Regis_Neo
Moderator
Yeah...granted if I was rich I would, but as I'm not, lol...
Help for someone getting into MTG?
- Thread starter Regis_Neo
- Start date
Yeah...granted if I was rich I would, but as I'm not, lol...
pat460
New Member
^^ Well, i was just saying that if you really want to play magic that you will have to spend money. And yeah, green cards are rediculous. a playset of 'goyf and two planswalkers and you have spent almost $200 in some cases. BTW starter decks are ok, but you should research what you want to play before you buy one. that way you might get something you need. then buy singles.
I'm pretty sure that the new set comes out next week (maybe it's two weeks). You might look for a prerelease in your area. We missed this one but when Lorwyn came out my husband and 9 year old went and the had a special event for beginners. I don't remember the specific details but my son got a deck, a pack (I think), and a promo that he had signed by the artist on site. My son was able to hold his own at this beginner event and enjoyed seeing a lot of the cards and meeting people. I'm not trying to compare you to a child but only to a beginning MtG player!
I love people who point at Tarmogoyf and say things like, "Magic is expensive!" Tarmogoyf is expensive. Magic is as cheap or expensive as you want it to be.
Green can be as cheap as a $20 Stompy deck for ****'s sake. Anyone who tells you that you need Tarmogoyf if you want to play green is an idiot.
Green can be as cheap as a $20 Stompy deck for ****'s sake. Anyone who tells you that you need Tarmogoyf if you want to play green is an idiot.
Regis_Neo
Moderator
I actually like the sound of a prerelease, I'll have to see if any are nearby. Are they about the same price as a Pokemon prerelease?
Also I agree with Marril, Magic is probably as cheap or expensive as you want; it applies to all TCGs pretty much. For example, you could have shelled out around $200 2 seasons(?) ago for BLS, or played something a LOT cheaper, but still effective, like Lunasol (which I did lol).
Also I agree with Marril, Magic is probably as cheap or expensive as you want; it applies to all TCGs pretty much. For example, you could have shelled out around $200 2 seasons(?) ago for BLS, or played something a LOT cheaper, but still effective, like Lunasol (which I did lol).
Following on from Marril's suggestions, I would first think about what type of deck you want to play. Marril plays Vintage/Legacy (same as me actually), which is pretty much Unlimited in Pokémon with some ridiculous cards restricted (one per deck) / banned.
Three things which make M:TG very different to Pokémon:
1) There are few ways to draw cards in M:TG. It's not like Pokémon where you can have lots of trainers and attacks letting you find what you want whenever. That makes card drawing very powerful in M:TG
2) It's much more interactive. You can counter what the opponent does, you can add spells to what the opponent does... it can get very very complicated. But mostly it's just good fun. I would start off slowly and just play whatever you want to. Some of the best ever decks are the simplest... others require a lot of skill and experience.
3) Specific colours do certain things. It's much more defined than in Pokémon, but it adds to the game... I don't get Pokémon card design at all.
Broadly speaking,
Blue - Control, card advantage (so things like card drawing), counterspells
Black - Discarding, Sacrificing (in Pokémon terms, putting a Pokémon in the discard pile to get a certain effect). Black can do most things, but there may be a drawback for the things its not naturally 'good' at
Red - Burn (in M:TG players have 20 life points. Rather than attacking with creatures, can 'burn' players/creatures directly
Green - the 'creature' colour - has the largest creatures, mana acceleration (so can generate mana=energy (in Pokémon terms))
White - efficient creatures, 'symmetric' destruction (so Wrath of God), taxing (making opponents pay extra mana to do things).
Most beginners start off with red/green to get a feel for the game. In fact, I have most fun playing the simplest burn decks. The most powerful stuff has historically been concentrated in blue/black, but they generally require more skill to play. Also, if you're planning on playing with the latest cards, the above might be slightly out of date. They like to move things around once in a while to keep things fresh.
Hope that helps. The others can probably point out the mistakes I've made.
