ontario didn't even get that, they just got Top 4. (Super congrats to those 4!)
 
Agreed, it was a little brutal having the kid place 27th out of 98 and not get any points. Not only did 1-16 get points at a minimum but they also got to play on to try to win the bigger prizes.
 
One interesting thing that I noticed was that to get any points, Jrs and Srs have to perform in the T16. Yes, they get more prize support for Nats, but that means nothing if they don't get their points to qualify. They have way more of an issue than Masters division when it comes to actually qualifying. If you don't get T 16, you get nothing. Other than at Nats, Jrs and Srs rarely have over 128 in their divisions...not even at Worlds this past year. Points are prizes, too.

This is a HUGE change for our family this year. With a Junior and a Senior - both of whom got packs at Regionals but no Championship Points - the 400 point threshold for Worlds is starting to feel pretty steep.
 
I agree. I have a twelve-year-old cousin who bubbled at twentieth and was really disappointed that he didn't even get any CP. I'd get it more if there was only barely enough for a top 16, but there were almost 100 seniors at Fort Wayne.
 
I wonder if Masters would complain that P!P sent out 100 extra inflatable Pokeballs and pencils just for the Junior and Senior divisions, while they got nothing extra.
 
Do you know how many pokemon beach balls they could buy with $3,000.00? That is how much prize support is being giving to Juniors/Seniors at these events. If that happened, I think a lot of people would complain about wasteful spending. Your point isn't a good one.
 
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