Oh, and don't buy boosters. Seriously are a waste of money in M:TG, which has the advantage of a rather nice secondary market. If you look around, you should be able to find what you want at a fair price. Dual lands are a fairly hefty investment though - only get those if you're in M:TG for the long haul
d
Three things which make M:TG very different to Pokémon:
1) There are few ways to draw cards in M:TG. It's not like Pokémon where you can have lots of trainers and attacks letting you find what you want whenever. That makes card drawing very powerful in M:TG
2) It's much more interactive. You can counter what the opponent does, you can add spells to what the opponent does... it can get very very complicated. But mostly it's just good fun. I would start off slowly and just play whatever you want to. Some of the best ever decks are the simplest... others require a lot of skill and experience.
3) Specific colours do certain things. It's much more defined than in Pokémon, but it adds to the game... I don't get Pokémon card design at all.
Broadly speaking,
Blue - Control, card advantage (so things like card drawing), counterspells
Black - Discarding, Sacrificing (in Pokémon terms, putting a Pokémon in the discard pile to get a certain effect). Black can do most things, but there may be a drawback for the things its not naturally 'good' at
Red - Burn (in M:TG players have 20 life points. Rather than attacking with creatures, can 'burn' players/creatures directly
Green - the 'creature' colour - has the largest creatures, mana acceleration (so can generate mana=energy (in Pokémon terms))
White - efficient creatures, 'symmetric' destruction (so Wrath of God), taxing (making opponents pay extra mana to do things).
Most beginners start off with red/green to get a feel for the game. In fact, I have most fun playing the simplest burn decks. The most powerful stuff has historically been concentrated in blue/black, but they generally require more skill to play. Also, if you're planning on playing with the latest cards, the above might be slightly out of date. They like to move things around once in a while to keep things fresh.
Hope that helps. The others can probably point out the mistakes I've made.
Oh, and don't buy boosters. Seriously are a waste of money in M:TG, which has the advantage of a rather nice secondary market. If you look around, you should be able to find what you want at a fair price. Dual lands are a fairly hefty investment though - only get those if you're in M:TG for the long haul
d
The Tenth Edition painlands aren't overly expensive, since they're only around the $6 range. I'd definitely impress upon any new player that once they've found a colour combination they like, their first priority should be to drop the $24 for the painlands in those combinations, as they'll be of more help than almost any other investment. I guarantee it.
As for a starter deck, I'd suggest either black/red if you want to learn how to be aggressive, or white/blue if you want to learn how to be defensive. I might just be old-fashioned though.
As for a starter deck, I'd suggest either black/red if you want to learn how to be aggressive, or white/blue if you want to learn how to be defensive. I might just be old-fashioned though.
Lands that produce two colours of mana, but when producing coloured mana deal 1 damage to you, hence their name. An example of one (which I posted above) would be Caves of Koilos. Think of it like Rainbow Energy or something—it hurts, it isn't strictly more useful than basic land/energy, but it makes your deck a whole lot more consistent if you've got them.
In any case, they're the only Standard-legal dual lands I know of.
In any case, they're the only Standard-legal dual lands I know of.
Regis_Neo
Moderator
Hmm...do they like deal one damage everytime you tap them to use them, or only once when they are put into play? Sounds like it can add up, considering you only have what, 20 life or something.
You only really need them for coloured mana until you get other lands into play for that mana, so in reality you're probably only taking 3-4 damage tops from them. Either way, they only deal damage to you when tapping for coloured mana, so you can always tap them for colourless and not take damage. No life points except the final one matter, so trading them for an early advantage (mana consistency in this case) is advantageous.
There are dual lands that simply damage you when you put them into play, though. The "shocklands" (so named because, like Shock, they hit you for 2 damage) from Ravnica are two basic land types and tap, pain-free, for either, but if you don't pay 2 life as they come into play, they come into play tapped.
There are dual lands that simply damage you when you put them into play, though. The "shocklands" (so named because, like Shock, they hit you for 2 damage) from Ravnica are two basic land types and tap, pain-free, for either, but if you don't pay 2 life as they come into play, they come into play tapped.
@ Marrill: sorry, I thought you meant the original duals from Alpha.
@Regis_Neo: The other thing to note is that the colour pie (distribution of abilities amongst the colours) has changed, so that Green is a lot more aggressive and White doesn't really know what it's doing. But in general, I wouldn't pay too much attention unless you get really into it.
The game is as complicated as you want it to be. As I said before, I often have the most fun just playing simple burn spells. The choice for starter decks at the moment (for new players) is very much red/green. Don't know what it was before - haven't been playing for very long. There is a new Elves vs Goblins deck out which is supposed to be good fun, and fairly powerful too. Try that maybe?
@Regis_Neo: The other thing to note is that the colour pie (distribution of abilities amongst the colours) has changed, so that Green is a lot more aggressive and White doesn't really know what it's doing. But in general, I wouldn't pay too much attention unless you get really into it.
The game is as complicated as you want it to be. As I said before, I often have the most fun just playing simple burn spells. The choice for starter decks at the moment (for new players) is very much red/green. Don't know what it was before - haven't been playing for very long. There is a new Elves vs Goblins deck out which is supposed to be good fun, and fairly powerful too. Try that maybe?
Regis_Neo
Moderator
Yeah I saw the Elves and Goblins one, but $20 is just...a tad too much right now. And lol, White doesn't know what it's doing...*notes to avoid*
White's always got the weenie rush (playing lots of small creatures and global buff spells like Glorious Anthem) going for it. My cheapest deck is probably my White Weenie, which on a good draw will kill you on turn 4, and which cost me maybe like $50 total to make. That said, I have no idea how effective Standard white is, though again, it always has Wrath of God going for it.
As for the original duals... I actually have a set of Scrublands (and Godless Shrines x_x) for my B/W deck, which I view as my most extravagent Magic purchase of all time. Then again, the mana in that deck is so unbelievably consistent that I can't imagine just using a bunch of Plains and Swamps instead and being anywhere near as effective. I'd recommend getting the real duals only if you're serious about Legacy/Vintage, however.
As for the original duals... I actually have a set of Scrublands (and Godless Shrines x_x) for my B/W deck, which I view as my most extravagent Magic purchase of all time. Then again, the mana in that deck is so unbelievably consistent that I can't imagine just using a bunch of Plains and Swamps instead and being anywhere near as effective. I'd recommend getting the real duals only if you're serious about Legacy/Vintage, however.
Historically white has been good; WW(= White Weenie) is one of the oldest archtypes in the game. Lately though, Green has been getting more and more efficient creatures, and without things like Armageddon, there is not much for white to do (which the other colours don't do better). Black now has Damnation (exactly the same as WoG but with black mana), so lots of people are wondering what's the point of white? White will have to move into a new direction, or they have to be willing to print some of the older cards. Last worlds, I think there was one white card in T8 or something... disgraceful.
Avoid in standard for now, unless you get a good draft.
Good for you! As I said before, if you enjoy the game, you can seriously go nuts. Proxies are also a good way to play with expensive cards before you decide to splash out.
Maybe reconsider the Elves/Goblins deck? It is fairly powerful from what I remember (for the cost, it's probably a small bargain).
Regis_Neo
Moderator
Hmm, I don't suppose you have a deck list for it? And perhaps can tell me the highlights of the cards in it? That'd be helpful, cause I read it comes with 2 60 card decks (which is nice since your average starter had what, 40-60?).
Damnation will get rotated out and will probably never be reprinted. Wrath of God will probably be in every base set until the end of time. If they really wanted white to be an engine of destruction, they'd reprint Armageddon.
Also, at Regis_Neo: I've linked to him already, but this guy's articles are pretty good for people who are either new to the game or don't want to spend a lot of money, yet still want to be able to win at casual tournaments. He does things like smoosh together Tenth Edition starter decks, and decks based around cheap rares. Good reading for you.
pat460
New Member
You pwn me in pokemon, but i dont play it anymore. But you just prooved yourself to be a MTG n0ob. There were many dual lands in larwyn,. Also, there were stock lands in timespiral. And those coldsnap duel lands. Plus the Doran land in morningtide. If you really think painlands are the only legal duel lands, you obviously dont play MTG much, because they see almost no play nowadays. and you commented on 'goyf earlier, saying that you dont need him in green to play competetivly. Find me a decklist that played green(i dont mean splashed) from a recent(i mean the current type-2 format) tournement that got top cut that DIDN'T play him, and i will agree. GL with that though.
AND i think you forget how core sets in MTG work, players vote on what gets reprinted. there is no telling who will vote for what in 11th at this point. it depends on the game then. So, Damnation might get reprinted. And there is no"gaurentee" that wrath will be reprinted, even though it is very, very likely.
BTW the elves/goblins thing isn't entirly standard legal. a lot of the cards rotated a while ago.